Buyer beware - questionable events? Re dealerships/repair shops

[RjKaz]

New thread to hilite experiences at Dealerships or Repair shops.

[roll_over]

GOFC

[RjKaz]

A calgary dealership is currently listing a 2009 Mercedes c230 with 7800 km. Advertised with 'heated leather' seats (and salesman said leather seats). Note this is not a Mercedes dealer.

Made a deal, put $1000 down. They couldnt tell me when the oil was last changed (could be original, 4 years old), so oil change was in the deal. Next day I had a Mercedes dealership run the option list for the vin. Leather was not an added option -standard is synthetic leather called mbtex aka 'ARTICO leather'- very nice but not leather. When I grew up it was called vinyl :-)
Note, real leather, aka 'leather' is @$2000 option. I called salesman next day, and emailed early am that deal was on hold til they could authenticate the leather claim.

After an apparent first attempt by them to say it was my misunderstanding on what leather means, they agreed to return deposit. However when I arrived, the refund was less $159 for the oil change (paid them to change oil in their incorrectly advertised car).

If you buy this car beware that the Mercedes option listing says it does not have leather. Note, most new C class cars I checked are not ordered w real leather, so apparently most buyers are ok without it. It's hard to tell the diff by look, even feel, so possible some don't realize. Of note, the authorized Mercedes dealership I visited was open about it when browsing their inventory.

I gave the dealership the mercedes option listing - I commented that the ad still said 'leather', but hoped they would change it. I think if it was an honest mistake, they'll change the ad - a positive sign of integrity - but still not impressed that they made me pay $159 for its oil change.

[Darell_n]

Originally posted by RjKaz
A calgary dealership is currently listing a 2009 Mercedes c230 with 7800 km. Advertised with 'heated leather' seats (and salesman said leather seats). Note this is not a Mercedes dealer.

Made a deal, put $1000 down. They couldnt tell me when the oil was last changed (could be original, 4 years old), so oil change was in the deal. Next day I had a Mercedes dealership run the option list for the vin. Leather was not an added option -standard is synthetic leather called mbtex aka 'ARTICO leather'- very nice but not leather. When I grew up it was called vinyl :-)
Note, real leather, aka 'leather' is @$2000 option. I called salesman next day, and emailed early am that deal was on hold til they could authenticate the leather claim.

After an apparent first attempt by them to say it was my misunderstanding on what leather means, they agreed to return deposit. However when I arrived, the refund was less $159 for the oil change (paid them to change oil in their incorrectly advertised car).

If you buy this car beware that the Mercedes option listing says it does not have leather. Note, most new C class cars I checked are not ordered w real leather, so apparently most buyers are ok without it. It's hard to tell the diff by look, even feel, so possible some don't realize. Of note, the authorized Mercedes dealership I visited was open about it when browsing their inventory.

I gave the dealership the mercedes option listing - I commented that the ad still said 'leather', but hoped they would change it. I think if it was an honest mistake, they'll change the ad - a positive sign of integrity - but still not impressed that they made me pay $159 for its oil change.

So you put money down on a vehicle you did not look at in a used car lot? That's the questionable event.

[zieg]

Yeah that seems pretty fair to me, lucky to get anything back imo

[Redlyne_mr2]

It's not a Mercedes dealership, what exactly were you expecting? The used lot you're buying from I'm sure could be more knowledgeable but I would do my own due diligence before putting a deposit down. I would also look at the car before agreeing to get service work done. A 2009 with such low mileage is a rare find and I would focus on the mileage rather than whether or not it's real leather. Glad to hear it all worked out.

[Graham_A_M]

Kind of shitty they billed you $159 on an overdue oil change for a car you dont want due to a miss-understanding on their behalf.
It was very foolish for you to put a deposit on a car without checking it out in person though.

[FraserB]

Billing him is 100% fine. He demanded it as part of the deal and then backed out, he should pay for it. There's also no way of telling if it was indeed overdue.

[snowcat]

95% of base model "luxury" cars don't have leather.

[bourge73]

So basically buddy wanted to be a "Baller" find out later from his friends not a "Baller" car doesn't even have real leather. Tries to get the oil change money back after telling them to do it? and now wants the money back? and makes a account/thread cause they shady... ya ok buddy making a big deal over $159? don't buy a Mercedes you cant afford it.

[RNB11]

Originally posted by bourge73
So basically buddy wanted to be a "Baller" find out later from his friends not a "Baller" car doesn't even have real leather. Tries to get the oil change money back after telling them to do it? and now wants the money back? and makes a account/thread cause they shady... ya ok buddy making a big deal over $159? don't buy a Mercedes you cant afford it.

It's not always about the money.

[RjKaz]

It's surprising how a few comments start with big assumptions, then most jump on to hilite how dumb my actions were. Usually I'd ask a few questions before passing judgement. Just goes to show there's room in every situation for misunderstanding.

I'm a newbie here, but I didn't bash the dealership or write an essay on the details. Point is if you are buying this car, pay attention. Now dealer knows it doesn't have leather, what will they do?

Read on, if you want more info:
I did look at the car. I wanted leather, I thought it was leather. I challenge most people to tell Mercedes vinyl from leather, unless you have/had one with leather. This isnt a debate why I want leather, it's not really relevant - I could challenge anyone on their preferences.

But whether I looked in person or not isn't really relevant either - when you put a deposit on a car/any deal for that matter, there will always be a certain level of trust - both parties have to assume the other is honest, or you would not do business. If the dealership lists options that are not true, it's not the buyers mistake - its the dealer's. I'm going to guess from some replies, that the nature of your business is limited buying and selling - or you'd know you or rep can't always attend in person. Many deals must be done 'remotely' - more than half for me. Do they always work out perfect - no, and that's just part of doing business, but partly manage risk with smaller deals with those I don't already know, until we establish mutual trust. (That however goes for all relationships).

Almost everyone does deals without even looking at the item, based on the advertisement. If you ordered something from Futureshop, you pay before it arrives. If the description or an option was wrong, too bad, you shouldn't be able to return??

But again, I looked at the c230. Some dealerships won't 'deal' until you are prepared to make an offer with a deposit - this dealership is like that. (If this was some Joe selling in his backyard, i would have just walked - difft implied trust for difft situations, I gave this dealership some trust). After we had a deal, I ran VIN check at Mercedes the next day (does everyone run a manufacturer option list on $25k used cars?). I called the salesman immediately, and emailed them at 6:30 am, and again spoke to them - that the deal was in peril unless/until we could verify the options were legit. They made the oil change that day, after that - probably another mistake. They did the oil change in their shop - they charged me full shop price.

I am not bashing the dealership. They agreed to return the deposit in relatively short order. Didnt say $159 was a large amount of money, again why do u judge that? I didn't post this for enlightening financial advice.
The car is still there - be aware it may not be as advertised. Read my experience and decide on the appropriate diligence.

[RjKaz]

Btw - what is a 'baller'? It's a sincere question ...

[tobypaddock]

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=baller

[gpomp]

Originally posted by RjKaz
It's surprising how a few comments start with big assumptions, then most jump on to hilite how dumb my actions were. Usually I'd ask a few questions before passing judgement. Just goes to show there's room in every situation for misunderstanding.

I'm a newbie here, but I didn't bash the dealership or write an essay on the details. Point is if you are buying this car, pay attention. Now dealer knows it doesn't have leather, what will they do?

Read on, if you want more info:
I did look at the car. I wanted leather, I thought it was leather. I challenge most people to tell Mercedes vinyl from leather, unless you have/had one with leather. This isnt a debate why I want leather, it's not really relevant - I could challenge anyone on their preferences.

But whether I looked in person or not isn't really relevant either - when you put a deposit on a car/any deal for that matter, there will always be a certain level of trust - both parties have to assume the other is honest, or you would not do business. If the dealership lists options that are not true, it's not the buyers mistake - its the dealer's. I'm going to guess from some replies, that the nature of your business is limited buying and selling - or you'd know you or rep can't always attend in person. Many deals must be done 'remotely' - more than half for me. Do they always work out perfect - no, and that's just part of doing business, but partly manage risk with smaller deals with those I don't already know, until we establish mutual trust. (That however goes for all relationships).

Almost everyone does deals without even looking at the item, based on the advertisement. If you ordered something from Futureshop, you pay before it arrives. If the description or an option was wrong, too bad, you shouldn't be able to return??

But again, I looked at the c230. Some dealerships won't 'deal' until you are prepared to make an offer with a deposit - this dealership is like that. (If this was some Joe selling in his backyard, i would have just walked - difft implied trust for difft situations, I gave this dealership some trust). After we had a deal, I ran VIN check at Mercedes the next day (does everyone run a manufacturer option list on $25k used cars?). I called the salesman immediately, and emailed them at 6:30 am, and again spoke to them - that the deal was in peril unless/until we could verify the options were legit. They made the oil change that day, after that - probably another mistake. They did the oil change in their shop - they charged me full shop price.

I am not bashing the dealership. They agreed to return the deposit in relatively short order. Didnt say $159 was a large amount of money, again why do u judge that? I didn't post this for enlightening financial advice.
The car is still there - be aware it may not be as advertised. Read my experience and decide on the appropriate diligence.

[gpomp]

Looks like the dealership is SDS

[FraserB]

Oil change is 100% on you. No ifs, ands or buts. You asked them to do it, never told them not to and you would not have been charged if you followed through on the purchase.

You should have run the VIN check beforehand, 99.9% of people buying a used car would. A dealership not willing to talk without you putting money down is a huge red flag.

[Alak]

Originally posted by FraserB
A dealership not willing to talk without you putting money down is a huge red flag.

I agree, a huge red flag. But Also, it seperates the tire kickers/dreamers from the real buisiness. On the other hand, asking for a deposit is like asking if your broke IMO.

[TomcoPDR]

Originally posted by RjKaz
Btw - what is a 'baller'? It's a sincere question ...

http://forums.beyond.ca/member.php?s=&action=getinfo&userid=49

[DeeK]

So all I'm reading is that you are implying "a level of trust" should be had at dealerships? And that you caught them in a lie about real leather seats...

I just nearly fell out of my chair laughing. Dealerships are all about making money and if they have to lie or swindle to do so, most will.

[Sugarphreak]

...

[rage2]

Originally posted by RjKaz
Leather was not an added option -standard is synthetic leather called mbtex aka 'ARTICO leather'- very nice but not leather. When I grew up it was called vinyl :-)
Nothing wrong with ARTICO, my BS has an ARTICO interior. I actually prefer it to leather. Wears 1000x better, cleans and maintains way easier too. And no it feels nothing like old vinyl.

[RjKaz]

Rage2 said it, it's not like vinyl, it seems very high quality (but it's hard to not see it as 'less' compared to leather). I drove the car, looked at the interior - it looks like leather. I doubt many people could tell. New leather smells very nice but this is a 4 year old car.

Sure, many dealers are unethical - I didn't know these guys and put $1000 on the line. They are aggressive re deposits before serious talk, but it helps them tell who is really serious. I don't see an issue, provided they refund it under right circumstances. The honest ones will - the fact the dealer gave most of mine back leads me to think the leather claim was a mistake. (I'll be disappointed in them if the ad doesn't change).

The oil change was part of the prep for delivery - which was put on hold before it was done. 'FraserB' said they didn't know - what an odd comment. (I have the receipt for the oil change showing the date). I could respect the comments with a prefix 'if they didnt know', but i doubt that's his style.
Anyhow I suspect the oil change was another oversight - but I paid for it.

When you don't have the history of service, fresh oil is recommended - and its not expensive ... usually < $160. :-)
We always put fresh oil in our engines ahead of sitting for extended periods (ie winter). Whoever buys this car, the fresh oil is my treat!

[RjKaz]

To be fair to the dealer, appears it's not the only Mercedes ad with 'leather', that's actually synthetic.
Does it matter if you buy synthetic thinking it's real leather? If u don't know and neither does the next buyer... Probably only an issue re European cars where their synthetic is so good. FraserB said 99.9% of buyers would run an original manufacturer check - doubtful, but neverless good advice? I read an article where some dealers were 'upgrading' the model on vehicles by purchasing the 'stickers/labels', and adding cheap aftermarket parts. You think ur buying higher model - as example a 'Laramie' but you get an 'ST' with cheap add ons. The VIN option list would verify - carproof gives you the make, model, but not going to confirm the details like the manufacturer check. Mercedes service ran it for me - anyone experienced in this regard and care to comment - Will all authorized dealers (all makes) do the same?

Btw - I was surprised few people in this matter focused on the fact the advertising does not accurately represent their product. Perhaps just so common - I guess the right perspective is that buying from dealer vs privately, dont go in with added trust...

[RjKaz]

I was also planning to post my sons experience re an out of province inspection. They quoted $1400 in repairs, one of the mandatory to pass was fixing the 'bad' rear brakes - $600 - $700. They seemed annoyed by a few questions - a few things were giving a bad vibe, so i told my kid to take the car elsewhere.
He paid for new inspection, turns out the rear brakes were new. The car was from his gparents - when we talked to them, they confirmed rear brakes had been recently done.
My kid picked the original inspection bc there was numerous reviews about the shop - everyone was overwhelming positive. Send me a private message if you want to know the name of the shop. I'd also give you the name of the second, the one that actually showed us the new brakes.

[Sugarphreak]

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