Wealth Distribution in America

[sabad66]

Interesting video to help visualize wealth distribution:

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[Kloubek]

Rather menacing production.

Welcome to the world of commerce. I know the rich are out there - and I know I'm not one of them. So be it - I have a decent life and if I was talented enough to make someone think I was worth 380X as a CEO, then good for me. Nice paycheque.

My only question is what Canadians look like on the same scale. Not likely *that* much better off - I presume.

[codetrap]

Meh.. so what else is new. The stupid get poorer, and the smart get richer. Such is life, and such it has been life for many many many generations. It's always the same way, and it always will be. Forceful redistribution of wealth, and the eventual accumulation of that wealth into the hands of a few....

[benyl]

Originally posted by codetrap
Meh.. so what else is new. The stupid get poorer, and the smart get richer. Such is life, and such it has been life for many many many generations. It's always the same way, and it always will be. Forceful redistribution of wealth, and the eventual accumulation of that wealth into the hands of a few....

Has nothing to do with smart. It has everything to do with having money.

Rich people have access to investments that the public do not. Even newly, hard working, self made millionaires don't get into the "club" of these investments that just make the rich, richer.

You might think hard work and a little luck will pay off, but the reality is that if you aren't born into it, you are never going to get there. Sure, there are exceptions (Billionaire Hi-tech founders), but it is harder to get into that club than to get into the NBA / NHL / NFL etc.

[ercchry]

Originally posted by benyl


Rich people have access to investments that the public do not. Even newly, hard working, self made millionaires don't get into the "club" of these investments that just make the rich, richer.

for some reason all i can think of right now is caddyshack (mostly the second one) :rofl:

[codetrap]

Originally posted by benyl


Has nothing to do with smart. It has everything to do with having money.

Rich people have access to investments that the public do not. Even newly, hard working, self made millionaires don't get into the "club" of these investments that just make the rich, richer.

You might think hard work and a little luck will pay off, but the reality is that if you aren't born into it, you are never going to get there. Sure, there are exceptions (Billionaire Hi-tech founders), but it is harder to get into that club than to get into the NBA / NHL / NFL etc. I think this is a very small part of the truth. I think if you look at history, you'll find all those people who ended up accumulating wealth did it because they were simply smarter, or perhaps better equipped than the masses. There are lots of people who started off with nothing, and accumulated vast amounts of wealth without "special access" to those investments.

[zipdoa]

It would be interesting to relate this same information to education, demographic, age, gender, etc.

[Sugarphreak]

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[Feruk]

Originally posted by Sugarphreak
As Codetrap said, the richest people are generally the smartest and more importantly the most disciplined when it comes to savings and spending. Dumb people who have no self control that are born into wealth or that win the lottery blow it away pretty quick. You just can't fix stupid.
That is a middle class mentality IMO. When you have a difference of 230X between what the average employee makes and what a CEO makes, managing your money has little to do with it. An average employee can go their entire career, be the world's best money manager, and still never come close to catching up.

[effingidiot]

Originally posted by codetrap
I think this is a very small part of the truth. I think if you look at history, you'll find all those people who ended up accumulating wealth did it because they were simply smarter, or perhaps better equipped than the masses. There are lots of people who started off with nothing, and accumulated vast amounts of wealth without "special access" to those investments.

What is TARP and QE?

[-relk-]

Originally posted by Sugarphreak
Best way to even out the distribution of wealth is to teach financial planning and how to invest in school so kids get a basic understanding. My parents had no clue and still don't to this day, nor did I when I got out; financial planning was skill learned by fucking up in my early 20's.
Not neccesarily the one and only reason why rich people stay rich, but a very good point nonetheless. Luckily, my dad has drilled me into saving and budgeting everything I spend, and I will be coming out of University with some money saved up and debt free.

Looking back on grade school years, it really doesn't make much sense why we learn about shakespeare and stuff like Ancient China over money management. IMO money management has a much greater impact on everything around us compared to learning about something that happened hundreds of years ago (not that it isn't important, just not as much as money management). No wonder so many people go into debt, and never come out of it. IMO, a money management class should be introduced as a mandatory class in schools. It won't solve everything, but I think it would be a step in the right direction.

[Sugarphreak]

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[max_boost]

Originally posted by Sugarphreak


Best way to even out the distribution of wealth is to teach financial planning and how to invest in school so kids get a basic understanding. My parents had no clue and still don't to this day, nor did I when I got out; financial planning was skill learned by fucking up in my early 20's.



Why does everybody need to be super rich exactly? I have all kinds of goals in life, and being stupid rich so I can "catch up" isn’t one of them.



Older Asians got it right or so it seems. Keep buying property and keep renting them out. :nut:

I could definitely use 10mill or so. :rofl:

[rx7boi]

I agree with Benyl and Feruk. Sugarphreak also has a point when he mentions that you need to be smart with money, but it's not about managing wealth. It's how to create more with what you have.

Anyone who is well-versed in the implications of the distribution of wealth is also aware of the concept of hegemony.

Not only do the rich have access to resources to further increase their funds, but they've been doing that generations upon generations. Look at the invention of Credit.

Hegemony is in every society but you can't possibly force people to give you money. But when you say to the mass that you will lend the money for whatever it is they want, so long as they pay it back with interest, people flock to it and over time, the consequences are the credit crunch that we now see.

For the people who lend, they win big or they take away from people what they are owed.

The only way you win is not to play the game, but you have to play the game because you might not have the money you need. Thus, the only way to win the game is to limit how much you play it.

Old money and new money are in an entirely different league with different rules. They have the power and influence that most people do not.

[sputnik]

I agree with the assertion that the smart get richer and the dumb get poorer. However many think "smart" has more to do with high levels of education or influence but rather I put it in terms of having a healthy view of money.

The smart people are generally going to be ones that live within their means and always consider the future before spending money. While the dumb people are those that spend for the moment and waste TONS of money on depreciating assets.

Both of these groups of people have educated and non-educated people. It also includes people from every income bracket.

I know people that worked hard and have millions in the bank working blue collar jobs their entire lives. They never had crippling mortgages and paid them off quickly, they didn't buy new cars every few years (if ever), cooked their own meals and paid for almost everything they own in cash. They socked money way and invested it wisely.

This is something that is in the reach of EVERYONE.

However our current culture makes us think that our identity and self-worth is what we buy and what we spend. This is what is causing the most damage to our economy and our way of life.

It isn't some evil conspiracy conjured up in a boardroom.

Stop endlessly shopping and be happy with what you have.

[codetrap]

Originally posted by sputnik
I agree with the assertion that the smart get richer and the dumb get poorer. However many think "smart" has more to do with high levels of education or influence but rather I put it in terms of having a healthy view of money.

#4 & #15

http://ca.finance.yahoo.com/news/21-ways-rich-people-think-differently.html?page=all

[ZenOps]

Being a billionaire in the US is a ratio of 442:331,000,000

So roughly one in a million people are Billionaires, the most interesting to me by far being Kyle Bass - who bought 20 million nickels at little over a year ago (each person in the US should have $8 worth of nickels - if spread evenly) and could technically buy up 1/10th of the nickels in the US if he sold his gold holdings.

Khadafi was also pretty cool before "they" whacked him.

[sputnik]

Originally posted by codetrap


#4 & #15

http://ca.finance.yahoo.com/news/21-ways-rich-people-think-differently.html?page=all

#4 - Finding a niche is always a big key to wealth. I know enough people with their MBAs doing little more than functioning as a middle manager buried somewhere in the middle of an org chart. Yet I know wealthy people who have taken a chance of a niche market and have either sold something unique that did well or had a unique skill that no one realized could be a marketable career.

#15 - I am on the fence when it comes to self-help books. On one hand they can be valuable for the socially inept, but on the other hand it turns a bunch of people into robots working a similar system. Just think about how many guys you know that have read Neil Strauss's book, The Game and while it might have worked at first, women started to realize what was going on and it all became very obvious. The same goes with many other books. If everyone reads them, everyone does the same thing and everyone knows what is going on. The guys who come out on top are those that are different from the clones that all read the same book.

While there is value in knowledge, I believe that there is even more value in being secure in who you are and the skills you possess. Confidence is far more powerful than knowing how to be a pickup/schmooze artist. Insecure people will consistently sell themselves short and let others abuse and walk all over them.

[BigMass]

poor guy without a job has 10k. Needs to save it in case of emergencies and can't afford to put it into risky assets. Sticks it in the bank so he has access to it as needed. Rich guy with 1 million sticks it in the stock market fueled by the Fed. Fed steals money from the guy with 10k by keeping rates low and uses it to inflate the stock market %100. Rich guy now has 2 million. Total money between the two is 2,010,000. Headline now reads "American's are wealthier thanks to fed policy". No, the rich are richer, the poor are just as poor and still have no jobs.

25 year old yuppies in Calgary have no idea about the real world and how shitty it is for most people. This city is in a bubble, be thankful for that, not arrogant and believe that you're somehow smarter than anyone else because you just happen to be living in possibly one of the best places economically in the world right now.

[Sugarphreak]

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[FraserB]

It really boils down to people wanting more than what they have and needing to realize they need to be happy with what they have.

Neither of my cars are the newest model and I sure can't afford to buy some of the cars that people I know are buying. I'm buying my first house in a year, but it woun't be as nice as some of theirs. However, I like both my vehicles; they are in good reapir, I have money to put gas in the tank and some left over to mod them. When I buy my house, I'll be able to say that I worked hard for it and I like it. Then I'll probably mod that too:rolleyes:

If you constantly judge your own success by comparing it to that of others, you'll never be happy. I'm sure if I really wanted to I could cry myself to sleep over the fact the someone has a nicer car and house than me, but what good does that do anyone?

No one considers that if they have a roof over their head, some food on their plate, a glass of clean water to drink and a little bit of money, they are better off than the billions of people who don't have those things.

[codetrap]

Originally posted by BigMass
<snip unrealistic example that wouldn't often happen>

<snip incorrect assumptions about knowledge>


sputnik, I think the books that you'll find aren't of the self help variety, but more along the lines of textbooks/treatise/published analysis... actual educational material. For example, if you look at my bookshelf, you'll find a ton of stuff on routing/switching, protocol analysis, circuit design, network design, electrical engineering, technical manuals, garden design, home improvement, auto repair, motorcycle repair, philosophy... etc... basically anything that I could buy and learn something that I could actually apply. No self help books, because that crap is all free online in PDF.

Then there's the fiction section.... because I like to be entertained as well. :)

Of course, I'm not anywhere near being a millionaire, so I'm not exactly the best example.

[sputnik]

Originally posted by codetrap
sputnik, I think the books that you'll find aren't of the self help variety, but more along the lines of textbooks/treatise/published analysis... actual educational material. For example, if you look at my bookshelf, you'll find a ton of stuff on routing/switching, protocol analysis, circuit design, network design, electrical engineering, technical manuals, garden design, home improvement, auto repair, motorcycle repair, philosophy... etc... basically anything that I could buy and learn something that I could actually apply. No self help books, because that crap is all free online in PDF.

For some reason I interpreted this...


"Walk into a wealthy person's home and one of the first things you'll see is an extensive library of books they've used to educate themselves on how to become more successful," he writes.

... as being people who have Rich Dad Poor Dad, The Millionaire Next Door, Think And Grow Rich, Freakonomics and Malcolm Gladwell books all over their shelves.

Something else to consider is the guy who wrote this article authored this book.

http://www.amazon.com/Rich-People-Think-Steve-Siebold/dp/0975500341

He is also only rich from selling books to people who buy this and his other self-help books.

[01RedDX]

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[Kloubek]

Originally posted by FraserB
If you constantly judge your own success by comparing it to that of others, you'll never be happy. I'm sure if I really wanted to I could cry myself to sleep over the fact the someone has a nicer car and house than me, but what good does that do anyone?

No one considers that if they have a roof over their head, some food on their plate, a glass of clean water to drink and a little bit of money, they are better off than the billions of people who don't have those things.

Well said. Of course, few follow this mentality.

What people "aspire" to be always seems to be one level higher than where they are. People in the 3rd world think they would be happy being poor in North America. Poor people want to be middle class and middle class want to be rich, and the rich can never be rich enough.

Oddly, in my travels to less advantaged countries, I've often found the happiest people tend to be the ones who have nothing.

[Sugarphreak]

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[ZenOps]

KENaWXPmBr0

I blame the terrorist commie Rob Anders.