Housing expense vs transportation expense way out of wack?

[variable_x]

Based on 2011 Alberta statistics,

http://www.statcan.gc.ca/tables-tableaux/sum-som/l01/cst01/famil130j-eng.htm

the average household spent 18,300 a year, (~$1525 / month) for housing while they spent 13,465 a year, (~1120 / month) on transportation.

Is it me, or this just seems absurd! Factoring that housing includes property taxes, utilities and mortgage payments, it seems like everyone either has their house paid off or is living in a condo, while driving BMWs.

Just wondering what everyone else thinks about this ratio, spending (~73% of housing on cars).

[msommers]

Calgary Transit sucks.

Lots of people work out of town and could be a contributor.

[BigMass]

seems easy if you factor in parking (downtown $20-$40/day), car, car insurance, car maintenance, gas, etc.

[Sugarphreak]

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[variable_x]

I can understand the transportation cost if a family owns 2 vehicles, but the overall housing cost seems very low to me. I would imagine if a family can afford to spend $1100 a month on cars, they would have a house that costs more than $1500 a month to upkeep.

I just can't grasp the fact that we are spending 73% of housing cost on a depreciating asset. Shouldn't we want to put more of our money in a house? I would either invest more in a house or spend less on a vehicle.

I would think < 50% ratio would be the norm. Personally I would like to keep it < 30%, which means that if you are spending 33% of your income on housing, you spend 10% on cars. With a 73% ratio, it means that we are spending 33% of income on housing and 25% on transportation!

[Sugarphreak]

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[schocker]

What is shelter vs Principal Accommodation?
Does seem like a lot on transportation though :eek:

[benyl]

There is more to transportation that going to work and back. People with kids make multiple trips per day.

Averages aren't really meaningful.

You have executives with $2K / month leases that skew the results.

[Twin_Cam_Turbo]

I spend on average $1415 a month on my car before taking depreciation into account per month. That includes payment, insurance, gas, modifications and maintenance. That's based off driving 35000km a year in my car currently.

I will be spending on average $1600 a month for my townhome, including mortgage payments, condo fees, gas/electricity/water and cable.

There's so many variables to this I don't think just saying averages shows the whole picture.

[flipstah]

Originally posted by Twin_Cam_Turbo
I spend on average $1415 a month on my car before taking depreciation into account per month. That includes payment, insurance, gas, modifications and maintenance. That's based off driving 35000km a year in my car currently.

I will be spending on average $1600 a month for my townhome, including mortgage payments, condo fees, gas/electricity/water and cable.

There's so many variables to this I don't think just saying averages shows the whole picture.

That's a cheap mortgage. :hitit:

[Twin_Cam_Turbo]

Originally posted by flipstah


That's a cheap mortgage. :hitit:

Yeah I saved for a couple years so I could put a nice chunk down and keep the payments low. I'm also expecting $500-600 a month towards that from my renter.

[Manhattan]

Those numbers sound about right if you're talking averages assuming you have 2 cars in your household. $300 to insure both cars, $300 for gas, some maintenance costs tossed in, parking or $180 for 2 transit passes if you work downtown, and that's before depreciation which is typically the most expensive part of car ownership. You've easily hit that average.

That's a huge chunk of incomes spent on just getting to work and a waste of time and money. Live close to work if you can afford it. You can almost get a 2nd mortage with the savings in commute time and costs and not to mention you don't have to deal with commuting in traffic or waiting for a bus that never comes in -30 conditions half of the year.

[variable_x]

Originally posted by flipstah


That's a cheap mortgage. :hitit:

That's more than the average mortgage in Alberta according to statistics, which is $1525 / month including property tax and utilities.

[botox]

Numbers seem about right. We are a family of 4 (me, wife, two kids grades 6 and 4), a van and SUV both by no means are fuel efficient vehicles which plays a big part when we have to drive the kids to their weekly activities. We both also buy monthly bus passes and drive to the bus station.

[mrsingh]

Originally posted by variable_x


That's more than the average mortgage in Alberta according to statistics, which is $1525 / month including property tax and utilities.

I wish my mortgage was this cheap! Working on it now, lump sum payments for the win!

[variable_x]

Originally posted by botox
Numbers seem about right. We are a family of 4 (me, wife, two kids grades 6 and 4), a van and SUV both by no means are fuel efficient vehicles which plays a big part when we have to drive the kids to their weekly activities. We both also buy monthly bus passes and drive to the bus station.

So your mortgage is also that small? My mortgage is WAY higher than the average, which is ~$1100 / month if you subtract monthly utilities and property tax.

[variable_x]

Originally posted by variable_x


So your mortgage is also that small? My mortgage is WAY higher than the average, the average being ~$1100 / month if you subtract monthly utilities and property tax.

[Tik-Tok]

Originally posted by variable_x


That's more than the average mortgage in Alberta according to statistics, which is $1525 / month including property tax and utilities.

Don't forget, the "average" is including people who bought a house 20 years ago for $150g, and still have a mortgage going.

[msommers]

I'm curious about what the average for first-time-home-owners mortgages is in the last 5 years.

All-in for mortgage, insurance, potential condo fees, utilities I'm thinking it's around $2000/month.

[mrsingh]

I bought my first house in 2009, and my current in the beginning of 2011. Definitely no $150,000 home for me totally missed that boat.

My mortgage payment alone is ~$2000 a month. :(

[muse017]

Bought first condo in 2012, and initial mortgage payment was around $980ish and this year I increased payment by 20% and paying around $1200.
With condo fee, insurance, utilities and property tax, I am now paying close to $1700/month.

[CapnCrunch]

I assume it includes people renting as well.

So if you throw all of the beyonders renting in the NE for $750 a month (split 2 ways) with each renter leasing an $800 a month base 3 series with $3000 rims and a $1000 lowering kit and a $5000 stereo, the numbers probably add up.

[Disoblige]

Originally posted by CapnCrunch
I assume it includes people renting as well.

So if you throw all of the beyonders renting in the NE for $750 a month (split 2 ways) with each renter leasing an $800 a month base 3 series with $3000 rims and a $1000 lowering kit and a $5000 stereo, the numbers probably add up.
:rofl: gold

[mrsingh]

Originally posted by CapnCrunch
I assume it includes people renting as well.

So if you throw all of the beyonders renting in the NE for $750 a month (split 2 ways) with each renter leasing an $800 a month base 3 series with $3000 rims and a $1000 lowering kit and a $5000 stereo, the numbers probably add up.

$800 a month should at least put you into a decently equipped 335i. Got to love new graduates in Calgary making $70k a year and blowing it on new cars to look like ballers! :nut:

[G]

Originally posted by mrsingh


$800 a month should at least put you into a decently equipped 335i. Got to love new graduates in Calgary making $70k a year and blowing it on new cars to look like ballers! :nut:

Well if they can't afford the house is Aspen might as well blow it on a car to look the part.

[mrsingh]

Originally posted by G


Well if they can't afford the house is Aspen might as well blow it on a car to look the part.

I don't know why it amuses me so much, when I made $70k a year I drove a car worth $4k on a good day.

[G]

Originally posted by mrsingh


I don't know why it amuses me so much, when I made $70k a year I drove a car worth $4k on a good day.

It amuses me too. Seeing young girls that can't even scrape together $4 for a starbucks coffee carrying purses that cost over $1000. Everybody wants what their parents have right now neglecting the fact that their parents worked hard all their lives to be where they are at now.

[mrsingh]

I was talking to my 21 year old cousin who is school and makes $12/hr working part time. He bought his girlfriend a $600 purse as a gift. I have never bought my wife a purse / bag that expensive and I am far from cheap. I don't understand this generation, it just doesn't compute.

[Sugarphreak]

...

[CanmoreOrLess]

Originally posted by mrsingh
I was talking to my 21 year old cousin who is school and makes $12/hr working part time. He bought his girlfriend a $600 purse as a gift. I have never bought my wife a purse / bag that expensive and I am far from cheap. I don't understand this generation, it just doesn't compute.

My wife would rather have the $600 in a paper bag, thank you very much. Once a Scot... always a Scot.

[BigMass]

nouveau riche... fake it till you make it

[botox]

Originally posted by variable_x


So your mortgage is also that small? My mortgage is WAY higher than the average, which is ~$1100 / month if you subtract monthly utilities and property tax.


Originally posted by Tik-Tok


Don't forget, the &quot;average&quot; is including people who bought a house 20 years ago for $150g, and still have a mortgage going.

Yes, we didn't buy our house 20 years ago, but it's pretty close ;) Should be paid off in the next few years :thumbsup:

[Xtrema]

$300 lease
$100 insurance
$250 gas

x2 for 2 car household.

not hard to do $1200/mth.

Then you have ballers that lease 335i or S4 @ $1000/mth. Since these are everywhere, sounds like average is bang on, lol.

[flipstah]

Originally posted by mrsingh
I was talking to my 21 year old cousin who is school and makes $12/hr working part time. He bought his girlfriend a $600 purse as a gift. I have never bought my wife a purse / bag that expensive and I am far from cheap. I don't understand this generation, it just doesn't compute.

You should teach him a new phrase,

"Gold digger".

May be off-color but that's what it sounds like, unfortunately.

[XylathaneGTR]

Originally posted by msommers
I'm curious about what the average for first-time-home-owners mortgages is in the last 5 years.

All-in for mortgage, insurance, potential condo fees, utilities I'm thinking it's around $2000/month.
I expect to be near that (taking first time possession at the end of this year). $2,000 (all in price) with a 20% down payment.

[mrsingh]

Originally posted by flipstah


You should teach him a new phrase,

&quot;Gold digger&quot;.

May be off-color but that's what it sounds like, unfortunately.

Lol the term I used was 'spoiled'. A lot of these kids have parents who spoil them to no end, they expect that to continue in their relationships.

As for mortgage costs:
On a $500,000 house, with $100,000 down (20%), fixed at 3.00% on a 25 year mortgage it still puts you at $1,900 a month in mortgage payments alone.

I do not know a lot of first time buyers who work in town who typically have greater than the 20%.

[Rat Fink]

.

[BigMass]

$2000 all in is what i'd be comfortable with. Condo fees / utilities / taxes + maintenance. That won't leave me with the option of "Baller Manor" but I don't want to live house poor and be constantly worried about how i'm going to make payments if I happen to lose my job etc.

[variable_x]

Originally posted by Rat Fink
You guys are thinking &quot;Calgary&quot; too much considering this is an Alberta average. Sure, there are places like Fort Mac that are raising the average as well, but there are plenty of towns and cities that are far cheaper than Calgary too.

My house purchased a few months ago is sitting at just under 1300/mo mortgage with less than 10% down payment. Throw property tax and utilities in there and I'm right around 1650-1700/mo. That's for a 1000 sq. ft home with a large yard and garage in a fully developed and nice area.

You are right, this is Alberta. According to http://www.explorecalgaryregion.ca/, Calgary Shelter expenditure totals $22,763 per households, of which, $20,884 is for principle accomodation, with regular mortgage payments of $9091.

The transportation expenditure totals $14,320 per household, of which $12,661 is for private transportation.

[variable_x]

Originally posted by CapnCrunch
I assume it includes people renting as well.

So if you throw all of the beyonders renting in the NE for $750 a month (split 2 ways) with each renter leasing an $800 a month base 3 series with $3000 rims and a $1000 lowering kit and a $5000 stereo, the numbers probably add up.

I guess someone needs to keep the economy going. Maybe I should buy some more bmw stocks.