Recommend a winter friendly vehicle?

[Luxx]

Hopefully this is the right place!

I love my little Honda Civic Coupe but I had a nasty time with it last winter and think I need something bigger. I bought it in Ontario before I moved, and really don't like driving it in Alberta/Calgary.

I'll be the first to admit I know barely anything about cars at all and need some guidance. I don't have a man around at home to help and I think I need to know what the hell I'm talking about before I step into a dealership alone.

I'm planning to trade in my 2008 Honda, and have a decent idea of what I can expect for trade in value on it. My total price range I'm thinking will max out around 30k before sales tax. I've started looking and it seems like there are some good financing deals on right now, if there is one thing I know a bit about its my financial situation and how I'll afford the vehicle lol. From what I've seen it makes more financial sense to buy new (2013 or 2014) than used for me right now.

I'm looking at a compact SUV. I'll be driving a RAV4 tomorrow on the way to some dealerships with family back in Ontario to test driving a Hyundai Tuscon, and maybe Mitsubishi RVR. My parents have the RAV4 and think it will be too big and feel too much like driving a truck and I'd prefer the Tuscon. I just need to feel bigger on the road. I don't see myself getting anything smaller though, like a regular hatchback wouldn't be enough of an improvement for me to consider it worthwhile.

I don't plan on towing anything, and I don't drive a whole lot so even losing the great gas mileage won't hit too hard. I do park outside at all times, but have plug ins at home and where I park during the day for a block heater.

My biggest concern is feeling comfortable driving. I don't have a good sense of spacial awareness or depth perception so it would be a benefit for me to be able to see the front of my vehicle when driving, and all the kinds I'm looking at don't have a trunk. The window is the back of the vehicle so that isn't an issue.

I'm hoping to be able to get a few bells and whistles, this is a long term purchase plan. I'd like to enjoy my vehicle as much five years from now and not wish I had upgraded when I could. I think the biggest thing I need some guidance on is the technical aspects. Will I feel better in an AWD vehicle? Do I need snow tires with AWD or will all seasons be fine? At what point are they trying to sell me something too big for my needs? Is there anything else to know that will help me drive in the snow/ice?

I am not a bad driver, but other drivers, especially the big vehicles are ruthless and dangerous to be around sometimes with what I drive now. I had a lot of problems getting traction last winter with the compacted snow/ice/gravel that is Calgary roadways in the winter.

So just looking for some opinions on what to look for, and what my needs would actually be mechanically so I can go in to a dealership and understand what they are telling me well enough to get the right vehicle.

[Modelexis]

What made/model tires did you have mounted on your civic last winter?

Why not just buy a top of the line winter tire and install them on the civic?
Traction problems = solved.

[n1zm0]

Originally posted by Luxx
I had a lot of problems getting traction last winter with the compacted snow/ice/gravel that is Calgary roadways in the winter.


So you're sure it was the car that had issues in snow/ice/gravel and not your choice (or condition) of tires you were using last winter?

I've driven many cars as winter beaters and it doesn't matter if it's FWD or RWD, a nice new set of decent winter tires will get you through almost anything regular winter driving in Calgary has to throw at you.

An 08 Civic with good winter tires should not have any issues whatsoever in this city even with heavy heavy snowfall. Is it not common in ONT to buy winter tires?

[G-ZUS]

Originally posted by n1zm0


So you're sure it was the car that had issues in snow/ice/gravel and not your choice (or condition) of tires you were using last winter?

I've driven many cars as winter beaters and it doesn't matter if it's FWD or RWD, a nice new set of decent winter tires will get you through almost anything regular winter driving in Calgary has to throw at you.

An 08 Civic with good winter tires should not have any issues whatsoever in this city even with heavy heavy snowfall. Is it not common in ONT to buy winter tires?

:werd: I got around with no problems last winter in my RWD 95 Mercedes with no traction control etc.

[FraserB]

Originally posted by Luxx
I just need to feel bigger on the road.

My biggest concern is feeling comfortable driving. I don't have a good sense of spacial awareness or depth perception so it would be a benefit for me to be able to see the front of my vehicle when driving, and all the kinds I'm looking at don't have a trunk. The window is the back of the vehicle so that isn't an issue.


I'm going to suggest that you hold off on a purchase until you deal with your issues feeling comfortable on the road around larger vehicles. And you solve you eye issues.

With poor awareness and nervousness, you're a hazard.

[Disoblige]

Originally posted by Luxx
Will I feel better in an AWD vehicle? Do I need snow tires with AWD or will all seasons be fine?
Yes you'll probably feel better. And yes you will probably feel even better with snow tires. But get a snow tire that lasts long on dry roads as well, since Calgary is dry most of the time. That way, you don't need to spend $$ on snow tires frequently.

I would personally recommend an Impreza w/ AWD based on your budget. I don't agree that being bigger is better, which is why I recommended this car. Hatchback version looks good too.

Edit: You can get a Juke w/ AWD. 3 advantages: Not too big, AWD, and it's an SUV like you wanted.

[Twin_Cam_Turbo]

Get a Subaru hatchback/wagon with AWD.

[Strider]

Originally posted by Luxx
I just need to feel bigger on the road.

This is such a strange concept... Bigger does not equate to safer.

A bigger vehicle is a heavier vehicle. A heavier vehicle is harder to get going, harder to turn, and harder to stop.

Just reading a few key points in your post, it sounds like you're not a very experienced driver, and putting you behind the wheel of an SUV sounds like an accident waiting to happen.

I'd start with a few basics like winter tires and learning to modulate your throttle better. There was only maybe 1 or 2 days last winter where traction should have been an issue with a civic.

[Twin_Cam_Turbo]

Originally posted by Strider


This is such a strange concept... Bigger does not equate to safer.

A bigger vehicle is a heavier vehicle. A heavier vehicle is harder to get going, harder to turn, and harder to stop.

Just reading a few key points in your post, it sounds like you're not a very experienced driver, and putting you behind the wheel of an SUV sounds like an accident waiting to happen.

I'd start with a few basics like winter tires and learning to modulate your throttle better. There was only maybe 1 or 2 days last winter where traction should have been an issue.

This, and as always "AWD/4X4 doesn't help you stop, or turn"

[ercchry]

EDIT:^^^^^ awd does help you turn, btw.... well, if you turn like 90% of the population its: FWD:plow straight off the road. RWD:go flying off road backwards. AWD:continue around corner


poor spacial awareness and depth perception.... logical response? BIGGER CAR! :rofl:

i'd keep the civic and invest in studded winter tires and go visit the guys out at ghost lake for the winter driving school once that kicks off

[Tik-Tok]

Buses are pretty big.

Here's your key.

http://www.calgarytransit.com/images/2013jan-a-pass.jpg

[sidewaysD]

Originally posted by FraserB


I'm going to suggest that you hold off on a purchase until you deal with your issues feeling comfortable on the road around larger vehicles. And you solve you eye issues.

With poor awareness and nervousness, you're a hazard.


Usually.. I am not a dick to anyone on beyond, but FraserB is right.

Consider getting a winter beater.. incase you hit something or someone hits you.. The damadge is minimal. (you pay $500-$1000 and can insure it one way and if you hit something you are out 500-1000.) Older volvos work best as they have good saftey features and get around town pretty nicley too.
You can have the snappy civic for summer ;) Vroom vroom :love:

In my honest opinion AWD or not.. any drivetrain is safe if you the driver is competent in conditions and understand the drivetrains advtanges/disadvantages. Tires are so critical in sub-zero tempertures as harder composition rubber become usless.

[ExtraSlow]

I'll agree with the people above. You need driver training and new tires, in that order.

[Luxx]

Oops, should have specified I had brand new winter tires last year. Couldn't tell you the make off the top of my head but they are somewhere in the upper end of average quality. I'm positive part of my problem is inexperience in the road conditions. In Ontario where I lived the roads are treated differently, they don't build up a layer of snow and are pretty clear if a little wet/slushy. I also never went through a proper Ontario winter in this vehicle. I managed OK last winter once I put some weight in my trunk.

I think I've made the spacial issues out to be bigger than they are, it is just easier if I can see the front of my vehicle. That's about it. It has never been an issue during actual driving, and I just tend to underestimate if I'd fit into a parking space or not. But I really don't care about parking a few spots down and walking an extra 5 seconds to avoid my car or someone else's getting dinged by a door. I've gotten enough mystery parking lot bumps as it is.

I also have no control over other drivers on the road. There are way more large vehicles in Alberta so maybe I just notice it more there than I did where I lived in Ontario but I'm not the most timid driver on the road by far. Obviously there are way more aggressive drivers than me but I drive like a normal person.

I'm not nervous around big vehicles, I am just aware that some of their drivers (and I've known some personally) are reckless because they know they won't be the ones hurt if something did go wrong. This is the smallest vehicle I've ever driven and at the time of purchase, it was a good choice and the only one I really had but circumstances have changed since then. Before this I was used to driving minivans and a Mazda hatchback.

Aside from the winter driving, I would be getting a new vehicle within a year or two regardless while this one still has some value. I bought what was practical at the time, I have a good job now and I can afford what I would have liked to buy in the first place but couldn't reasonably afford at the time.

I didn't claim to be a really experienced driver, but I could be doing worse. 7 years on the road and never had an incident. I have had close calls (that honestly, would not have been my fault) where I would have been the one screwed. I cannot afford to be in an accident with a vehicle that would crush mine, I've had enough non-vehicular accidents that I'd literally be fucked for life if I was.

I realize this is the internet and all, but some of you are just wasting your time being unhelpful. You have no idea if I'm a good driver or not. Yeah 7 years isn't long at all, but I've been driving since it was legal for me to do so without issue. I could be more aggressive, but I have family members who grew up in Calgary and are excellent on the roads in the winter. They are also extremely aggressive at it and I wouldn't be at all surprised if they had cause someone else to wrap their car around a tree because they think about themselves first instead of remembering there are other people on the road as well.

I need more experience driving in Alberta winters, obviously. But I still don't see how it is better for me to be in a vehicle that is half the size and weight of a lot of others on the roads.

[ercchry]

the fact that you need to see the front of your car is enough information to let us draw the conclusion that you suck at driving. take a course. learn.

ps: sandbag in the trunk of a FWD car?!?! really?? :nut:

[gogreen]

Originally posted by Disoblige

Yes you'll probably feel better. And yes you will probably feel even better with snow tires. But get a snow tire that lasts long on dry roads as well, since Calgary is dry most of the time. That way, you don't need to spend $$ on snow tires frequently.

I would personally recommend an Impreza w/ AWD based on your budget. I don't agree that being bigger is better, which is why I recommended this car. Hatchback version looks good too.

Edit: You can get a Juke w/ AWD. 3 advantages: Not too big, AWD, and it's an SUV like you wanted.

An additional advantage of the Juke is that it's easy to tell where the front end is by virtue of the signal light location on top of the fenders. Good ground clearance in the AWD version too.

That being said, there is merit to the suggestions that perhaps some investment in a driving course may serve you better. An '08 Civic should be more than manageable in the winter with good tires. I drive a '92 Integra with no issues and that's even smaller.

[DEATH2000]

Originally posted by Luxx
I need more experience driving in Alberta winters, obviously. But I still don't see how it is better for me to be in a vehicle that is half the size and weight of a lot of others on the roads. [/B]

Because its easier to control a smaller vehicle then a large one. A large vehicle has more mass, and more mass is harder to stop quickly. Smaller vehicles are also more manueverable.

In the winter, stopping quickly is pretty important.

[gogreen]

^Agreed. Better to avoid the collision than worry about whether or not your vehicle has sufficient mass to put the hurt on the other guy rather than yourself.

What exactly gave you issues with the Civic? Lack of traction when starting/stopping? Where you getting stuck often (not enough ground clearance)?

Or is it that you simply want a different vehicle? Which is perfectly fine, btw.

[jwslam]

My mom owns a 2013 Soul and loves it. Tricked out at $27k just no navi.

DON'T buy the RVR if you care about your rear passengers. Those seats are retched.

[Sugarphreak]

...

[TheStigz]

Originally posted by Luxx
Oops, should have specified I had brand new winter tires last year. Couldn't tell you the make off the top of my head but they are somewhere in the upper end of average quality. I'm positive part of my problem is inexperience in the road conditions. In Ontario where I lived the roads are treated differently, they don't build up a layer of snow and are pretty clear if a little wet/slushy. I also never went through a proper Ontario winter in this vehicle. I managed OK last winter once I put some weight in my trunk.

I think I've made the spacial issues out to be bigger than they are, it is just easier if I can see the front of my vehicle. That's about it. It has never been an issue during actual driving, and I just tend to underestimate if I'd fit into a parking space or not. But I really don't care about parking a few spots down and walking an extra 5 seconds to avoid my car or someone else's getting dinged by a door. I've gotten enough mystery parking lot bumps as it is.

I also have no control over other drivers on the road. There are way more large vehicles in Alberta so maybe I just notice it more there than I did where I lived in Ontario but I'm not the most timid driver on the road by far. Obviously there are way more aggressive drivers than me but I drive like a normal person.

I'm not nervous around big vehicles, I am just aware that some of their drivers (and I've known some personally) are reckless because they know they won't be the ones hurt if something did go wrong. This is the smallest vehicle I've ever driven and at the time of purchase, it was a good choice and the only one I really had but circumstances have changed since then. Before this I was used to driving minivans and a Mazda hatchback.

Aside from the winter driving, I would be getting a new vehicle within a year or two regardless while this one still has some value. I bought what was practical at the time, I have a good job now and I can afford what I would have liked to buy in the first place but couldn't reasonably afford at the time.

I didn't claim to be a really experienced driver, but I could be doing worse. 7 years on the road and never had an incident. I have had close calls (that honestly, would not have been my fault) where I would have been the one screwed. I cannot afford to be in an accident with a vehicle that would crush mine, I've had enough non-vehicular accidents that I'd literally be fucked for life if I was.

I realize this is the internet and all, but some of you are just wasting your time being unhelpful. You have no idea if I'm a good driver or not. Yeah 7 years isn't long at all, but I've been driving since it was legal for me to do so without issue. I could be more aggressive, but I have family members who grew up in Calgary and are excellent on the roads in the winter. They are also extremely aggressive at it and I wouldn't be at all surprised if they had cause someone else to wrap their car around a tree because they think about themselves first instead of remembering there are other people on the road as well.

I need more experience driving in Alberta winters, obviously. But I still don't see how it is better for me to be in a vehicle that is half the size and weight of a lot of others on the roads.

Would you like to go for a coffee with me?
Ill show you how to drive, and maneuver through the toughest conditions and how to be alert and a defensive driver.

:love:

[jwslam]

Originally posted by TheStigz
Would you like to go for a coffee with me?
Ill show you how to drive, and maneuver through the toughest conditions and how to be alert and a defensive driver.

:love:
sounds more like you wanna teach her how to handle a stick shift :devil:

[snowcat]

Any car + correct tires!

[zieg]

The XV Crosstrek is pretty darn nice and has effective awd. Bigger than a civic but it's not a "huge SUV." Might be worth checking out.

[Graham_A_M]

Originally posted by ercchry
the fact that you need to see the front of your car is enough information to let us draw the conclusion that you suck at driving. take a course. learn.

ps: sandbag in the trunk of a FWD car?!?! really?? :nut:

Yeah, that was the part where my brain went on vacation.....

Here, I've started driving when I was 8 at my dads farm, and have never been in an accident ever.... Which isn't too shabby considering Im rocking summer use (*ONLY*) tires on my DD in these kinds of conditions

If you need some help on winter driving, tips, know how of what vehicles to look at (etc etc etc), let me know by PM or whatever.

No I'm not "hitting on you" by offering that either.
:rolleyes:

You'll always see the people that claim winter tires are a must, so is 4wd, but no.... all you need is driving skills.... seriously. Knowing what to do, how to predict and handle situations, what to do at all times, thats 90% of the battle right there. Its not the other way around.
Sure you go out and blow idiotic amounts of money, on a 4wd SUV, or winter tires for it after buying it, OR you can just learn how to properly drive..... which to me is a helluva lot cheaper.

I've taught about 50 people how to drive properly over the years, so I know what to do and so on.

The cool part? You'll have those skills forever, long after any set of winter tires or any SUV.

[Xtrema]

I rocked a Civic for 7 or 8 years without winter tires out of school. 0 accidents.

I have yet to see how even the worse winter tire can't put traction on a Civic. It's not a torque monster.

You didn't buy your winter tires used did you?

$30K budget will get you in a Impreza or Juke and still room for a set of winters. Regardless, I echo others that you need training. Civic on winters is a damn fine winter combo.

[DeleriousZ]

Fiero with balding all seasons. Will learn you how to drive in adverse conditions real quick. Or kill ya, lol.

[reijo]

Yah, come out and take our winter driving course (taught by real racers includes tactics we use on the track adopted for street and, really, any driving - I guarantee you will learn a LOT! If you have not taken a race school, you have not lived! :) ) at Ghost Lake. We can change your driving - just give us a day. :)

R

[Neil4Speed]

Originally posted by reijo
Yah, come out and take our winter driving course (taught by real racers includes tactics we use on the track adopted for street and, really, any driving - I guarantee you will learn a LOT! If you have not taken a race school, you have not lived! :) ) at Ghost Lake. We can change your driving - just give us a day. :)

R

This course is superb, I did it last year, amazing experience and I highly recommend it.

Also gave me a reputation for one wheel burnouts :D

[ercchry]

Originally posted by Neil4Speed


Also gave me a reputation for one wheel burnouts :D

speaking of...

first time in a long while that i've drove a RWD open diff car in these kind of conditions... i dont like it, think i might drive the mustang this winter. so much more predictable

[slammedfc]

studded winters on my civic and its awesome never stuck.


any details on this winter race course?

[ercchry]

Originally posted by slammedfc
studded winters on my civic and its awesome never stuck.


any details on this winter race course?

http://www.beyond.ca/2013-sasc-winter-and-ice-driving-school/23832.html

[flipstah]

Originally posted by ercchry


http://www.beyond.ca/2013-sasc-winter-and-ice-driving-school/23832.html

+1. Buying studded tires this year when it's close for 2014!

[xnvy]

I would say that the winter driving course is your best bet.

I really want to go, haven't made it out to one yet. Hopefully the dates for this year's Ghost Lake school don't conflict with anything.

[Tik-Tok]

Originally posted by ercchry


http://www.beyond.ca/2013-sasc-winter-and-ice-driving-school/23832.html

I take it the mods don't check the article comments for spam? Lol.

[freshprince1]

Wow. Ease up guys. Luxx is admitting he/she needs more experience. Also, he/she wants a bigger car...welcome to Alberta.

Based on what you've mentioned Luxx, i would highly suggest a Subaru Forester. The All-Wheel Drive is fantastic, and is got a higher stance than a car, with good visibility. Get a set of winter tires on the Forester, and you'll get a significant performance increase in winter driving.

Roads out here can suck int he winter, but if you're cautious, you'll do just fine. Leave extra room, don't get going too fast when you don't need to...etc.

Good luck with the hunt.

[slammedfc]

Originally posted by ercchry


http://www.beyond.ca/2013-sasc-winter-and-ice-driving-school/23832.html

thanks man!

[Murray Peterson]

Originally posted by xnvy
I would say that the winter driving course is your best bet.

:werd:

I wouldn't worry about a bigger vehicle or even AWD. Your Civic is actually an amazingly good car for winter driving -- bring it out to the lake and find out what it (and you) can do.

[mrsingh]

Wow I didn't know this even existed, I need to look into this sounds like a lot of fun!

[Canmorite]

Originally posted by ercchry


http://www.beyond.ca/2013-sasc-winter-and-ice-driving-school/23832.html

I hope they post up details about a 2014 winter driving course, would love to do it!

[ercchry]

Originally posted by Canmorite


I hope they post up details about a 2014 winter driving course, would love to do it!

although they are all members here beyond is normally the last place to know. so i'd check out here for details

http://cscc.speedracer.ca/forums/index.php?action=forum

since the sasc site is down

[Canmorite]

Originally posted by ercchry


although they are all members here beyond is normally the last place to know. so i'd check out here for details

http://cscc.speedracer.ca/forums/index.php?action=forum

since the sasc site is down

Ah I was trying that site and it was down. Thanks!

[scboss]

Just invest in a good set of winter tires. Ive driven a RWD 380 hp skyline in winter and was completeley fine. This year ill be rocking a 350z :thumbsup: