Ukraine protests government.

[ZenOps]

Ukraine protests against goverment decision to not be a member of the EU.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/ukraine-proeu-protests-police-forced-to-flee-as-demonstrators-take-over-central-kiev-8975954.html

Q9_TQekf0W0

Can't say I blame them. Inclusion in the EU means you get to own those awesomesauce €1 and €2 Euro coins, which contain a couple grams of nickel each.

Whereas in soviet russia, money owns you.

[ZenOps]

Escalation: Ukraine President forced to leave country.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/ukrainian-president-going-to-china-as-protests-mount-1.2447444

Half a million angry citizens, ouch.

[GAMBLE]

nooooooooooooooooooooo

i was going to move there!!!!!! my fiance lives there lol

[01RedDX]

.

[l/l/rX]

I don't want them to join the EU because that'll make my vacationing more expensive. :banghead:

[ZenOps]

Still escalating

N9wkwwWKSzc

You know its bad when the officers are shoulder to shoulder six men deep.

[busdepot]

Originally posted by GAMBLE
nooooooooooooooooooooo

i was going to move there!!!!!! my fiance lives there lol

Are brides from Ukraine on back order right now? :rofl: jkjk

[GAMBLE]

Originally posted by busdepot


Are brides from Ukraine on back order right now? :rofl: jkjk


been waiting for a year now.
first they sent me the wrong package.

[CapnCrunch]

Originally posted by GAMBLE

first they sent me the wrong package.

Pre-op?

[revelations]

Originally posted by GAMBLE
been waiting for a year now.
first they sent me the wrong package.

Yea, you want to be kinda sure there is a distinct "package" missing ... :nut:

[ZenOps]

Protests continue, now with legally killed protestors.

_OhLUzGvSW4

[Shlade]

But let's just focus on Justin Beiber shall we?

Fucking media

[BrknFngrs]

I'm constantly shocked by how much patience riot police have; no way I could just stand there as someone was trying to kick me, hit me, light me on fire, etc. :nut:

[Feruk]

Originally posted by BrknFngrs
I'm constantly shocked by how much patience riot police have; no way I could just stand there as someone was trying to kick me, hit me, light me on fire, etc. :nut:
What would you do instead? The second they start shooting people, you'll have the same result as Syria. Instead of having stuff thrown at you, you'd have bullets flying at you. I'm actually really impressed that so far only three people have died. Hopefully Europeans are better at working out their problems than the dirty savages in Egypt, Syria, Yemen, and Libya.

[ekguy]

the us has no right to lecture another government about respecting the rights of its citizens. hypocrites...

but good on the people of ukraine for fighting for what they believe in.

[LollerBrader]

Originally posted by ZenOps
Still escalating

You know its bad when the officers are shoulder to shoulder six men deep.

Holy shit - I was amazed at the discipline of the officers in the face of the aggression of the crowd.

[Supa Dexta]

What are they lined up protecting?

[ZenOps]

The last vid where they were shooting the protestors was in front of their Parliament.

As much as I knock Rob Anders for things like sleeping during work, things are still really good in Canada. As long as the government does not rock the petrodollar boat too much, he can sleep as much as he wants.

It has been suggested that the only reason that the Ukraine went to Putin instead of the EU is because Putin offered a sweet deal on cheap natural gas. IE: If Rob Anders had the ability to sell me a few hundred billion dollars worth of natural gas at a 3% discount, I'd buy him lunch. I do prefer a government that has little influence over the markets however, as that just reeks of corruption (happens all the time in China and Russia however)

I can see the point of going with Putin. Cheaper petroleum, water and food is a huge reason to go with one side over the other. Will Californians who have no water defect or seek refugee status in Canada? I don't want them here, lol.

Afterall, you can't eat gold (or nickel) - And if you are starving and cold, food and natural gas is more important. IMO: They are not ready for entry into the EU, they would probably be crushed just like Greece.

On the flipside: Latvia went to the EU just recently. Time may tell which side was better for the people.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-12-31/latvia-becomes-18th-euro-area-member-as-public-animosity-lingers.html

[ZenOps]

Now with tanks.

uljG3xacCPw

Bad night last night. Escalation continues.

Nine protestors dead, several police badly burned and injured by bricks.

Police now have live round Kalashnikovs. Military is at the outskirts of the city.

85WBb9xA9AI

How do you take down a million dollar tank with $100 worth of gasoline? Starve it of oxygen and roast it of course.

[Arash Boodagh]

ZenOps, western allied bankers overthrew the Russian monarch and installed the Bolsheviks leading to 10 million Ukranians dying of famine. Its said that cannibalism was rif at that time.
Do you really think those same banking power that run the west and Nato, have the best interest for Ukraine?

Also do you know how billions in trade Ukraine will lose to Russia if was to open to the E.U. and what prospects it will get from the broke EU in return?

[ZenOps]

I don't think bankers have any more or less interest in any nation other than ones that are easily controllable.

Ukraines situation is not unique, every nation now has an underclass that the bankers will take advantage of (usually through currency, interest, and commodity manipulation)

The US has a much stronger propoganda machine for its local citizenry, even though arguably they are pushing the majority of citizens into debt slavery far worse than Zimbabwe. Propoganda is how they maintain strength, faith and subservience to the US dollar (although technically, its a FED dollar and not a US dollar)

When there is a conflict of propoganda between ideologies (like between Russia and the US) thats when the citizenry starts to polarize. Propoganda is not all on one side, and you get conflicts.

I will say that I think the Russian path is a much much slower path to prosperity. There are very few if any get rich schemes in a communist system. Some people need dreams and hope in order to survive, others are fine with just bread and water.

Canada is also on a much slower path than the US, but its also much safer. We don't spend trillions to go to the moon, and hope that the debt burden does not cripple future generations.

[Arash Boodagh]

Just like the rusting cast iron pans in your avatar, you're advocating the spreading of this rust through out the world by these bankers... and at whose expense? Starting at the most destitute of people through out the world... like resource rich Africans who starve to death and die of simple disease in droves to the Anglo Europeans who are committing suicide because the same bankers have scammed them and their countries economies in such deep debt.
What will the global society look like if the whole pan was rusted because everyone looked out for their own short term interest?
How about another mass genocide of 300 million people by these bankers, it wouldnt be their first time.

As for Ukraine's economy...
"Currently the unemployment rate in the European Union is 24% for persons under 25, and 12% overall.
In Ukraine its 8% for both figures.
....
On top of that Ukraine will loose over 100 billion in trade with Russia if it signs this agreement... something like 160 billion till 2017.

What does the broke EU have to offer Ukraine other then an American military base at Russia's front door"

edit-
Lastly I feel only a minority are on the streets protesting, this is not the whole countries feelings... most of the protesters are probably long term members of groups which are funded by the U.S.
One other thing, Im curious on how Russia's system is communist?

[ZenOps]

Each side has its merits and downfalls.

There is such thing as mutual benefit. Prosperity is not a zero sum game where one person has to lose for someone else to win. It is possible for Ukraine to be productive and actively trade with other nations for its services and goods to benefit of all.

But its very unlikely that the Ukraine can compete with Germany in a goods production capacity. Under the EU, given the choice between a car made in Germany or a car made in the Ukraine, nearly everyone would choose Germany.

Could the middle east compete against Germany? No. Could Canada compete against Germany? No.

That is my dose of reality.

So yes, Ukraine is arguably better under Putin.

[Maybelater]

Probably the best, highest quality footage I've seen so far: http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=58b_1392877307

Can't hyper link liveleak, sorry.

[cancer man]

Originally posted by Maybelater
Probably the best, highest quality footage I've seen so far: http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=58b_1392877307

Can't hyper link liveleak, sorry.

Terrible situation.

[euro_racer]

Don't think I saw it anywhere but riots and protests across Bosnia as well this last week. Can't forget what's happening Venezuela also.... Civil uprising seems to be pretty popular these days. Wonder what this will eventually mean? Is it for the better or worse?

[ZenOps]

Venezuela is having an economic crisis.

$31,000 fridge. Which is arguably just as bad as a $16 pineapple in nunavut.

Of course we in Canada, will sit back (because were actually on the side that is gaining, the oil side.) Litmus test for me that things have gotten bad enough here to start worrying would be if Quebec has a mass protest of some sort.

[Sugarphreak]

...

[HiTempguy1]

Originally posted by euro_racer
Don't think I saw it anywhere but riots and protests across Bosnia as well this last week. Can't forget what's happening Venezuela also.... Civil uprising seems to be pretty popular these days. Wonder what this will eventually mean? Is it for the better or worse?

The world has just gone through what is arguably it's most peaceful couple decades in per capita deaths (from what I am lead to understand). I personally believe shit will get much more real before it gets much better...

[roll_over]

Just over an hour untill they attack and kill the prez who's watching

Taking bets he walks or gets merked

[ZenOps]

kSJ8vhKmyTc

Ouch... Harsh but probably true.

I figure a citizen has until about Sunday night (end of olympics) to safely get their money and physical self out of Ukraine before it gets real. Anyone with means should be considering at the very least a two month holiday with any relatives in any other nation.

Once that line is crossed where you bring the Russian army in (which is huge, make no mistake - its land forces arguably are larger and better paid than the US) Its pretty much game over for physical movement.

[01RedDX]

.

[Maybelater]

"Ukrainian protesters currently playing golf on the President's residence in Kiev"
http://i.imgur.com/NPoU5fp.jpg

Live news coverage: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y_LFrMcoEm4#t=1364376

[ZenOps]

The local police know the score. They would be crushed along with the protestors if the army comes in. A little metal shield might as well be tissue paper.

Shelling tends to take out everyone within a radius. It does not discriminate.

[Maybelater]

Originally posted by ZenOps
The local police know the score. They would be crushed along with the protestors if the army comes in. A little metal shield might as well be tissue paper.

Shelling tends to take out everyone within a radius. It does not discriminate.

Think about all that scrap metal that would be left behind from the shells!

Also the army released a statement saying it won't become engaged the 'domestic' matter.

[ZenOps]

Meh, its all poor quality stuff anyhow.

A Kalashnikov goes for about $20. The metal shields that the Russian cops use are probably aluminized steel (meaning, about $15 at most)

Really, I'd pay a solid $40 to get my hands on one of those completely clear shields (that they tend to use before the escalate to the full metal shield)

This is squarely a fight for the power to keep the people paying for property tax, water, natural gas, and electricity.

The elites only use the police for as long as they can remain loyal, but just like protestors probably see them as expendable in the greater picture. Army, also useful as a tool - but also expendable.

The smart law enforcement types probably know when to call it quits and abandon their now absent government. IE: That the government funds the army with million dollar tanks, and police with $100 worth of equipment does not usually fool anyone. If the army is expendable, how low on the totem pole is a police officer?

[Toma]

What?!?!?!?

The US and CIA are funding and promoting unrest??

No Way!!!

[Toma]

This is pretty serious though, as we are IMO about to see a CIA versus Russia show down in Ukraine.

[ZenOps]

My guess for next step would be sabre rattling with tanks.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BMP-1

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/cc/BMP-1_firing_arcs.png/800px-BMP-1_firing_arcs.png

Send a few hundred BMP-1, 2 or 3's in the city streets as a show of force. Along with a water cannon contingent for the nasty molotov throwers. Strictly for show, no shooting, yet.

If they send any more than that, the streets will absolutely collapse under the weight. There is also no need for anything larger than 73mm, I'm pretty sure they would try to take the city more or less intact - so a pure infantry fighting vehicle like the BMP instead of more devastating measures.

Demand capitulation of any remaining police force. Detain dissenters, but absorb leadership and refit police as weak infantry.

Wait for response from Obama admin.

But not before monday.

[Toma]

Don't forget.... this was all started by the CIA and others with the "Orange Revolution" way back to begin with.

Ukraine/Russian border is second biggest in EU. TONS of Ukrainians work in Russia, and make the commute.

Ukraine's unemployment rate is 8%, and destroys the EU's ~20% (official number is 12.1%.). Eurozone is a central bankers heaven, and is doomed to fail, as we see with the economies it has destroyed.

Since it is directly on the Russian border, this is a economic, security, and political matter for the Russians, and they will NOT let some feeble warnings stop them. Western control of Ukraine would mean NATO bases on Russia's border. Russia wont allow that anymore than the US would allow Russian bases on their border.
__________________

[Toma]

Re "Orange Revolution" (the original stimulus for the destabilization) and the like....


Activists in each of these movements were funded and trained in tactics of political organisation and nonviolent resistance by a coalition of Western pollsters and professional consultants who were partly funded by a range of Western government and non-government agencies but received most of their funding from domestic sources. According to The Guardian, the foreign donours included the U.S. State Department and USAID along with the National Democratic Institute for International Affairs, the International Republican Institute, the NGO Freedom House and George Soros's Open Society Institute. The National Endowment for Democracy, a foundation supported by the U.S. government, has supported non-governmental democracy-building efforts in Ukraine since 1988. Writings on nonviolent struggle by Gene Sharp contributed in forming the strategic basis of the student campaigns.

Former president Leonid Kravchuk accused Russian oligarch, Boris Berezovsky (the Oligarch Russia jailed for being a corrupt scumbag), of financing Yushchenko's campaign on 14 September 2005. Yushchenko denied Berezovsky financed his election campaign. Financing of election campaigns by foreign citizens is illegal in Ukraine. At first Berezovsky refused to confirm or deny Kravchuk's allegations, but in November 2005 he did claim that indeed he had heavily financed the Orange Revolution.

Lot's of outsiders fueling and funding "Pro West" unrest..... sad that they feel compelled to meddle and ruin lives, over an ideology

[Toma]

Hahahaha. Canada, playing 'America Wannabe'.... Just threatened Russia with Sanctions if they 'disturb the peace'.

Hahahhahahhaha.... On so many levels lol.

[Datsun-Fever]

Originally posted by Toma
Hahahaha. Canada, playing 'America Wannabe'.... Just threatened Russia with Sanctions if they 'disturb the peace'.

Hahahhahahhaha.... On so many levels lol.

Do you have a link to the source, friend?

Thanks

[Toma]

http://ww2.nationalpost.com/m/wp/blog.html?b=news.nationalpost.com/2014/02/23/ukraine-united-states-russia

[ZenOps]

Canada sanctions does have teeth. We have what Ukrainians need, food (grain), oil and natural gas.

US sanctions have no teeth, they do not export excess oil and for the first time this year - may have some difficulty with vegetables, fruit, beef, etc at home.

The US can print up $15 billion dollars to match the $15 billion dollars worth of natural gas that Putin has promised in a matter of a few days (They are afterall, buying their own debt at $75 Billion per month, every month) But thing is - the US proclaimation is only on paper, they cannot and do not have the ability to ship $15 billion dollars worth of natural gas.

You can't eat gold, but you also can't burn US dollars to keep warm in winter. And California porn, dvd's, and facebook mean nothing when you are trying to keep warm.

Exiled President Yanukovich now wanted on mass murder charge

http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/02/24/us-ukraine-idUSBREA1G0OU20140224

Ukraine now seeks $35 Billion in emergency aid (oil, food, munitions, etc.)

http://www.sfgate.com/business/bloomberg/article/Ukraine-Sees-35-Billion-Aid-Need-as-Yanukovych-5261689.php

Thing is... It very well may be that 51% of Ukraine wants to join the EU, but does Germany want to bail out Ukraine for a few hundred billion?

[01RedDX]

.

[cancer man]

Hired Mercs no badges on uniforms and nobody is talking.Good luck Ukraine.

[dubhead]

Originally posted by 01RedDX
Russian invasion of Crimea is under way. Time to remind those CIA-backed neo-fascists in Kiev who they're fucking with.

Right because Putin doesn't have all the hallmarks of a Fascist dictator :nut:

[01RedDX]

.

[Supa Dexta]

qqznq5hCkXE

[ZenOps]

Could be US soldier of fortune, if they aren't in - they will be very soon.

Putin mobilized a lot more that I expected so far (and people usually call *me* crazy). Helicopters, jets, and navy along with mech infantry.

Nice show of force, and the shooting hasn't even started - yet.

If he is concentrating on Crimea and not Kiev, he is thinking military naval campaign and not simply crushing an insurrection. I'm thinking - possible extended military campaign outside of Ukraine.

If you start the snowball rolling, might as well see how far it will go. Putin might as well set his sights to Italy, no reason not to. Ukraine on its own is a military cakewalk.

[hampstor]

Considering Russia has now authorized military force in the Ukraine, shit is going to get real soon.

Honestly, Obama will do fuck all, the general public has no appetite for US-intervention anywhere that has no direct relevance to them.

If I was a country with a militarized neighbour that is relying on the US to come to the rescue in a shooting war (ie: Japan, Taiwan, or the NATO Baltic states bordering Russia), I would seriously consider an arms build up cause 'Murica will not be coming to the rescue.

[HiTempguy1]

Originally posted by 01RedDX
Russian invasion of Crimea is under way. Time to remind those CIA-backed neo-fascists in Kiev who they're fucking with.

Are you retarded?

This whole thing started with Ukraine pulling out of a HUGELY beneficial deal with the EU because Russia meddeled in their affairs. Fuck, some of you guys are dense. It blows my mind that there are actually people like you on this planet. What fucking right does Russia have to invade Ukraine? None!.

But apparently its perfectly ok for Russia to do so in your world, and to rape.and pillage the economy of another country for their own gain. Jesus :banghead: Pot meet the damn kettle you bunch of hypocritical idiots.

[ICEBERG]

Originally posted by HiTempguy1


What fucking right does Russia have to invade Ukraine? None!.


Blame Bush..:D

What right did U.S had to invade Iraq.. Fu@king bush started everything.

On a other note...

Obama: Warning to Russia

The United States urged Russia on Friday to pull back from the Crimea region or face possible consequences.

"We are now deeply concerned by reports of military movements taken by the Russian Federation inside Ukraine," U.S. President Barack Obama said in televised comments from the White House.

"...It would be a clear violation of Russia's commitment to respect the independence and sovereignty and borders of Ukraine and of international laws."

Obama said any violation of Ukraine's sovereignty and territorial integrity would be "deeply destabilizing, and he warned "the United States will stand with the international community in affirming that there will be costs for any military intervention in Ukraine."


Yea.. U.S is going to DO NOTHING....


:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[rx7_turbo2]

Originally posted by HiTempguy1


Are you retarded?


Yes, yes he is:rofl:

[Toma]

Originally posted by HiTempguy1


Are you retarded?

This whole thing started with Ukraine pulling out of a HUGELY beneficial deal with the EU because Russia meddeled in their affairs. Fuck, some of you guys are dense. It blows my mind that there are actually people like you on this planet. What fucking right does Russia have to invade Ukraine? None!.

But apparently its perfectly ok for Russia to do so in your world, and to rape.and pillage the economy of another country for their own gain. Jesus :banghead: Pot meet the damn kettle you bunch of hypocritical idiots.

No, the whole thing started with the US's meddling in Europe, fueling unrest, funding "opposition", the whole "Orange Revolution" 10 years ago was a sham orchestrated by the west.

This is Russia's house. On their border, half of Ukraine is Pro Russian, and a third are Russians, on Russias border.

You think they are gonna allow a Nato base on their border?

What did the US do when Cuba wanted Russian missiles? Right, they put sanctions on that country that lasted 50+ years, and almost went to nuclear war over what they feel entitled to now.

This was a violent, "western backed and funded" overthrow over an elected government. Thew country is split 50/50.

They are gonna have to learn to get along when they lose an election. Simple as that.

Look at the US, ALWAYS split 50/50. and they aren't in a civil war every time their side loses an election (though the right wing element would always want violence)

[rx7_turbo2]

^So is he.

[Toma]

A more level headed article


Russia could send a "limited contingent" of troops to the Ukrainian region of Crimea to assure the security of Russia's Black Sea Fleet and its citizens, the speaker of the upper house of parliament said Saturday.

"It is possible in this situation... to send a limited contingent of troops to ensure the security of the Black Sea Fleet and Russian citizens," said Federation Council chief Valentina Matviyenko, in theory Russia's number three figure after the president and the prime minister.

"The decision lies with the president of our country, the commander in chief (Vladimir Putin). But looking at the situation today, such a scenario cannot be excluded. We have to protect people," she said.

Her comments were the first time a Russian official has directly spoken of sending Russian troops into Crimea.

She said that Ukraine is home to a "huge number of dangerous objects", including nuclear power stations, that need protection.

[Toma]

It's the modern democratic world. Those right wing idiots are gonna have to learn, that democracy means that they have to respect the elected government EVEN WHEN THEIR CANDIDATE loses.

You can't say, "yeah, lets vote". If your guys wins, it would be "see, we won, Yay". But if you lose, it's "lets take to the streets, take up guns, bombs, violence and get our way anyway".

Fucking wingnuts sore loser imbeciles.

[HiTempguy1]

Toma, you are batshit crazy. Your ideological hatred of anything you deem western/conservative/capitalistic is unerving. Once again, what RIGHT does Russia have to do anything in this situation? Nothing. End of discussion. That is the same way you feel about the US doing anything outside their borders.If you don't support that stance, you're just a hypocritical piece of crap troll. Put your money where your mouth is.

Edit-
You mention a nato base on Russias border... its not Russia's decision. This isn't the 80's, welcome to the 21st century. The Ukranian people have the right to figure their shit out, even if it costs lives. Its not the wests or easts choice. Itis theirs. And I certainly hope the US stays the hell out for everyone's sake.

[rx7_turbo2]

Toma a troll? You don't say:rofl:

He constantly lures otherwise rational posters into responding to the nonsense he spews on an almost hourly basis. Not a single member of this forum has been able to resist it. To be honest I'm more shocked there's members of this forum that don't have him on their ignore list and just refuse to engage in his insanity, than his insanity itself.

[jutes]

Originally posted by rx7_turbo2
Toma a troll? You don't say:rofl:

He constantly lures otherwise rational posters into responding to the nonsense he spews on an almost hourly basis. Not a single member of this forum has been able to resist it. To be honest I'm more shocked there's members of this forum that don't have him on their ignore list and just refuse to engage in his insanity, than his insanity itself.

Ignore button FTW. :clap:

Ukraine is a shit hole, they are probably better off under Russian rule anyway, not that Russia is any better.

[Toma]

Originally posted by HiTempguy1
Toma, you are batshit crazy. Your ideological hatred of anything you deem western/conservative/capitalistic is unerving. Once again, what RIGHT does Russia have to do anything in this situation? Nothing. End of discussion. That is the same way you feel about the US doing anything outside their borders.If you don't support that stance, you're just a hypocritical piece of crap troll. Put your money where your mouth is.

Edit-
You mention a nato base on Russias border... its not Russia's decision. This isn't the 80's, welcome to the 21st century. The Ukranian people have the right to figure their shit out, even if it costs lives. Its not the wests or easts choice. Itis theirs. And I certainly hope the US stays the hell out for everyone's sake.

Did you support US intervention in Iraq? Afghanistan? Kosovo? Ukraine? Venezuela? Cuba

Is military intervention any different than creating the unrest through money and the CIA in the first place?

Do they not have a right to defend their military bases, and millions of Russian people near their border?

Can you give me ONE REASON that if a country is 50/50 divided in political affiliation.......

Call them Left and Right. When the "right" won, did the left take up violence and overthrow the elected government to get their way? They let the idiot ruin the country, and run it's course.

Then, when the "Left" won, NOW the right will have none of it, and took to violence?

Can you give me one good reason that is acceptable? Why would "we" support this behavior?

And the "80's"??? Have we evolved since the 80's?? How recent a history should we ignore as being irrelevant?

No lessons from WW1? WW2? Vietnam? 20 years? 10 years? 6 months?

Don't be an idiot. Debate my argument, don't kick and scream like an emotional little girl.

[Toma]

A reminder how this shit "started" in the first place.... (RECENT history, since you are short sighted).

In case you missed it the first time, THESE ARE the SAME people currently taking up violence against the ELECTED government.



Activists in each of these movements were funded and trained in tactics of political organisation and nonviolent resistance by a coalition of Western pollsters and professional consultants who were partly funded by a range of Western government and non-government agencies but received most of their funding from domestic sources. According to The Guardian, the foreign donours included the U.S. State Department and USAID along with the National Democratic Institute for International Affairs, the International Republican Institute, the NGO Freedom House and George Soros's Open Society Institute. The National Endowment for Democracy, a foundation supported by the U.S. government, has supported non-governmental democracy-building efforts in Ukraine since 1988. Writings on nonviolent struggle by Gene Sharp contributed in forming the strategic basis of the student campaigns.

Former president Leonid Kravchuk accused Russian oligarch, Boris Berezovsky (the Oligarch Russia jailed for being a corrupt scumbag), of financing Yushchenko's campaign on 14 September 2005. Yushchenko denied Berezovsky financed his election campaign. Financing of election campaigns by foreign citizens is illegal in Ukraine. At first Berezovsky refused to confirm or deny Kravchuk's allegations, but in November 2005 he did claim that indeed he had heavily financed the Orange Revolution.

[Toma]

Originally posted by jutes


Ignore button FTW. :clap:

Ukraine is a shit hole, they are probably better off under Russian rule anyway, not that Russia is any better.

maybe a shit hole....

but the women are hot

[Datsun-Fever]

I think, that in the west, Russians and the Russian government will always be viewed as aggressors and warmongers, capable of only causing death and destruction. They will always be viewed in this way because they are portrayed this way. To believe that Russia should completely throw up its arms and do nothing in this situation is pretty stupid, its not going to happen. The Ukraine and Russia have a very long, and complex relationship in which borders are not as clearly drawn out as people would like to think. For Russia to do nothing and allow the entire Ukraine to cede to the EU and the west would be insanity on their part.

[01RedDX]

.

[Supa Dexta]

Is it a good time to get a hot Ukrainian woman, or has that boat sailed?

[Sugarphreak]

...

[HiTempguy1]

Originally posted by 01RedDX
I
At least some people actually understand the situation and are capable of analyzing it rationally.

Yes, because getting your news from RT is such an unbiased source. LOL :nut:

And also, some people in the US still think the wrong side won the civil war. That doesn't mean they are particularly right, or that their opinion is even a valid one. The fact that you are going on and on and on about neo-nazis and the like just goes to show how much of a nut like Toma you are :rofl:

[01RedDX]

.

[Toma]

Originally posted by HiTempguy1


Yes, because getting your news from RT is such an unbiased source. LOL :nut:

And also, some people in the US still think the wrong side won the civil war. That doesn't mean they are particularly right, or that their opinion is even a valid one. The fact that you are going on and on and on about neo-nazis and the like just goes to show how much of a nut like Toma you are :rofl:

I may be a nut, I may be crazy, I may be a socialist, a troll, a communist, gay, muslim, a hater, whatever.

Makes no difference, you are always wrong or irrelevant to any conversation I have ever seen here.

That goes for blocked rx7 dweeb as well.

[HiTempguy1]

Originally posted by Toma


Makes no difference, you are always wrong or irrelevant to any conversation I have ever seen here.


Weird, I think the same thing about you and your lackey. How strange...

[Sugarphreak]

...

[01RedDX]

.

[01RedDX]

.

[rx7_turbo2]

****edit****

01RedDx
On occasion I do go back and read your posts (rarely). If you looked in this thread I have not posted anything regarding the topic, just took pot shots at Toma.

Your knowledge base regarding this thread topic is beyond what anyone else in the thread could claim. I'm legitimately interested in your point of view on these issues. I'll go back to hating you in another thread ;)

[Nitro5]

From what I read I see medling by both the US and Russia. Neither side is 'right'

[FixedGear]

Edited to remove the pointless insult. :)

[rx7_turbo2]

Oh relax Fixedgear.

You've been a member of this forum for less than 2 years, I'm working on my 12th. You'll need a few more years under your belt before you're qualified to make a claim about who's the biggest idiot on Beyond.

[FixedGear]

Originally posted by rx7_turbo2
Oh relax Fixedgear.

You've been a member of this forum for less than 2 years, I'm working on my 12th. You'll need a few more years under your belt before you're qualified to make a claim about who's the biggest idiot on Beyond.

I've been here since 2004.

[rx7_turbo2]

Originally posted by FixedGear


I've been here since 2004.

What was your previous username/usernames?

"Fixedgear joined 04-10-2012"

[JRSC00LUDE]

Hmmm. Idiot contest?

I'm in.

[GTS4tw]

Me too! Where is the love FixedGear?

[rx7_turbo2]

Given what I've seen on Beyond I can't imagine I even make the Top 100. I've never even been banned:dunno: Extra respect always goes to the members who've been here 10+ years and posted under the same username and only that username the whole time.

[jutes]

I, myself, personally, am from Odessa and its sad to see the current state of affairs in Ukraine. I've only been back once since I left in 90' and to be honest the country had it coming. Not that I agree how a democratically elected president can just be overthrown with force because he is corrupt. The general consensus I got is that people over there just don't care. I spent a few days in Poland and the difference was overwhelming, no trash on the streets, no idiots on the road. It was almost western-like. I don't know enough about this whole mess, but IMHO Ukraine needs a massive overhaul or else just split the country.


Originally posted by 01RedDX
As far as I know, Russia is re-entering historically Russian regions to protect its own people from western-backed ultra-nationalists and is being welcomed with open arms, while the US is actively involved in bombing civilians of completely unrelated countries around the world.

Seems legit, I'd buy it. :thumbsup:

[sillysod]

Originally posted by jutes
I spent a few days in Poland .... no trash on the streets

Don't know what part of Poland you were in but there is shit everywhere. I'm Eastern Euro and every time I go back I see the ditches full of shit and just general messes everywhere.

You won't see it from the highway, but take an exit and get off the main roads...

[jutes]

Originally posted by sillysod


Don't know what part of Poland you were in but there is shit everywhere. I'm Eastern Euro and every time I go back I see the ditches full of shit and just general messes everywhere.

You won't see it from the highway, but take an exit and get off the main roads...

Hmm, maybe I didn't see enough of it. :dunno:

[m10-power]

Funny to read how US is to blame for this happening, now they are neo nazis when I thought they were jew lovers?

Also interesting how people dont see the obvious problem with Russia invading another Country which was doing nothing to threaten outside countries beyond attempting to join the EU.

Russian = Eastern European Terrorist Organization

I think Russia not winning gold in mens hockey drove putin over the top. Seems russia is tops at figure skating...

[FraserB]

Originally posted by m10-power


Also interesting how people dont see the obvious problem with Russia invading another Country which was doing nothing to threaten outside countries beyond attempting to join the EU.

Russian = Eastern European Terrorist Organization


Ah yes, I forgot that when the US invades a country for no reason and overthrows a government it's ok. But when Russia invades a country where it has real interests, it's terrorism and they are automatically the bad guys.

[rx7_turbo2]

Originally posted by FraserB


Ah yes, I forgot that when the US invades a country for no reason and overthrows a government it's ok.

I don't think the U.S has ever invaded a country for no reason:dunno: The reason may not always be clear or justified to the layman, but rest assured a reason exists.

[FraserB]

Originally posted by rx7_turbo2


I don't think the U.S has ever invaded a country for no reason:dunno: The reason may not always be clear or justified to the layman, but rest assured a reason exists.

Still, a lot of people are applying a ridiculous double standard in this situation. When the US invaded Iraq I can't recall Harper admonishing them for it. It can be easily argued that Russia has just as much, if not more, justification for going into Ukraine as the US did in Iraq.

[CompletelyNumb]

Originally posted by rx7_turbo2
The reason may not always be clear or justified to the layman, but rest assured a reason exists.


Isn't that a problem though? Seems to me that a simple "There's a reason, you just dont get it" isn't good enough justification from the leaders of a country.

[rx7_turbo2]

Originally posted by FraserB


Still, a lot of people are applying a ridiculous double standard in this situation. When the US invaded Iraq I can't recall Harper admonishing them for it. It can be easily argued that Russia has just as much, if not more, justification for going into Ukraine as the US did in Iraq.

That might be the case. My issue is with the sentiment that the US does things for "no reason" like they're just some random war mongering country looking for the next conflict. Whether people agree with they're foreign policy or not it would be naive to believe that it's random and without purpose.

[rx7_turbo2]

Originally posted by CompletelyNumb



Isn't that a problem though?

Yes absolutely.

[JAYMEZ]

It'll be interesting to see what US will do with this , as well as the rest of Europe . Im just surprised NK hasn't done anything to cry for attention . I think in this day and age , two huge military powers would never war against each other. Just a whole lot of flexin .

[rx7_turbo2]

Originally posted by JAYMEZ
It'll be interesting to see what US will do with this , as well as the rest of Europe . Im just surprised NK hasn't done anything to cry for attention . I think in this day and age , two huge military powers would never war against each other. Just a whole lot of flexin .

No doubt part of this is a dick waving contest.

[FraserB]

Originally posted by JAYMEZ
It'll be interesting to see what US will do with this , as well as the rest of Europe . Im just surprised NK hasn't done anything to cry for attention . I think in this day and age , two huge military powers would never war against each other. Just a whole lot of flexin .

Nothing will happen. Obama and Harper will kick and scream on the sidelines, maybe not go to a summit or two and freeze some assets. Putin will just keep doing what he's doing and give the West the finger from his newly acquired territory.

The US won't commit any military forces and the Russians would simply wipe the floor with anyone else who tried to intervene.

[Toma]

Didn't you hear? The US sent a earthquake to Crimea using HAARP?

:rofl:

http://www.turnerradionetwork.com/news/331-mjt

[max_boost]

Originally posted by rx7_turbo2


I don't think the U.S has ever invaded a country for no reason:dunno: The reason may not always be clear or justified to the layman, but rest assured a reason exists. I dunno I just lol'd at this lol