Thoughts? 2014 Dodge Ram EcoDiesel - 3L Turbo

[Ekliptix]

Anyone looking at these? Has not been a diesel in a 1/2 ton forever.
http://www.ramtrucks.com/en/ecodiesel/
http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/2014-ram-1500-ecodiesel-v-6-first-drive-review

Power: 240 hp @ 3600 rpm
Torque: 420 lb-ft @ 2000 rpm
8 speed auto
9,200lb towing capacity
People are getting high 20's and even 30+ mpg unloaded highway, low 20's in the city. Mid teens towing.

I just got back from driving from Calgary to Sicamous and back driving my Brother's 2010 1/2 ton GMC 5.3L. We were towing a 2 place enclosed trailer with 2 snowmobiles in it. Average fuel economy was about 9.8mpg (Canadian gallons via the display) doing 5-10km/h over the speed limit. Even if the truck wasn't downshifting and doing 3,200rpm, it was still eating gas hard.

I think these would have been ideal conditions for the new EcoDiesel to shine, a 1,500-5,000lb load on the highway. Even with diesel being ~18cents/L more then gas right now, I'd expect at least a 50% improvement in mpg performance over the gaser we towed with over the weekend.

Now, if I were pulling a 26' boat with a cuddy, I'd want a 3/4 ton truck to have some mass relative to the boat. But, for sub 5,000lb pulling, I think this truck would kick ass.

One negative is the price. I believe you can get into this truck with a diesel for low $30's. However, is sure adds up quick if you want leather, a crew cab, etc.

The storage in the side of the box seems handy too.

If someone needs a commuter vehicle that can tow 2 sleds and handle winter, is there much better? How about the cost vs a used 3/4 diesel for less up front cost, or are there any used 1/2 tons gasers that get decent fuel mileage? I know the Ford EcoBoost is poor on gas when towing.

There are rumors of a 5L turbo diesel coming to Nissan in 2015, and the Chevy Canyon is suppose to have a Cummings 2.8L turbo diesel in 2015 too with 6,500lb towing capacity....
:whipped:

[Boosted131]

As far as the economical v8 gasers go, that 5.3 is actually very good.

[heavyfuel]

Diesel is facing some serious pussification. Either be a eco warrior hippy who thinks you're gonna save the world by burning less fuel, or own a diesel truck. Can't have both. Or wait- now looks like you can.


Originally posted by Ekliptix


Chevy Canyon is suppose to have a Cummings 2.8L turbo diesel in 2015 too with 6,500lb towing capacity....
:whipped:

IT'S CUMMINS NOT CUMMINGS FOR FUCK SAKES!

[Twin_Cam_Turbo]

Originally posted by heavyfuel
Diesel is facing some serious pussification. Either be a eco warrior hippy who thinks you're gonna save the world by burning less fuel, or own a diesel truck. Can't have both. Or wait- now looks like you can.



IT'S CUMMINS NOT CUMMINGS FOR FUCK SAKES!

Not to mention the Canyon/Colorado will have a Duramax 2.8L not a Cummins lol...

[btimbit]

I'm sure the engine will be great, just a shame the rest of the truck will fall apart around it.

[Cos]

.

[heavyfuel]

I would never, ever consider another Dodge again. Ever.

[Benny]

Originally posted by heavyfuel
I would never, ever consider another Dodge again. Ever.

Why's that?


As far as this truck, here's the problem with it: It's trying to do too much at once, and not doing any of those things particularly well. It's not fast, it's not that good on MPG, it can't tow that much. There's just no real reason to buy the diesel over the 5.7L.

Nissan sounds like they have the correct idea with the 5L Cummins. If you're gonna do a diesel truck, pick your battle and do it right. If you want efficiency, do a small diesel engine. If you want a halfton diesel that has some balls and can haul, do a bigger engine and make it worthwhile to own the diesel.

[heavyfuel]

^^Cuz mine proved to me over the years, that Cummins is over hyped and over rated, and that Chrysler is the absolute worst customer service in the business. I don't want or need a shiny new truck, but I would get a F-350 Powerstroke over a Dodge if financing a brand new truck would be my only option.

[Maxt]

I think this great for light truck buyers. The cummins is way to much engine for what a lot of consumers need.

[sxtasy]

Originally posted by heavyfuel
I would never, ever consider another Dodge again. Ever. :werd: +1 as a former Dodge cummins owner. Ride quality and handling are terrible, front ends are weak, electrical gremlins, sooo many problems. On top of that chrysler service is terrible, parts are overpriced and grouped together. As an example I had a bad wastegate solenoid, Chryslers only solution is a turbo replacement. Handle for the seat recline broke, only Chrysler solution is to buy the whole seat assembly at nearly a grand.

[Masked Bandit]

I don't see this option being a big seller. It tows less than the 5.7 Hemi and will cost more money. Driving empty will get a bit better fuel consumption numbers but how long is it going to take to catch up to the overage you paid on purchase. Factor in possibly higher maintenance costs long term and I just don't see enough upside.

Now with Nissan going to a 5L diesel, if the tow rating is over 11,000 lbs I could see the advantage there. Technically the Ford EB will go over that but uhhhh....no thanks.

[Alak]

Originally posted by Masked Bandit
I don't see this option being a big seller. It tows less than the 5.7 Hemi and will cost more money. Driving empty will get a bit better fuel consumption numbers but how long is it going to take to catch up to the overage you paid on purchase. Factor in possibly higher maintenance costs long term and I just don't see enough upside.

Now with Nissan going to a 5L diesel, if the tow rating is over 11,000 lbs I could see the advantage there. Technically the Ford EB will go over that but uhhhh....no thanks.

Im a diesel guy at heart, but I would have to agree. I think its too little engine for the truck, with potential for high repair cost, combined with guys tuning them out beyond what it can do.

Ive had some friends with Titans and they aren't particularily impressed with the truck and both parties have moved on to other trucks. Curious to see how this new Nissan does and if the engine is good enough. V8 would certainly make for a smoother running engine.

[AE92_TreunoSC]

No one wants to be a test driver for the new engine. Wait 2 years for sure.

[HiTempguy1]

Originally posted by Benny


It's not fast


It's a truck. Sorry, I use trucks to be trucks, not to be fast :dunno:


Originally posted by Benny


it's not that good on MPG


It's 25% better than the ecotec3 5.3L, and probably 30+% better while towing. That is a HUGE difference. I just towed 7k lbs through the mountain (probably the average weight most people tow with their 1/2 ton trucks I reckon, including travel trailers) and averaged ~12usmpg @ 65mph. If I could get 15usmpg with the diesel, I'd have a better towing truck and the fuel costs would work out. AND diesel has historically always been lower than gas, I expect the prices to sort themselves out eventually.


Originally posted by Benny


it can't tow that much


How much do you need to tow with a 1/2 ton? The max tow rating is 9k lbs, wtf are you towing consistently that you need more towing capacity then that?? I've towed 11k lbs with 1/2 tons and their "max tow" packages, and it's a stupid f*&king idea.


Originally posted by Masked Bandit
I don't see this option being a big seller. It tows less than the 5.7 Hemi and will cost more money. Driving empty will get a bit better fuel consumption numbers but how long is it going to take to catch up to the overage you paid on purchase. Factor in possibly higher maintenance costs long term and I just don't see enough upside.


The truck would pay for itself in under 5 years if you daily drove it. Less if you towed consistently with it, and would have a higher resale value. Maintenance costs on diesels are minimally higher than gas, you just hear horror stories because there have been some lemons :dunno:

As to the people hating dodges (or any truck manufacturers) half ton models based on their 5+ year old 3/4 ton models... lulz.

[sxtasy]

I love diesel trucks but realistically:

Originally posted by HiTempguy1


The truck would pay for itself in under 5 years if you daily drove it. Less if you towed consistently with it, and would have a higher resale value. Maintenance costs on diesels are minimally higher than gas, you just hear horror stories because there have been some lemons :dunno:

As to the people hating dodges (or any truck manufacturers) half ton models based on their 5+ year old 3/4 ton models... lulz.
:rofl: How many diesel trucks have you owned? Please show the numbers if you think a diesel will pay for itself in 5 years. Maintenance costs are considerably higher, everything from oil changes, fuel filters, injectors, drivetrain problems from high torque to all of the maintenance from the extra weight of a diesel including tire and brake wear and additional stress on the front end.

Due to recently introduced emission regulations, reliability and fuel economy both have dropped with newer diesels when compared to their 5+ yr older counterparts.

There is no way that the diesel will be overall more economical (especially out of its warranty period) than a gas for the average half ton user, but if you want to tow like a boss through the mountains then go for it.

[Masked Bandit]

Originally posted by sxtasy
I love diesel trucks but realistically:

:rofl: How many diesel trucks have you owned? Please show the numbers if you think a diesel will pay for itself in 5 years. Maintenance costs are considerably higher, everything from oil changes, fuel filters, injectors, drivetrain problems from high torque to all of the maintenance from the extra weight of a diesel including tire and brake wear and additional stress on the front end.

Due to recently introduced emission regulations, reliability and fuel economy both have dropped with newer diesels when compared to their 5+ yr older counterparts.

There is no way that the diesel will be overall more economical (especially out of its warranty period) than a gas for the average half ton user, but if you want to tow like a boss through the mountains then go for it.

9200 LBS sure isn't towing like a boss! Most gas half tons are right around 10,000 LBS and the soon to be released GM 6.2 L gasser is going to be 12,000 LBS. If I'm going to suffer the higher purchase price & maintenance cost of a diesel, I want to see tow ratings over 11,500 LBS.

[Boosted131]

If it can tow 9000 without downshifting a bunch then it's good. That's the most annoying thing with mine is every little hill she downshifts, with just a couple quads and small trailer

[CapnCrunch]

Is it too much to ask for a truck that can tow 12000 lbs, has one gear, and cruises around 1500 rpm at highway speed getting 20mpg?

[HiTempguy1]

Originally posted by sxtasy
everything from oil changes


Diesels typically hold MORE oil in their pans, which allow longer intervals. Hence, more expensive. Beyond that, if you are running synthetic, you'll be doing oil changes every 15-20,000kms... even if the oil change is double the price of a typical gasser, we're talking an extra $100 per year.


Originally posted by sxtasy
fuel filters


A maintenance item, I can buy that as an additional cost with diesels, but until you know what the interval is with this one, your opinion is just as valid as mine.


Originally posted by sxtasy
injectors


Again, certain trucks have had injector problems, many diesels out there that haven't and don't.


Originally posted by sxtasy
drivetrain problems from high torque


AGAIN, conjecture and your opinion. Means nothing. 420lbft is not much torque, should be fine in the 1/2 ton.


Originally posted by sxtasy
maintenance from the extra weight of a diesel


The diesel is like 50lbs heavier, derp.

So in short, inform yourself better. This truck makes sense for a majority of Albertan's who don't use trucks as trucks, and even makes sense for a majority that does.


Originally posted by Masked Bandit


9200 LBS sure isn't towing like a boss! Most gas half tons are right around 10,000 LBS and the soon to be released GM 6.2 L gasser is going to be 12,000 LBS. If I'm going to suffer the higher purchase price & maintenance cost of a diesel, I want to see tow ratings over 11,500 LBS.

Then buy a 3/4 ton. :dunno: They already make a truck for you.


Originally posted by CapnCrunch
Is it too much to ask for a truck that can tow 12000 lbs, has one gear, and cruises around 1500 rpm at highway speed getting 20mpg?

At first, I thought you were being serious, and then noticed the "it has one gear" part :rofl: That's exactly it, it's one thing to demand better mpg AND accept a lower towing limit, but it's ridiculous to demand everything. The fact is, even modern gas motors get pretty shitty mpg towing, so 1/2 tons are expensive to tow with. A diesel will be able to tow the same amount but you end up with MUCH better mpg (and more/the same torque at a significantly lower rpm, so much easier to tow with as well). It's practically a win-win.

[btimbit]

Originally posted by HiTempguy1

As to the people hating dodges (or any truck manufacturers) half ton models based on their 5+ year old 3/4 ton models... lulz.

No, I'm hating them based on all their models, from every year in the last 15 years

[sxtasy]

You forgot one HiTempguy

Originally posted by sxtasy
How many diesel trucks have you owned?
I have spreadsheets outlining the operating costs of diesel and gas trucks for tax purposes. Please spare everyone your bullshit :D

[Tik-Tok]

Originally posted by CapnCrunch
Is it too much to ask for a truck that can tow 12000 lbs, has one gear, and cruises around 1500 rpm at highway speed getting 20mpg?

CVT transmission in a 4x4? I'm sure they're trying to make it work :rofl:

[heavyfuel]

Originally posted by sxtasy
You forgot one HiTempguy

I have spreadsheets outlining the operating costs of diesel and gas trucks for tax purposes. Please spare everyone your bullshit :D


^^ Yup that was a good read lol. If I never had my Dodge, I'd EASILY would have been able to get a condo by now. On the other hand, my Duramax paid for itself in less than 2 years. If you're gonna own diesel trucks either be rich to begin with or use them for what they were meant for, cuz the reality of diesel ownership expenses will fall on you like a ton of bricks if you don't do your homework.

[SKR]

My guess is that it won't pull a dick out of a lard pail. I'd love to see a dyno graph. It'll probably be okay on fuel but anybody buying one to tow is going to be feeling pretty bad about themselves. It'll burn fuel like a motherfucker because you'll have to rev the piss out of it to get it to move and stay cool.

[Maxt]

Originally posted by sxtasy
I love diesel trucks but realistically:

:rofl: How many diesel trucks have you owned? Please show the numbers if you think a diesel will pay for itself in 5 years. Maintenance costs are considerably higher, everything from oil changes, fuel filters, injectors, drivetrain problems from high torque to all of the maintenance from the extra weight of a diesel including tire and brake wear and additional stress on the front end.

Due to recently introduced emission regulations, reliability and fuel economy both have dropped with newer diesels when compared to their 5+ yr older counterparts.

There is no way that the diesel will be overall more economical (especially out of its warranty period) than a gas for the average half ton user, but if you want to tow like a boss through the mountains then go for it.

A diesel turns a lot slower than a gas motor, everything attached to the motor turns a lot slower and lasts a lot longer. At 250k my truck still has the original accessories and serpentine belt on it, my gas trucks needed a new one every 70k. My Gm vortec work van would eat idlers pulleys, probably thanks to the GM transmission programming that would slam it down to 2nd and 5000 rpm every hill it hit.
And many diesels still use plain oil , synthetic is optional.. Plain old 15w40 is 2.75 a litre in bulk..

[Tik-Tok]

Originally posted by SKR
My guess is that it won't pull a dick out of a lard pail. I'd love to see a dyno graph. It'll probably be okay on fuel but anybody buying one to tow is going to be feeling pretty bad about themselves. It'll burn fuel like a motherfucker because you'll have to rev the piss out of it to get it to move and stay cool.

Lol. Yeah, those 90's 6bt cummins, those wouldn't tow at all with their 200hp, 400ft-lbs of torque... :nut:

[carson blocks]

I was thinking about the new 3.0 diesel, but I'll let someone else be the guinea pig and find out how good/bad it is. If you need to tow much, I'd step up to the 2500 as there's not that much price difference between a fully loaded Laramie 1500 3.0 and a fully loaded Laramie 2500 6.7. The 2500s are available with all the same comfort and convenience options to make a decent daily driver and starting in '14 they have coil suspension in the rear so the ride isn't rough at all.

If you want a 1500, The 5.7 Hemi is probably a smarter choice no matter how you cut it, but some people just like diesels, economics be damned. I'm one of those people, and I wasn't ready to take a chance on the new powertrain (can't even test drive them yet), so I ended up ordering a 2500 Laramie Crew Cab 4x4 with the 6.7 Cummins and the 6 speed manual. The 3.0 probably would have worked, but it wasn't that much more and deep down I just wanted a Cummins and a stickshift.

And yeah, I'm one of those guys that bought a 3/4 ton Crew Cab 4x4 diesel for a commuter, just because. I don't own a trailer, nor do I haul heavy stuff. If by some miracle they offer the 3.0 with a stick in the future, and it proves itself to be a good powertrain, I'd buy one next time as it will still be more than enough truck for me.

[Maxt]

Originally posted by Tik-Tok


Lol. Yeah, those 90's 6bt cummins, those wouldn't tow at all with their 200hp, 400ft-lbs of torque... :nut:
You mean 160 hp/400 ft/lbs.. My 94 was no passing monster, but it was a great car towing truck, even with my work tools on it. I was exceeding the 3/4 ton suspension sometimes so I bought the 1 ton instead, otherwise I would probably still be driving the 94...

[SKR]

Originally posted by Tik-Tok


Lol. Yeah, those 90's 6bt cummins, those wouldn't tow at all with their 200hp, 400ft-lbs of torque... :nut:

Where do they make their power? Where does this new V6 make its power? It doesn't do any good if it makes all its torque down low, but the EGT gets too hot to let it rev down there.

There's more to it than just numbers. My 10 Duramax makes 365hp and 660ft-lbs, but it only makes around 100hp and 300ft-lbs at cruising rpm. It gets hot as fuck and I have to drop a gear and have it revving at 2500rpm if I ever have to climb a slight hill or pass someone.

It's interesting that you'd compare an inline 6 with a V6 half its size. I guess we'll see.

[Alak]

Diesels last a lot longer because they are made from considerably tougher parts, and designed to work. Most people, do not work their trucks. Sure merging on the highway makes it 'work'. But it was actually designed to pull a trailer at its GVW its entire life.

[Tik-Tok]

Originally posted by SKR


It's interesting that you'd compare an inline 6 with a V6 half its size. I guess we'll see.

Time will tell for sure, but all reports say the N/A version of the motor has a peak torque at 2000rpm. I doubt it'll get nearly as hot as a the duramax either.

[CapnCrunch]

I've got nothing against the Dodge brand, but there is no way in hell I would want to have to deal with any of the local Dodge dealerships.