NY Times puts Calgary #17/52 for places to travel in 2014 [Archive] - Beyond.ca - Car Forums

kertejud2

01-12-2014, 06:51 PM

Originally posted by Sugarphreak
What a shitty list :facepalm:

Forget the 7 wonders of the world, or endless destinations which showcase culture and nature... lets pack up and go to Calgary where we can walk across a red tube bridge!

What kind of hopeless shut in needs to be told about the 7 wonders or Paris, Rome and London to travel to?

Probably the same people who would need an article on what bands to check out in 2014: The Beatles, The Rolling Stones, Michael Jackson, U2...

People traveling to Canada know about Toronto, Vancouver and Montreal. Calgary is where things are changing and growing. Oddly enough, it was a former Vancouver stripper turned NYT writer who was the one to give Calgary credit.

Alberta was mentioned in a different travel section as well

http://www.theguardian.com/travel/2014/jan/03/holiday-hotspots-where-to-go-in-2014

"For city life try Calgary, which has gone from cowboy town to cosmopolitan cool."

01RedDX

01-12-2014, 07:10 PM

kertejud2

01-12-2014, 07:37 PM

Originally posted by 01RedDX

Exactly.

When my friends from NYC came here they were blown away by the sight of the mountains before we even drove there. They simply had never seen anything like it, and they are traveled people.

I had the same thing happen when some Irish friends came over. They knew the mountains were there, but when mountains are "an hour away" they don't expect to actually see them.

Our zoo is one of the best in the world. Well, at least it was before the flood. We are within biking distance of some of the most spectacular scenery in the world. And yes, the Stampede is something to see for someone who has never experienced it.

You'd be hard pressed to find a city with as much accessible nature as Calgary does within the city. Fish Creek Park is second only to Central Park for largest urban parks in North America. Everything along the Bow, even the Weaselhead, not too many cities match it. There's a whole whack of stuff to do and only getting better. The Folk Fest and Sled Island are two of the best music festivals in the country (hell, even Montrealers are jealous of Sled Island, most Calgarians don't even know it exists or know what it is if they do).

But yeah, way to take pride in where you live guys. Duh, are they stupid, we don't want anyone coming here. :facepalm:

Calgary is going through a big transformation right now. People are naturally resistant to change and when it happens as quick and fast as it has here, it makes people even more resistant. Especially when the growth and changes bring with it traffic and taxes. The former will turn people into curmudgeons no matter where you live.

VTEXTC

01-12-2014, 07:38 PM

Originally posted by 01RedDX

Exactly.

When my friends from NYC came here they were blown away by the sight of the mountains before we even drove there. They simply had never seen anything like it, and they are traveled people.

Our zoo is one of the best in the world. Well, at least it was before the flood. We are within biking distance of some of the most spectacular scenery in the world. And yes, the Stampede is something to see for someone who has never experienced it.

But yeah, way to take pride in where you live guys. Duh, are they stupid, we don't want anyone coming here. :facepalm:

:werd:

max_boost

01-12-2014, 08:01 PM

lol such haters! Calgary is fantastic!

01RedDX

01-12-2014, 08:09 PM

Sugarphreak

01-12-2014, 09:40 PM

...

rx7_turbo2

01-12-2014, 10:01 PM

Calgary has the mountains, yes.

Anybody that thinks this city has anything even remotely resembling world class shopping, food, or entertainment has to get out more :rofl:

There are a handful of places I absolutely love to eat at in this city, but they all play second fiddle to a bistro on just about any street corner in Paris. Entertainment? Hooray Stampede! Besides the rodeo, it's 10 days of shitty exhibition rides, and beer gardens. I'll take Broadway, or London's West End thanks, well maybe a Flames game if a comedy is what you're after. Shopping? Uh ya okay lol!

I know it's fun being a "homer" but come on, I've lived in Calgary my whole life, it's a great place to make a buck, but a destination for culture, food, entertainment, and shopping? That's got to be a complete joke.

frozenrice

01-12-2014, 10:06 PM

Hey, we're cultural. Look at the mayor and look at what he's done for the arts and culture for this city.
:whocares:

Who needs racing facilities?

kertejud2

01-12-2014, 10:22 PM

Originally posted by frozenrice

Who needs racing facilities?

Not New York, London or Paris.

01RedDX

01-12-2014, 11:15 PM

ZenOps

01-12-2014, 11:24 PM

Nooooo! Recind the article.

I don't want any $100,000 personal plus $54,500 national debt owing Californians getting any ideas.

"Run for the Border"

davidI

01-12-2014, 11:30 PM

Originally posted by rx7_turbo2
Calgary has the mountains, yes.

Anybody that thinks this city has anything even remotely resembling world class shopping, food, or entertainment has to get out more :rofl:

There are a handful of places I absolutely love to eat at in this city, but they all play second fiddle to a bistro on just about any street corner in Paris. Entertainment? Hooray Stampede! Besides the rodeo, it's 10 days of shitty exhibition rides, and beer gardens. I'll take Broadway, or London's West End thanks, well maybe a Flames game if a comedy is what you're after. Shopping? Uh ya okay lol!

I know it's fun being a "homer" but come on, I've lived in Calgary my whole life, it's a great place to make a buck, but a destination for culture, food, entertainment, and shopping? That's got to be a complete joke.

Couldn't agree more.

kertejud2

01-12-2014, 11:40 PM

Originally posted by 01RedDX

I really think it's just a list, or did you guys seriously think that the #1 destination is in a country currently considered to be the murder and rape capital of the world? :rofl:

They're people who think that the New York Times is missing New York City as a travel destination for it's readers.

01RedDX

01-13-2014, 12:30 AM

sexualbanana

01-13-2014, 12:32 AM

It humors me and frustrates me to read comments about Calgary, especially as it relates to Calgary as a destination. How is it that this city has such a wide-spread inferiority complex when it comes to its places in the World?

The people who complain about Calgary having nothing to do are the same people who complain about Calgary wasting money when it tries to address that problem.

There's more to this fucking city than beer halls but nobody looks or is willing to try it!

Sure, we're not perfect. Our public transportation could be better, but so could a lot of other 'top-tier' cities.

We (born and raised Calgarians), may be sick of the Stampede, but it's fun for tourists and if there's one thing to be said about the city during the Stampede, it's that there is nowhere else in the World that has everyone buy into the concept like Calgary does, and that's fun.

01RedDX

01-13-2014, 12:45 AM

adamc

01-13-2014, 01:46 AM

Originally posted by davidI

Couldn't agree more.

Succinct, and right on the money.

Sugarphreak

01-13-2014, 08:27 AM

...

01RedDX

01-13-2014, 09:13 AM

GTS4tw

01-13-2014, 09:21 AM

Originally posted by Sugarphreak

I knew if I posted something that required some cognitive thinking it might confuse you

Ok, clear your mind…. If the other cities are not on the list, isn’t it safe to say they are not ranked higher than #17? I know… mind blowing concept ;)

From the bottom of the article:

Normally when you talk about things that top your list, and then assign numbers to them… they are in order of ranking. For instance if I said these are foods that top my list:

1) Pizza
2) Spaghetti
3) Marshmallows

It isn’t expected that I just put up 3 random foods... and most people will assume that I prefer Pizza over Marshmallows simply by the ranking I assigned to it.

They never said they were ranking those places....Just places to visit in 2014. So simple, sooooo simple.

DeleriousZ

01-13-2014, 09:33 AM

I don't know about you guys, but the only reason I'm here is because I can't afford to live in BC lol.

rx7_turbo2

01-13-2014, 11:07 AM

Originally posted by DeleriousZ
I don't know about you guys, but the only reason I'm here is because I can't afford to live in BC lol.

Most of the lifelong Calgarians I know have said something similar over the past few years. Maybe not mentioning BC but the same sentiment.

Calgary is a great place to make money, and until relatively recently it was a city that functioned well, with a common sense approach to its own issues and image. That's changing. I don't feel it's for the better either. I know a lot of long time if not lifetime Calgarians who's plan is to put enough money in the bank and then GTFO. These are generally people I consider well educated, intelligent, hardworking. If people like that are looking for somewhere else to live when the time comes, well I'm not sure that's a good thing.

msommers

01-13-2014, 11:17 AM

Originally posted by 01RedDX

Maybe I missed it, but can you guys point out where exactly it says that this list of place is in any particular order or rank? I'm trying to find what would lead you to believe that this list is a ranking of places.

Imagine this, could it just simply be a list of places to visit in the world?

http://i.imgur.com/i1RMNP9.gif

I really think it's just a list, or did you guys seriously think that the #1 destination is in a country currently considered to be the murder and rape capital of the world? :rofl:

I'll level with you, I assumed it was ranked. And having come back from Cape Town this summer, I can tell you personally how fun it was to be there.

I'm born and raised in Calgary and I'm not ashamed of my city or think it's terrible by any stretch. And putting out public art is something I'm really excited to see - the brown sandstone buildings and overall gray boring tones of downtown were getting old. But when you start travelling more and more, it's not exactly a "cultural hub." There are lots of reasons for people to come to Alberta, Calgary not exactly being the pinnacle point.

Things Calgary has going for it:
1) Low pollution, fresh air, clean water
2) Fairly low crime
3) Strong economy
4) Mountain access, hub to see things outside of Calgary
5) Personal space

In short, great for a family but for a tourist?

Things Calgary can't boast about:
1) Being a cultural hub (Think Toronto if we're talking Canada)
2) A nightlife
3) Completely tied to one resource
4) Health care and education levels are low for a place with so much wealth

Again, the appeal to a tourist? What food is here? What sites are in Calgary specifically? What art scene is there that gains international appeal?

For a tourist, Calgary is a great play to fly into but to stay a few days here? I honestly just do not see it. But I'm more than welcome and open to suggestions (honestly).

r3ccOs

01-13-2014, 11:23 AM

Druh Farrell's commitment to create a diverse urban cultral hub in the Canadian mid-west is why I and will continually vote for her!

The Pease Bridge, the Devonian Gardens are just a small testimony to her contributions and example of her ongoing commitment to turn Calgary from a redneck dustbowl to the flourishing Paris of the Praries that it will be.

Druh FTW

ercchry

01-13-2014, 11:34 AM

calgary will never be a good tourist destination till we stop having a shortage of people in unskilled jobs. the customer service in this town is atrocious. the one thing i love about visiting the states and their recessed economy is that people actually want to be employed and even getting a $2 burger you are treated like a king... drop $300 on a bottle of wine in calgary? still treated like shit.

its actually frustrating. i keep finding these amazing restaurants... but its almost unbearable to eat there cause the service is to the point where i feel like i should just put in my own orders :banghead:

sexualbanana

01-13-2014, 11:45 AM

Originally posted by msommers

In short, great for a family but for a tourist?

Things Calgary can't boast about:
1) Being a cultural hub (Think Toronto if we're talking Canada)
2) A nightlife
3) Completely tied to one resource
4) Health care and education levels are low for a place with so much wealth

I know a few people from Toronto (who are deeply in tune with the art scene) who like where the city is going in terms of art and culture. It may not be at the same level of the Montreals or Torontos, but we're a lot younger relatively, I think.

Nightlife, just like my last culture argument, I think it comes down to where you're looking. There's lot of things to check out and do. It's a matter of actually trying it out. The CPO, for example, does so many shows that cover every genre of music, that it's hard for me to take someone seriously when they say they don't play anything they like.

max_boost

01-13-2014, 11:53 AM

Originally posted by rx7_turbo2

Most of the lifelong Calgarians I know have said something similar over the past few years. Maybe not mentioning BC but the same sentiment.

Calgary is a great place to make money, and until relatively recently it was a city that functioned well, with a common sense approach to its own issues and image. That's changing. I don't feel it's for the better either. I know a lot of long time if not lifetime Calgarians who's plan is to put enough money in the bank and then GTFO. These are generally people I consider well educated, intelligent, hardworking. If people like that are looking for somewhere else to live when the time comes, well I'm not sure that's a good thing. Maybe they just old. :D :D

Sugarphreak

01-13-2014, 12:05 PM

...

rx7_turbo2

01-13-2014, 12:12 PM

Originally posted by max_boost
Maybe they just old. :D :D

There's an element of that no doubt.

I just don't see any of the recent pushes to create culture having any type of long term sustainability, and all it does in the meantime is cost a shit ton of money and decrease the functionality of the city. Manufactured culture doesn't work, never will. A city's culture as I see it is organic. It starts organically and is sustained organically. Economies can shift, Manhattan is Manhattan, London will remain London, Paris will remain Paris. Calgary will never be those places. Calgary is Detroit. When it goes bad here it will go really bad. No amount of manufactured culture will save it.

I know far to many people with multiple homes who spend only as much time as is absolutely necessary in Calgary. Come in, do business and GTFO as quick as possible. That attitude ultimately is Calgarys organic culture. Do business, make your money, then spend as little time here as possible. I don't think that's a good thing. It would be nice if Calgary was a place that when you had the money, freedom, and choice you would still live here. However of the people I know with those things they choose to live elsewhere. That speaks volumes.

kertejud2

01-13-2014, 12:33 PM

Yes, the organic culture of Paris.

Things like the Louvre (former royal palace), the opera house (state built and still state funded), Notre Dame (church sponsored) and Eiffel Tower (state sponsored) certainly were organic constructs that simply stemmed from the general will of the people and not some government vanity projects.

These projects would require the best artists and brightest minds, which would then churn out more of it because aspiring artists and thinkers would need to go to these cities or work and improvement.

To think the state doesn't play a role in the growth of culture and that cities can't encourage it is just fucking stupid.

sexualbanana

01-13-2014, 12:35 PM

Originally posted by rx7_turbo2

There's an element of that no doubt.

I just don't see any of the recent pushes to create culture having any type of long term sustainability, and all it does in the meantime is cost a shit ton of money and decrease the functionality of the city. Manufactured culture doesn't work, never will. A city's culture as I see it is organic. It starts organically and is sustained organically. Economies can shift, Manhattan is Manhattan, London will remain London, Paris will remain Paris. Calgary will never be those places. Calgary is Detroit. When it goes bad here it will go really bad. No amount of manufactured culture will save it.

I know far to many people with multiple homes who spend only as much time as is absolutely necessary in Calgary. Come in, do business and GTFO as quick as possible. That attitude ultimately is Calgarys organic culture. Do business, make your money, then spend as little time here as possible. I don't think that's a good thing. It would be nice if Calgary was a place that when you had the money, freedom, and choice you would still live here. However of the people I know with those things they choose to live elsewhere. That speaks volumes.

You're citing cities that have centuries of history. Calgary, comparitively, is still a fetus in comparison to the Paris', Rome's and London's of the World. I don't disagree with you that culture must be organic, but you also have to create the environment that would allow culture to grow organically through inspiration and education.

Take the Red Mile for example. When the phenomenon first happened in 2004, no one really knew what to make of it. People naturally decided to congregate on 17th Ave and the general vibe of the area was that it was a party atmosphere and people were just there to have a good time and celebrate hockey. Compare that with other cities, and what do you get? Riots in Los Angeles and Vancouver.

clem24

01-13-2014, 12:38 PM

Originally posted by Sugarphreak

To me it reads like a ranking, they say it is a list of “top” places which also hints at it being a ranking. Why even number them if it is just a bunch of random places to go? Why not include better places to go?

It's just the list of places to visit IN 2014 because probably you've been to every other place and need somewhere new to go. Otherwise, if you think about it, the list would be the same year after year! Everyone well traveled has been to NYC, Paris, TO, Tokyo, etc... I think the list makes perfect sense.

Our biking trails are world class, and we make a great staging area for visiting Banff, which ranks VERY VERY high on the list of must visit places IN THE WORLD. We have some great shopping (Crossiron and Chinook and one of the biggest malls IN THE WORLD is just a 3 hour drive). And as much as I despise how much was spent on that Peace Bridge, you gotta admit that it looks pretty damn good in PR photos.

rx7_turbo2

01-13-2014, 12:47 PM

Originally posted by kertejud2
Yes, the organic culture of Paris.

Things like the Louvre (former royal palace), the opera house (state built and still state funded), Notre Dame (church sponsored) and Eiffel Tower (state sponsored) certainly were organic constructs that simply stemmed from the general will of the people and not some government vanity projects.

These projects would require the best artists and brightest minds, which would then churn out more of it because aspiring artists and thinkers would need to go to these cities or work and improvement.

To think the state doesn't play a role in the growth of culture and that cities can't encourage it is just fucking stupid.

You work for the city right?:dunno: Maybe not directly, but in some form?

State does play a role in the growth of a culture. It should support the already existing and emerging movements, not try and manufacture it from the ground up:rofl: There's a big difference and not understanding that is "just fucking stupid"

Sugarphreak

01-13-2014, 12:50 PM

...

rx7_turbo2

01-13-2014, 12:55 PM

Originally posted by sexualbanana

but you also have to create the environment that would allow culture to grow organically through inspiration and education.

I agree to a certain extent.

I guess my big stumbling block is that I just don't ever see Calgary being what some in this city want it to be. So to me resources are much better spent on the functionality of the city.

I compared Calgary to Detroit. I'm not the first to do this of course. Calgary is what it is, what it's always been. A great place to make money, a relatively safe place to raise a family and because of the wealth raise them well. So why is that not good enough? Why does it have to be this great destination for food, entertainment, culture?

The push over the last few years to make this place what it isn't naturally just seems so manufactured and fake to me. Because of that I just don't see it being sustainable long term. Calgary will always revert back to what it really is. My take on it anyways.

GTS4tw

01-13-2014, 12:56 PM

Originally posted by Sugarphreak

Saying "you've been everywhere else that is nice so here is somehwere that isn't a total shit-hole" for a travel article is kind of a big assumption IMO.

Why not just say #17 - Banff then? That would make more sense

Lots of people go to Vancouver for stuff like Granville Island or Stanley park, but stay in Richmond... they don't put Richmond as the travel destination

Because the specific writer, who wrote this article, didnt want to visit banff in the year 2014, maybe he will in 2015. In 2014 the writer, who wrote this specific article, about his (or her) desire to visit 52 places in the year 2014 (one for each week of the year?) decided that Calgary was one of those places. Thney did not decide that they wanted to visit banff in 2014, just Calgary. Maybe in 2015 they will write an article "Top 52 places to visit in 2015" and it will include banff, however it will not elevate Banff's position in the "official" ranking of the greatest most amazing places on the earth, if such a thing exists. It will still just be the opinion of the writer who wrote the article about the top 52 places to visit in 2015.

adamc

01-13-2014, 01:04 PM

Originally posted by rx7_turbo2

I agree to a certain extent.

I guess my big stumbling block is that I just don't ever see Calgary being what some in this city want it to be. So to me resources are much better spent on the functionality of the city.

I compared Calgary to Detroit. I'm not the first to do this of course. Calgary is what it is, what it's always been. A great place to make money, a relatively safe place to raise a family and because of the wealth raise them well. So why is that not good enough? Why does it have to be this great destination for food, entertainment, culture?

The push over the last few years to make this place what it isn't naturally just seems so manufactured and fake to me. Because of that I just don't see it being sustainable long term. Calgary will always revert back to what it really is. My take on it anyways.

I believe a city is a living, growing, changing thing, and is not truly one thing or another.

Over time, any city will flex and bend to meet the needs of the current demographic. When I moved here in '06 the city was a shell of what it currently is. The improvements in culture, dining, nightlife, etc. are a reflection of the desires of and needs of the people that live here now.

Just because Calgary was once a slightly backwards O&G town, doesn't mean it is always going to be that way. Things are changing for the better in a natural way, in my opinion.

EDIT: looks like these points were already made

Sugarphreak

01-13-2014, 01:05 PM

...

clem24

01-13-2014, 01:09 PM

adamc

01-13-2014, 01:09 PM

Originally posted by rx7_turbo2
It would be nice if Calgary was a place that when you had the money, freedom, and choice you would still live here. However of the people I know with those things they choose to live elsewhere. That speaks volumes.

Totally agree, and in the time I've lived here, I've seen this happen more and more.

I was never particularly happy when I moved here, because I love big city life - Calgary didn't have what I was looking for. It has a lot more of what I'm looking for in a city today, than it did 10 years ago.

And it will continue to get better.

I think in 10-15 years if the pace of development continues, Calgary could rival the other great Canadian cities in terms of livability.

max_boost

01-13-2014, 01:18 PM

Originally posted by rx7_turbo2

There's an element of that no doubt.

I just don't see any of the recent pushes to create culture having any type of long term sustainability, and all it does in the meantime is cost a shit ton of money and decrease the functionality of the city. Manufactured culture doesn't work, never will. A city's culture as I see it is organic. It starts organically and is sustained organically. Economies can shift, Manhattan is Manhattan, London will remain London, Paris will remain Paris. Calgary will never be those places. Calgary is Detroit. When it goes bad here it will go really bad. No amount of manufactured culture will save it.

I know far to many people with multiple homes who spend only as much time as is absolutely necessary in Calgary. Come in, do business and GTFO as quick as possible. That attitude ultimately is Calgarys organic culture. Do business, make your money, then spend as little time here as possible. I don't think that's a good thing. It would be nice if Calgary was a place that when you had the money, freedom, and choice you would still live here. However of the people I know with those things they choose to live elsewhere. That speaks volumes.

Interesting! I do share some of that attitude. If I'm not working I am on vacation somewhere :nut: But that's probably more to do with the fact I grew up here and want to see other parts of the world.

I don't think its that bad here though. Can enjoy 4 seasons of sports and winters aren't that bad (love the Chinooks).

IMO The city is in transition right now. Time will tell.

rx7_turbo2

01-13-2014, 01:28 PM

Originally posted by max_boost

IMO The city is in transition right now. Time will tell.

Agreed. I don't think it's sustainable, because I believe the current movement is manufactured. That may simply be me being overly cynical. As you said time will ultimately tell.

Sugarphreak

01-13-2014, 01:38 PM

...

adamc

01-13-2014, 01:38 PM

Manufactured by whom, exactly?
It's not like developers and taste makers are having closed door meetings about what to shove down Calgary 's collective throat next.

People travel the world and bring concepts and ideas back with them, some stuff works, some doesn't.

Feruk

01-13-2014, 01:45 PM

Originally posted by 01RedDX
IMO Calgary is second to none when it comes to urban parks and pathways.
Really? I think it's OK for parks and pathways, but considering even Red Deer is better, I'd say "second to none" is an overstatement.

Let's face it, Calgary has two good things going for it:
1) An airport
2) Easy access from that airport to the mountains

Calgary's a great place to work and a decent place to raise a family, but it's definitely not a tourist destination. Then again, all the other places on that list that I've been to aren't particulairly gems either.

MGCM

01-13-2014, 03:06 PM

finally, now i can use this as an excuse to not travel and keep spending money on cars :thumbsup:

Moonracer

01-13-2014, 03:54 PM

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: all the negative people on beyond post negative comments in pretty much every single thread they post in, why should this one be any different. Especially when it comes to city matters...lol I've lived here for 41 yrs. and if I won the lottery tomorrow I'd buy a nice big house here and continue to call it home.

clem24

01-13-2014, 04:11 PM

In a nut shell, Calgary is home. About the only place I'd actually consider moving to if jobs wasn't an issue and houses were affordable would be Seattle.

We do seriously have one world class cuisine item: pho LOL. I honestly have not had any better pho than the stuff at home, and pho is something I eat at least once a week! :D

lasimmon

01-13-2014, 04:36 PM

Originally posted by Feruk

Really? I think it's OK for parks and pathways, but considering even Red Deer is better, I'd say "second to none" is an overstatement.

Care to elaborate?

I was born and raised in Red Deer for 20 years and I find that statement outlandish.

Feruk

01-13-2014, 05:18 PM

Originally posted by lasimmon
Care to elaborate?

I was born and raised in Red Deer for 20 years and I find that statement outlandish.
Sure. Between Gaetz and Taylor you've got a path that runs all the way from campus till the river bank (with exception of 3 blocks where you've gotta cross). Paths on both sides of the river, the one on the east bank going all the way to 67th. Beyond there, the Ponds just north of the bird sanctuary which are fantastic and so isolated that you don't even feel like you're in a city. On the east side, you've got the forested ravine path that runs pretty much from the river along 49th/50th to Enmax Centrium. I heard Kerry Wood nature centre was really nice, but never went. On top of that, throw in the golf courses like Riverbend that blow ANY public course in Calgary out of the water.

The golf's way better and some of the parks make you feel like you're in the bush rather than in a city. I really liked the parks out there. Being raised in the NW, I will admit to not having spent much time at Fish Creek, but the paths by the river Downtown here are nothing special and Nose Hill sucks balls in comparison.

Maxt

01-13-2014, 05:38 PM

Originally posted by adamc
Manufactured by whom, exactly?
It's not like developers and taste makers are having closed door meetings about what to shove down Calgary 's collective throat next.

People travel the world and bring concepts and ideas back with them, some stuff works, some doesn't.
Have you read the imagine Calgary documents?

kertejud2

01-13-2014, 06:33 PM

Originally posted by rx7_turbo2

You work for the city right?:dunno: Maybe not directly, but in some form?

No. I have been moderately active in a community association which does work with the city in some capacity, but it isn't a job.

State does play a role in the growth of a culture. It should support the already existing and emerging movements, not try and manufacture it from the ground up:rofl: There's a big difference and not understanding that is "just fucking stupid"

This isn't how the cities you mentioned got their culture. They built things that would bring the best to their cities which then required an industry around them. New York had the biggest and grandest concert halls and theatres, so the people who wanted to make it big would move there to try and get their break and in trying to do so would partake in the local scene. As the big stage got bigger and would draw from the local stage, more people would move and so on and so forth. When your city has great works of art, entertainment and architecture, it helps promote more of it organically.

I compared Calgary to Detroit. I'm not the first to do this of course.

Calgary could very well be like Detroit, which is why things need to be done to prevent it. Detroit failed not because it was a one industry town, but because of how it's demographics shifted. Calgary is threatened by the former, but not the latter. White flight and the freefall of population downtown turned Detroit into a bankrupt shithole. The downtown part is more significant to Detroit because their suburbs are independent municipalities and therefore as the city aged, they had to pay ridiculous pensions (it is a union town afterall) with a significantly shrinking tax base. Calgary doesn't really have that problem as our tax base in almost twice as large and growing, while theirs is still shrinking (the metro area has a few million more people, but that doesn't do the city of Detroit any good).

Increasing density helps keep things more sustainable. More people in a smaller space are easier and cheaper to provide services to. Make more businesses able to be successful which increases the economic diversity of a city. As the demographics of the city change and offers more than just basic amenities, it attracts different people which helps attract different industries. This is the goal and one that must be chased to avoid becoming a Detroit.

Calgary is what it is, what it's always been. A great place to make money, a relatively safe place to raise a family and because of the wealth raise them well. So why is that not good enough? Why does it have to be this great destination for food, entertainment, culture?

Because that's what motivated and educated people want. Calgary has a lot of very successful people who moved here for money and for the reasons you mentioned, many wanted to stay. So why shouldn't they get better food and culture? Why should you have to travel or move away to get that? The city has grown past the point of just being a wealthy small city, it is the new hot spot for people looking to thrive and has left the other small cities in the country well behind.

Calgary's population today is where Vancouver's was in 1981, before they had their growth and shift. We are growing and it isn't showing any signs of slowing down (Vancouver didn't have the second most corporate offices in the country back then like we do either). We can embrace it and accept that the growth we had in the previous 20 years isn't how we can deal with it for the next 20.

trieu

01-13-2014, 06:58 PM

Originally posted by clem24
We do seriously have one world class cuisine item: pho LOL. I honestly have not had any better pho than the stuff at home, and pho is something I eat at least once a week! :D

I thought I was the only person saying this! I've eaten pho almost everywhere I've travelled to and I think pho in Calgary is the best. Much better than any pho I had in Vietnam

msommers

01-13-2014, 08:42 PM

Originally posted by sexualbanana

I know a few people from Toronto (who are deeply in tune with the art scene) who like where the city is going in terms of art and culture. It may not be at the same level of the Montreals or Torontos, but we're a lot younger relatively, I think.

Yep I'd have to agree. Things are definitely growing, even for small venues like Market Collective, for example. I have a friend in Montreal who tells me Alberta is boring and everyone is a redneck, including me because I had a t-shirt and jeans on instead of being decked out like lots of Montrealers! I had a good laugh about that.

But I actually used you're age argument - we need time. The amount of art galleries in Quebec City, Montreal and Toronto are staggering. I wish we had more here. Live music is decent, there are some good venues setup like Ironwood, Wine-Ohs, Black Betty, Palamino (well maybe) among others that I'm sure I've forgotten. Folk Fest and Sled Island are larger festivals that I'm happy to see as annual events. But compared to Montreal for example, it's not even close. Again growth but not huge yet.

Culture wise...our culture will always be cowboy culture to some degree (IMO).

If tourists want to come here, that's great, it'll help our local economy. But when I think of going to a city I've never been to see something major or specific (landmark, food, gallery etc), there isn't one thing that comes to mind in Calgary that would be a "We're going to Calgary to see the ____!!!!!"

max_boost

01-13-2014, 08:55 PM

haha it's not the first time I've heard that Pho comment either. Calgary is indeed awesome for that.

MalibuStacy

01-13-2014, 09:02 PM

Wow this thread is quickly becoming more about pho then Calgary

adamc

01-13-2014, 09:03 PM

This thread made me get Pho for dinner.

I have a huge steaming bowl of sate beef from Basil in front of me right this second.

rx7_turbo2

01-13-2014, 10:22 PM

As a white guy I do enjoy Pho, admittedly don't know what makes good Pho from bad Pho, but am willing to try a bowl from any of this cities fine establishments, regardless of how much like pee the place may smell. However I'm always too scared to try it when I'm in any other city.

cancer man

01-14-2014, 08:04 AM

Pho is an overrated chicken soup and it smells like smelly socks.

I love this city our skyline is second to none and you can see the sky.
Look at all are parks.(i'll bet half of you hipsters never even went)
Great place to raise a family.We say pls and thankyou.
How many of you have visited the Glenbow museum?Science Centre?
Husky Tower? Even the Bay...

We have great pub food and some excellent restaurants.
Little china is a great place to visit on the weekends.
We have world class casinos.
You can live and die within 4 sq km's.
Car to go.

Why don't you guys actually go out an experience Calgary.
FK i love this place.

Better yet go buy a dog and actually go and experience the parks and people.
Break down on the deefoot and somebody will stop to help.

All the flood volunteers are people that are Calgarians or trying to be.
People that bitch about Calgary are a bunch of piss ants.

END OF RANT.

googe

01-14-2014, 08:17 AM

I've yet to meet an American who has visited Calgary and hasn't wondered why they wasted their time on it, other than because work made them. It's not that it's terrible, it's just incredibly unremarkable. On the other hand, they all absolutely love Montreal, with Vancouver being not far behind. I haven't met an American who wasn't amazed with Montreal actually. Never been there myself.

Tik-Tok

01-14-2014, 08:29 AM

Originally posted by googe
I've yet to meet an American who has visited Calgary and hasn't wondered why they wasted their time on it, other than because work made them. It's not that it's terrible, it's just incredibly unremarkable. On the other hand, they all absolutely love Montreal, with Vancouver being not far behind. I haven't met an American who wasn't amazed with Montreal actually. Never been there myself.

:werd:

Calgary isn't a terrible city, but it is very bland.

You can blame it on it's youth, but the reality is that it's a city that has grown unnaturally fast. Too many people have moved here solely to make money, and typically, they are blue-collared people who prefer toys to arts, so not much of the population is in favour of real culture.

MalibuStacy

01-14-2014, 01:44 PM

msommers

01-14-2014, 01:59 PM

Originally posted by cancer man
Pho is an overrated chicken soup and it smells like smelly socks.

I love this city our skyline is second to none and you can see the sky.
Look at all are parks.(i'll bet half of you hipsters never even went)
Great place to raise a family.We say pls and thankyou.
How many of you have visited the Glenbow museum?Science Centre?
Husky Tower? Even the Bay...

We have great pub food and some excellent restaurants.
Little china is a great place to visit on the weekends.
We have world class casinos.
You can live and die within 4 sq km's.
Car to go.

Why don't you guys actually go out an experience Calgary.
FK i love this place.

Better yet go buy a dog and actually go and experience the parks and people.
Break down on the deefoot and somebody will stop to help.

All the flood volunteers are people that are Calgarians or trying to be.
People that bitch about Calgary are a bunch of piss ants.

END OF RANT.

Totally missed this rant. In times of disaster, people help each other out. Look at the Australian forest fires for example. You get a flat on the highway in butt fuck no where and people will help you. On Deerfoot? How many people would drive by because they gotta be somewhere? The mentality has changed here from what it once was - a small town feel with a big population. I just don't feel that anymore. It's like everyone has their dicks out comparing salaries, cars, houses, vacation homes to one another because all they do is work.

And world class casinos? Ha.

Let me ask you something. If you won 25 million bucks, would you still live here? If you genuinely feel the answer is yes because of the reasons you listed, then I'll take your rant seriously.

MalibuStacy

01-14-2014, 02:21 PM

I can honestly say that I would stay here. Here is home, I disagree and feel a vast majority of Calgarians aren't just douchebags with money. Again this might be due to my up bringing. I have never been nor will I likely be anything more then your typical lower middle class working guy.

But then again, maybe I'm just not as cynical as some of the other people in the city

rx7_turbo2

01-14-2014, 03:55 PM

Originally posted by msommers

Let me ask you something. If you won 25 million bucks, would you still live here? If you genuinely feel the answer is yes because of the reasons you listed, then I'll take your rant seriously.

As far as I'm concerned that's the litmus test.

Saying that if you won the lottery you'd stay in Calgary is all well and good but in actual practice I've seen that people with that type of money generally flee. Most of them keep a house in Calgary for business purposes but spend as little time as possible here.

There's this underlying sentiment that Calgary needs a culture because it has none, and that the Municipality should fund that. What those people are really saying is that Calgary has a culture but I don't like it, and want money spent on changing it to the culture I want.

I've lived n Calgary my entire life. I've always loved it, but every year it gets more and more frustrating to live here. I know a few people who are getting to the point of being able to taper their workload back and transitioning into retirement or semi retirement, I can tell you part of their plan is to get away from Calgary. Some of them are on this forum ;)

davidI

01-14-2014, 10:32 PM

Originally posted by cancer man
Pho is an overrated chicken soup and it smells like smelly socks.

I love this city our skyline is second to none and you can see the sky.
Look at all are parks.(i'll bet half of you hipsters never even went)
Great place to raise a family.We say pls and thankyou.
How many of you have visited the Glenbow museum?Science Centre?
Husky Tower? Even the Bay...

We have great pub food and some excellent restaurants.
Little china is a great place to visit on the weekends.
We have world class casinos.
You can live and die within 4 sq km's.
Car to go.

Why don't you guys actually go out an experience Calgary.
FK i love this place.

Better yet go buy a dog and actually go and experience the parks and people.
Break down on the deefoot and somebody will stop to help.

All the flood volunteers are people that are Calgarians or trying to be.
People that bitch about Calgary are a bunch of piss ants.

END OF RANT.

It's great you're proud to be Calgarian. I'm just curious what other cities you've spent time in that you're using for comparison?

Manhattan? Brooklyn? London? Dubai? Bangkok? Singapore? Melbourne? Gold Coast? Sydney? Montreal? San Diego? San Francisco? Seattle? Barcelona? Madrid? Valencia? Munich? Cape Town? Perth? Florence? Krakow? Budapest? Stockholm? Helsinki? Rekyjavik? Glasgow? Belfast? Nice? Salzburg?

I just mention the above because I'd probably choose to live in any of those places before moving back to Calgary (unless it was for work) because of the lifestyle and better culture (music, food, arts, etc.)

I agree that Calgary is a great place to work just because of the job availability and competitive salaries. If you're using architecture (skyline), parks, museums, casinos, and restaurants as your comparison criteria though, Calgary falls quite short IMO.

Sugarphreak

01-14-2014, 10:38 PM

....

frizzlefry

01-14-2014, 10:46 PM

My wife and many friends of mine have lived all over the world. Prague, Paris, Vienna etc. Lots of world traveler types. They always go on and on about the culture and art in the places they have been. Whenever I ask why they chose to settle down here they say the same thing...

Those other places are fucking disgusting and there is no work. Fun to visit but live there? Hell no.

davidI

01-14-2014, 11:03 PM

Originally posted by Sugarphreak

Should start a "If you won 25 million, where would you live" thread

Done.

http://forums.beyond.ca/showthread.php?s=&threadid=378439

:D

sexualbanana

01-15-2014, 12:27 AM

Originally posted by rx7_turbo2

I've lived n Calgary my entire life. I've always loved it, but every year it gets more and more frustrating to live here. I know a few people who are getting to the point of being able to taper their workload back and transitioning into retirement or semi retirement, I can tell you part of their plan is to get away from Calgary. Some of them are on this forum ;)

How is that different from retirees from other areas? Florida is popular retirement spot for retired New Yorkers, yet New York is continually used in this thread as a place that's far more cultured than Calgary. Same goes for retired Californians in Hawaii and Arizona. The reasons for retirees moving out of a city are far more extensive than just 'the city sucks/has changed' because it happens in every other major city in the world.

And for the record, if I won a $25M lottery at my age, I would be sticking around Calgary. At least until I'm 50, and that's not to say I won't be doing any travelling.

clem24

01-15-2014, 10:19 AM

Originally posted by frizzlefry
My wife and many friends of mine have lived all over the world. Prague, Paris, Vienna etc. Lots of world traveler types. They always go on and on about the culture and art in the places they have been. Whenever I ask why they chose to settle down here they say the same thing...

Those other places are fucking disgusting and there is no work. Fun to visit but live there? Hell no.

This right here. Once you live somewhere, you'll get bored of it, no matter where you are. You can live in a city like Paris but you'll probably get sick of the commute and the French. Live in Tokyo and you'll get sick of the humidity and the cigarette smoke. So many of those places are really nice places to visit but just not what I would call 'home'.

davidI

01-15-2014, 11:08 AM

Originally posted by clem24

This right here. Once you live somewhere, you'll get bored of it, no matter where you are. You can live in a city like Paris but you'll probably get sick of the commute and the French. Live in Tokyo and you'll get sick of the humidity and the cigarette smoke. So many of those places are really nice places to visit but just not what I would call 'home'.

There's a reason I didn't include Paris, Tokyo, or Vienna in my list. ;)

I wouldn't enjoy living in any of those cities. Prague is a maybe. I didn't spend enough time to get a good feel for it.

Of course, it's all about the kind of person you are and what your needs are. Raising a family? Needing a certain type of work? Education? Health care? Love to ski? Love to mountain climb? All depends on your needs. I just listed those cities from the general availability of a good cultural lifestyle without too many hassles.

rx7_turbo2

01-15-2014, 01:12 PM

Originally posted by sexualbanana

And for the record, if I won a $25M lottery at my age, I would be sticking around Calgary. At least until I'm 50, and that's not to say I won't be doing any travelling.

Why would you stay in Calgary till you're 50? Not a dick question just wondering what would keep you here till then? I'm early 30's, I'd wrap up a few things here, probably take a couple years to accomplish, then I'd sell my house and bail.

01RedDX

01-15-2014, 02:00 PM

sexualbanana

01-15-2014, 02:49 PM

Originally posted by rx7_turbo2

Why would you stay in Calgary till you're 50? Not a dick question just wondering what would keep you here till then? I'm early 30's, I'd wrap up a few things here, probably take a couple years to accomplish, then I'd sell my house and bail.

For me, my family and friends are here, and I like it here (and in case you haven't noticed, I will defend this city to the bitter end). It's clean, everything's accessible, and there's lots of things to do. Sure, it's not perfect, but every city has its drawbacks.

rx7_turbo2

01-15-2014, 02:59 PM

Originally posted by sexualbanana

For me, my family and friends are here, and I like it here (and in case you haven't noticed, I will defend this city to the bitter end). It's clean, everything's accessible, and there's lots of things to do. Sure, it's not perfect, but every city has its drawbacks. Fair enough. Most of my extended family is out east, I have no interest being anywhere near them, and my immediate family splits time between a few different residences, I've got friends all over so for me there's a long list of places I'd rather be than Calgary if I had that type of money.

sexualbanana

01-15-2014, 03:31 PM

I have friends all over, and I've spent time living in LA. LA is a fun place to live when you're young, but couldn't see myself living as I got older.

davidI

01-15-2014, 09:01 PM

https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn2/q71/1555588_10151806219701594_1453507521_n.jpg

Saw this on Facebook. Seems to suit the thread... :angel:

davidI

01-15-2014, 09:13 PM

Originally posted by 01RedDX
Unsurprisingly, the vast majority so far are saying they would keep their primary residence here or close to here. I'm from Europe originally, it's on a major decline and I'm not going back except to visit. Anyone considering a permanent move sounds crazy to me. Sure, take your millions to a place with the highest taxes, cost of living, unemployment, welfare spending and illegal migration. :nut:

There are a lot of places with lower taxes and a lower cost of living in Europe. If you have $25 million I suspect unemployment rates don't really matter. End of the day, it should be about lifestyle, and I think Europeans (especially those in the South) have that figured out a lot better than North Americans do.

01RedDX

01-16-2014, 08:36 AM

davidI

01-16-2014, 11:09 PM

Originally posted by 01RedDX

Do I really have to explain the effects of high unemployment on a society and its economy and crime rate? Are you not aware that Europeans (especially those in the south) stand for everything you hate and bitch about in your perpetual traveller thread?
:nut:

I see the point you're trying to make and can see how you'd think my position is confusing but to me the decision on where to live always has to do with your personal circumstances. Most importantly, are you looking for somewhere to work or raise a family or be immersed in a great social culture?

As I said before:

Of course, it's all about the kind of person you are and what your needs are. Raising a family? Needing a certain type of work? Education? Health care? Love to ski? Love to mountain climb? All depends on your needs. I just listed those cities from the general availability of a good cultural lifestyle without too many hassles.

I do hate mediterranean politics and think their tax spending is terribly inefficient and wasteful and their systems are broken. Would I want to work in such a system? No. Would I want to start a business in such a system? No. Would I contribute taxes to such a system? No. Would I spend time living in such a system if I intelligently sheltered my money? Yes.

Since you mentioned my Perpetual Traveler thread, one of the stand out potential future residencies for me at the moment is Andorra. It has a wonderful tax status, European culture, mountains, lots of outdoor activities, and is close to French and Spanish beaches. However, it's the type of place you move to after you've already made your money.

Malta and Cyprus also have favourable tax regimes depending on your circumstances.

If I lived in Andorra, I'd likely seek to spend a lot of time in Spain or France. If anything, the high unemployment is simply driving down costs and making real estate and the cost of living more affordable in Southern Europe.

If I decide to have kids and need to consider their education and future job prospects, then I'd have to reconsider again based on those factors.

With respect to your comment on unemployment, I'm sure unemployment does influence crime, but I beleive it does so to varying degrees depending on the culture you're looking at. In the Mediterranean, the high unemployment has pushed more young people to continue living at home. I haven't noticed a significant change in how safe I felt in the Mediterranean over the last 8 years.

I just got back from Ethiopia, which is both incredibly poor and safe. It just reminded me that crime has a lot more to do with the mentality of people than simply their wealth situation.

I think it should be repeated:

I agree that Calgary is a great place to work just because of the job availability and competitive salaries. If you're using architecture (skyline), parks, museums, casinos, and restaurants as your comparison criteria though, Calgary falls quite short IMO.