Wire transfer...limits, things to know?

[eblend]

Hey guys,

About 5 years ago a relative in Japan lent us some money to buy our first home and she send it to us via a wire transfer which was received by our TD bank here. Well time has come to send back some cash, and I want to know if there are any limits or things I need to know. I am planning on sending $150k and want to make sure there isn't something that I am missing and that there is no suspicion or anything from the government as to why I am sending this amount of money and all that. Do I have any forms to fill out for this or anything like that, or is it just a simple matter of going to the bank, giving them the wire information, and being done with it?

[Sugarphreak]

...

[spikerS]

yeah, something like this, best to make an appt at the bank, and discuss your options.

[dezmarez]

There is no limit to send a wire transfer.

I would suggest booking an appointment so that you can get it done as soon as you get to the branch.

Make sure you have the Name, Address, Account Number of the Beneficiary, as well as Name, Address and SWIFT Code of the Beneficiaries bank.

[you&me]

Do you need to send CA$ or ¥? Either way, I'd suggest using a currency exchange to send the funds. They'll have a much better rate than you'll get at the bank and the fees will be lower. I've used both Olympia Trust and Axiom; Axiom generally has better rates.

On the day you're ready to send the funds, the process goes -

Call the currency exchange for a 'day rate'

Pick the one with the best rate.

Go to your bank and get a draft for $150,000 (or whatever the converted amount is) payable to the currency exchange. Cost for the draft at TD is $7.50 (which they'll usually waive) vs. $50+ for a wire (which they rarely waive).

Take your draft to the currency exchange office with the wiring instructions.

They send the money and you're done...

On $150,000, you could sae thousands with the more favourable exchange rate.

[tch7]

Ditto the currency exchange suggestion, especially on a large sum like that. Saved me about 10% when I transferred a bunch to Australia a few years back versus just doing a straight up bank to bank wire transfer. Used currencyonline.com, as it had the best rates at that time for my situation and it worked well, but shop around in any case.

[eblend]

Originally posted by you&me
Do you need to send CA$ or ¥? Either way, I'd suggest using a currency exchange to send the funds. They'll have a much better rate than you'll get at the bank and the fees will be lower. I've used both Olympia Trust and Axiom; Axiom generally has better rates.

On the day you're ready to send the funds, the process goes -

Call the currency exchange for a 'day rate'

Pick the one with the best rate.

Go to your bank and get a draft for $150,000 (or whatever the converted amount is) payable to the currency exchange. Cost for the draft at TD is $7.50 (which they'll usually waive) vs. $50+ for a wire (which they rarely waive).

Take your draft to the currency exchange office with the wiring instructions.

They send the money and you're done...

On $150,000, you could sae thousands with the more favourable exchange rate.

I actually have a JPY account with TD as well, so I was going to send in YEN after doing the exchange at TD. I was told at the bank that when doing an exchange in large denominations, it isn't their standard rate that average joe gets off the street, but the "mid-market" rate or something like that. I don't recall if that's the specific terminology used, but I had to google it online just now to see what it could be.

Anyways, once the money is in JPY account I was just going to get TD to do the wire transfer and pay the fee. How much do those currency exchange places charge for wiring?

Also, I don't know if this is true or not, unfortunately my old contact with TD is no longer there, but she told me before that I got the "Friends and family" rate....I don't know if it's true as the new guy at TD tells me there is no such thing...but I know when I initially did the exchange rate from YEN to CAD back 5 years ago or so, the exchange I got was better than what was listed on xe.com for example at that point in time, and was told it was the "Friends and family" rate...anyone know if this is true or if I just got the mid-market rate?

[roopi]

Originally posted by eblend


I actually have a JPY account with TD as well, so I was going to send in YEN after doing the exchange at TD. I was told at the bank that when doing an exchange in large denominations, it isn't their standard rate that average joe gets off the street, but the "mid-market" rate or something like that. I don't recall if that's the specific terminology used, but I had to google it online just now to see what it could be.

Anyways, once the money is in JPY account I was just going to get TD to do the wire transfer and pay the fee. How much do those currency exchange places charge for wiring?

Also, I don't know if this is true or not, unfortunately my old contact with TD is no longer there, but she told me before that I got the "Friends and family" rate....I don't know if it's true as the new guy at TD tells me there is no such thing...but I know when I initially did the exchange rate from YEN to CAD back 5 years ago or so, the exchange I got was better than what was listed on xe.com for example at that point in time, and was told it was the "Friends and family" rate...anyone know if this is true or if I just got the mid-market rate?

Some forex companies will waive the fee. Others are in the $35.00 range.

The only time I've seen a bank meet a forex companies rate is if you have a business account setup with the bank and you have access to send your own wires.

When exchanging 150k it's worth calling around. Don't believe what the bank tells you. Call the bank today and ask what your rate would be and then call the forex companies.

[you&me]

Originally posted by roopi


Some forex companies will waive the fee. Others are in the $35.00 range.

The only time I've seen a bank meet a forex companies rate is if you have a business account setup with the bank and you have access to send your own wires.

When exchanging 150k it's worth calling around. Don't believe what the bank tells you. Call the bank today and ask what your rate would be and then call the forex companies.

Even with the direct wire access through my business account at TD, I could never get anywhere near the rates of the forex houses, so I've just never done it.

On $150,000, we're still talking about probably a 2-3% difference in exchange rates... That's significant.

I've never paid a wire fee at Axiom or Olympia, though ymmv...

Edit - Eblend, my bank rep claims to give me the "best" rate and since he waives every other fee for me, I don't see why it wouldn't be and they still can't touch the forex rates. Either way, it's easy enough to get two or three quotes in ~5 mins and take your pick from there... All I'm saying is I wouldn't just blindly do this transaction through the bank... The last time I did, it probably cost me thousands.

[eblend]

Originally posted by you&me


Even with the direct wire access through my business account at TD, I could never get anywhere near the rates of the forex houses, so I've just never done it.

On $150,000, we're still talking about probably a 2-3% difference in exchange rates... That's significant.

I've never paid a wire fee at Axiom or Olympia, though ymmv...

Edit - Eblend, my bank rep claims to give me the "best" rate and since he waives every other fee for me, I don't see why it wouldn't be and they still can't touch the forex rates. Either way, it's easy enough to get two or three quotes in ~5 mins and take your pick from there... All I'm saying is I wouldn't just blindly do this transaction through the bank... The last time I did, it probably cost me thousands.

Interesting to know. Do these Forex places require an account or anything, or do I just show up with a bank draft for $150gs, all the tranfer information, and get it all done?

I know how the percentage can make a big difference, just didn't realize it would be that bad since I thought I got a good exchange the first time I did it. Does XE in general show a good rate you would say, or is there a better place to look to compare?

I will def check out these forex places, even though its a bit more complex but if I can get even 1% on 150k, that's $1500!

[KrisYYC]

I have nothing to contribute to this thread other than to say I've learned something from you&me and roopi. I have a brother who lives in Taiwan and have sent money through the bank or western union here and there, but usually pretty small amounts.

This info will come in handy if I need to send a larger amount. :thumbsup:

[dezmarez]

With most major banks, if you bring them a rate from a Forex place the bank will do their best to match.

When you are looking to transfer that large of an amount, you will be purchasing the currency live on the market through a forex agent.

Forex is big business for the banks, and are always willing to negotiate against a solid quote.

Best suggestion, get the different quotes, go into the branch right after (as the rates are constantly changing) ask them to match, see if they can, and complete your wire transfer.

[BrknFngrs]

Another vote for looking at forex companies instead of your bank. I get "preferred rates" through my bank and they're still awful in comparison to most forex houses (USD)

[you&me]

Originally posted by eblend


Interesting to know. Do these Forex places require an account or anything, or do I just show up with a bank draft for $150gs, all the tranfer information, and get it all done?

I know how the percentage can make a big difference, just didn't realize it would be that bad since I thought I got a good exchange the first time I did it. Does XE in general show a good rate you would say, or is there a better place to look to compare?

I will def check out these forex places, even though its a bit more complex but if I can get even 1% on 150k, that's $1500!

From what I understand, XE is essentially "spot rate", ie the exact exchange rate without any markups. In my experience, the bank rate is ~3-4% above the XE rate while the forex houses are ~.25%... That's a big difference, especially on $150k.

I've never heard of a bank offering to 'price match'. As I said, I have a pretty solid relationship with my banker to the point of not paying fees on anything else I do, so I'm not sure why he'd withhold a rate match if it was an option... Can't hurt to try though.

Regardless of the bank matching the rate, they'll still charge ~$50 for the wire whereas the forex house will not charge a wire fee, so you're left (maybe, maybe not) paying ~$7 for a draft from the bank instead. If there's one thing I'm happy to grind on, it's bank fees - they sure as fuck don't need any more from me, so I'm happy to do what I can to avoid an unnecessarily high wire fee.

The process for both Axiom and Olympia trust are -
get a quote,
"buy the money"
get a draft from your bank payable to the forex company
go to the forex company office with your draft and wiring instructions and...
done.

On a more frequent basis, you can set up an account with the forex company and have your bank account debited, eliminating the draft and going to their office bit...

[thetransporter]

just don't go to ATB. they will will call other account holders and let them know we have some money if you guys still wanted to do a withdrawal before they do your wire.

[ZenOps]

If you can spread it out a bit, then do a $99,000 transaction and then a $51,000 transaction.

Big numbers tend to draw attention. Banks tend to arbitrarily decide a nice round number on which they will do extra checking on.

For smaller amounts $9,900 per month is a good number.

[Prelude_dude]

Anything over $10,000 should be reported to Fintrac by the institution.

In regards to the 9,900 a month, I believe most institutions have a "Pattern Behavior" (not sure of the actual name....) algorithm in place much like Visa/Mastercard. It should catch this and a file will get submitted to Fintrac anyways.

Most likely where ever you go, there might be a extra form or two you need to fill out.

Also I am with you&me, use a Forex company. I exchange a lot of CDN -> US and over the years and a lot of shopping around; no bank has come remotely close. Doesn't matter if I've dealt with the bank for so many years, they are usually pretty set on their rates.

[Canmorite]

Should be fine, but you'll get better currency rates other than the bank. I've witnessed transactions that are over $500M being broken into $500M tranches, as there's some limitation with the Canadian banking system apparently.

[eblend]

Originally posted by Prelude_dude

Also I am with you&me, use a Forex company. I exchange a lot of CDN -> US and over the years and a lot of shopping around; no bank has come remotely close. Doesn't matter if I've dealt with the bank for so many years, they are usually pretty set on their rates.

I usually exchange my moneys for my travels at Calforex, but I am guessing the Forex places mentioned here are more corporate/better rates, or is Calforex in the same league?

[Prelude_dude]

So far, the last 3-4 years I have done exchanges from CDN to USD I have received better rates than Calforex. You can always just give them a call and get a quote.

At 150k any little bit is gonna make a difference.

[eblend]

Originally posted by Prelude_dude
So far, the last 3-4 years I have done exchanges from CDN to USD I have received better rates than Calforex. You can always just give them a call and get a quote.

At 150k any little bit is gonna make a difference.

Do you also recommend Olympia Trust and Axiom like you&me did or is there another one you use?

[roopi]

You can also try Cambridge Mercantile

Calgary Office
310-5920 MacLeod Trail SW
Calgary, AB T2H 0K2
Phone:(403) 269-1480
Toll Free: (866) 858-5987
Fax: (403) 269-1482
Email: [email protected]

[OU812]

Originally posted by dezmarez
With most major banks, if you bring them a rate from a Forex place the bank will do their best to match.



This is such BS. They are banking record profit and your a customer and they "try" to match. Just do it.

end rant

[Prelude_dude]

Originally posted by eblend


Do you also recommend Olympia Trust and Axiom like you&me did or is there another one you use?

I personally deal with Olympia Trust FX myself, but I have heard nothing bad or wrong with Axiom.

[eblend]

So gave Olympia a call and getting my account all setup with them. I did a rate check as well and they were better than listed on XE.com, and about $105 better than the rate at Axiom (peanuts for 150k but still). The thing that sold me above all on Olympia is the fact that they have a trust account at TD, so I can just walk into the bank, and with the form they provided me, have the bank transfer funds directly into their trust account instead of having to deal with a draft. Exchange rate is 97.5 right now for the yen...gonna hold out out until its 100! *fingers crossed*

[roopi]

So at the rate of 97.5 did you figure out your savings over the bank rate? :thumbsup:

[eblend]

Originally posted by roopi
So at the rate of 97.5 did you figure out your savings over the bank rate? :thumbsup:

didn't bother, when a bunch of people tell you it can't be beat, no point in even trying.