Is community fee mandatory in Calgary?

[oz388]

Hi guys I've been paying my community fee every year since i moved in although they don't offer anything for what they asked from us, the activities and room rental at the community center are all at an additional charge...

My question is do all of you pay your community fee as mandatory requirement? Is there a law backing up Calgary's communities so they can charge whatever on every family every year for doing nothing?! (I know they maintain things like public green space but the poor job they have done just not worth anything to me...:whipped: )

Please give your thoughts.

[Sugarphreak]

...

[ercchry]

yes... ask me how i know? :rofl:

[roopi]

It is mandatory for the community you live in however there are communities that don't have a fee.

If you don't like the fee the only way out is by moving to a no fee community.

[mrsingh]

We have the fee as well in my community, they do pretty much what Sugarphreak's old community association did. I have always paid it and intend to keep doing so. Out of curiosity, what are the legal repercussions if I don't?

[killramos]

Are we talking gated community strata style? Or just like a community association fee?

In my community they ask for one but I have never paid it and I don't think it's mandatory I think it's a pittance like 25 dollars a year but I am not that involved and as such don't know where theomeu goes so I don't pay.

[ercchry]

Originally posted by mrsingh
We have the fee as well in my community, they do pretty much what Sugarphreak's old community association did. I have always paid it and intend to keep doing so. Out of curiosity, what are the legal repercussions if I don't?

new brighton will not send you to collections... cause when they do that they can only recover a portion of the fee, no... instead they send you to their lawyers... and you have to pay their fee+original fee... and you cant sell till its all paid up to date

[sputnik]

It is mandatory.

You cannot sell your house until your account is paid up.

There will be a contract regarding this that you would have signed when you bought your house in that area.

[spikerS]

Home Owners Association (HOA) fees are on a community by community basis.

Each community can choose to create one, or remove one. When you buy a house in the community, it is written into the purchase contract that you agree to pay it, and it is legally binding. If you choose not to pay it, they can plan a lien on your property, so that it is paid when you choose to sell the property.

They are basically condo fees.

Personally, I hate them, and wish they didn't exist, but they are becoming more and more prevalent. The only good thing about them, is they are usually pretty cheap. The most expensive one I have heard of was $240 / year and that was Tuscany. I am sure there are more expensive ones in Calgary though.

[403ep3]

I apparently have a HOA fee/year but I haven't paid it since I moved in. No bills or contracts have been received/signed. Will it end up sneaking up on me once I sell my house?:rolleyes:

[spikerS]

Originally posted by 403ep3
I apparently have a HOA fee/year but I haven't paid it since I moved in. No bills or contracts have been received/signed. Will it end up sneaking up on me once I sell my house?:rolleyes:

You should review your purchase contract. They are usually written into those.

[Sugarphreak]

...

[roopi]

Originally posted by spikerS
The most expensive one I have heard of was $240 / year and that was Tuscany. I am sure there are more expensive ones in Calgary though.

Cranston - $140ish
Auburn Bay - $500ish
Mahogany - $850ish

Lake communities tend to be the highest.

[schocker]

Glad I don't have one of these yet :rofl:

[mrsingh]

Originally posted by Sugarphreak
Actually you just reminded me of something... in my old community there was 2 associations... one was mandatory, the other was some sort of voluntary thing.

The mandatory one was highlighted to me when I bought the house, and it is in the legal documents.

Ya we have something similar in Kincora. The Resident's Association is mandatory and is $210/yr incl GST. The optional one is the Community Association, I have never bothered with that one so not sure of its cost.

[rage2]

Originally posted by roopi
Cranston - $140ish
Auburn Bay - $500ish
Mahogany - $850ish

Lake communities tend to be the highest.
Arbour Lake seems cheap in comparison.

Regular Lot $215.00
Lake Access Lot $294.11
Lakeshore Lot $430.00
Multi Family Residential $166.75
(All prices include GST)

[oz388]

Originally posted by spikerS
Home Owners Association (HOA) fees are on a community by community basis.

Each community can choose to create one, or remove one. When you buy a house in the community, it is written into the purchase contract that you agree to pay it, and it is legally binding. If you choose not to pay it, they can plan a lien on your property, so that it is paid when you choose to sell the property.

They are basically condo fees.

Personally, I hate them, and wish they didn't exist, but they are becoming more and more prevalent. The only good thing about them, is they are usually pretty cheap. The most expensive one I have heard of was $240 / year and that was Tuscany. I am sure there are more expensive ones in Calgary though.

So it is legal for greedy bastard community board to pay themselves big salary using everyone's money and just do the minimum work to maintain the community?! Why can't this type of corruption be stopped??

[speedog]

Older communities (1970's or older) generally don't have any mandatory fees, but you also don't usually get big fancy community gardens, fancy community entrance signs, fancy hanging flower baskets on the boulevards, fancy community centers, lakes, outdoor refrigerated rinks. etc.

Evergreen, which is near our shop, has some nicely maintained community entrance points as well as nice hanging flower baskets and residents there probably have some sort of annual fee that goes in part to maintaining such things.

Our mid-50's community, where our home is, has no mandatory fees - there is a voluntary annual fee ($15) that we pay because we see the value in having a community association building, an outdoor rink and an outdoor pool that are well maintained, well utilized and are integral parts of our community. Luckily for us, we have a strong community association and great volunteers which means our community makes enough in rental income to keep our community's assets in very good condition and at the same time, have a very large, financial safety blanket at the same time should something unforeseen happen to our hall or such.

Would I pay a mandatory fee - in my community, yes, as we have great planned events which have been happening annually for decades and which are always sold out. Halloween events, chili cook-offs, stampede breakfasts, stampede BBQ's, theatre in the park, outdoor shinny tournament, movie nights at the pool, senior events, the list is quite extensive. To some, this is of no value, to others such as our family, it has plenty of value - after 18 years in our community and attending community events for every one of those 18 years, there is probably not a block in our community that I don't know someone. Kind of nice to be able to go for an evening stroll and know people throughout our community.

[speedog]

Originally posted by oz388
So it is legal for greedy bastard community board to pay themselves big salary using everyone's money and just do the minimum work to maintain the community?! Why can't this type of corruption be stopped??

Odd - our community board is made 100% of volunteers. I sat on our CA's board for a number of years and realized exactly zero dollars in compensation and in fact, the only people who were paid any sort of income in our community would be the cleaning staff.

By the way oz388, what community are you in? It would be interesting to find out why your CA's board is being paid a salary when that is most definitely not the norm.

[kenny]

Originally posted by rage2

Arbour Lake seems cheap in comparison.

Regular Lot $215.00
Lake Access Lot $294.11
Lakeshore Lot $430.00
Multi Family Residential $166.75
(All prices include GST)

Probably because Arbour Lake is so small. The storm ponds in all new communities are bigger than Arbour Lake. :rofl:

With that said, Mahogany fees are crazy considering those prices are for basic lots. I know Auburn Bay fee breakdown is 500/1500/1800. Wonder how expensive Lake Bonaventure and Bonavista fees are.

[Cos]

.

[JamMan23]

Originally posted by roopi


Cranston - $140ish
Auburn Bay - $500ish
Mahogany - $850ish

Lake communities tend to be the highest.

That's not really accurate, according to here:
http://mahoganyliving.com/benefits/faq.html#2

The fees for Mahogany are $400/year ( I'm 90% sure it's almost the same in Auburn Bay). You pay more for beach front/lake access lots, but a regular lot is $400/year.

[roopi]

Originally posted by kenny


With that said, Mahogany fees are crazy considering those prices are for basic lots. I know Auburn Bay fee breakdown is 500/1500/1800. Wonder how expensive Lake Bonaventure and Bonavista fees are.

Well I guess I should have been clear. I'm sure Mahogany must have a tiered system like Auburn Bay. I was just stating what my fees were this year. I'm assuming I'm in the middle somewhere. I'm not in a starter home but I don't have a dock on the lake. I'm within a block of the lake so I'm assuming somewhere around the middle.

[JamMan23]

To answer the original question, if it's mandatory there will be an encumbrance placed on your property.

For instance, I just bought in Legacy, and the document said something like:

We reserve the right to charge up to $500 a year in "rent".

Right now Legacy has no community fees, but it will once it is more fully built out. So even if a community doesn't currently have fees, that doesn't mean there isn't some legal documents attached to your property saying that it is possible.

[roopi]

Originally posted by JamMan23


That's not really accurate, according to here:
http://mahoganyliving.com/benefits/faq.html#2

The fees for Mahogany are $400/year ( I'm 90% sure it's almost the same in Auburn Bay). You pay more for beach front/lake access lots, but a regular lot is $400/year.

Hmmm. Interesting. Just checked what I paid and it was $799.60. I fall in the 'Reserve Collection'. I'm not lakefront so they must have changed the fees.

[sputnik]

Originally posted by spikerS
The most expensive one I have heard of was $240 / year and that was Tuscany. I am sure there are more expensive ones in Calgary though.

Auburn Bay was $400/year for a back lot and up to $1500/year for a lake lot.

I think Mahogany is even more than that.

[speedog]

So let's use Mahogany as our guinea pig (http://mahoganyliving.com/benefits/homeowners-association.html) - a nice lake that will be stocked with trout, a 21 acre private beach for residents, a very fancy clubhouse CA building, an outdoor rink very soon.

Meanwhile, there's lots of communities where the residents will drive a considerable distance for those same amenities. There's also lots of CA's that on the verge of bankruptcy (Highland Park) or have been bankrupt (Beddington) - communities that have low, low voluntary annual fees and had low numbers of volunteers coming out to sit on and run their CA boards. Mahogany will have a very nice funded CA building, a restricted access lake and yes, it will probably have some paid staff to maintain these facilities.

So the real answer is you either pay these fees in the communities that have them or move to a community that doesn't have these mandatory fees. It is a choice because no one if forcing anyone to buy in any community, mandatory fees or not.

[oz388]

Originally posted by speedog

So the real answer is you either pay these fees in the communities that have them or move to a community that doesn't have these mandatory fees. It is a choice because no one if forcing anyone to buy in any community, mandatory fees or not.

Can anyone provide a list of the communities in Calgary that don't charge a fee? Let's see if these communities are as nice as those with the fees.

[ercchry]

Originally posted by oz388


Can anyone provide a list of the communities in Calgary that don't charge a fee? Let's see if these communities are as nice as those with the fees.

i believe its not that simple... the fee thing is mostly a burbs thing cause the developers are the ones doing the maintaining instead of the city

[speedog]

Originally posted by oz388


So it is legal for greedy bastard community board to pay themselves big salary using everyone's money and just do the minimum work to maintain the community?! Why can't this type of corruption be stopped??
Which community are you in?

[Chandler_Racing]

Originally posted by roopi


Hmmm. Interesting. Just checked what I paid and it was $799.60. I fall in the 'Reserve Collection'. I'm not lakefront so they must have changed the fees.

That sounds about right believe mine was ~$800 (non lakefront).

Think they went up about $75 from the previous year.

The starter homes fees are closer to $400 as far as I know.

[rage2]

Originally posted by kenny
Probably because Arbour Lake is so small. The storm ponds in all new communities are bigger than Arbour Lake. :rofl:
While that's true, it doesn't make much of a difference anyways as none of the lakes in the city allow motorized watercrafts.

[spikerS]

Originally posted by rage2

While that's true, it doesn't make much of a difference anyways as none of the lakes in the city allow motorized watercrafts.

Everything is legal man, as long as you don't get caught!

nixoJJxZZY0

[Sugarphreak]

...

[spikerS]

Originally posted by Sugarphreak


I guess because of noise and potential for pollution...

...Telsa needs to make a Jetski

See my video. 100% electric, and a small one at that. My bigger boats are WAY louder.

[roopi]

Originally posted by spikerS


See my video. 100% electric, and a small one at that. My bigger boats are WAY louder.

I think they are referring to watercraft that can hold a passenger larger then a G.I. Joe. :rofl:

[rage2]

Yes we are. :rofl:

[oz388]

Originally posted by speedog

Which community are you in?

I'm going to move to Riverstone of Cranston. I heard the fee there is between $400-$500. In my opinion this is a robbery for a non-lake community. Sure the river runs by it but it doesn't cost them anything having a river! Anyone can walk down there enjoy fishing so why it costs so much for residents?

[ercchry]

Because of the refrigerated outdoor rink...

[rage2]

New Brighton has a community fee with absolutely zero amenities haha. Ok they have a clubhouse that you have to pay to use. A steal at $325!

[speedog]

So don't buy in New Brighton. :dunno:

[ExtraSlow]

Mount Pleasant has no community fee. I'm happy with that.

[OU812]

so two questions.

1. Has anyone ever seen the financials to see where the money is actually being spent in any of their hoods?

2. WTF does a person on a lake lot have to pay more? Doesnt sound like they get any benefit over the rest of the neighborhood other than direct access which everyone else goes to the com centre for. This just sounds like a cash grab.

[roopi]

Originally posted by OU812
so two questions.

1. Has anyone ever seen the financials to see where the money is actually being spent in any of their hoods?

2. WTF does a person on a lake lot have to pay more? Doesnt sound like they get any benefit over the rest of the neighborhood other than direct access which everyone else goes to the com centre for. This just sounds like a cash grab.

1. Financials are sent each year (well in Cranston they are).

2. Lakefront lots do have the private docks into the lake. Private gated walkways Maybe ask Sugerphreak about it. Kind of related to how property tax works. :D

[rage2]

Some communities publish financials online.

The New Brighton one is interesting:

http://newbrighton-connect.com/clientuploads/Resident%20Version.pdf


I'd like to see a breakdown of that $589k where staffing (salaries) got lumped into. :)

[BrknFngrs]

I can't believe that they don't publish any explanatory notes when the financials are shown with that much aggregation :confused:

[speedog]

Originally posted by BrknFngrs
I can't believe that they don't publish any explanatory notes when the financials are shown with that much aggregation :confused:
One could probably attend a meeting and get anything explained in detail - I know that everything is available at our community meetings and especially at the AGM.

These community boards have to be on the up and up and be able to explain anything in detail as getting any form of a grant will depend on them being able to provide details. This I know from sitting on our CA board in the past - the level of detail needed to satisfy the CoC and other granting organizations is amazing. I'm sure our CA could provide monthly details as to how much is spent on bathroom cleaners versus kitchen supplies.

In response to OU812's #1 question, yupp, I've seen my community's financials (Highwood) and they are very detailed - at regular meetings, a basic overview is provided but details are always available. Our mid-50's community has no mandatory fees but we also don't have a big lake or a huge, fancy club house or manicured boulevards/community entrances decorated with flowers and plantings - those are things that the mandatory fees in the burbs pay for similar to New Brighton. If one doesn't want to pay those fees, then move to a community that doesn't charge them - it's as simple as that.

[barmanjay]

To reiterate over again,.. those fees are mandatory.

They may or may not be written in your purchase contract, but they sure will be registered on your title.

Your lawyer should have reviewed the title and explained this to you when you were signing the papers.

Pull your title and look at additional documents registered. You will see some form of association registered to it and they are usually formed the day the land starts getting developed. Every home in the community will have the same thing registered on their title.

If you don't pay, they will send your file to their lawyers. They wont send you to collections, but they will register a caveat on your title to a specified amount that will have a clause that includes any future non-payments, legal fees and accumulated interest.

If the fees do become significant (never paid ever). They have every right to put a Lis Pendens (easy way to remember what this is - Li-tigation Pend-ing) on title - take you to court and force you to sell to pay off the fees, or force you to pay by any other means.

[jacky4566]

+1 barmanjay

Always. Always. Always.

Get copies of ALL the registered documents on a property and read them thoroughly.

Its $10 per document and when your buying a home you wanna be sure of what your buying into.

[Paul]

I can't believe what some of you are saying you pay in community fees, it seems rediculously high to me. We lived in Copperfield for a number of years an had no Community Asso fees, but also had no amenities whatsoever. I now live in Mountain Park and we only pay $260/yr with full lake access. They also charge us an extra $6/yr on our property taxes to clear snow on the paths each year which I don't agree with as I'm sure it's really only used by people walking their dogs

[BerserkerCatSplat]

Originally posted by oz388


So it is legal for greedy bastard community board to pay themselves big salary using everyone's money and just do the minimum work to maintain the community?! Why can't this type of corruption be stopped??

To my knowledge, a CA board cannot unilaterally give themselves a salary, it must be voted into place at an AGM. So if they're getting a salary, it's because the owners voluntarily gave it to them.

[bg_27]

Originally posted by barmanjay
To reiterate over again,.. those fees are mandatory.

They may or may not be written in your purchase contract, but they sure will be registered on your title.

Your lawyer should have reviewed the title and explained this to you when you were signing the papers.

Pull your title and look at additional documents registered. You will see some form of association registered to it and they are usually formed the day the land starts getting developed. Every home in the community will have the same thing registered on their title.

If you don't pay, they will send your file to their lawyers. They wont send you to collections, but they will register a caveat on your title to a specified amount that will have a clause that includes any future non-payments, legal fees and accumulated interest.

If the fees do become significant (never paid ever). They have every right to put a Lis Pendens (easy way to remember what this is - Li-tigation Pend-ing) on title - take you to court and force you to sell to pay off the fees, or force you to pay by any other means.

So true, these fees are title registered.
There were a couple people in the Hamptons that refused to pay their fees for YEARS, I believe the CA did the Lis Pendens on them and won.

[rage2]

Originally posted by bg_27
So true, these fees are title registered.
There were a couple people in the Hamptons that refused to pay their fees for YEARS, I believe the CA did the Lis Pendens on them and won.
Damn Asians.

[FraserB]

Originally posted by roopi
2. Lakefront lots do have the private docks into the lake. Private gated walkways Maybe ask Sugerphreak about it. Kind of related to how property tax works. :D

Sugarphreak doesn't have the private dock yet, they still have to build him his lake.

[speedog]

Originally posted by ercchry
Because of the refrigerated outdoor rink...
Spot on - those outdoor refrigerated rinks are very expensive to operate (including the Zamboni) and Cranston also has a very nice community hall which includes a full sized gymnasium.

[4DoorGTZ]

Originally posted by speedog

Evergreen, which is near our shop, has some nicely maintained community entrance points as well as nice hanging flower baskets and residents there probably have some sort of annual fee that goes in part to maintaining such things.


$105/yr for a condo owner in Evergreen....

[botox]

I'm in Panorama Hills and I think last years fees were $270. My neighbor looked into getting rid of the fees and he said is was possible but you would need 80% votes/signatures in agreement to remove the fees.

[Sugarphreak]

...

[firebane]

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[oz388]

Originally posted by botox
I'm in Panorama Hills and I think last years fees were $270. My neighbor looked into getting rid of the fees and he said is was possible but you would need 80% votes/signatures in agreement to remove the fees.


omg $270 for Panorama now?! I lived there for 5 years and that community offered me nothing but people, lots of people...

[nj2Type-S]

Originally posted by oz388


I'm going to move to Riverstone of Cranston. I heard the fee there is between $400-$500. In my opinion this is a robbery for a non-lake community. Sure the river runs by it but it doesn't cost them anything having a river! Anyone can walk down there enjoy fishing so why it costs so much for residents?

i just signed to build in riverstone, and when i saw the price difference between upper cranston and riverstone, it made me go :banghead:

upper cranston: $150.68 incl. gst
riverstone: $427.46 incl. gst

why should we have to pay way more when upper cranston residents can just walk down the paths to the river? ah well haha! :(

[ercchry]

Originally posted by nj2Type-S


i just signed to build in riverstone, and when i saw the price difference between upper cranston and riverstone, it made me go :banghead:

upper cranston: $150.68 incl. gst
riverstone: $427.46 incl. gst

why should we have to pay way more when upper cranston residents can just walk down the paths to the river? ah well haha! :(

hopefully that extra is going to building a berm for the river... since that shit was under water during the floods :rofl:

[roopi]

Originally posted by ercchry


hopefully that extra is going to building a berm for the river... since that shit was under water during the floods :rofl:

The water never reached the homes along the river. They are pretty far in. I believe it was about 10-20 ft short of touching a home.

Personally I still wouldn't risk it.

[nj2Type-S]

i had those concerns, too, of course. our house will be along the escarpment, so pretty far from the riverbanks. like roopi said, the flood did not even come close to the homes along the river.

let's hope this 100+ year flood doesn't happen for another 100 years. haha!

[oz388]

Originally posted by nj2Type-S


i just signed to build in riverstone, and when i saw the price difference between upper cranston and riverstone, it made me go :banghead:

upper cranston: $150.68 incl. gst
riverstone: $427.46 incl. gst

why should we have to pay way more when upper cranston residents can just walk down the paths to the river? ah well haha! :(

I hope we should all vote to build a gate at the entrance of riverstone so only the residences has right to enter! :guns:

[speedog]

Originally posted by oz388

I hope we should all vote to build a gate at the entrance of riverstone so only the residences has right to enter! :guns:

That are good english. ;)

[nj2Type-S]

is it too late to back out now that i've signed the purchase agreement? maybe i'll get a lot in upper cranston instead LOL!

[oz388]

Originally posted by nj2Type-S
is it too late to back out now that i've signed the purchase agreement? maybe i'll get a lot in upper cranston instead LOL!

If u have mortgage condition in ur contract i think u can still back out saying u can't get a loan...but Riverstone is a better choice IMO. The high community fee filters out the "cheap" neighbors for you at least.

:poosie:

[nj2Type-S]

Originally posted by oz388


If u have mortgage condition in ur contract i think u can still back out saying u can't get a loan...but Riverstone is a better choice IMO. The high community fee filters out the "cheap" neighbors for you at least.

:poosie:

hey man,

i tried to send you a PM, but your mailbox is full. i have some questions for your about riverstone, please.

thanks!

[sexualbanana]

I always get a kick out of people complaining about community fees since I grew up in an old neighborhood without one.

Mostly because I've seen what happens to a neighborhood that doesn't...
- Shitty rinks
- Shitty community halls, if any
- No maintenance/upkeep or aesthetic enhancements of any kind

Then I go to neighborhoods that do...
- The exact opposite

And people complain that they don't use the amenities or that they don't see the value, as if that stuff just pops up overnight.

Besides, for most people who bought their places new, they were well aware that there were community fees and it's not until they stop using them (ie the hockey rinks) that they start complaining about having to pay the fee.

[schurchill39]

Originally posted by ercchry


hopefully that extra is going to building a berm for the river... since that shit was under water during the floods :rofl:

It wasn't even close to any of the houses or putting the construction in danger, which was suprising.



Originally posted by oz388


I hope we should all vote to build a gate at the entrance of riverstone so only the residences has right to enter! :guns:
Good call, but then all of us lower class "upper cranstonites" just walk down the coolie into your community anyways. Where's your gate now huh?



Originally posted by sexualbanana
I always get a kick out of people complaining about community fees since I grew up in an old neighborhood without one.

Mostly because I've seen what happens to a neighborhood that doesn't...
- Shitty rinks
- Shitty community halls, if any
- No maintenance/upkeep or aesthetic enhancements of any kind

Then I go to neighborhoods that do...
- The exact opposite

And people complain that they don't use the amenities or that they don't see the value, as if that stuff just pops up overnight.

Besides, for most people who bought their places new, they were well aware that there were community fees and it's not until they stop using them (ie the hockey rinks) that they start complaining about having to pay the fee.

All we have to show for in Cranston is a windmill and that community hall. There are tons of walking paths in the community that don't get maintained or the snow cleared. If I'm paying community fees I want to be able to move about my community regardless of if its winter or summer.