Calgary schools getting gender neutral washrooms [Archive] - Beyond.ca - Car Forums

rage2

02-10-2015, 09:25 AM

http://img2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20141009211936/southpark/images/b/ba/Cartman's_new_transgender_bathroom.png

Calgary Board of Education’s new schools to feature gender-neutral washrooms

It wasn’t exams or essays that used to stress out Alexis Hood, but rather a simple trip to the school bathroom.

As a transgender student at Forest Lawn High School, she said finding a place to do one’s business was a “lose-lose” scenario.

“Some of us were using our preferred washrooms and kids would target us and then we would go to the one where we would fit and were told we were in the wrong one,” Hood explained.

After complaints, the school did take action, converting two singular staff washrooms into gender-neutral sites that could be used by students if they obtained a key from the teacher sponsor of the school’s gay-straight alliance.

Even then, the situation is not ideal. Fellow transgender student Sam Dyck said it can take up to 15 minutes for him to trek across the building to get the key and use the washroom.

“They need to be more accessible; it’s really inconvenient,” he said.

But there’s hope on the horizon.

Earlier this month, Dyck and a peer sat down with a group of Calgary Board of Education officials to talk about plans to incorporate designated, gender-neutral washrooms in the designs of up to 20 new schools due to be constructed and begin opening in fall 2016.

“I’m very hopeful these washrooms are going to be more common in schools,” Dyck said. “Let’s face it, we kind of need them in all schools.”

There was also discussion of retrofitting washroom spaces to make them more inclusive in existing schools, Dyck said, as well as talk of establishing gender-neutral change rooms for those partaking in gym class.

The CBE confirmed that gender-neutral washrooms are being incorporated in the designs of all new schools.

No one was made available for an interview but the organization said in a statement that all members of the school community “share the responsibility of cultivating environments that welcome everyone and provide opportunities to thrive in life and learning.”

A spokesperson for the Calgary Catholic School District said staff washrooms at all its facilities are offered up as gender-neutral spaces for students.

Dyck said the washrooms are hardly different from typical ones, but the removal of the sign on the door signalling whether it’s for a man or woman is highly important.

The washrooms also need to be accessible for those in wheelchairs and located near areas teachers frequent so they can keep an eye out for potential issues that may arise.

The topic of gender-neutral washrooms was also raised at a forum in Edmonton last week concerning gay-straight alliances. It’s expected new legislation will be brought to the provincial legislature later this year specifying the rules for schools where students request to form such groups.

Last week’s forum was attended by Alberta Education Minister Gordon Dirks, but he wasn’t made available for an interview on the matter Wednesday.

Dirks did issue a statement but made no specific mention of gender-neutral washrooms.

“All school boards are required to ensure they are providing a welcoming, caring, respectful and safe learning environment for students,” the minister wrote. “All school jurisdictions have flexibility in the design of their schools to determine how they wish to address the needs of all students and staff.”
Seriously, WTF? Do we have a flood of transgender kids in school today that I'm not aware of? Have we come to the point where we have to cater to every exception and every special interest group now?

A790

02-10-2015, 09:26 AM

South Park had it right.

R154

02-10-2015, 09:29 AM

The fuck is a gender neutral person?

Does it have a dick ----> Mens

Does it have a vagina ----> Womens

what am I missing?

killramos

02-10-2015, 09:30 AM

Yup. One of the stupidest things i see about all this is :

"gender-neutral sites that could be used by students if they obtained a key from the teacher sponsor of the school’s gay-straight alliance."

Why should someone need a key? Why cant everyone use the "Gender Neutral Washroom".

Its not even a gender neutral washroom at all. Its Sam Dyck's personal washroom now. And he isn't even satisfied with that. He wants them places periodically around the school so he doesn't have to walk so far to get to one.

wtf?

:banghead:

tsi_neal

02-10-2015, 09:31 AM

Easier solution, parents need to stop being dicks to people who are different, thus stop teaching their kids to be dicks, and let the transgender kids use whatever bathroom they are comfortable with.

killramos

02-10-2015, 09:32 AM

Originally posted by R154
The fuck is a gender neutral person?

Does it have a dick ----> Mens

Does it have a vagina ----> Womens

what am I missing?

Exactly, i have no fucking clue what sexual orientation has to do with anything of this.

Because that's all this is.

Is the preference of someone as to who they want to have sex with.

And people should be granted special privileges for this? :facepalm:

killramos

02-10-2015, 09:33 AM

Originally posted by tsi_neal
Easier solution, parents need to stop being dicks to people who are different, thus stop teaching their kids to be dicks, and let the transgender kids use whatever bathroom they are comfortable with.

No parents need to stop nurturing the massive sense of entitlement to special treatment that 90% of youth have these days.

edit: wow that's alot of posts in a short span, i need to calm down lol. Bad mood this morning...

tsi_neal

02-10-2015, 09:38 AM

Originally posted by killramos

No parents need to stop nurturing the massive sense of entitlement to special treatment that 90% of youth have these days.

While that is very true, the issue as I see it is the kids that have the issue want to be able to take a shit without being harassed. Its not exactly entitlement to want to shit in peace. Expecting a personal bathroom on the other hand, is.

If a kid isn't a dick to another kid trying to shit then problem solved.

DENZILDON

02-10-2015, 09:38 AM

Originally posted by tsi_neal
Easier solution, parents need to stop being dicks to people who are different, thus stop teaching their kids to be dicks, and let the transgender kids use whatever bathroom they are comfortable with.

This is the solution. I'm sure the transgender kids doesn't want any special privilege if the people would just let them be.

Funny thing is this is it's a big issue here in a First world country. I never encountered this in the Philippines and has never been an issue.

killramos

02-10-2015, 09:41 AM

Originally posted by tsi_neal

While that is very true, the issue as I see it is the kids that have the issue want to be able to take a shit without being harassed. Its not exactly entitlement to want to shit in peace. Expecting a personal bathroom on the other hand, is.

If a kid isn't a dick to another kid trying to shit then problem solved.

How is this any different than a fat kid getting harassed for taking a shit?

Cause that happens to, guess what. Kids are little shits, have been for years. And it doesn't necessarily have anything to do with their parents being assholes.

Its human nature to distrust and mock deviants in society. That's just reality and kids don't need to be taught to do it.

i think if anything we need to introduce more "thicker skin training" for all children. Because EVERYONE has something different about them, that one day someone will make fun of them for.

BerserkerCatSplat

02-10-2015, 09:44 AM

Originally posted by killramos

Exactly, i have no fucking clue what sexual orientation has to do with anything of this.

Because that's all this is.

Is the preference of someone as to who they want to have sex with.

And people should be granted special privileges for this? :facepalm:

I can't agree that gender dysphoria/transgenderism is the same as "sexual orientation". They're rather different things, gender identity and sexual preference may be linked but that's not always the case and it's a pretty big oversimplification to lump them together.

With that said, it really seems like there's a lot of kowtowing to a group that actually encompasses less than one percent of the population. Maybe the current wave of tumblr trans-trenders is making it appear like more of a problem than it is.

On the other hand, handicapped people also make up a similarly low portion of the population and we do a lot to make their lives easier as well.

clem24

02-10-2015, 09:46 AM

Originally posted by R154
The fuck is a gender neutral person?

Does it have a dick ----> Mens

Does it have a vagina ----> Womens

what am I missing?

You miss the entire point of the transgender debate and have a complete lack of understanding of the issues.

kertejud2

02-10-2015, 09:47 AM

Gender neutral washrooms are good for the purpose intended, but the proposed execution of these is absolutely ridiculous. It shouldn't be this hard to make a gender neutral washroom.

R154

02-10-2015, 09:49 AM

Originally posted by clem24

You miss the entire point of the transgender debate and have a complete lack of understanding of the issues.

You're right, because I have never given any of that a passing thought.

If you would be so kind, would you offer me a quick explanation?

killramos

02-10-2015, 09:52 AM

Originally posted by kertejud2
Gender neutral washrooms are good for the purpose intended, but the proposed execution of these is absolutely ridiculous. It shouldn't be this hard to make a gender neutral washroom.

Yup it is quite easy, they exist all around the world.

http://i.ytimg.com/vi/EUwyC9-Aqs4/hqdefault.jpg

In tons of country they don't give a flying rats ass what your parts look like. These are gender neutral as fuck. There is a nice rebuke to the Thailand argument. Though I think this is in India lol.

DENZILDON

02-10-2015, 09:54 AM

Originally posted by killramos

How is this any different than a fat kid getting harassed for taking a shit?

Cause that happens to, guess what. Kids are little shits, have been for years. And it doesn't necessarily have anything to do with their parents being assholes.

Its human nature to distrust and mock deviants in society. That's just reality and kids don't need to be taught to do it.

i think if anything we need to introduce more "thicker skin training" for all children. Because EVERYONE has something different about them, that one day someone will make fun of them for.

So the issue is adults making a big fuss about it.

The funny thing about this is most transgender kids with the same issue fight to use the bathrooms their gender is associated with it and this is completely the opposite.

I think if kids are educated about gender dysphoria then they will be less harassed. I know kids will be kids but if everyone is educated in a young age then hopefully in the future most people will accept them as normal.

DENZILDON

02-10-2015, 09:57 AM

Originally posted by R154

You're right, because I have never given any of that a passing thought.

If you would be so kind, would you offer me a quick explanation?

Here's a question for you, let's say you are peeing on a mens public restroom and this hot chick stands beside you and also pee. Would you feel comfortable?

She has a penis but she knows she is a girl, looks like a girl and acts like a girl.

EDIT*** there's a commercial about this.... hahaha!

Sugarphreak

02-10-2015, 10:00 AM

...

R154

02-10-2015, 10:02 AM

I refer back to my differentiation medium.

I have pee'd beside a transgendered individual exactly as you described at the airport (heathrow). At first I was wondering if I was in the right place. after that thought I went back to peeing, and didnt think about it again until this conversation.

I think people are making a big deal over nothing.

rage2

02-10-2015, 10:03 AM

R154

02-10-2015, 10:04 AM

Originally posted by rage2

I'd be more uncomfortable if a black guy pissed beside me TBH.

:rofl:

killramos

02-10-2015, 10:05 AM

Originally posted by Sugarphreak
Last time I checked both mens and womens bathrooms had stalls in which privacy can be had... just add a +transgender symbol to the doors and stop making it a big issue

I don't think it is really about privacy. Its about accommodation of what they consider to be a third gender.

Presumably all of these kids know who the trans people are ( i mean come on its pretty obvious without surgery)

I think its about them being harassed in the washrooms where there is no administration presence to discourage the harassment.

Because if that isn't what it is then i agree with you 150% and that is this is overblown. Its either a political statement or its about harassment.

A point from the article that proves that this is mostly about making a statement is that all they care about is there not being a gender on the door. :nut:

BigMass

02-10-2015, 10:06 AM

make everything co-ed from the very beginning and kids might not grow up with the same hang-ups and dogmas adults currently have. Transgender, gay, straight, race, etc. We need to move passed the discrimination. It wasn't too long ago where blacks and whites had separate bathrooms because whites didn't want to get contaminated by the blackness. Our societal morals are constantly evolving, lets not stifle that change. Remember when you guys were young and laughing at how closed minded your parents were about certain issues? I see some posters in this thread acting no differently. It's funny how that works isn't it.

killramos

02-10-2015, 10:10 AM

Originally posted by BigMass
It wasn't too long ago where blacks and whites had separate bathrooms because whites didn't want to get contaminated by the blackness.

Well according to this thread we have moved from whites not wanting to be in the same washroom as blacks to asians not wanting to be in the same washroom as blacks.

:rofl:

Sugarphreak

02-10-2015, 10:11 AM

...

lilmira

02-10-2015, 10:12 AM

Boys have a penis, girls have a vagina.

The good old 90s, nowadays we don't know who has what.

lasimmon

02-10-2015, 10:13 AM

Whole lot of hilarity from some posters in this thread

killramos

02-10-2015, 10:13 AM

Originally posted by Sugarphreak
^^ Mens washrooms are pretty disgusting compared to Womens though, so I don't blame them :rofl:

We had coed washrooms on our floor in Res in university :poosie:

Fuck those women were nasty pigs... :barf:

lilmira

02-10-2015, 10:18 AM

Ban stalls too while we are at it. Don't discriminate against people going for number 2. Yes I had taco bell with extra hot sauce a while ago, it stinks, I'm proud of it and I'm not hiding behind no door. Taco power!

Mibz

02-10-2015, 10:22 AM

Originally posted by lasimmon
Whole lot of hilarity from some posters in this thread Yup. I'm kinda surprised so many people on Beyond have no idea what a transgender person is. I feel like this argument happened everywhere else on the internet at least once a month for the last year.

BigMass

02-10-2015, 10:40 AM

Originally posted by lilmira
Boys have a penis, girls have a vagina.

The good old 90s, nowadays we don't know who has what.

because we have science, reason and logic to help guide us forward instead of Joe Six Pack and the rest of his nascar buddies telling us how society should be. "I remember when real man could beat his wife and own a slave, those were the good ole days". Give it another hundred years and watch those people laugh at how backwards we are now.

Maxx Mazda

02-10-2015, 11:00 AM

What in the fuck do KIDS know about being "transgender??" You have a dick, or a vagina. It's simple. You're a boy or a girl. Enough of the bleeding heart sympathetic bullshit. If you want to change your sex, that is 100% a YOU problem, not a ME problem...

BigMass

02-10-2015, 11:05 AM

Originally posted by Maxx Mazda
What in the fuck do KIDS know about being "transgender??" You have a dick, or a vagina. It's simple. You're a boy or a girl. Enough of the bleeding heart sympathetic bullshit. If you want to change your sex, that is 100% a YOU problem, not a ME problem...

I'll ignore the face palming ignorant rant at the start of your post, but the last part is a false dichotomy. Why does it have to be a problem for anyone?

suntan

02-10-2015, 11:06 AM

They mostly want to do this because usage is unbalanced. Men don't use the stalls nearly as much as women do, so if you can ease lineups by having common stalls then hey whatever.

Also it saves on maintenance costs because there's only one bathroom to clean.

killramos

02-10-2015, 11:21 AM

Originally posted by suntan
They mostly want to do this because usage is unbalanced. Men don't use the stalls nearly as much as women do, so if you can ease lineups by having common stalls then hey whatever.

Also it saves on maintenance costs because there's only one bathroom to clean.

By the same logic there should be 2-3 times as many women's washrooms as men's because women need more time and space to do their business than men do. I read a paper on it in university ( not by choice), you can look it up if you want.

The problem with all this is where does it stop?

The whole transgender right movement really seems like progress for progresses sake.

While some don't want to admit it gender neutrality is not actually a thing. Humans are biologically gendered. It is not a purely social construct as many SJW's will tell you. Some people associate with a gender that they were not physically born as ( this is not a normal occurrence, it is a defect, however regardless of how politically incorrect i sound by saying that). Those people still have a gender.

IMO i don't give a shit what washroom people use, if you look like a dude use the mens or if you look like a chick use the womens. Or if you have a dick use the mens or if your genitals are aesthetically pleasing use the womens.

I don't know what peoples normal washroom habits are but i certainly don't experience many people whipping their shit out for everyone to see that would cause this to be an issue in day to day life.

I went to high school with someone who was transgendered ( actually the same person who made a huge stink about the washrooms at UofC recently) he wasn't particularly well liked and he likes to flaunt that it was because people didn't support his status and brings it up time and time again to justify his need to special treatment. Actually he was just an asshole and people called him out on it. He thought he was better and smarter than everyone else, and you know exactly how that goes over. He dropped out half way through grade 12 ( well before he actually publicly came out btw).

All of you calling people backwards etc for disagreeing with these move by the school are just as bad as feminazis calling men misogynists if they do not support "feminism"

dexlargo

02-10-2015, 11:34 AM

Originally posted by BigMass
make everything co-ed from the very beginning and kids might not grow up with the same hang-ups and dogmas adults currently have. Transgender, gay, straight, race, etc. We need to move passed the discrimination. It wasn't too long ago where blacks and whites had separate bathrooms because whites didn't want to get contaminated by the blackness. Our societal morals are constantly evolving, lets not stifle that change. Remember when you guys were young and laughing at how closed minded your parents were about certain issues? I see some posters in this thread acting no differently. It's funny how that works isn't it. This is exactly it. The whole problem is that our society has an expectation that you only go to the washroom with people of your own gender (and for whoever believed that this is a gay/straight issue, I point out that we don't discriminate washroom access on sexual orientation).

When other people get confused about what gender a person is, you get attempts to keep kids out of a washroom because they disagree with the kid's gender identification.

When gender neutral washrooms become more common, gender discriminating washrooms, imo, will become less common. Like gay marriage, I think this will turn out to be no big deal.

clem24

02-10-2015, 11:41 AM

Originally posted by R154

You're right, because I have never given any of that a passing thought.

If you would be so kind, would you offer me a quick explanation?

I can't tell if you're being sarcastic or not. If the issue was so black and white as you describe, then why would the government even bother having laws protecting transgender people?

I'll start with this: being transgender is very similar to being gay; it's NOT about making a choice. Why is it an issue now and not before? Because this was something that was ignored in the past. I mean really if mankind didn't move forward, we'd still have slaves and genocide would be perfectly acceptable, but just sayin'.

Now, do I really think they need their own washrooms? That's debatable because to me, the current system works. But incorporating it into new school designs, I don't see a problem with it if the costs are only incremental. But really, if we cater to disabled people, then why can't we cater to this issue? I am not saying I agree with it necessarily, but that's the whole point of debate and why it's such as issue right?

suntan

02-10-2015, 11:58 AM

Originally posted by killramos
[B]

By the same logic there should be 2-3 times as many women's washrooms as men's because women need more time and space to do their business than men do. I read a paper on it in university ( not by choice), you can look it up if you want.Uh, yeah? Do you actually go to things like sporting events, or even the mall on a weekend? No shit sherlock. The bitches line up to go to the can, and guys just scoot in and out.

dexlargo

02-10-2015, 11:59 AM

Originally posted by killramos

By the same logic there should be 2-3 times as many women's washrooms as men's because women need more time and space to do their business than men do. I read a paper on it in university ( not by choice), you can look it up if you want.I don't see how this point doesn't support the efficiency of gender neutral washrooms - If anyone can use any washroom, then you eliminate having to figure out how many washrooms you need for women vs. men. You just figure out how many washrooms you need for the occupant load.

...

While some don't want to admit it gender neutrality is not actually a thing. Humans are biologically gendered. It is not a purely social construct as many SJW's will tell you. Some people associate with a gender that they were not physically born as ( this is not a normal occurrence, it is a defect, however regardless of how politically incorrect i sound by saying that). Those people still have a gender.I agree, physical anatomy is not a social construct - but separating people to poop based on this anatomical difference is a social construct. Do you have a men's washroom and a women's washroom in your home? If you don't, doesn't that show that there's no real practical reason to separate genders for pooping except social construct?

IMO i don't give a shit what washroom people use, if you look like a dude use the mens or if you look like a chick use the womens. Or if you have a dick use the mens or if your genitals are aesthetically pleasing use the womens.So you don't actually care who uses which washroom? But then aren't you saying, "let's have labels on the door saying 'men' and 'women', but we won't actually care who uses which washroom." If that is what you're saying, why put a label on the doors at all, except to tell people that it's a washroom?

R154

02-10-2015, 12:06 PM

Originally posted by clem24

I can't tell if you're being sarcastic or not. If the issue was so black and white as you describe, then why would the government even bother having laws protecting transgender people?

I'll start with this: being transgender is very similar to being gay; it's NOT about making a choice. Why is it an issue now and not before? Because this was something that was ignored in the past. I mean really if mankind didn't move forward, we'd still have slaves and genocide would be perfectly acceptable, but just sayin'.

Now, do I really think they need their own washrooms? That's debatable because to me, the current system works. But incorporating it into new school designs, I don't see a problem with it if the costs are only incremental. But really, if we cater to disabled people, then why can't we cater to this issue? I am not saying I agree with it necessarily, but that's the whole point of debate and why it's such as issue right?

I was not being sarcastic. I genuinely didnt think this was an issue of magnitude. Call me uninformed but I was unaware that there was big news about this subject.

Its not that I am rigid in my views, because I am not. I am more confused about this as I look into it more. I did know that kids could identify as a woman but have male parts and vice versa... However, I didnt think this happened enough that accommodations needed to be made. If this is the case, then why shouldn't these provisions be accounted for? You're right, as a society we have evolved in our needs and thought process to meet the demands of our population.

For me its an issue of practicality of design. Adding 50% more bathrooms to a school layout would seem ridiculous if there isnt enough "clientele" to service it. This isnt an issue that is comparable to disabled people/accessibility, because those provisions are built into existing bathroom locations.
What we are talking about is the necessity for a 3rd "type" of bathroom instead of the standard 2.

Put aside the human strife of it all as I dont care to debate the validity of one's claim about gender identification. I have neither the insight or interest to argue about someone else's undertaking.

If it really is a concern, then address it. If this whole issue is just being used as a soapbox to complain, then I have zero sympathy.

codetrap

02-10-2015, 12:09 PM

Originally posted by clem24
But really, if we cater to disabled people, then why can't we cater to this issue? We cater to the disabled people because they're physically, as in mechanically, not able to use a regular stall. And in most cases, the "disabled" stall is built into the standard gender washroom at a very minor increase in cost. This particular special interest group is requesting specific stalls when there is no physical barrier for them use a standard bathroom.

The only way I could possibly support this was if each of those gender neutral bathrooms was also a specifically assigned disabled bathroom. Otherwise I think this is just stupid. As for the incremental cost argument, is the next step to start including a foot washing sink to cater to a specific religious groups need to wash? Where does it end?

killramos

02-10-2015, 12:11 PM

Originally posted by dexlargo
I don't see how this point doesn't support the efficiency of gender neutral washrooms - If anyone can use any washroom, then you eliminate having to figure out how many washrooms you need for women vs. men. You just figure out how many washrooms you need for the occupant load.

I agree, physical anatomy is not a social construct - but separating people to poop based on this anatomical difference is a social construct. Do you have a men's washroom and a women's washroom in your home? If you don't, doesn't that show that there's no real practical reason to separate genders for pooping except social construct?

So you don't actually care who uses which washroom? But then aren't you saying, "let's have labels on the door saying 'men' and 'women', but we won't actually care who uses which washroom." If that is what you're saying, why put a label on the doors at all, except to tell people that it's a washroom?

I don't care about making all washrooms gender neutral at all.
I even made a comment a while back where i mentioned that i was among a group of people who unanimously supported and followed through with making washrooms on our residence floor co-ed.

What the SJW's want are special washrooms for trans people. They don't want to allow men and women to share the same washrooms. They want Trans people to become a third "gender neutral" designation

Actually as a general statement I support making everything 100% equal. Period. :dunno:

Its accommodations that i disagree with.

killramos

02-10-2015, 12:12 PM

Originally posted by codetrap

The only way I could possibly support this was if each of those gender neutral bathrooms was also a specifically assigned disabled bathroom. Otherwise I think this is just stupid. As for the incremental cost argument, is the next step to start including a foot washing sink to cater to a specific religious groups need to wash? Where does it end?

They should just let everyone use the bathroom. Not have it be a special bathroom that only trans students who get a key can use.

BerserkerCatSplat

02-10-2015, 12:18 PM

Originally posted by killramos

While some don't want to admit it gender neutrality is not actually a thing. Humans are biologically gendered. It is not a purely social construct as many SJW's will tell you. Some people associate with a gender that they were not physically born as ( this is not a normal occurrence, it is a defect, however regardless of how politically incorrect i sound by saying that). Those people still have a gender.

I'm going to preface my comment with a note that you would have much difficulty labelling me an SJW of any stripe.

Now, you've really got some well-defined terms mixed up here.

Humans are not biologically gendered, they are biologically sexed. Biological sex is not a social construct, it is defined by your chromosomes - XX or XY (disregarding the rare variants).

Gender is regarded as more of a psychological construct, and the roles thereof are usually socially determined. There are no physical markers (yet known) that define it. Some believe it even exists on a sliding scale, similar to sexual orientation.

That is why there are a number of terms used that separate these things. Male and Female are usually used for sex, Man and Woman generally used to note gender - hence "transwoman" and "transman" are the common terms rather than "transmale" or "transfemale".

Dysphoria is what happens when your psychological gender doesn't match up with your biological sex. It's similar in concept to how homosexuals' sexual orientation doesn't match up with their sexual equipment. Someone who identifies with both genders (ie "gender neutral") would more or less be the gender equivalent of a bisexual person.
Dysphoria is a real thing and a pretty shitty situation for those who experience it. I'm sure most transgendered people would be more than happy to have been born cisgendered and just not have had to deal with it at all, but it happens. Sure, there's transtrenders and all the myriad Tumblr genders and otherkin and whatnot, but that sort of silliness shouldn't serve to undermine the people who actually have to deal with dysphoria.

rx7boi

02-10-2015, 12:19 PM

Holy fuck what a debacle this thread turned out to be.

Half of you don't even understand the difference between gender, sex, and orientation and are making all the wrong kind of comments.

As for the washroom, it should not be hard to have a gender-neutral washroom. The language the article is using betrays the context and hype the situation up to be worse than it really is; all part of journalism I suppose.

Just put a washroom and call it a washroom.

The fact that you need to get a key before you can take a dump is probably the dumbest thing I've ever heard. How can people even feel dignified given something so hypocritical?

fourrings

02-10-2015, 12:39 PM

I want my children to be successful, not sexually confused about their identity, orientation, or gender , they are simply children, children that need school for knowledge and not to get involved in the public school boards sexual agendas.

My children will attended private school to learn logic & become successful, not to understand how to make sexual choices about themselves. I personally haven't met a transgender that would be defined as successful, not that they can't be, but there sure isn't a presence of them in my professional world.

While they are at it, why don't they lower the driving age to 10 or 8 years of age? Old enough to sexually identify yourself as transgender, should be old enough to drive

jwslam

02-10-2015, 12:43 PM

Originally posted by BerserkerCatSplat
With that said, it really seems like there's a lot of kowtowing to a group that actually encompasses less than one percent of the population. Maybe the current wave of tumblr trans-trenders is making it appear like more of a problem than it is.

Originally posted by clem24
But really, if we cater to disabled people, then why can't we cater to this issue? I am not saying I agree with it necessarily, but that's the whole point of debate and why it's such as issue right?

Originally posted by codetrap
We cater to the disabled people because they're physically, as in mechanically, not able to use a regular stall. And in most cases, the "disabled" stall is built into the standard gender washroom at a very minor increase in cost. This particular special interest group is requesting specific stalls when there is no physical barrier for them use a standard bathroom.
According to these comments it makes more sense to cater to lefties before making gender neutral bathrooms. The flush handle is on the wrong side!

Xtrema

02-10-2015, 12:52 PM

Just make all bathrooms unisex. Who give a shit.

dexlargo

02-10-2015, 01:14 PM

Originally posted by killramos

They should just let everyone use the bathroom. Not have it be a special bathroom that only trans students who get a key can use. Which is actually what is happening. I heard this Sam Dyck on the radio and he explained that the plan approved by the CBE is that the gender-neutral washrooms that will be created will be usable by all - not transgender-only.

I think you've gotten confused by the stop-gap measure they've employed, which was to give transgender kids access to the staff washrooms, but making them go get the key first.

speedog

02-10-2015, 01:52 PM

MGCM

02-10-2015, 02:32 PM

If you have a female cock and you decide to piss in a urinal, then get made fun of.......well its your own fucking fault. These people want to be different and difficult, so be it, but no more fucking catering to them. They knew the fucking risks when they had a doctor change them, so tough fucking shit. This whole this makes me so fucking angry:banghead: :banghead: :banghead:

clem24

02-10-2015, 02:37 PM

Originally posted by jwslam
According to these comments it makes more sense to cater to lefties before making gender neutral bathrooms. The flush handle is on the wrong side!

No wait.... The handles are on the left already so they DO cater to lefties. And all this time... Shit. :D

01RedDX

02-10-2015, 02:39 PM

clem24

02-10-2015, 02:40 PM

Mibz

02-10-2015, 02:54 PM

Originally posted by MGCM
They knew the fucking risks when they had a doctor change them, so tough fucking shit. This whole this makes me so fucking angry:banghead: :banghead: :banghead: Transgender has absolutely nothing to do with sex changes except for the fact that some trans people end up getting them. But a sex change is not a prerequisite for being transgendered.

So, you know, keep banging your head against the wall if you want, but it's not going to cure your ignorance. If you want to feel better about the situation, learn about it.

sputnik

02-10-2015, 03:16 PM

Isn't a gender neutral washroom just a one-person bathroom with a generic sign on the door?

Not sure what the big deal is here.

rx7boi

02-10-2015, 03:20 PM

^ Yup.

But nowadays everything needs to have a label so now it's just a complicated clusterfuck.

MalibuStacy

02-10-2015, 03:40 PM

Originally posted by fourrings
I want my children to be successful, not sexually confused about their identity, orientation, or gender , they are simply children, children that need school for knowledge and not to get involved in the public school boards sexual agendas.

My children will attended private school to learn logic & become successful, not to understand how to make sexual choices about themselves. I personally haven't met a transgender that would be defined as successful, not that they can't be, but there sure isn't a presence of them in my professional world.

While they are at it, why don't they lower the driving age to 10 or 8 years of age? Old enough to sexually identify yourself as transgender, should be old enough to drive

:facepalm:

You... just... wow... you are a special brand of close-minded stupidity, with a serious superiority complex.

This whole transgender/gender neutral argument came up on UC campus this fall and the exact same arguments were being had there too.

Personally I sit on the functionality argument. A washroom is a washroom, and I our houses they are not segregated to whether you have a penis or vagina. This is purely a institutional thing, its nothing but a social construct. So why not have the best of both and just get rid of gendered washrooms all together. Realistically it might even encourage more gender acceptance cues we won't be so hung up on what part we all have.

HiTempguy1

02-10-2015, 04:31 PM

Originally posted by fourrings

While they are at it, why don't they lower the driving age to 10 or 8 years of age? Old enough to sexually identify yourself as transgender, should be old enough to drive

SOCIETY IS AGEIST! What about my rights as an 8 year old? I AM BEING OPPRESSED!!!! :rofl:

HiTempguy1

02-10-2015, 04:35 PM

Originally posted by MalibuStacy

A washroom is a washroom, and I our houses they are not segregated to whether you have a penis or vagina.

What about a change room? Are you cool with your (hypothetical, I don't know if you have kids) daughter changing in and out of gym clothes at school with the guys?

Honestly curious. Because that was mentioned in this thread.

Or what about at a bar? Its cool for drunk dudes to just use the women's washroom? I'm sure THAT would go over well :rolleyes:

rage2

02-10-2015, 04:38 PM

Originally posted by HiTempguy1
What about a change room? Are you cool with your (hypothetical, I don't know if you have kids) daughter changing in and out of gym clothes at school with the guys?
It's the future.

yRJOvS7N66Q

Originally posted by HiTempguy1
Or what about at a bar? Its cool for drunk dudes to just use the women's washroom? I'm sure THAT would go over well :rolleyes:
Everytime I'm at the bar taking a piss, there are drunk chicks in there using the stalls.

suntan

02-10-2015, 04:46 PM

Originally posted by HiTempguy1

What about a change room? Are you cool with your (hypothetical, I don't know if you have kids) daughter changing in and out of gym clothes at school with the guys?

Honestly curious. Because that was mentioned in this thread.

Or what about at a bar? Its cool for drunk dudes to just use the women's washroom? I'm sure THAT would go over well :rolleyes: Don't most bars have totally open washrooms now? Like the toilet has no walls around it.

There actually are co-ed change/shower rooms, just not in NA.

MalibuStacy

02-10-2015, 04:46 PM

I'll be honest I have not put much thought into the issues pertaining to change rooms (no kids for me). But as for washrooms, you are assuming that men are inherently more likely to conduct acts of rape or assault.

I know I am gonna get flack for this but honestly by eliminating the gendered washrooms, hypothetically you would have more people in one washroom, and this in turn could eliminate the issues of rape and assault because there will simply be more people. And most men are not likely to commit rape, and especially not in a public well used place. Plus if someone did try it, I could tell you a "normal" guy such as myself would have no issues stopping the slimeball that would try.

Thales of Miletus

02-10-2015, 04:56 PM

We had gender neutral bathrooms in the early 80s. My dick would neutralize some chic's vag and we would be one neutral fun mess.

You just had to make sure her feet were off the floor if a teacher came in.

MalibuStacy

02-10-2015, 05:05 PM

^I have been watching your posts and I seriously ant determine if you are. Good guy, smart guy, or just a opinionated red neck.

Thank you Thales for a useless post...:rofl:

lilmira

02-10-2015, 05:14 PM

Originally posted by rage2

It's the future.

Sex with teacher, neutral gender changing room, no physical punishment, no failing, wtf man? Life ain't fair.

MalibuStacy

02-10-2015, 05:23 PM

I am all for the failing of kids, and physical punishment to some extent. Teacher sex, meh not in my books.

Tik-Tok

02-10-2015, 05:28 PM

Originally posted by MalibuStacy

I know I am gonna get flack for this but honestly by eliminating the gendered washrooms, hypothetically you would have more people in one washroom, and this in turn could eliminate the issues of rape and assault because there will simply be more people. And most men are not likely to commit rape, and especially not in a public well used place. Plus if someone did try it, I could tell you a "normal" guy such as myself would have no issues stopping the slimeball that would try.

In theory sure. That's assuming there isn't any pyschopaths around, or bullies, or bystander effect.

Not sure what your high school experience was like, but we had a certain... group (being politically correct here)... of people who would beat the shit out of other kids in the boys room, while their friends wouldn't let anyone else in. The same group walks into a washroom where a lone girl is finishing up and about to leave. I wouldn't have put it past them.

HiTempguy1

02-10-2015, 05:29 PM

Originally posted by MalibuStacy
I'll be honest I have not put much thought into the issues pertaining to change rooms (no kids for me). But as for washrooms, you are assuming that men are inherently more likely to conduct acts of rape or assault.

Well... the thing about rape is another topic for another time. Too much thread derailing on that one.

Originally posted by suntan
Don't most bars have totally open washrooms now? Like the toilet has no walls around it.

There actually are co-ed change/shower rooms, just not in NA.

I have never seen these "open washrooms" you speak of. I must be going to the wrong bars. And I understand there are co-ed change/shower rooms elsewhere in the world. South Koreans also encourage men essentially fondling each other, including student teacher relations, but that "ain't how we do" in NA. ;)

Originally posted by rage2

It's the future.

yRJOvS7N66Q

Everytime I'm at the bar taking a piss, there are drunk chicks in there using the stalls.

Yes, but its kind of that female privilege thing. Men have never given a shit about sharing washrooms with women.

speedog

02-10-2015, 05:35 PM

Physical punishment - man, you young'uns would be amazed at what was doled out in the 60's and 70's and even in grade school. Certainly most of the punishments back then would not be allowed these days - getting the leather strap, wooden rule sticks to the knuckles, teachers chucking chalk sticks at the heads of kids who wouldn't shut up, cleaning floors/bathrooms with a toothbrush, etc.. Don't think I've heard any of the sort these days.

Now I don't recall getting any of these punishments myself but I certainly did see kids getting the ruler to the knuckles or the strap to the palms of their hands and enough so that the skin was red and swollen. My, how times have changed.

03ozwhip

02-15-2015, 03:30 PM

Originally posted by DENZILDON

Here's a question for you, let's say you are peeing on a mens public restroom and this hot chick stands beside you and also pee. Would you feel comfortable?

She has a penis but she knows she is a girl, looks like a girl and acts like a girl.

EDIT*** there's a commercial about this.... hahaha!

Why would a chick, who looks like a chick and acts like a chick, even think about going to the men's washroom, regardless of said dick? IMO that's asking for trouble, because we know that a lot of guys that see that wiuldnt take it lightly.

No one would know the difference if she went into the chicks bathroom with a dick, it's a stall...

CompletelyNumb

02-15-2015, 04:19 PM

There's only one solution to make everyone happy.

No more communal washrooms. All bathrooms, in schools, businesses, anywhere... they will all be converted to multiple single-toilet rooms. Gender neutral. Door says bathroom. Anyone can use it. One person at a time.

That way no matter gender you think you are, you will fit in. People cant be offended by someone elses presence because there's no one in there with them.

And change rooms will have to be the same way. Because it's just as wrong to force transgender people into a certain change room as it is to expect everyone else in that change room will be comfortable with it. And dont say "teach them to be comfortable with it". If you can be uncomfortable about the genitalia you were born with, you can be uncomfortable about some elses struggle with it. Welcome to equality.

Arash Boodagh

02-15-2015, 04:33 PM

TL;DR

In before being gay is cool.
liiR6xUKXS0

"Alberta will surely increase tax productivity once we brainwash a quarter of the population to be gay"
- Illuminati Overlord

*Source currently not available.

suntan

02-16-2015, 11:20 AM

Originally posted by CompletelyNumb
There's only one solution to make everyone happy.

No more communal washrooms. All bathrooms, in schools, businesses, anywhere... they will all be converted to multiple single-toilet rooms. Gender neutral. Door says bathroom. Anyone can use it. One person at a time.

That way no matter gender you think you are, you will fit in. People cant be offended by someone elses presence because there's no one in there with them.

And change rooms will have to be the same way. Because it's just as wrong to force transgender people into a certain change room as it is to expect everyone else in that change room will be comfortable with it. And dont say "teach them to be comfortable with it". If you can be uncomfortable about the genitalia you were born with, you can be uncomfortable about some elses struggle with it. Welcome to equality. Some places are already like this. Lots of workout places now have private one person change rooms.