basement development

[juwantme]

I’m fuming now but to make a long story short… I'm building a new home with Shane and also having them do the basement development. In the drawings they provided there was no indication of where the bulk heads would be for the heating. I requested a copy of detailed basement drawings however they were never provided and the only drawing that we signed off on for the basement development was the electrical that showed the layout with what we selected for cabinets, bedrooms, bathroom and pot lights, etc. The area manager said that, that was the only drawing the drafters provided.

We also had our cabinets going up to the ceiling also drawn up but in those drawings there too was no indication of a bulk head.

Now we based our decisions on that layout and assumed the heat runs would only be in the mechanical room and most likely in the one bedroom adjacent to it.

Now fast forward to the framing stage and long and behold we see a huge bulk head running across the whole family room and rec area of the basement. They said they will look into it but I am furious. In some preliminary talks I have had since, I am getting the impression that they cannot relocate the heat runs. Has anyone gone through this before, what options do I have or recourse in this matter? I don’t want the builder to be like “oh well so sorry to bad”.

In advance, thanks for reading and any input.

[Kloubek]

Originally posted by juwantme
Now we based our decisions on that layout and assumed the heat runs would only be in the mechanical room and most likely in the one bedroom adjacent to it.


And therein lies your problem. You assumed, and didn't get in writing that there would be no such bulkhead running where you didn't want it.

While it seems like you started to do your due diligence, you let it slide because the information was not being supplied. You should have insisted on it, and worked your way up until they gave you the information you needed to make the decisions you made.

Now that work has already started, it's going to be that much more difficult to get them to tear it out and redo it to your liking. I imagine they'll likely just tell you to pound sand.

[ExtraSlow]

I don't think you'll have much recourse.

[TL911]

agreed with the guys above, if you didn't get it in writing they are going to tell you to pound sand and live with it...this is what all builders do...ive been through it too!

[suntan]

Bulkheads are unavoidable with forced air heating systems and typically run down the center of the basement.

Best bet would've been to ask for 9-10" ceiling so bulkheads don't interfere.

[kenny]

Not sure why you would assume the heat runs would only be in the mechanical room and bedroom beside it. Did you not want heat to the other areas of your basement?

It's one thing to assume it would be located on the side of the room vs. running down the middle of the room, but not expecting a bulkhead at all was a bit of an oversight on your part.

As for what to do now, you could ask Shane to see if they're willing to get the trades to relocate the heat runs but ask yourself its a really a big deal? Could redesign the lighting or add other ceiling details to make it look better.

[sillysod]

Everything depends on what way your joists run. If they are crossways to the direction of the ducting all you can do is try to get them to run it in the corner and box in one side of your roof.

"Low and behold" just fyi ;)

[78si]

What is the distance from the floor to the bottom of the bulk head?

[jwslam]

Originally posted by 78si
What is the distance from the floor to the bottom of the bulk head?
This. What you might choose to do is drop the rest of the ceiling to match.

[G]

Our builder did not "consult" us on where to put all the HVAC runs they just mapped it out the most sensible way possible to get the most height possible. We were very impressed that they paid that much attention to little details. They even made the rooms big enough to hide all the posts.


Our rec room and spare bedroom is all 9 feet while the gym and washroom is 8 feet.

http://i.imgur.com/LxvHLxi.jpg

It is all 9 feet right of the stairs
http://i.imgur.com/ELS5lgp.jpg

Looking towards the gym and bar
http://i.imgur.com/RqElksb.jpg

[ExtraSlow]

When I had my basement developed, we spent hours with our contractor figuring out how to work around the HVAC bulkhead. In the end, our solution involved some areas of "raised" ceilings, and moving some walls. I think the way most houses are designed, you can't avoid having that HVAC run the length of the basement, usually perpendicular to the joist direction.
Most of the heat for my main floor is carried in those ducts too, so there was no option to remove them.

If someone was designing a house from scratch, you could always use some longer/larger engineered beams and make space for the ducting between the joists, but I'm betting it would be a major undertaking, and would require some real structural engineering work, far beyond what most homebuilders would allow.

[Lex350]

I designed my own basement and then handed the plans over to the contractor. Wen then sat down and had a 2 hour meeting to determine in anything I designed was out to lunch so we had the opportunity to fix things before he started.

[visualk]

Thanks for the input guys...we have 9 ft floors and the bulk head is 1ft. I could deal with the bulk head but we planned the pot lights and cabinets without that bulk head in the rec area. We're in talks with the site super to see what we can do. There was a lot of planning involved on each floor and when your staring at the plans for so long I inadvertently missed to take into account the bulk heads.

[freshprince1]

Originally posted by sillysod
Everything depends on what way your joists run. If they are crossways to the direction of the ducting all you can do is try to get them to run it in the corner and box in one side of your roof.

"Low and behold" just fyi ;)

This. If they require to get heat across the room, be it for downstairs heat or for upstairs heat, the direction of the joists is the deciding factor. They can bury the ducting if it goes parallel, but not if it has to cross the joists. You can't punch a huge hole through the webbing of all the joists in a row.

Sorry bro. You might be hooped. Best case it to try and get them to re-route it along the edges of the basement ceiling. I have this issue in my basement and will just have to build around it. Luckily, they followed the edge/corner as much as possible.

Don't let the issue die though until you feel you've exhausted every option. Talk it through with the Area Manager and Site Supervisor. If you still feel unsatisfied, ask to speak to the Construction Manager. Put a call into the head office yourself and ask to speak to the Construction or Sales Managers. I did this with several issues with my new place this year, and was able to to get 2/3 major issues resolved. The one issue we couldn't fix, we talked it through several different scenarios and they informed me of some construction protocol that I wasn't aware of that made my request unrealistic - or rather - more expensive than I was willing to absorb. But the other two items were resolved to my satisfaction, and had I stopped at the Area Manager, nothing ever would have happened.

As in all situations, be respectful and assertive and you should be able to see it through to the end.

Good luck!

[jeffh]

The basement print should have had an indication of depth and location of bulkheads indicated by at least by a dashed line. Kinda weak that yours werent shown. Does your drawing indicate where the structural beams are and size at least?

[FixedGear]

Originally posted by ExtraSlow
When I had my basement developed, we spent hours with our contractor figuring out how to work around the HVAC bulkhead. In the end, our solution involved some areas of "raised" ceilings, and moving some walls. I think the way most houses are designed, you can't avoid having that HVAC run the length of the basement, usually perpendicular to the joist direction.
Most of the heat for my main floor is carried in those ducts too, so there was no option to remove them.

If someone was designing a house from scratch, you could always use some longer/larger engineered beams and make space for the ducting between the joists, but I'm betting it would be a major undertaking, and would require some real structural engineering work, far beyond what most homebuilders would allow.

If you plan in advance it should be easy to do, you just need to increase the ceiling height a bit on the basement, which is just a couple courses of block.

[C_Dave45]

Originally posted by FixedGear


If you plan in advance it should be easy to do, you just need to increase the ceiling height a bit on the basement, which is just a couple courses of block.
???
What builders do you know that use cinder block for residential foundation walls?

[jeffh]

I believe it was about $900 to have my poured foundation lowered/raised 3" by my builder. It increased in increments of 3" up to 12".
Fixed gear: i think cinder block for residential foundations is an eastern Canada thing.