ANOTHER?!??!?? What car to buy thread

[ExtraSlow]

Posting for a relative of mine, and looking for ideas I haven't thought of.

Here's what we're looking for, none of these are negotiable, and there is no trade-in to consider.

AWD
Four doors
Wagon/SUV/CUV body style. No sedans.
Large-ish back seat. lots of leg room so the kidlets in carseats aren't always kicking the back of the driver seat.
MUST NOT take premium fuel.

MUST be available for a LEASE with $0 down and max monthly payment of $600, prefer under $500 (on 24 or 36 month lease). Seems like that means max cash price of around $35,000
Annual KM of under 20,000.

Subaru Forester and Ford Escape are current strong contenders.

[xnvy]

Mazda CX5 AWD?

[carson blocks]

Kia Sportage / Sorento? I'm impressed by how much you get for how little money in the Sportage and Sorento. I've been asked to find vehicles for friends twice now with very similar criteria, and both have ended up in a Sorento. I don't think there's a better value for a AWD SUV. Last year's leftovers had some awesome rebates too if there are any left. Just don't go to Eastside Kia, the finance manager is too greasy in my opinion.

[ExtraSlow]

Just did a little research on the CX-5, looks like a pretty competitive option.
Ford Edge seems like a decent choice if you are getting a little bigger.

Really, this is a massive segment, so keep those opinions coming please.

[mazdavirgin]

Originally posted by ExtraSlow
Just did a little research on the CX-5, looks like a pretty competitive option.
Ford Edge seems like a decent choice if you are getting a little bigger.

Really, this is a massive segment, so keep those opinions coming please.

IMHO it's really just between the CX-5 and the Forrester if you are asking about the compact SUV segment. All the other cars just are not up to snuff atm.

[AE92_TreunoSC]

You can get a Turbo SanteFe Sport for that as well, strong contender, I didnt like its lack of oomph compared to my forester or I'd have one right now.

They have heated steering wheels and giant sunroofs. About the same space as the Forester.

Nothing touches the forester xt on visibility and fun in the segment though. I've looked :D

I liked the CX5 a few years ago but I read about so many problems, and even with a lease problems are a pain in the ass. I'd rather have a Rav4 than a CX5 or the Ford.

[mazdavirgin]

Originally posted by AE92_TreunoSC
You can get a Turbo SanteFe Sport for that as well, strong contender, I didnt like its lack of oomph compared to my forester or I'd have one right now.

:nut: SantaFe is the biggest POS. You actually drive one? Steering wheel feels horrible... Constantly having to adjust the steering wheel to drive in a straight line? Yeah shoot me now.

[JustinMCS]

Ford Escape Titanium can be had at those numbers....

[roopi]

GMC Acadia or Terrain

[max_boost]

I thought you were like sugarphreak and liked to pay cash for cars. Why lease? I thought I was the only one who did that. :rofl:

[ExtraSlow]

I do normally pay cash. Haven't had a car payment in years. This is for a relative of mine who has had some periods of unemployment and lives way out in the suburbs in a house that I'm not sure they can afford. There will be zero down payment, let alone buying with cash.

[max_boost]

Ohhh for your relative. Honda CRV something super reliable.

[J.M.]

Originally posted by ExtraSlow
I do normally pay cash. Haven't had a car payment in years. This is for a relative of mine who has had some periods of unemployment and lives way out in the suburbs in a house that I'm not sure they can afford. There will be zero down payment, let alone buying with cash.

Should they even be getting a new car then? Lol

Anyways I vote Forester

[Redlyne_mr2]

I can help out with a CX5 or Tiguan if you find yourself loving either one of them.

[ExtraSlow]

Let's not turn this into a financial advice thread. I have already gone down that road and provided plenty of material for them to study.

[mr2mike]

Veloster? :dunno:

[rage2]

We just picked up a well optioned 2015 B250 4Matic. Kids love it. Back seats have food/drink trays too! Only complaint so far is that passenger seat doesn't have power adjustments. Not a huge deal. It comes with the latest gen Infotainment system (same as new C class), and what a huge improvement. Dual charging/ipod plug ins is great, especially when the kids are charging their ipod and want to hear a song off there. Very roomy car. Tons of legroom in the back.

210hp, 7 speed DCT, as fast as a GTI, really nice car to drive. Let me know if you want to check it out. Here are the specs, and pricing:

2015 B250 4Matic
Premium Package
Versatility Package
Keyless Go

With those options the car parks itself, full on pano roof, blind spot assist, rear view camera, power/memory driver seat, nav, ipod, dvd player.

$40k MSRP

Leasing rates are alright too. With $0 down, website is showing:

$573/36 months
$553/39 months
$520/45 months

All 3 at 1.9%, tax and fees included.

[ExtraSlow]

Originally posted by mr2mike
Veloster? :dunno: you shut your whore mouth.

[rage2]

I'll add that the B starts at $33.5k, so with no options you're looking at $490/month tax in $0 down.

[InRich]

^ Benz's suck Rage :burnout: :rofl:

[rage2]

Originally posted by InRich
^ Benz's suck Rage :burnout: :rofl:
At least you can get one in his price range. Base X1 28i is over $600 a month lease on $0 down, and has worse rear leg room. :bigpimp:

[ExtraSlow]

Hadn't realized that the B came in 4matic. That's a nice option, I like those cars. How do you like the rear seat space?

[rage2]

It's roomy. Our 1.75 y/o is the size of the 3 y/o and he can barely touch the seat back with me sitting in the front. With anyone else shorter sitting up front, not going to come near the seat backs. There's lots of width too, we sat 3 kids in the back this weekend comfortably.

For older kids, there's a tray table connected to the seat back with a cup holder. Greatest invention ever. Not sure if that's part of any package or if that's standard, we didn't see it in our order spec sheets, and was surprised when we took delivery of the car. The USB/ipod plugin is in the center arm rest, and the cable easily reaches the back seats and closes without pinching the cable. It's going to be an awesome long roadtrip car for the family.

If you've ever seen the last gen B, you have to check this one out. It's 2x the car. Absolutely everything is upgraded. It went from an econobox interior to a last gen C class interior. The fake leather even has contrast stitching haha.

Like I said if you want to check it out, shoot me a PM. The B 4matic is new for late 2015 model year, we got the first one delivered, not sure how many are in stock right now. We ordered it during xmas holidays. Would've been here earlier if it wasn't for the Halifax storms.

[InRich]

Originally posted by rage2

At least you can get one in his price range. Base X1 28i is over $600 a month lease on $0 down, and has worse rear leg room. :bigpimp:

Cheap is NOT good. GOOD is NOT cheap. :bigpimp:

heh :goflames:

[Tik-Tok]

.

[Frank_White]

Forrester has my vote

[max_boost]

Oh I think I want a B250 for delivery car now. Nice pitch rage2.

[rage2]

Originally posted by max_boost
Oh I think I want a B250 for delivery car now. Nice pitch rage2.
Better get one quick. There's a 3 month payment discount going on right now too. They basically gave us $1200 when we took delivery.

[Redlyne_mr2]

Is the b anything like the cla because I found the cla to be an awful car.

[Sugarphreak]

...

[rage2]

Originally posted by Redlyne_mr2
Is the b anything like the cla because I found the cla to be an awful car.
Depends on what you found awful. The B has twice the room, the suspension isn't rock hard, and the AWD pretty much dialed out the power on understeer and torque steer from the FWD CLA's. Everything else is about the same.

[Tik-Tok]

Originally posted by ExtraSlow

MUST be available for a LEASE with $0 down


Originally posted by Sugarphreak
cash deal ... cash promotions ...

... finance instead ... with 4600$ down.

[Redlyne_mr2]

Originally posted by rage2

Depends on what you found awful. The B has twice the room, the suspension isn't rock hard, and the AWD pretty much dialed out the power on understeer and torque steer from the FWD CLA's. Everything else is about the same.
ya that's what I found awful.

[ExtraSlow]

I think the list is getting shorter for them. They'll be doing some test-drives over the next couple of days.

They've cut the B-series out of the list for looks, requirement of premium fuel, and the vexing problem of owning a "cheapo" benz. I still think it's a pretty neat little car, maybe it's in my future?.

Current top contenders look like Forester, CX-5 and Escape. They were going to look at the Rav4 and CRV.

So far, I think this info has been very helpful. Thanks everyone!
I will provide updates if they do make a decision.

[93VR6]

I'd recommend the CX-5 or Tiguan, looks like both can be had for 0 down and under $600 with 20k km a year over 36 months.

The CX-5 does get you more options for the money but I think the 2.0t in the Tiguan is a superior engine to the 2.5 N/A in the CX-5.

[Aleks]

I was going to say, doesn't the B look like a Minivan pretty much. No one wants that.

[guessboi]

^ The new B Class is awesome. Is a mini version of the R.

[Sugarphreak]

...

[JRSC00LUDE]

That "cheapo" Benz looks like a rad little family car for the money. :dunno:

[ExtraSlow]

I like the B series too. But it's off the list for this buyer. Others should strongly consider it.

[ExtraSlow]

I'm going to add one more requirement that I hadn't realized at the start. Must NOT take premium fuel.
That scratches the RDX and B series.

[rage2]

At 20k of driving a year, premium fuel is around $10 more a month. They do know the difference is pretty minor right?

[Sugarphreak]

...

[rage2]

Read above, they're looking at the RAV4 and CR-V, which will certainly eliminate the CR-V. The RAV4 is a better buy in almost every way.

[BerserkerCatSplat]

It's at the upper tier of your price range, but a Ford Flex SEL AWD ticks all the boxes and comes in at $608/mo with zero down at 0.99% at 48mo.

[rage2]

I really liked the Ford Flex when I looked at it. The problem is that Ford's lease rates are brutal.

[ExtraSlow]

Originally posted by rage2
premium fuel is around $10 more a month. They do know the difference is pretty minor right?
Originally posted by Sugarphreak
Usually the premium cost is offset by the fact engines that require it have higher combustion and therefore better efficiency You have to do something to shorten the list, dropping cars that use premium fuel is one way to do that. Otherwise, they'll be cross-shopping twenty cars, and it would drive them insane.




Originally posted by ExtraSlow
MUST be available for a LEASE with $0 down and max monthly payment of $600, prefer under $500 (on 24 or 36 month lease).
Originally posted by BerserkerCatSplat
It's at the upper tier of your price range, but a Ford Flex SEL AWD ticks all the boxes and comes in at $608/mo with zero down at 0.99% at 48mo.
Flex is a cool car, I really like them, but they are A) too much money and B) massive compared to the rest of the stuff on the list.

[Aleks]

Originally posted by rage2
I really liked the Ford Flex when I looked at it. The problem is that Ford's lease rates are brutal.

0% lease on Flex for 36 and 0% on Escape for 48 months. Doesn't get better than that.

[BerserkerCatSplat]

Originally posted by ExtraSlow

Flex is a cool car, I really like them, but they are A) too much money and B) massive compared to the rest of the stuff on the list.

Fair on the money part (unless they're willing to sack AWD) but the extra interior space would make dealing with the kids a lot easier than a small CUV.

[ExtraSlow]

I know, it's like a cool looking minivan, massive inside and awesome 2nd row seats.

[rage2]

Originally posted by Aleks
0% lease on Flex for 36 and 0% on Escape for 48 months. Doesn't get better than that.
The residuals are brutal on the Flex. We cross shopped the Flex AWD, spec'd to $40k, and the payments were a whopping $140/month more than the B250 at $40k MSRP and 1.9% interest on a 36 month lease. 0% doesn't mean much when you're leasing a much larger sum over 3 years.

[Aleks]

Originally posted by rage2

The residuals are brutal on the Flex. We cross shopped the Flex AWD, spec'd to $40k, and the payments were a whopping $140/month more than the B250 at $40k MSRP and 1.9% interest on a 36 month lease. 0% doesn't mean much when you're leasing a much larger sum over 3 years.

I never got that far, just saw it was 0% for the rate.

[chongkee_]

Originally posted by rage2

The residuals are brutal on the Flex. We cross shopped the Flex AWD, spec'd to $40k, and the payments were a whopping $140/month more than the B250 at $40k MSRP and 1.9% interest on a 36 month lease. 0% doesn't mean much when you're leasing a much larger sum over 3 years.

What was the residuals on the Flex? <45%?

[rage2]

Originally posted by chongkee_
What was the residuals on the Flex? &lt;45%?
Yea, 40% over 3 years. :nut:

[Tik-Tok]

Originally posted by rage2

Yea, 40% over 3 years. :nut:

It is a domestic, that's it's value after 3 years, lol.

The only good thing about it, is if the person decided they wanted to buy it out, it's dirt cheap.

[chongkee_]

Originally posted by rage2

Yea, 40% over 3 years. :nut:

Might as well get this.
http://www.ford.ca/trucks/f150/incentives/?postalCode=T2P1L3


More cargo space than a Flex.

[Xtrema]

My favs:

Acura RDX - 2016 is coming so there may be some deals to clear 2015.

Murano - 2014 is cheap if you can still find one on the lot. No deals but should be able to get it under $600/month on 2015.

CX5 - interior improved lots this year and still most sporty of all entry CUVs.



From left field:
Outlander - Nobody is buying Mitsu right now. I'm sure salesman will give you their first born to drive one away.

[ExtraSlow]

Weird, they put the GLA on the list, drove it, didn't like the visibility, so then put the B class back on the list.

Dropped the forester because one of them is ungodly tall and he hit his head on the roof. I find that odd, because that car looks like it's really tall, but they would know since they were inside it today.

Current front runners are the CRV and the B class. My opinion is that the CRV is ugly.

[ExtraSlow]

Well, sounds like this is wrapped up. They took delivery of a B250 4Matic today. I think it's got pretty much all the available options, I'll have a closer look at it in the next week or so.

Don't bother asking me what the exact financial details are, because I doubt they'll tell me, and if they did, I wouldn't tell you. I am 100% sure it fits the criteria in the OP.

Cool little car, I look forward to getting a ride in it.

Anyone else looking at this segment, there is a lot of great advice in this thread. Thanks to everyone.

[rage2]

The in stock B250 4Matics don't have the Sport Package, or the LED Headlamps. Both are (were) delayed availability. Even fully loaded without those 2, it's within their budget at $0 down, especially with the $1200 cash back deal.

Glad they looked at it and didn't think it was just a cheap entry benz. There's so much car for the money with the B250, and the interior is top notch in the price range.

The GLA wouldn't have met their $ criteria anyways. Much higher price, interest rate and slightly lower residual makes they payment quite a bit more than the B's.

[guessboi]

Good choice with the B250 - the only thing I don't like about Mercedes is the maintenance cost.
I get owed buying those pre-paid maintenance packages. :nut:

[Ariakas]

Originally posted by rage2
There's so much car for the money with the B250, and the interior is top notch in the price range.


I totally agree with that. I posted earlier asking people's opinion of Q3. After some research, picked up the B250 in Apr pretty much around same time as rage2, same packages + black ash wood. Very happy with the car, good power and really roomy. Very solid and great interior.

[Mitsu3000gt]

Bumping this thread due to the previous B250 discussion and I am in the market for a new car.

I am finding the value proposition had to ignore, and it has the compact car drivetrain trifecta which is so very rare (AWD, DCT, 2.0T).

It looks like you can lease a B250 4MATIC for $358/mo for 45 months which seems pretty good. I think it's around $400/mo with zero down.

http://www.mercedes-benz.ca/content/canada/mpc/mpc_canada_website/en/home_mpc/passengercars/home/new_cars/current_offers.html

On the MB website though all leasing shows "unavailable" when I go to calculate payments, so I don't know what's up with that. 4MATIC + premium package is all I would need, looking at the options.

Does anyone know if these are going to be majorly refreshed/replaced anytime soon, or is now as good time as any to get into one? I've read a couple rumors of a new platform coming end of 2017 but it didn't seem reliable.

[rage2]

The MFA cars (A/B/CLA/GLA) are on a 6 year design cycle. This gen came out as MY2012 (although we didn't get it till MY2013) and was refreshed 3 years later in MY2015 which added 4matic and some minor bodywork changes. New model based on MFA2 is supposed to come out MY2018 but there's been zero news on it. The MB Canada builder doesn't even have an Avantgarde final year package so maybe MB is late and the B gets stretched out to a 3+4=7 year cycle.

There were some HUGE discounts last month on remaining 2016 models, but I'm not sure if there are any left. Check with the dealer, they were giving out something like $5k discounts which is huge for a car this cheap.

edit - https://www.mercedes-benz-lonestarcalgary.ca/inventory/new/2016-mercedes-benz-b-class-calgary-alberta/6795360

$9k off lol. Based on price, most likely spec'd with Premium and Versatile packages and Pano roof. Looks like a demo at 1400km, but hey, $9k off haha. I'd run to the dealer on this one TBH.

edit2 - Hyatt has 3 2016's but they range from $40-48k. :nut: The Lone star one at $29k is a no brainer here, unless Hyatt will match prices and have a more preferable color (2 silvers 1 white).

[Sonic]

Wow didn't know these came in awd and 2.0 turbos?!?!!

[rage2]

Originally posted by Sonic
Wow didn't know these came in awd and 2.0 turbos?!?!!
And DCT. It's like a poorer handling more comfortable and roomier GTI. Dead even in a straight line. You do look like you're driving a mini-minivan tho.

It's also a bit of a drift machine in the winter with traction off. Pretty fun.

[Mitsu3000gt]

Thanks rage, hoping to have time to visit a dealer tomorrow and check things out.

[guessboi]

Originally posted by rage2

And DCT. It's like a poorer handling more comfortable and roomier GTI. Dead even in a straight line. You do look like you're driving a mini-minivan tho.

It's also a bit of a drift machine in the winter with traction off. Pretty fun.

+1 Most people don't believe this but pretty bang on here. :rofl:

[ExtraSlow]

Originally posted by ExtraSlow
Well, sounds like this is wrapped up. They took delivery of a B250 4Matic today. I think it's got pretty much all the available options, I'll have a closer look at it in the next week or so.



Hey, after all the help the first time around, it sounds like this same family is looking for a change away from that sweet B-class.
Criteria:
- Needs bigger rear seat to fit a rear-facing carseat.
- Must be AWD
- not a true mid-sized vehicle, they want it to feel small for urban use


When I look at this segment, the Ford edge keeps popping up because on paper it looks like the most room rear seat.
Other contenders are the Ford Escape, GMC terrain, Buick Envision, Hyundai Tuscon, Hyundai Santa Fe Sport, Lincoln MKC.

So folks, what do you thinkÉ

[Tenkara Way]

It is a bit more complex than simply rear seat room, I was under the same impression until I watched a video. Ease of access for placement and removal, door opening angle, roof slope, front and rear seat angles, leg kicking distance to the front seat, etc.

AlexOnAutos on YouTube has a complete review of vehicles and how child seats fit with and without adults in the rear seats. He also does what I think are the most thorough vehicle reviews on YT:

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLdmWqCdsjCu50RxrEOlPZJLi8E-xolDWJ

Sample video from a highly rated Infiniti a relative bought after watching the video as they were expecting twins. No idea why the YT code is not working, it ends up going to a different vehicle. Tried a few things and fail. Here is an ugly old style link instead:

https://youtube/JKNTdY-PA4I?list=PLdmWqCdsjCu50RxrEOlPZJLi8E-xolDWJ

[ExtraSlow]

Holy, those are great reviews. I've already watched a couple.

[Tenkara Way]

Originally posted by ExtraSlow
Holy, those are great reviews. I've already watched a couple.

Also, strong consideration needs to be made for crash test results. How will those in the rear come out in a rear-ender or t-bone. The Infiniti relative kept the car (loved it) for a year and bought a $70K F150 to carry more stuff to the cabin.

[rage2]

Rear facing car seats are the bane of my existence. Really if you want easy access nothing beats a full sized SUV, a truck or a minivan. Really, it's only a year, love with it and go front facing when they can walk and hit 30 lbs.

[ExtraSlow]

Raj bro, that's why there's an odyssey in my garage. And it's been a lot more than 1 year for us. Bought it in 2012, still love it.

Will be seeing this family today probably, and will chat with them.

[jwslam]

Originally posted by rage2
Rear facing car seats are the bane of my existence. Really if you want easy access nothing beats a full sized SUV, a truck or a minivan. Really, it's only a year, love with it and go front facing when they can walk and hit 30 lbs.
Pretty sure the car2go fleet is not meant for people with car seats. :rofl:

[ExtraSlow]

Originally posted by ExtraSlow


Hey, after all the help the first time around, it sounds like this same family is looking for a change away from that sweet B-class.
Criteria:
- Needs bigger rear seat to fit a rear-facing carseat.
- Must be AWD
- not a true mid-sized vehicle, they want it to feel small for urban use


When I look at this segment, the Ford edge keeps popping up because on paper it looks like the most room rear seat.
Other contenders are the Ford Escape, GMC terrain, Buick Envision, Hyundai Tuscon, Hyundai Santa Fe Sport, Lincoln MKC.

So folks, what do you thinkÉ
Thoughts on Santa Fe Sport vs Ford Edge?

Funny, I know three families shopping this segment right now. Me, I'm loving the Fit.....

[R-Audi]

My family was looking at vehicles in the same category, ended up with a Santa Fe. Seemmed like you got way more value for your money. We hav had it for 4 years now, and havent had any major issues. Its actually decent to drive as well, the 2.0T is pretty peppy.

Ford Edge/Escape was close, but the salesman at the dealership was way too pushy and gave off a super sleezy feeling. We couldnt wait to get out of there. (Escape felt smaller, Edge was better but more $$)

[SkiBum5.0]

Take a look at the Subaru Outback. Same ground clearance as SUV, better mileage and had lots of room for a rear facing seat.

[Neb]

My brother's the "SUV guy".

He swears by the Subaru Forester series.