Two Canadians being blamed for causing Malaysian earthquake

[Tik-Tok]

Seriously, you can't make this shit up.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/canadians-who-allegedly-posed-naked-on-mount-kinabalu-barred-from-leaving-malaysia-1.3104221


The Department of Foreign Affairs says it's assisting two Canadians barred from leaving Malaysia amid reports the pair could be charged after allegedly posing naked atop the country's highest peak.
...
Sabah's deputy chief minister Joseph Pairin Kitingan blamed the tragedy on 10 foreigners — including two Canadians — who "showed disrespect to the sacred mountain" by posing naked at the peak on May 30.


Local indigenous people believe that the tourists' act angered the mountain spirits, who then retaliated with the destructive force of the earthquake.

[carson blocks]

Originally posted by Tik-Tok
Seriously, you can't make this shit up.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/canadians-who-allegedly-posed-naked-on-mount-kinabalu-barred-from-leaving-malaysia-1.3104221





I found the people on Borneo to be some of the nicest, friendliest, and most accommodating people I've ever met. That said, it's a muslim country and fairly conservative and the idea that posing naked on one of their sacred mountains wouldn't land you in hot water is ridiculous.

Also, the article said the brother and sister were naked together, and that they're from Saskatchewan.:poosie: Enough said.

[Tik-Tok]

I do get being charged for indecency, but its being blamed for the earthquake that's mind boggling.

[rage2]

Those Canadians are the visitors there, if that's what the locals believe we should respect that. No different than us bitching about immigrants enforcing their ways upon our society.

[JRSC00LUDE]

Originally posted by carson blocks
Also, the article said the brother and sister were naked together, and that they're from Saskatchewan.:poosie: Enough said.

Don't talk about my uncle brother like that man! :rofl:

[flipstah]

Originally posted by rage2
Those Canadians are the visitors there, if that's what the locals believe we should respect that. No different than us bitching about immigrants enforcing their ways upon our society.

Exactly.

[01RedDX]

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[flipstah]

Originally posted by 01RedDX
Not to stir the pot too much, but why exactly should we "respect that?" They were not inside a mosque, they were on a mountain.

Charge them with indecency if you must, if it's the law of the land, but there is no need to respect moronic superstitions.

Why do you need to see walls and some sort of symbol for something to be 'sacred'?

[01RedDX]

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[flipstah]

Originally posted by 01RedDX
^ I'm not saying it's stupid to consider a place sacred, I'm saying it's stupid to think that a couple of dangling white wieners can cause an earthquake. :rofl:

The power of the white man in Asia knows no bounds.

[Sugarphreak]

...

[ZenOps]

If you build yourself up - you gotta take the fall.

I'm pretty sure I would have blamed Rob Anders or Kim Jong Un for Ebola if it ends up wiping out half of human civilization, might yet still.

[JRSC00LUDE]

Did they upload it and tag themselves or how was this even discovered? No one understands discretion.....first rule of Fight Club?

[Tik-Tok]

Originally posted by JRSC00LUDE
Did they upload it and tag themselves or how was this even discovered? No one understands discretion.....first rule of Fight Club?

From the photo that's on every news site, it looks more like someone not in their group took the photo that proves it.

Definitely no discretion.


Originally posted by rage2
Those Canadians are the visitors there, if that's what the locals believe we should respect that. No different than us bitching about immigrants enforcing their ways upon our society.

No, they have to respect the laws, not the beliefs. I'm also fairly certain prior to this, that there was no belief that if you get naked on top of the mountain, it will cause an earthquake. It's just typical mob mentality blaming them.

It's also significantly different because this group wasn't there trying to change anyone's beliefs or demanding laws be changed, unlike the immigrants that we bitch about here.

[Canmorite]

Originally posted by 01RedDX
\Charge them with indecency if you must, if it's the law of the land, but there is no need to respect moronic superstitions.

Unreal claims by the local Government. Please leave the dark ages and join 2015.

[Feruk]

There are several Republican US presidential candidates that believe we are now in the "end times" described in the bible, so are North Americans really any less crazy??

[Manhattan]

Don't be a fool when you're visiting a foreign country. You can't apply the same laws or logic when you're on another continent. Reminds me of when people try to smuggle small amounts of drugs into conservative countries and shocked at the severe consequences.

[max_boost]

People believe what they believe. Draw a cartoon of the prophet and it's game over. Respect other peoples traditions in their homeland.

[ZenOps]

God tends to live on a mountaintop. Or inotherwords, don't pee on the glowing bush when someone is watching.

Should throw 'em in jail for a few years that'll teach them blasphemers.

Side note: Seems the scientists that did not predict and earthquake have been cleared of their six year jail sentences.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2829107/Scientists-jailed-manslaughter-did-not-predict-deadly-earthquake-Italy-killed-309-people-cleared.html

[JudasJimmy]

Seems they have a general disrespect for other people and other cultures. That's not even acceptable behavior here. Maybe it's a good wake-up call for them and other dipshit Canadian tourists.

[Unknown303]

Seems like they YOLO'd a little to hard there. Respect the laws and beliefs of the places you visit. And don't show your sister your dick. Pretty easy to follow...

[D. Dub]

Not my country not my problem? They disrespected the culture and the laws? There are consequences.

[Tik-Tok]

Originally posted by Unknown303
And don't show your sister your dick. Pretty easy to follow...

But it's ok to show your brother your tits? :rofl:

[01RedDX]

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[max_boost]

Should have known better than to start shit in a foreign country! :thumbsup:

[01RedDX]

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[ZenOps]

People absolutely do believe in magical mountain spirits. Some mountains are more sacred than others, Sinai would be the most important one for Christianity.

[HuMz]

Originally posted by 01RedDX


I don't think anyone is arguing this point, they should face punishment under local law (as ridiculous as it may be) as they were guests in that country. The problem is that now there is a lynch mob after them because the regional minister, a government official, directly blamed their nudity for causing an earthquake which killed dozens of people, including children and whipped the local populace of mostly ignorant superstitious folk into a frenzy. I trolled the FB post and the comments are truly scary - they are promising to kill him in the streets, organizing "headhunts," cursing and threatening his family and friends. I don't think the consequences have been proportionate at all.

Your worldview doesn't allow for anything to be wrong in another culture. Morality (in your view) rests solely as a cultural /social construct and you as an individual have no basis to criticize how another culture evolved.

Problem is it violates general human experiences that certain actions themselves are wrong, regardless of the subject. To be intellectually honest you have to say that it's wrong in your opinion and you would do things differently.

[max_boost]

You do that here at Ha Ling Peak and no one gives a shit.

Do that in Malaysia, good luck bro, better get Harper on the phone.

[01RedDX]

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[HuMz]

Originally posted by 01RedDX


Not this bullshit again. You've had your ass handed to you in previous debates with your ideas on moral/cultural relativism and yet here you are, again. You sound like a broken record. The ideas of cultural relativism and that truth is relative are still 100% wrong. According to cultural relativism, we cannot object to Stalin, Hitler and Nazism, apartheid in South Africa, native infant sacrifice, China’s massacres in Tiananmen, genital mutilation of young girls in Africa etc etc. We would also be prevented from criticizing our own culture’s past practices such as witch hunts, slavery and residential schools. Within the perspective of cultural relativism, there would be no need for social progress. It a fallacy that only serves religious nuts and their nefarious agendas.

The only fallacies here are attacking me instead of engaging what I said. You can criticize any culture that you want, past or present. But as usual you set up a strawman, and if you were to actually read what I wrote, you would see that I said in doing so what be reduced to a personal opinion.

Others have recognized that we have no right to impose our version of morality on another culture. So why is it we you advocate your version of morals on another culture? Especially when these people have survived believing that a mountain is sacred?

[BananaFob]

FYI, this isn't a "sacred" mountain, I've been up Mount Kinabalu and climbed it since it's really close to my hometown in Malaysia. It's a 2 day round-trip to go up and down and believe me, I whipped out my junk and pissed down the side of the mountain many times on the way up and down. Didn't cause any earthquakes then :dunno:

Not only that... most of the Kadazan/Dusun people that are being "offended" in that area are catholic... It's not even part of their damn religion.

[01RedDX]

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[01RedDX]

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[01RedDX]

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[clem24]

I need some high res pics of the sister. And the Australian girl...:love:

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2015/06/10/16/29833A6200000578-3117940-Arrested_British_tourist_Eleanor_Hawkins_pictured_has_been_accus-a-18_1433951159138.jpg

[Seth1968]

Originally posted by rage2
Those Canadians are the visitors there, if that's what the locals believe we should respect that. No different than us bitching about immigrants enforcing their ways upon our society.

Should we also respect pedophiles?



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KoBK8kHFbXE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KoBK8kHFbXE

[Majestic12]

What kind of a moronic comparison is that'?

[Seth1968]

Originally posted by Majestic12
What kind of a moronic comparison is that'?

Woosh.

It's their custom and tradition. Do you respect it?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bacha_bazi

[ZenOps]

If anything were the majority, I figure people would let it slide.

HdhrUKRdKM8

[rage2]

Originally posted by Seth1968
Woosh.

It's their custom and tradition. Do you respect it?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bacha_bazi
Nope. But I'm not about to hop on a plane to Afghanistan and tell them to stop or piss on their mountain in protest.

[Seth1968]

Originally posted by rage2

Nope. But I'm not about to hop on a plane to Afghanistan and tell them to stop or piss on their mountain in protest.

Me either.

What they did was naive. But being held responsible for 19 deaths because you got naked on a mountain? Holy shit.

[rx7boi]

Originally posted by clem24
I need some high res pics of the sister. And the Australian girl...:love:

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2015/06/10/16/29833A6200000578-3117940-Arrested_British_tourist_Eleanor_Hawkins_pictured_has_been_accus-a-18_1433951159138.jpg

Goddamn :love: :love:

Google the other images of her and it's a whole different story though :rofl:

[rage2]

Originally posted by Seth1968
Me either.

What they did was naive. But being held responsible for 19 deaths because you got naked on a mountain? Holy shit.
Who said they're responsible for 19 deaths? Just because the locals were pushing for it doesn't mean that's what happens in court.

They got 3 days in jail (time served) and a $1k fine.

[revelations]

I've traveled extensively for work and pleasure- the age old adage of "when in Rome" applies - regardless of how silly a custom or tradition may seem.

For eg. If you get lashings in Singapore for being an adult idiot in public, tough shit!

If you dont agree to comply, catch the next flight out. Basically DO YOUR HOMEWORK before traveling.

[coldmind]

I was from around the area... we called it Shen Shan (God's mountain).

[Seth1968]

Sabah Deputy Chief Minister Joseph Pairin Kitingan blamed the tragedy on the foreigners for having shown disrespect to the mountain, believed by local tribes to be a resting place for the dead. He said a special ritual will be conducted to appease the mountain spirits.

A "special" ritual. Oh oh.

http://globalnews.ca/news/2050792/saskatchewan-siblings-plead-guilty-in-malaysian-nudity-case/

[googe]

Originally posted by rage2

Who said they're responsible for 19 deaths? Just because the locals were pushing for it doesn't mean that's what happens in court.

They got 3 days in jail (time served) and a $1k fine.

The government. That's the whole point. See thread title.

Nobody is arguing about whether or not it's disrespectful to violate their indecency laws. The point of contention is the idiots think being naked caused earthquakes. And that does not deserve respect.

Edit:
Turns out, the causing earthquakes part is mostly bullshit made up by Canadian media.

http://www.theguardian.com/news/reality-check/2015/jun/11/are-naked-backpackers-charged-with-causing-earthquake

The minister's exact words:


“Whether other people believe this or not, it’s what we Sabahans believe. When the earthquake happened, it’s like a confirmation of our beliefs. It is a sacred mountain and you cannot take it lightly.

“There is almost certainly a connection. We have to take this as a reminder that local beliefs and customs are not to be disrespected.”




Were the foreigners actually arrested for causing the earthquake?
No. Although there have been calls to try the tourists in local courts and according to tribal laws, that is not what has happened.

The four who have been arrested in Malaysia will face charges under the national penal code, and the alleged offences do not have any connection to the earthquake.

Hawkins’ lawyer, Ronny Cham, said “causing annoyance by conducting obscene acts in a public place” is the likely charge.

Masidi Manjun, Sabah state tourism minister, said Malaysians “especially those in Sabah were very upset” at some tabloid reports suggesting the tourists were arrested for angering the mountain gods and for causing the earthquake.

“They were remanded for four days for further investigation for alleged offence or offences under the penal code. Definitely they were not arrested for causing a ‘deadly earthquake’,” Masidi said.


tl;dr version, they were arrested for and charged with indecency, and some randoms expressed superstitions that their disrespect angered the gods, but they were not charged or arrested for angering the gods.

Pretty much a non-story. I've met christians who think the "sinning" in california is why they're in a drought right now. These crazies are everywhere, it's when they get actual authority that we have to worry. Like that time Bush invaded Iraq to save the chosen people from Gog and Magog :thumbsdow

[Majestic12]

Originally posted by Seth1968


Woosh.

It's their custom and tradition. Do you respect it?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bacha_bazi

Yeah, but obviously something like that can be seriously harmful to parties involved. It'd compare it more to something like taking a shit in the Sistine Chapel or something. Sure, nobody gets hurt and some people might find it funny, but it's seriously disrespectful for no reason at all.

I'm as non-religious as they come, but I sure as fuck wouldn't step all over someone else's beliefs for kicks.