Will Insurance Company Find Out?

[RedDawn]

My parked car was hit a couple days ago. 100% other driver's fault with him on record admitting fault to the police. Other driver wants to settle outside of insurance.

However, we both have the same insurance company. This being my first time dealing with something like this, I was wondering:

a) Since we both have the same insurance company, even if we do settle privately, won't the insurance company still find out and hike his rate once I report it to them?

b) I haven't informed my insurance company yet. If we settle outside of the insurance company, do I still have to tell them? I've reported it to the police already and obtained the collision sticker. ~$3k in damage.

[MR2-3SGTE]

If you do it privately, you do not/should not report it to insurance. Otherwise they will increase his rates. If the other driver was also cited a ticket after admitting fault to the police officer, the insurance company may be able to find out. But most likely they'll only increase his insurance due to the ticket and not the damage.

[eblend]

The whole idea of settling outside of insurance, is to not get insurance involved at all. Why would you tell your insurance company, you got the funds to fix the car, the guy didn't want insurance to know for a reason, to prevent premium increase, so don't tell anyone, take the money and fix your car (or not, do whatever you want with it)

[RedDawn]

I'd still like to report it so there's an official record of what happened, if I can do so without his rates going up. I'm just trying to understand if his rate will go up or not. The two opinions are:

a) It won't go up because, even though it was reported, he didn't file a claim.

b) It will go up solely because it was reported.

Which one is it?

[relyt92]

Originally posted by RedDawn
I'd still like to report it so there's an official record of what happened, if I can do so without his rates going up. I'm just trying to understand if his rate will go up or not. The two opinions are:

a) It won't go up because, even though it was reported, he didn't file a claim.

b) It will go up solely because it was reported.

Which one is it? Would depend on the company. If you're settling, you don't tell insurance, otherwise put it through as a claim. You said he's admitted to police it was his fault and was ticketed, is that not official record?

[Jonathanl10]

He doesn't need to file a claim because you did. The second you tell the insurance company for 'record' purposes, it's a claim, and they will pursue damages. It's their job.

Settling outside of insurance is like dealing under the table with cash. No record, no one knows and no strings attached.

If you're deciding to settle out of insurance and you report it to the insurance company anyway then you're being an asshole lol

The fact that you want to report it to your insurance company means you don't want to settle out of and yes, his rates will increase accordingly because there's a record of him being 100% at fault. Quite frankly I wouldn't give a damn whether his rates went up or not because I'm not paying for damages. The only reason why I would do it is if the damage was small enough where I don't want to waste the deductible or where I don't want a claim on my car that affects later resale value.

[Cos]

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[codetrap]

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[Thaco]

police report is your official report, echnically you should report it to your insurance, but all that will do it pur a note on both of your history which will be take in to account for future incidents.

[Jonathanl10]

Originally posted by codetrap
Huh? This makes no sense. Assume I'm the guy who's at fault. Why would my rates go up if I'm paying for the repairs to another vehicle out of my pocket? There's no claim against my vehicle.. so? Well, I could agree to settle out of insurance and one day bite you in the ass by telling insurance company anyway. Now you paid me cash, and there's a claim on you so you got ripped off. I pocket that cash and get insurance to deal with repairs, and you can't do anything because there's no receipt or proof that the transaction happened.

Generally this doesn't happen because the guy whose at fault is the usual one trying to weed himself out.

One day, someone is going to back into your car and be all sorry and want to settle it out of insurance. Then one day later, there's a claim on your vehicle saying you rear ended him and that you conveniently didn't file a claim. Now you're fucked and look like the enemy. If I get into an accident where I'm not at fault, I call insurance right away because if you don't, you're setting yourself up for a scam.

[Thaco]

Originally posted by Jonathanl10
Well, I could agree to settle out of insurance and one day bite you in the ass by telling insurance company anyway. Now you paid me cash, and there's a claim on you so you got ripped off. I pocket that cash and get insurance to deal with repairs, and you can't do anything because there's no receipt or proof that the transaction happened.

Generally this doesn't happen because the guy whose at fault is the usual one trying to weed himself out.

One day, someone is going to back into your car and be all sorry and want to settle it out of insurance. Then one day later, there's a claim on your vehicle saying you rear ended him and that you conveniently didn't file a claim. Now you're fucked and look like the enemy. If I get into an accident where I'm not at fault, I call insurance right away because if you don't, you're setting yourself up for a scam. lol, you think insurance is an "i told daddy first so i win" game? its facts based on the evidence... not who tattled first

[Jonathanl10]

Originally posted by Thaco
lol, you think insurance is an "i told daddy first so i win" game? its facts based on the evidence... not who tattled first Well, I did leave out the fact that since there's a police report and what not so there's paperwork to back up what happened.

My scenarios being completely blind/no proof or police involvement. When there's no proof you can't deny that it's a tattle game.

[Thaco]

Originally posted by Jonathanl10
Well, I did leave out the fact that since there's a police report and what not so there's paperwork to back up what happened.

My scenarios being completely blind/no proof or police involvement. When there's no proof you can't deny that it's a tattle game. avoiding insurance has nothing to do with the police, you ALWAYS file a report with the police.

[Cos]

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[Jonathanl10]

Originally posted by Thaco
avoiding insurance has nothing to do with the police, you ALWAYS file a report with the police. I just meant that a police report is proof... I know that a police report and the insurance are independent of each other...

I'm just emphasizing the fact that if stuff is unreported with insurance, the risk of one person not keeping their end of the deal and reporting it anyway can quickly turn the tide of the argument.

[CompletelyNumb]

Originally posted by Cos
Super dick move to take his cash and then still file a claim.

:werd:


Settle in cash or go through insurance, pick one.

[Cos]

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[codetrap]

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[Thaco]

Originally posted by Jonathanl10
I just meant that a police report is proof... I know that a police report and the insurance are independent of each other...

I'm just emphasizing the fact that if stuff is unreported with insurance, the risk of one person not keeping their end of the deal and reporting it anyway can quickly turn the tide of the argument. you;re still saying its who tattled first, which it certainly is not.

[schurchill39]

Originally posted by Jonathanl10
If I get into an accident where I'm not at fault, I call insurance right away because if you don't, you're setting yourself up for a scam.

This. I've unfortunately learned my lesson on both sides of this as I was a bit of a shit head driver when I was younger.

I've been in accidents where I was not at fault and the other driver wanted to settle outside of insurance. I took their word and when I presented them with 3 quotes they didn't like how much it cost. I was too dumb at the time to call my insurance company after because I thought I would be penalized for not going through them in the first place.

In my personal experience, the police did nothing to help outside of taking the initial report. When I went to them I got the "its not our problem" treatment.

I've also slid into people in the winter and wanted to settle outside of insurance. When I paid them in cash I later found out they submitted a claim then disappeared when I called to get my money back.

All in all unless its my wife or a friend, I will never again try and settle outside of insurance. There is way to much potential for you to get fucked over regardless of which side of the accident you're on.

[Jonathanl10]

Originally posted by Thaco
lol, you think insurance is an "i told daddy first so i win" game? its facts based on the evidence... not who tattled first If there is evidence to begin with in the first place.

If there's proof, dashcam video, pics of what happen, then you have nothing to worry about because you have evidence to prove what happened. I totally agree with you that insurance is settled this way.

When you have nothing and the situation is vague af and blind. Not settling with insurance now becomes a tattle game. You're relying on blind trust with someone you don't know, and more often than not, they'll file a claim against you when you've conveniently not filed one and given them your cash.

The person who didn't file the claim is going to be incriminated because if I wasn't at fault, I would have every reason and incentive to pursue damages and vice versa.

TLDR: If you got proof, dashcam, police report as evidence and statement on who's at fault from police. I totally agree with you Thaco. But with no evidence and a vague or difficult description of the accident, the tattle game is going to decide what happens unfortunately, and you cannot deny it.

[rage2]

Originally posted by Cos
All in all unless its my wife or a friend, I will never again try and settle outside of insurance. There is way to much potential for you to get fucked over regardless of which side of the accident you're on.
This. I just helped a co-worker who's car who got backed into a day before leaving town, and what a PITA because he wanted to be nice and deal with it outside insurance (and she was kinda cute). Back and forth with the chick, who thought the quote was too expensive, tried to get me to take the car to a different shop to get a quote, took forever before she came up with the cash to pay. Would've been in and out if he went through insurance, instead it's still not done, dunno how to get the car on summer tires back home (accident happened in October), and god forbid there's more damage underneath and we have to get more money from this chick.

All this for what? It's not like anyone's banging this bitch haha.

[Thaco]

realistically the out of insurance is more for the guilty party, but in the event that the car may be written off, it could benefit the victim if they would rather keep the car and its still drivable or easily fixable... all really depends on the situation. I had my beater rear ended, was agreat car, 98 civic with low KM (under 200k..) relable as anything... insurance company gave me $2k, i could have driven a hell of a lot more than $2k value out of that thing for sure, was super disappointed, i really hoped the chick would settle outside insurance. so i could buy a new bumper cover and trunk lid from the junkyard and get another 10 years out of the car


Also insurance reports end up on the carfax, which could lower the resale value of the car.

[Env-Consultant]

Originally posted by CompletelyNumb


:werd:


Settle in cash or go through insurance, pick one.

+1. Keep everything off the books - accident and vehicle repairs or go completely by the book. If it's not major, why screw the guy over if he seems decent/honest just to have an "official report". If he seemed seedy, sure.

If possible and minor, I'd prefer my Carfax report doesn't show an accident when the only item needing replacement was a bumper or something minor. If it was major, sure I'd disclose it, but do you want your vehicle filtered out when people search by zero accidents?

[rage2]

Originally posted by Thaco
Also insurance reports end up on the carfax, which could lower the resale value of the car.
Not always. It depends if carfax buys info from your insurer or not. Some insurance companies has non disclosure clauses in the policy in which case it'll never get reported as they're not allowed to sell it, while some bodyshops sell that info so you'll get dinged even if it's not through insurance. It's a crapshoot.

My old SLK had 2 major repair jobs on it and it's still clean on carfax and carproof haha.

[Jonathanl10]

Yes insurance lowers your vehicle's resale value, but you never paid out for the repairs in the first place besides the deductible.

If you decide to settle it cash, you front the repair bill, and in MOST cases, it "won't lower" your resale value through the carproof. Either way, the cost is incurred. Which one will result in less financial damage, I couldn't tell you, but the fact that you got into the accident would've cost you regardless. There is the argument of your vehicle being more difficult to sell I'll give you that.

Me going through insurance is knowing my ability to be scammed through a cash deal is very low (because I never made one in the first place), and also having legal representation should I need it. Before you know it, the other party is suing 2 years after the accident for soft tissue damage or some bs like that and I'd want my insurer to deal with that shit.

[Xtrema]

We have said it enough times on here.

NEVER EVER SETTLE OUTSIDE OF INSURANCE IF YOU ARE NOT AT FAULT.

There is no argument about this.

Insurance is about punishing people who fucks up. Letting people go isn't fair to all good drivers on the road. Plus you just screw yourself up if guy flakes out.

Take pictures, take informations down, file police report, let the insurance company deal with the rest.

[Kloubek]

I'm not so sure that his rates would go up because it's reported.

Several years ago I backed into someone. Not sure why she didn't get out of my way since I was going slow and she had tons of time, but that's besides the point. Anyway, I paid for the damages outside insurance, but since she was in a rental car it was reported through insurance anyway.

My rates didn't go up, though. It wasn't recorded as an official claim, though TD did want to exempt me from getting their accident forgiveness as a result. (Though they did so a couple of years later).

Not sure how if policies have changed or if it depends on the company. Nevertheless, if you are kind enough to settle outside insurance, I see little reason to report it... Otherwise, it kind of defeats the purpose of settling outside insurance.

[Masked Bandit]

There are a lot of variables here and not enough concrete info to make a solid recommendation but here are my general thoughts on the scenario.

If the OP intends to let this settle outside of insurance, don't report it to anyone other than the police. The problem is that some insurance companies now rate clients for $0 claims (commonly referred to in the industry as self-insured losses). The theory behind it is that your premiums are based on your driving behaviour, not simply how much money insurance companies have paid out on your behalf. So if you've had three accidents in the last five years but have deep enough pockets to pay the claims yourself, you're still a risky driver. The problem is that not all companies view self insured losses this way so it's impossible to say for certain what the other guy's insurance company may or may not do here.

Settling a claim outside of insurance can be tricky but it can also be easier than going through insurance IN THE RIGHT SITUATION, with the RIGHT ADVICE & GUIDANCE from your broker. There are far too many variables that can come into play for me to explain it all here both in general and as it pertains to OP's case, but this would be a conversation for him (her?) to have with their broker, not as a general question on the internetzzzzz.

And of course...:goflames: :winter:

[Thaco]

^^^ yep, thats what I've been saying, lots of different situations with different variables, too many to make an informed call, thats why my comments involved examples, because theres just nto enough info to know the exact situation here.

[schocker]

When the lady scuffed my bumper up (Parked while I was at work) about a year ago, I went outside insurance, and it worked out in the end and it was fixed great, but I probably wouldn't do it again just because of the chance of shit heads.

[killramos]

If you pay for full coverage insurance i don't see why you wouldn't use the service. Even if it is someone you know or deal with regularly it just takes the personal out of it.

Like you say though if the wife backed into my car i would obviously not go through insurance as I would be the one dealing with the whole thing anyways.

[max_boost]

Here's an example.

Years ago a family member side swiped an old lady in her pos car. Those old Dodge/Chrysler 4 door Spirits?! The vehicle was worth $500-700. We paid her $3500 to settle outside of insurance and had her sign it.

A month later she tells insurance anyway and insurance calls us. We had to show them that we settled it but because insurance knows about it, like masked bandit said, you are higher risk now. Guess what? Rates go up! However since there wasn't an actual claim, it wasn't documented we simply switched insurance companies.

[rx7boi]

Even if you are at fault and manage to convince the other person to settle outside of insurance, have the good sense to write up a document and have both parties sign it.

There's always the chance the other person is seedy and will try to get more money out of you later on.

Having this contract makes both parties aware that both sides are taking a risk (yes, he is technically doing you a favour if you are at fault).

At the same time, you never know if you're being bluffed and the other person doesn't have insurance and therefore has incentive to deal outside of insurance.

Either way, that's why sometimes it's just not worth the risk especially if the damage is too great.

[automotivat3d]

Originally posted by Jonathanl10
If you're deciding to settle out of insurance and you report it to the insurance company anyway then you're being an asshole lol


This happen to me back in October. A 2012 BMW 750i XDrive owner fucked up my door at MRU while I was parked waiting to pick up a friend, he took 100% responsibility and gave me a couple of hundred just to fix my door so it wont go under insurance a few days later my insurance called me and said that I hit him and now I have to pay to get his front bumper fix ....like what just happen :confused: :confused:

[acedia]

I would always go through insurance. This has happened twice in my extended family - their vehicle gets hit, they call insurance, the other driver decides to pay in full, and there are no insurance hikes. They haven't "used" their insurance to have a claim paid for.

My insurance guy told me last time, always call in and have it on record, and if the at fault party pays the damages in full, there is no problem. They do not have their premiums raised, and we have the bonus of having the insurance involved to keep an eye on buddy in case he decides to not pay. Otherwise what happens if you go to pick up your car at the shop and the other party suddenly says FO and won't cover the cost? You're going to start making phone calls then?? Good luck with that.

[heavyD]

I got hit by a guy a few years ago and he literally begged me not to go through insurance that he would pay me cash. I had no issues telling him too bad. There has to be repercussions for poor driving and I'm not bailing out anyone for hitting my car when it could have been avoided in the first place if the guy was more careful.

[brown911]

I have been in a few non at fault accidents on personal cars and dealt with many with our cab company, if they want to settle outside of insurance, this is how we do it:

*If they balk at paying me as soon as I hand over the quotes, or stall in any way shape or form, I use insurance*

1) If they are under 25 and from some sort of asian descent (brown/yellow), I look at their address and want to talk to their parents, don't give two shits what the driver says.

2) I deal regularly with the cab industry and can get 3 diff body shop quotes the next day.

3) I basically demand, I need the cash for the repair within 1 day and once I have the cash in hand, I give them a letter which states flat out that we were in an accident, they admitted fault, we opted to deal with this privately and I was paid $xxxx.xx for the damages and my car was repaired to my standard and that I will not pursue any future claims against XX person.

4) If they balk at paying me as soon as I hand over the quotes, or stall in any way shape or form, then its insurance/police report the very next day. If the asian parents seem clueless, cheap or I don't like the neighbourhood they live in, same deal, insurance/police report the next day.

I've been rear ended twice, once by a white girl, once by an asian girl, both of them were younger university students who live at home in nicer neighbourhoods in the NW (Panorama/Hamptons). Their parents were very nice, lived in nice-ish homes and had nice-ish cars, so I didn't mind letting it taking 2-3 days, never had an issue.

Once I was semi side swiped by a brown guy who didn't shoulder check (I had dash cam). His parents were clueless and seemed cheap. Even though I am brown my self, I said fuck that dude and went straight to insurance even though they begged me not to. Told them I didn't feel comfortable and that was that.

With the cab company, if we are at fault, oh well, insurance it is. If the other person is at fault, we do the same exact thing as explained above.

This is going to be rude/stuck up as fuck, but their address, demeanor, clothing, car and if I ever get to the front door of their house, the way it looks on the inside from the front door are honestly the most important things to me.

If you are not at fault, be as judgemental as you want, the ball is in your court.

People in decent neighbourhoods who have no problem going to the bank and pulling out 1500-2000 cash are good to deal with, but if you take take their cash and then later on inform insurance, I hope you "randomly" get jumped.


*edit* Sorry! Just saw this is a month old and is useless to you now, but you can read it for future reference.