Kanye West wants $1 Billion loan. [Archive] - Beyond.ca - Car Forums

rx7_turbo2

02-15-2016, 08:16 PM

Can any of the "younger" members take the time explain the whole "Kanye" thing to me? I hear people call him the voice of a generation, one of the greatest artists of all time etc, etc, etc. I just don't get it.

Artists like Dylan, Crosby, Stills, Nash & Young, Lennon, they were all well before my time. However even as a child I could listen to the lyrics and recognize and appreciate the message of a given point in time. I'm not British but I still listen to The Clash, and The Sex Pistols recognizing their influence in other musicians and their own representation of a difficult time in their generations history. My life could not be more polar opposite than that experienced by the members of NWA, or Ice-T, and their music was never my favourite, but even back then I could hear the message of people living a life I didn't understand but was fascinated by. Eminem, not my thing but strong visuals about the struggle of one young man, crude of course but accurately represented some youth of that time. Nirvana, Soundgarden, Pearl Jam, this was my generation so it's hard for me to look at them without a bias, but I remember even my mother would listen to a song like Jeremy and understand the message and how the story reflected what we were seeing in the youth of the time.

Because of my enjoyment of music as a whole, and the massive amounts of praise that's been heaped on him, I've tried to listen to Kanye. There doesn't appear to be any substance whatsoever. His lyrics are almost universally about how amazing he is or how someone else is not as amazing as him, that's it that's all. Despite my appreciation for artists well outside my own time have I just become too old to understand the message he's sending? Is there something I'm missing when it comes to his music?

Shlade

02-15-2016, 08:17 PM

Fuck this guy

codetrap

02-15-2016, 08:35 PM

Xtrema

02-15-2016, 08:44 PM

The only Kayne song I can listen all day long.

UhJteYnoLBI

HiTempguy1

02-15-2016, 08:50 PM

Originally posted by codetrap
rx7_turbo2, he's just an epic self absorbed douchebag.

Well, I mean he IS the voice of a generation; entitled, narcissistic twitheads posting selfies all the time, demanding that their opinion matters.

Popularity does not mean something is good.

ercchry

02-15-2016, 08:57 PM

His earlier stuff was alright, he also use to produce a bunch back in the day... Now his head has inflated to a point where he thinks he is a god... Probably thinks he should be jay-z status but just is failing at making it to the next level and is going off the deep end

Sentry

02-15-2016, 09:04 PM

Kanye's alright, his music's pretty good. Questionable taste in women though, and I think he might be legitimately bipolar or NPD at the very very least.

You're all still mad that the mean black man said something not nice to the pretty white girl. :D
http://www.etonline.com/awards/grammys/2015/02/24130773/600_kanye_west_taylor_swift.jpg

Type_S1

02-15-2016, 09:30 PM

Originally posted by rx7_turbo2
Can any of the "younger" members take the time explain the whole "Kanye" thing to me? I hear people call him the voice of a generation, one of the greatest artists of all time etc, etc, etc. I just don't get it.

Artists like Dylan, Crosby, Stills, Nash & Young, Lennon, they were all well before my time. However even as a child I could listen to the lyrics and recognize and appreciate the message of a given point in time. I'm not British but I still listen to The Clash, and The Sex Pistols recognizing their influence in other musicians and their own representation of a difficult time in their generations history. My life could not be more polar opposite than that experienced by the members of NWA, or Ice-T, and their music was never my favourite, but even back then I could hear the message of people living a life I didn't understand but was fascinated by. Eminem, not my thing but strong visuals about the struggle of one young man, crude of course but accurately represented some youth of that time. Nirvana, Soundgarden, Pearl Jam, this was my generation so it's hard for me to look at them without a bias, but I remember even my mother would listen to a song like Jeremy and understand the message and how the story reflected what we were seeing in the youth of the time.

Because of my enjoyment of music as a whole, and the massive amounts of praise that's been heaped on him, I've tried to listen to Kanye. There doesn't appear to be any substance whatsoever. His lyrics are almost universally about how amazing he is or how someone else is not as amazing as him, that's it that's all. Despite my appreciation for artists well outside my own time have I just become too old to understand the message he's sending? Is there something I'm missing when it comes to his music?

Listen to his albums "college dropout" and "late registration". Even "graduation" is above average. Kanye was an unreal artist with lyrics that reached millions back in the early 2000's then I can only assume the money got to his head and his music went downhill fast. It sucks seeing him nowadays as I see what he used to put out back in my teen years to who he is now and I just shake my head.

rx7_turbo2

02-15-2016, 09:44 PM

Originally posted by Sentry
Kanye's alright, his music's pretty good. Questionable taste in women though, and I think he might be legitimately bipolar or NPD at the very very least.

I think there's little doubt he falls somewhere on the autism spectrum. That's not trying to insult the guy many great artists have had similar struggles obviously. The ability to see the world and express your observations differently than the average person is what makes a great artists, whether that be songwriting or visual arts.

That.Guy.S30

02-15-2016, 09:44 PM

^808 and Heartbreak is pretty sick! College drop out was his best.

But what I think what people don't know is how much he produces for other people. His vision is amazing. Him not so much.

RealJimmyJames

02-15-2016, 09:45 PM

He's no Deep Purple, that's for sure.

bigbadboss101

02-15-2016, 09:51 PM

Dude is a jerk. Forget it.

J.M.

02-15-2016, 10:10 PM

His earlier music was much better, but one of his latest tracks called Real Friends is pretty good imo.

This is probably a media stunt for his latest album lol

soloracer

02-15-2016, 10:35 PM

He's an idiot and he can't fade into history soon enough. How can anyone who uses auto tune be considered talented?

tirebob

02-15-2016, 10:40 PM

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B-jq7WqCYAAXZfw.jpg

ercchry

02-15-2016, 10:53 PM

Originally posted by That.Guy.S30
But what I think what people don't know is how much he produces for other people. His vision is amazing. Him not so much.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Albums_produced_by_Kanye_West

rx7_turbo2

02-15-2016, 11:10 PM

Originally posted by RealJimmyJames
He's no Deep Purple, that's for sure.

Oh hush;)

A lot of people saying how good his early stuff was. I guess that's part of it for any artist? Would i feel differently about this guys music if he had died before the whole marry a Kardashian saga? Interesting question.

Part of it is the narsasistic personality, it's really tough to see any substance filter through that. I watched his SNL performance this past weekend, I'm just left going WTF was that? Weird lights, a shit ton of auto-tune combined with mostly just monotone rambling. The people on stage with him look like they're so privileged to be there but it just comes off as really silly since the reality was most of them were exhibiting far more talent than he was at the time.

D'z Nutz

02-16-2016, 12:04 AM

I enjoy his first three albums and still listen to them from time to time, but even then he was a terrible rapper. Where he excels is his production. His rapping skills are average at best.

[GaGe]

02-16-2016, 01:53 AM

Originally posted by D'z Nutz
I enjoy his first three albums and still listen to them from time to time, but even then he was a terrible rapper. Where he excels is his production. His rapping skills are average at best.

:werd:

Yeah he's a great producer with a great vision, but a terrible rapper and singer.

He produced a bunch of Jay-Z's biggest hits around 2000ish. Tried to start a rap career but no one would sign him except for Jay-Z. His first album (College Dropout) was awesome - rapped about school, family, life choices, etc. while everyone else was rapping about money and bitches. After a while, he turned into a dbag and start releasing shit albums.

He did have a big part in John Legend's success too.

max_boost

02-16-2016, 05:06 AM

Originally posted by JRSC00LUDE
Oh man, if anyone were to end up homeless and forgotten.... Brothers let us pray. oh yes and that entire k klan lol

finboy

02-16-2016, 06:30 AM

For better or worse, his career has steered the direction of modern rap, and the style changes every album. I suspect part of the douchebaggery is an act to grab attention in the over saturated pop market, and part of it is mental in some way (on the spectrum wouldn't surprise me, the guy has always been known as crazy emotional and impulsive). A lot of people struggle to get past the persona, but the music is quite good. From a production standpoint, yeezus was amazing, Lou reed wrote a glowing review of it before he died. My beautiful dark twisted fantasy was an interesting experiment in the complete opposite way, throwing everything and the kitchen sink on a record.

I think what I find most interesting about kanye's work is that his albums have caused his older albums (and others from that era) to sound dated. I love college drop out, but listening to that album NOW is weird as it still has some elements of early 2000 rap with sound very outdated, and that album was groundbreaking when it came out compared to cash money, rockafella, shady/aftermath, etc. The same can be said for pre-808 albums compared with where rap has gone since he made that album.

Even if you don't like the direction rap has moved in, it's impossible to say he hasn't influenced it's direction with the albums he has made. I would argue that jay-z hasn't even put out a relevant record since Kanye came around (the black album) with the exception of watch the throne (which collaborated with Kanye, and was probably his weakest effort).

With all that said, I am not holding my breath on this album, it seems rushed and it took Rick Rubin to save yeezus, thought I hope I'm wrong.

Originally posted by D'z Nutz
I enjoy his first three albums and still listen to them from time to time, but even then he was a terrible rapper. Where he excels is his production. His rapping skills are average at best.

Agree with this, I would say Kanye (and his production team) are great at what they do, and have a great sense of songwriting (structure, phrases, etc.) but Kanye as a rapper is meh. People buy his album for the whole package, not because he is rakim 2.0

danno

02-16-2016, 06:59 AM

You cant even buy his new album you have to join tidal, which i imagine is a sinking ship and kanye thinks he is going to save it. Im just guessing though, as i dont like streaming music anyway.

flipstah

02-16-2016, 07:31 AM

WTF is Tidal?

egmilano

02-16-2016, 07:41 AM

Man he cannot sing or rap but his production is on point.

finboy

02-16-2016, 08:03 AM

Originally posted by flipstah
WTF is Tidal?

Some BS streaming service jay-z bought, it has flopped hard so far despite all attempts to use celebrities to promote it. Even jay-z is distancing himself from it at this point.

Originally posted by egmilano
Man he cannot sing or rap but his production is on point.

He has had a few moments as a rapper, but he is definitely better at putting together a solid, cohesive album. He is like dr dre in that he can work with some great studio guys to make a great album, get some quality collaborations, and can bring the whole thing together. Unlike dre, he can actually write his own lyrics, albeit they are pretty average.

dandia89

02-16-2016, 09:36 AM

kanye is most likely one of the best producer rappers of our generations, he was known for revitalizing jay-z's career with the blueprint. he's an average rapper at best, but produces incredible beats/lyrics. look at his earlier albums, college dropout, late registration and graduation.

he definitely has a stronger message with his more recent albums, and he will do it at the risk of having good sounding music. yeezus was probably the toughest album to ever listen to, but it was merely a 'message' to the current music standards

JRSC00LUDE

02-16-2016, 09:52 AM

^

What was the message? :confused:

rx7_turbo2

02-16-2016, 10:16 AM

Originally posted by dandia89
he definitely has a stronger message with his more recent albums, and he will do it at the risk of having good sounding music. yeezus was probably the toughest album to ever listen to, but it was merely a 'message' to the current music standards

Ya, I have to ask, what exactly was/is the "message"?

I understand the point, a guy like Dylan had a very unique voice, and the arrangement of his songs was at times unconventional. However his message was always pretty clear and relatable.

dandia89

02-16-2016, 10:30 AM

yeezus was about about current hollywood, typical famous standards and it's challenges against current societal norms and corporations.

i.e. "new slaves" "i am god" "black skin heads" "bound 2 (the video)"

you know what i could be completely wrong and i wouldn't be surprised either. his messages were unclear. but i do know that album was meant to challenge the current hip hop musical standards and to deliver something new

finboy

02-16-2016, 11:23 AM

Originally posted by dandia89
yeezus was about about current hollywood, typical famous standards and it's challenges against current societal norms and corporations.

i.e. "new slaves" "i am god" "black skin heads" "bound 2 (the video)"

you know what i could be completely wrong and i wouldn't be surprised either. his messages were unclear. but i do know that album was meant to challenge the current hip hop musical standards and to deliver something new

Further to the point of yeezus was the drive to be anti-pop in a way similar to lou reeds metal machine music. Cluttered among the shifting moods, noises, screams, etc. Were influences from early Chicago house music, industrial, acid house, and dance hall music. His production team (mostly Rick rubin) was able to bring a cohesive idea out of he lyrical themes by jolting the themes back and forth, dead stopping songs, cutting to seemingly different songs, etc. To add to that, the song had no official singles, was sold in a very cheap cd case, and had no album artwork, etc. The sample use was really interesting, (mixing Marylyn Manson with Gary glitter, using a throwaway sound from a chemical brothers track, etc.), but how much production was Kanye vs. Daft punk, Rick Rubin, mike dean, etc. Who knows.

That contrasts with mbdtf which had a huge amount of artwork, a half hour music video, double Lp vinyl offering, and was an album with a focus on maximizing everything, and having the album flow together song by song.

sputnik

02-16-2016, 11:37 AM

Originally posted by BensonTT
His music sucks anyways.. I wouldn't even torrent it lol

His performance on SNL was bizarre and confusing.

HiTempguy1

02-16-2016, 12:44 PM

Originally posted by finboy

Further to the point of yeezus was the drive to be anti-pop

So basically "Throw shit at the wall and see if it sticks" is what I am getting from your post. Ride your success to put out whatever garbage you want. Yes, "art". :rofl:

Or maybe he just has no idea wtf he is doing and made some shit music that he thought was good at the time. Just like you are never supposed to confuse malice with stupidity, don't confuse genius with stupidity either. And also, what is this "omg his production quality is amazing!" crap? WGAF? That's like saying Transformers is a good movie series because the CGI is awesome :rofl:

I don't think Mindless Self Indulgence is GOOD music, but it DOES entertain me and I do (for the most part) understand the message. It's wonderful entertainment, but shit art. Just by it's shear over-the-topness does it highlight the problems with modern day music. But that's the point, it's not "good". It's awful. And that's why I like it. So at least be honest with yourselves :rofl:

J.M.

02-16-2016, 05:11 PM

Anyone listen to The Life of Pablo yet?

JRSC00LUDE

02-16-2016, 05:17 PM

Originally posted by J.M.
Anyone listen to The Life of Pablo yet?

I heard the office toilet flushing a couple times today, I'm sure that about sums it up.

rx7_turbo2

02-16-2016, 05:32 PM

Originally posted by dandia89
yeezus was about about current hollywood, typical famous standards and it's challenges against current societal norms and corporations.

I've heard this a lot but it just doesn't go round. The observations he makes need to be made as an outsider. He married a fucking Kardashian media whore, and seems almost completely motivated by financial gain and an increased level of celebrity. He is what he bitches about. I think the fact I didn't really give him a shot until he'd already proved himself a massive narsasistic ass hat is a problem. I can't "unsee what I've seen".

Mitsu3000gt

02-16-2016, 06:30 PM

Lol:

http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-35587381

He also said his new album will "never ever be on Apple", which ensures another enormous market will probably just download it instead. What an idiot.

finboy

02-16-2016, 09:17 PM

Originally posted by J.M.
Anyone listen to The Life of Pablo yet?

From what I've heard so far, not great, I'm guessing he is in for a michael jackson level meltdown

relyt92

02-16-2016, 09:24 PM

Originally posted by J.M.
Anyone listen to The Life of Pablo yet? Can't say I enjoyed it, and I've liked everything including 808's. Couple good songs but just wasn't feeling it overall.

civic_stylez

02-17-2016, 12:56 PM

Hes just trying so hard to be edgy and modern. His shit just looks stupid but he must be doing something right as people and the media just gobble this crap up. Guy sells out MSG for an album release and doesnt even perform. Just does a knock off of a thriller video from the hood and basks in his own glory. Clown.

finboy

02-17-2016, 12:59 PM

Originally posted by relyt92
Can't say I enjoyed it, and I've liked everything including 808's. Couple good songs but just wasn't feeling it overall.

If it was 8-9 tracks and had some more polishing put on it could be good. The lack of Rick Rubin as exec producer is pretty apparent this time round

mr2mike

02-17-2016, 01:05 PM

Originally posted by sputnik

His performance on SNL was bizarre and confusing.

Yup. Hadn't seen anything that messed up since Lana Del Rey on there.
His 'rap battle' skit was terrible. It was just an 8 mile rip off. Already saw White Rabbit rip on himself in a rap battle, disclose it all so the other guy had nothing. Kanye just did the same thing.

Jay Z obviously managed to harness the guy's talent and motivation. Got the best out of him, the quality of a good leader. Kanye can't lead himself... proof is in the last few years.

To say he might have NPD is an understatement.

carson blocks

02-17-2016, 01:29 PM

I was looking for some new music and found 'Yeezus' on some 'x best albums of all time' list. I wanted to like it, but found it completely unlistenable. Quite possibly the worst album I've come across in any genre, and I have pretty broad tastes. Immediate delete, and a reminder of why I torrent things before buying them.

I was thinking that despite being an unlikeable, egotistical douchebag with no grounding, he might actually have some musical talent to back up his fame. Nope, just another talentless moron backed by the media machine to sell crap albums.

darthVWader

02-17-2016, 03:04 PM

Originally posted by J.M.
He should start a gofundme page

:rofl:

https://www.gofundme.com/kanyesmedicis

Manhattan

02-17-2016, 03:21 PM

You guys sure talk about Kanye a lot for supposedly not being fans.

TLOP is pretty good, not amazing, but still one of the more interesting albums so far this year. I expected a better product given that he's been working on this for over 2 years. It feels rushed/half-finished but there's definitely a few highlights.

Yes his personal life is pretty nuts but like it or not he's been the most influential artist of the past 10 years.

JRSC00LUDE

02-17-2016, 03:38 PM

Originally posted by Manhattan
like it or not he's been the most influential artist of the past 10 years.

To who/what genre? I might believe that, should it be limited strictly to hip-hop.....?

rage2

02-17-2016, 03:49 PM

699108088687755264

Everyone needs a luxury search engine.

JRSC00LUDE

02-17-2016, 03:56 PM

:rofl:

J.M.

02-17-2016, 04:12 PM

I liked the majority of TLOP, few tracks I was thinking wtf is this shit though lol

Manhattan

02-17-2016, 04:19 PM

Originally posted by rage2
699108088687755264

Everyone needs a luxury search engine.

Emoticon auto correct :rofl:

Also, I didn't know you could embed tweets on beyond. Cool.

rx7_turbo2

02-17-2016, 05:50 PM

Originally posted by Manhattan
You guys sure talk about Kanye a lot for supposedly not being fans. I've never understood this logic. I'm not a fan of low oil prices but I talk about them a lot, by your logic we should only talk about things we're fans of? Cool I'll let all food at movie critics know from now on they shouldnt be mentioning movies or food they dislike

Yes his personal life is pretty nuts but like it or not he's been the most influential artist of the past 10 years.
Like I said earlier, this accolade gets thrown out about him ALL the time but I've not yet heard any real substance to the claim, even by industry "experts". Some people in this thread have touched the surface a bit. You've now made the claim as well, could you elaborate.

Just to be clear as well, we're not considering him "the most influential artist of the past ten years" across all genres right?

finboy

02-17-2016, 06:14 PM

Originally posted by rx7_turbo2
I've never understood this logic. I'm not a fan of low oil prices but I talk about them a lot, by your logic we should only talk about things we're fans of? Cool I'll let all food at movie critics know from now on they shouldnt be mentioning movies or food they dislike

Like I said earlier, this accolade gets thrown out about him ALL the time but I've not yet heard any real substance to the claim, even by industry "experts". Some people in this thread have touched the surface a bit. You've now made the claim as well, could you elaborate.

Just to be clear as well, we're not considering him "the most influential artist of the past ten years" across all genres right?

Since 808's and heartbreak, the genre of sensitive rappers has come around (for better or worse), drake, childish gambino, etc.

He drove the shift towards more conscious rap coming back to the mainstream pre-college drop out and after by helping common, freeway, talib, mos def, etc. pairing them with mainstream acts like Lillie allen, jay z, and busta rhymes.

He helped non hiphop groups like Coldplay, john mayer, Bon iver, and maroon 5 cross over into the hiphop genre.

That's just a start, not saying it is all good/bad, as music is subjective, but he has had a huge influence on rap/hip-hop and pop music as a whole for the last decade. To some point, his work with daft punk and yeezus as a whole has realy turned heads with noise rock/drone fans. People on several guitar forums I'm on who HATE him and his work still throw tons of praise on yeezus.

rx7_turbo2

02-17-2016, 06:21 PM

^Thanks :thumbsup:

Cos

02-17-2016, 06:41 PM

JRSC00LUDE

02-17-2016, 06:57 PM

Thanks finboy, that's the first time someone has cited examples. I can see how he's affected hip hop. Of course my personal opinion is that it's a pretty talentless genre in general but, I also know it's just my opinion. At least the fact remains that he's a delusional self-worshiping nutjob haha

finboy

02-17-2016, 07:19 PM

If I had to guess, the guy has zero to no self esteem, he's admitted as such on "all falls down" and it makes sense based on all the over compensating and needing to stay popular. Music is subjective, so I can understand why people might not be a fan of his music, and definitely his personality, but to say he is untalented or not influential is a hard case to make. I wouldn't even say his music is perfect, far from it, and it could write pages on what the consider some pitfalls. I figured I would help some of those who seemed baffled understand why some of the claims made about Kanye specifically have merit.