Buying a car - agreed price then seller backs out

[KPHMPH]

So we FINALLY found a car. Phoned, emailed and texted the dealer about this car.

Agreed to a price and booked out flights for Monday to go pick it up.

Seller literally just phoned us and said he messed up and the price is $20,000 more than what we agreed to in email with a deposit on the car.

What do I do now? Leave it and don't buy it or back after him for the original price we agreed to. We have emails stating the price and him agreeing to it - Autotrader ads with the price and his website with a price we were going to pay.

I really wanted this car and now he wants another 20k....

[Jeeper1986]

is this a Ferrari we are talking about??

what is this car that an extra 20k is needed to sell it, I say if u put a deposit down then u might have a case or the seller can just give u ur deposit back and off u go say who the dealer was and let the net take care of its thing

[KPHMPH]

2014 E550 for $45,000

He phones back and says it's $65,000

I REALLY want this so I'm a little choked.

[spikerS]

if you have the paper trail to back it up, you probably have a case, at least for all your expenses involved through small claims.

I heard a rumor that small claims is up to 50K now.

[Sugarphreak]

...

[Jeeper1986]

is this the car? http://www.kijiji.ca/v-cars-trucks/calgary/2014-mercedes-benz-e-class-e-550-coupe-2-door/1144311366?enableSearchNavigationFlag=true

not sure how much they run for but if u where at 45,000 and theres a 20k mistake something is fishy

[Mibz]

Just walk away.

Burn his house down first, but then just walk away.

[D'z Nutz]

Originally posted by Jeeper1986
is this the car? http://www.kijiji.ca/v-cars-trucks/calgary/2014-mercedes-benz-e-class-e-550-coupe-2-door/1144311366?enableSearchNavigationFlag=true

not sure how much they run for but if u where at 45,000 and theres a 20k mistake something is fishy

Clearly it's not. Why would the OP book a flight out of Calgary to Calgary?

[KPHMPH]

This is the car .


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v76/bonder45/Screen%20Shot%202016-04-09%20at%209.10.27%20PM_zpsfdq0pgnf.png

[guessboi]

I don't think you have a case without a purchase agreement. Did they send you one before you book your flight?

[btimbit]

Pursue it with a few emails maybe, but really, all you can do is just walk away.

I know the feeling, you get all excited then the rug gets pulled out from under you. Fucking sucks

[rx7_turbo2]

So what's the fair market value for the car? If it's $65k the fact he was offering it at a $20k discount would have set off major alarm bells for me. If it's a $45k car he's now asking $20k more for? You could try suing for what you're out of pocket I guess. I might chalk it up to a lesson learned, if something is too good to be true it probably...........

[max_boost]

Deposit? Bill of sale?

Interesting. Probably SOL but keep us posted.

[shakalaka]

I'd ask for a refund of the deposit as well as for them to pay for your flights of it's non-refundable. Whether or not an official contract was signed, you still have a claim considering you made an offer and it was accepted. It's all in writing so you have the evidence. The question is if you really think it's worth pursuing over small claims.

[Mibz]

Shit, I thought you were flying to Winnipeg or something. If you're in Van just go eat some sushi, race some go-karts and enjoy your weekend.

[know1edge]

.

[djmr2]

Originally posted by Mibz
Shit, I thought you were flying to Winnipeg or something. If you're in Van just go eat some sushi, race some go-karts and enjoy your weekend.

:thumbsup:

[FixedGear]

What is the point of this thread, do you seriously not understand that there wasn't a legally binding contract? There's nothing you can do, go to Vancouver and enjoy the vacation - and next time make sure to get things in writing before you make travel plans. :nut:

[CompletelyNumb]

Deposit paid and flights booked with no paperwork? Don't you usually make a purchase contract when you pay a deposit?

Worst case use Beyond's pagerank to get listed for Crossborder Vehicle Sales scam and Corcars scam. Surrey based so it's believable.:poosie:

[KPHMPH]

Originally posted by CompletelyNumb
Deposit paid and flights booked with no paperwork? Don't you usually make a purchase contract when you pay a deposit?

Worst case use Beyond's pagerank to get listed for Crossborder Vehicle Sales scam and Corcars scam. Surrey based so it's believable.:poosie:

In the car business you give a deposit then sign a bill of sale.

I spoke to a lawyer today and he said there is a case with it to either get damages or get the car for the agreed price from the start.

[rage2]

$65k is still a good deal for that car. They start at 81k new base and options up to 100k.. $45k was definitely a typo.

[FixedGear]

Originally posted by KPHMPH


In the car business you give a deposit then sign a bill of sale.

I spoke to a lawyer today and he said there is a case with it to either get damages or get the car for the agreed price from the start.

Oh so you gave a deposit and signed a bill of sale? You didn't mention that in your earlier posts.

Of course a lawyer is going to say you've got a case, that's their livelihood. :rofl:

[know1edge]

.

[FixedGear]

Originally posted by know1edge


a legal contract basically consists of an offer, acceptance, and consideration (the deposit)

When i posted that, he had said nothing about paying a deposit... and he still hasn't said that.

[FixedGear]

Oops, just read the first post again and he does mention as deposit

[mr2mike]

If you paid a deposit, you must have a sales agreement signed by dealer and you?? If so, small claims court I believe. But really just getting back to cost of tickets and deposit.

The guy probably thought he could pull a fast one. You're committed and he figured top on $20K.

In beyond fashion, you generally post the sales guy's name, number and home address. :devil:


edit: Is this a Major dealer or a shady, Surrey, Cars4less dealer?

[KPHMPH]

I was saying in the car business you give a deposit first THEN sign a bill of sale.

In my case I gave a deposit then he must of went to go to a bill of sale up and wanted to jack the price up or someone else gave a higher offer which he wanted to take.

Cornelis Bobeldijk
[email protected]
www.corcars.com
1 604 803 9995 cell
1 877 838 9997 fax

[riander5]

Was definitely a typo. Too bad you couldnt have bought it before they caught it. Rough luck

[01RedDX]

.

[FraserB]

I'd definitely get at least a consultation from a lawyer. Might make him think twice next time he tries to back out of a sale.

[Redlyne_mr2]

Mistakes happen, I've had the wrong pricing online before, simple typo. What baffles me is how he goes as far as confirming the pricing and taking a deposit. If there is no signed bill of sale there is no deal. If he wants to do the right thing then refunding you your plane tickets would be the right thing to do.

[CompletelyNumb]

Originally posted by KPHMPH
[B]I was saying in the car business you give a deposit first THEN sign a bill of sale.


Damn. That's shady. No offense.

I've only bought two vehicles from a dealership, both brand new. Just went in, negotiated, signed the dotted line and drove off. Never paid a deposit, wasn't sure how that worked.

[Redlyne_mr2]

Originally posted by CompletelyNumb


Damn. That's shady. No offense.

I've only bought two vehicles from a dealership, both brand new. Just went in, negotiated, signed the dotted line and drove off. Never paid a deposit, wasn't sure how that worked.

If youre negotiating on a deal from out of town any individual/dealer would require a deposit to hold the car until you arrive to view it. Nothing shady about that practice. From a consumer stand point I definitely wouldn't sign a bill of sale until I viewed the car.

[you&me]

OP - was there any correspondence that explicitly acknowledged the price of $45,000? Or was it more of a "I'll buy your E550 cabriolet and I'll send you a deposit until I fly out to pick it up"?

As someone else mentioned, $45,000 is almost suspiciously cheap for that car. To me, it would either indicate a typo, or a car that has major issues.

In the interest of full disclosure, I have bought a car from Cornelis before and talked to him about many others. Unless you have some documentation of the $45,000 price being agreed to, I have no doubt that this was an honest mistake.

[My_name_is_Rob]

I could see maybe if he thought he listed it in USD, and you were a US buyer. Since he does advertise he does crossborder vehicle sales. Once he realized the implied price was in CAD then he realized his mistake and upped the price.

[KPHMPH]

Originally posted by rage2
$65k is still a good deal for that car. They start at 81k new base and options up to 100k.. $45k was definitely a typo.
They start at $60k and go up to $80k

[zieg]

Hm, there is something about a verbal contract being legally binding in Alberta but no clue if it applies here.

I once looked at a great deal on a used suv that turned out to be a typo as well (though not as bad). Told them the corrected price (No agreement made prior) was too high to justify for a used one, so they gave me a deal on a new one instead. :dunno:

[you&me]

Originally posted by rage2
$65k is still a good deal for that car. They start at 81k new base and options up to 100k.. $45k was definitely a typo.



Originally posted by KPHMPH

They start at $60k and go up to $80k

The base price of an E400 is $71,300 and gets over $80 with the usual options.

The E550 like the subject of this thread starts at $81,500 and, like Rage said, but barely gets over $90 if you tick every-single-box...

[blitz]

Originally posted by ZiG-87
Hm, there is something about a verbal contract being legally binding in Alberta but no clue if it applies here.

I once looked at a great deal on a used suv that turned out to be a typo as well (though not as bad). Told them the corrected price (No agreement made prior) was too high to justify for a used one, so they gave me a deal on a new one instead. :dunno:

I'm pretty sure that's the classic bait and switch move.

[88CRX]

Did they explicitly agree to sell you the car for $45k?

Or did you tell them you'd buy the car for the full asking price noted in the add and then you booked your ticket?

If it sounds too good to be true..... :dunno:

[CompletelyNumb]

Originally posted by Redlyne_mr2


If youre negotiating on a deal from out of town any individual/dealer would require a deposit to hold the car until you arrive to view it. Nothing shady about that practice. From a consumer stand point I definitely wouldn't sign a bill of sale until I viewed the car.

What kind of paperwork is normally done for the deposit? Any guarantees on advertised price? No questions asked refund if they decide not to buy?

Curious is all.

[KPHMPH]

Originally posted by 88CRX
Did they explicitly agree to sell you the car for $45k?

Or did you tell them you'd buy the car for the full asking price noted in the add and then you booked your ticket?

If it sounds too good to be true..... :dunno:

I have an email stating

The car is yours. Let me know what time you are arriving on Monday.
I will try to get a bill of sale off to you tonight or tomorrow.

Thanks guys and congrats.

The previous email stated

Excellent!

Given what we have discussed we will take the unit - contingent on a satisfactory test drive on Monday. You spoke to my husband this afternoon and we are willing to pay the full $45K plus GST - for a total of $47,250. I will fly to Vancouver on Monday morning to test drive the unit and, if all is good, to take the car home. Mike sent you our credit card info for the deposit to hold the unit via email.

Please respond to this email to confirm your agreement - I will book my flight following confirmation.

[FraserB]

Looks like it should be an easy win?

[rage2]

So other than a couple of emails, there was no bill of sale?

[killramos]

I am no lawyer but those two emails SEEM to have all the elements of a legally binding contract?

The fact that this was done by email helps OP a ton i think as it will have seller and buyers contact ( email) listed right on them and are date, time stamped. Can't be refuted.

Personally, over 20 grand, I would run this past my lawyer. Not necessarily have them represent me in court ( esp in a different province ). But to confirm I am on good legal ground if that's the direction I want to head.

If the seller really did fuck up then he needs to learn his lesson about not reading things he is agreeing to.

[btimbit]

I dunno. You might have a leg to stand on but without that bill of sale that leg still won't get you far. You might be able to pressure the seller but as far as any actual traction in court? I'd push for the flights to get paid for but past that, don't see anything happening

[bjstare]

I'm sure he has a leg to stand on, bill of sale or not. But if you think of the hassle of actually taking this to court, and paying for a lawyer to sort it out? Very likely not worth it.

[spikerS]

Originally posted by btimbit
I dunno. You might have a leg to stand on but without that bill of sale that leg still won't get you far. You might be able to pressure the seller but as far as any actual traction in court? I'd push for the flights to get paid for but past that, don't see anything happening

He has every leg to stand on.

Every contract is an offer/conditions/acceptance. Those 2 emails back and forth have all those elements.

Now, how far can he push it? probably not very far. Shit like this has happened in the states lots, and nothing ever comes of it. I can recall about 2 years ago, some guy winning an eBay auction for a BMW, and then BMW dealer refused to sell it to him at that price. Was on jalopnik for awhile too, but I don't think anything came of that either.

I would definitely push for my plane tickets to be refunded at the very minimum, and probably for a $100 GC to a nice restaurant out there.

[killramos]

The way i look at it if OP is going to buy one of these cars anyways, and pursuing this can save him $20,000 on the car. Well $20,000 buys a fuck ton of hassle from me, buys a fuck ton of lawyer too ( if the initial consultation goes well and an actual lawyer thinks I have a case for this ).

However if OP is just generally shopping around for cars and 45k is his budget and he'll just go for something else in that range then yea not worth it. Just depends on if you want a $45,000 car or a $65,000 one.

:dunno:

I think the big debate here is whether or not the contract is enforceable, alot of points here and there on both sides of the issue in the thread. Thing is the only way that debate gets settled is by a judge, of which I am pretty sure NONE OF US are. Hence, if OP is serious about this he needs to lawyer up.

[Hallowed_point]

Originally posted by killramos
I am no lawyer but those two emails SEEM to have all the elements of a legally binding contract?

The fact that this was done by email helps OP a ton i think as it will have seller and buyers contact ( email) listed right on them and are date, time stamped. Can't be refuted.

Personally, over 20 grand, I would run this past my lawyer. Not necessarily have them represent me in court ( esp in a different province ). But to confirm I am on good legal ground if that's the direction I want to head.

If the seller really did fuck up then he needs to learn his lesson about not reading things he is agreeing to. I would think that you're right. To me, this is a legally binding contract.

[know1edge]

.

[Mitsu3000gt]

For a potential $20K what have you got to lose by contacting a lawyer and having them draft up a letter or something and see what happens?

[rage2]

Interesting read about emails being legally binding:

http://blog.bennettjones.com/2015/05/04/email-form-legally-binding-agreement-ask-canucks/

[killramos]

Yup, if you want to BS someone do it verbally. Much harder to prove.

[max_boost]

Interesting. So the buyer can still opt out pending test drive. The dealer can opt out pending ??? There has to be fine print somewhere right? haha

[vengie]

Did they credit your credit card for the deposit?? If so, they took the steps to complete the transaction under the terms agreed upon.

To me, it sounds like you definitely have a leg to stand on.

[btimbit]

Originally posted by spikerS


He has every leg to stand on.

Every contract is an offer/conditions/acceptance. Those 2 emails back and forth have all those elements.

Now, how far can he push it? probably not very far. Shit like this has happened in the states lots, and nothing ever comes of it. I can recall about 2 years ago, some guy winning an eBay auction for a BMW, and then BMW dealer refused to sell it to him at that price. Was on jalopnik for awhile too, but I don't think anything came of that either.

I would definitely push for my plane tickets to be refunded at the very minimum, and probably for a $100 GC to a nice restaurant out there.

That's.... pretty much what I said. You just typed it out more:)