Basement Electrical question

[nonofyobiz]

I'm currently working on the electrical for my basement, and i'm running cat5 cable to where the TV will go, another area that will be a desk/computer station, and the bedroom. I read somewhere that you can't run the networking cables, coax, or speaker wires beside the power cables and they should be min 2" away. I'm not sure if this is the requirement here, does anyone know what it should be?

Edit
Adding this in for anyone looking to wire their basement or garage
http://www.calgary.ca/PDA/pd/Documents/Electrical/Homeowner%20electrical%20wiring%20guide.pdf

[codetrap]

.

[FraserB]

50mm separation. I'd also go so far as to use conduit for ease of any future modifications.

Have you discovered the joys of the 2016 CEC changes regarding AFCI yet?

[nonofyobiz]

Originally posted by FraserB
50mm separation. I'd also go so far as to use conduit for ease of any future modifications.

Have you discovered the joys of the 2016 CEC changes regarding AFCI yet?

damnit ....no I Haven't.

and getting the code book won't help me, trust me on that.
:banghead:

[nonofyobiz]

So from what I can tell I need either a AFCI breaker on the panel protecting the circuit, or a receptacle type AFCI which would have to be at the first outlet on the corner circuit and the line to the box would have to be protected.

[rx7_turbo2]

I haven't even really read through the AFCI bullshit yet. I keep telling myself to pull it out and browse through it, but then literally anything else pops up and I do that instead.

[FraserB]

Originally posted by nonofyobiz
So from what I can tell I need either a AFCI breaker on the panel protecting the circuit, or a receptacle type AFCI which would have to be at the first outlet on the corner circuit and the line to the box would have to be protected.

Pretty much. Applies to all 20A and below receptacles supplying 125V. Either need the breaker in the box (~$150/each) or the first outlet in the circuit needs to be AFCI and connected to the panel with AC90 BX cable. The issue I found when trying to use an AFCI protected outlet was that I could only find 15A outlet with a 20A flow through, not the 20A outlet I wanted.

Lights don't need to be AFCI protected and circuits that have GFCI don't need it either.

This what I'm doing; two blank face protectors right at the panel, connected with 12/2 armored cable. Each of the receptacles downstream of those blank faces is wired using normal 12/2 NMD90 cable. In this configuration, I could have 11 outlets on each circuit after the blank face.

http://i220.photobucket.com/albums/dd316/fraserbrown1986/IMG_20160625_131553_zpslhmmc0er.jpg

**Not a professional electrician, not my fault if you fry yourself.

[nonofyobiz]

That makes sense and probably way cheaper way to go?

Home depot doesn't even sell the right circuit breakers. . It has to be combination type (parallel and series protection).

Are you using AFCI's or GFCI's then?

[FraserB]

I have AFCI blanks. Can't use them interchangeably as they protect against two different things.

[The_Penguin]

Originally posted by nonofyobiz
That makes sense and probably way cheaper way to go?

Home depot doesn't even sell the right circuit breakers. . It has to be combination type (parallel and series protection).

Are you using AFCI's or GFCI's then?

Home Depot are usually a ways behind. When I did a major home reno, I went to Home Depot looking for tamper proof outlets. The sales droids had no idea. I told them it's now code, and they'd best get them in stock. it was quite a while before I saw them in HD.

[gimp]

just rewired my house, you need CAFCI, AFCI are the old style and of course home depot still sells them, and they sell the CAFCI'S but they aren't listed on the website or in the electrical aisle.

ecole electric has the same CAFCI's for $20 cheaper!

[gimp]

http://www.calgary.ca/PDA/pd/Documents/Electrical/Homeowner%20electrical%20wiring%20guide.pdf

should help

[nonofyobiz]

My panel is federal pioneer stab lok and they don't even make the combination afci for that. I went to eecol and pick up 2 faceless afci's to Mount near my panel and run to my Outlets but they don't even say on them what type they are so I still don't even know if I have the right freakin thing. . This is starting to piss me off. . I've been back and forth to home depot like 4 times just for this

[FraserB]

I'm 99.9% positive my blanks didn't say CAFCI on them, it's probably just the breaker that has to be CAFCI.

Also, make sure you ground to the box for the receptacles and lights. I had to redo a bunch when I caught the mistake. And while it isn't code, looping a bit of extra wire by the box is a good idea so you have a bit of extra for the future.

Deep boxes also would have been a good idea lol.

[gimp]

on the breakers, the green test button is the old AFCI and the CAFCI has a white test button. I have no idea about the blank face protectors, quick search shows that the leviton blank face protectors are combination

http://www.leviton.com/OA_HTML/SectionDisplay.jsp?section=66013&minisite=10251

also

Only the following 15A or 20A outlets are excluded:
 Kitchen counter, island and peninsula outlets
 Kitchen refrigerator outlet
 A cord connected sump pump on a separate breaker (the sump pump must only be plugged
into a single receptacle)
 Ground fault protected outlets within 1m of a bathroom or washroom sink

even lights still need cafci protection

[FraserB]

Originally posted by gimp


even lights still need cafci protection

Lights are excluded. AFCI is only needed on circuits supplying 125V outlets rated 20A or less

[gimp]

have the code handy on this ? from my understanding there are some lights excluded but not all? maybe im wrong

[nonofyobiz]

I was told lights are excluded by the senior inspector with the city. . Also, using dead-front AFCI'S mounted beside the panel is perfectly fine vs buying the breaker. My for my panel they don't even make them.
He also said that even though the dead front doesn't say 'combination' it is a combination arc fault. . It's just the standard now I guess and there is no need to differentiate.

[codetrap]

.

[gimp]

here's the code, and I was told by an inspector that everything except kithen and gfci receptacles require afci.

(f) each branch circuit supplying 125 V receptacles rated 20 A or less shall be protected by a combination-type arc-fault circuit interrupter, except for branch circuits supplying (i) receptacles installed in accordance with (A) Rule 26-710(f); or (B) Rule 26-712(d)((i), (iii), (iv), and (v); and (ii) a single receptacle for a sump pump where (A) the receptacle is labelled in a conspicuous, legible, and permanent manner identifying it as a sump pump receptacle; and (B) the branch circuit does not supply any other receptacles; and (g) notwithstanding Item (f), the entire branch circuit need not be provided with arc-fault protection where (i) an outlet branch-circuit-type arc-fault circuit interrupter is installed at the first outlet on the branch circuit; and (ii) the wiring method for the portion of the branch circuit between the branch circuit overcurrent device and the first outlet consists of metal raceway, armoured cable, or non-metallic conduit or tubing.

[gimp]

Originally posted by FraserB


Lights are excluded. AFCI is only needed on circuits supplying 125V outlets rated 20A or less

lights are on 20a or less and 120v....

[gimp]

seems like there's conflicting opinions between inspectors, even they are confused with the afci thing lol

[FraserB]

Originally posted by gimp


lights are on 20a or less and 120v....

A light is not an outlet though.

[gimp]

Originally posted by FraserB


A light is not an outlet though.

code says receptacles though

[gimp]

im not seeing in the 2015 CEC anything about lights being excluded, i'd actually like to have clarification on this

[nonofyobiz]

Ya... Receptacles, no lights.

I put all my Receptacles on a circuit by themself protected by the dead face AFCI. Then I put the entire bedroom circuit on an AFCI protected circuit. The bathroom is on its own circuit and will have a GFCI receptacle, and the rest of the lights are on their own regular breaker. .

Inspection tmw... We'll see what happens lol

[thinmyster]

Good luck tomorrow. Did you require a building permit before you applied for your electrical permit?

[nonofyobiz]

Well the only thing he didn't like was my access to my panel. . I had to put in a 24" door in the bedroom to provide a clear path to the breaker. . That sucked... Removing the anchored down bottom plate framing... Moving a stud.... Moving electrical and data boxes and lines, having to re-run the wires because they were too short :banghead:
Also had to change out the speaker wire because I didn't buy 'in-wall' wire :banghead:

The inspector did want my bathroom receptacle on a AFCI circuit as well but I argued a little bit with him. . I told him I was going to put in a GFCI receptacle and I thought the bathroom is one of the exceptions. . He considered it and felt like he was okay with that and let it go lol

[FraserB]

My inspection is tomorrow (garage and new underground electrical service), I'll post up what they say and probably make a new thread.

[Sugarphreak]

...

[FraserB]

Passed inspection, inspector was here less than 10 minutes.

He also confirmed that lights on a non-AFCI circuit by themselves would be acceptable under code.