Low Hot Water Pressure

[dj_rice]

Recently, been noticing the hot water pressure in the house getting lower and lower. Its still enough to take a shower and use but definately compared to the cold water pressure its way too low.

And this is throughout the entire house which leads me to believe its the hot water tank.

Upon visual inspection, everything looks fine, and working fine. Its a newer updated tank I think in 2005. So I'm guessing the problem is the water outlet is clogged with calcium and whatever else blocking it.

House has PEX pipe so I don't think I need to cut and solder pipes. Do I just un-screw the outlet pipe and clean or any tips? I'm gonna drain the hot water tank first and see if that helps (first time I've done this since moving in)

[Darell_n]

2005 is ancient.

[The_Penguin]

Originally posted by dj_rice
So I'm guessing the problem is the water outlet is clogged with calcium and whatever else blocking it.

Reasonable guess. Is PEX going directly in to the water heater, or is there some copper? Ours was poly-b to copper to the fitting on the tank.
After about 9 years of service, the oultlet connection was 95% clogged with crud.

[dj_rice]

Originally posted by The_Penguin


Reasonable guess. Is PEX going directly in to the water heater, or is there some copper? Ours was poly-b to copper to the fitting on the tank.
After about 9 years of service, the oultlet connection was 95% clogged with crud.


I'll double check when I get home, I believe its PEX going to copper, to a fitting on the tank.

If thats the case, just un-loosen fitting, clean and then re-install and we're back in business?

[revelations]

I would also strongly recommend a whole house sediment filter as well for appliance and piping longevity.

[The_Penguin]

Originally posted by dj_rice



I'll double check when I get home, I believe its PEX going to copper, to a fitting on the tank.

If thats the case, just un-loosen fitting, clean and then re-install and we're back in business?

Theoretically, yes. You may need to cut the copper pipe to remove the fitting depending on the type. Also, a lot of plumbers dismiss this, but some people say that the cause of this is the dissimilar metals (copper pipe, steel fitting) When 2 dissimilar metals are touching in the presence of an electrolyte, you get a small current flow, and transfer of one metal to another (Galvanic Corrosion). The cure is to use a dielectric union.

When I fixed mine, I did this, and checked it a few years later, no sign of trouble. 'course many years later the plumbers that replaced our heaters and installed a softener, scrapped the dielectric unions, and went back to the old way. :(

[The_Penguin]

Here's the union (about $5-7 if I remember correctly.
Bonus is that you can disassemble without cutting the pipe.

[dj_rice]

Here's pics of my setup. I think it does have those union connection installed from what ur pictures look like.

http://i355.photobucket.com/albums/r470/djrice1234/IMAG0694_zpszokizpe6.jpg

http://i355.photobucket.com/albums/r470/djrice1234/IMAG0690_zpsfvtavzp5.jpg

http://i355.photobucket.com/albums/r470/djrice1234/IMAG0692_zpsv9s8x0go.jpg

[dj_rice]

Tried to shut off my main water shut off valve yesterday. Its stuck open and won't budge.

Tried shutting off the cold water flow into hot water tank valve as well. That's stuck open and won't budge. I'm hoping some Penetrating fluid will loosen it and its not ball valve inside isn't f'd and stuck.

Both valves are ball seat valves.

Tried showering yesterday and it was a bare drizzle so :banghead: :banghead:


If not, plumber we go. But if he can't shut off the water, I assume city will have to come and shut off from the street?

[revelations]

Originally posted by dj_rice
Tried to shut off my main water shut off valve yesterday. Its stuck open and won't budge.

Tried shutting off the cold water flow into hot water tank valve as well. That's stuck open and won't budge. I'm hoping some Penetrating fluid will loosen it and its not ball valve inside isn't f'd and stuck.

Both valves are ball seat valves.

Tried showering yesterday and it was a bare drizzle so :banghead: :banghead:


If not, plumber we go. But if he can't shut off the water, I assume city will have to come and shut off from the street?

You can shut it off at your WV location. Its just a big socket. We had ours shut off this summer temporarily and it was really easy.

[dj_rice]

Originally posted by revelations


You can shut it off at your WV location. Its just a big socket. We had ours shut off this summer temporarily and it was really easy.


Sorry Mar moment here but English please? :dunno:

[J-D]

Originally posted by dj_rice



Sorry Mar moment here but English please? :dunno:

I think he means Water Valve, although I know when the city started forcing water meters on older houses they had huge failure rates so they started putting the meters after the basement water shutoffs. Theoretically you could bypass the meter but I guess it's cheaper than digging up a bunch of old valves :rofl:

[dj_rice]

Penetrating fluid and some WD40 and got the shut off valves to turn.


Drained the tank. Confirmed cold water feed side was getting water. Tried to remove the brass nut on the hot side but after 10 years of no maintenance from previous owner it wasn't budging. Brute stength got it turning but I ended up cracking the brass union nut on the copper flex pipe.

But the whole dip tube connector was plugged up with rust, debris and sentiment exactly like The Penguins picture. And I believe the dip tube was rusted off as well so will need to get a new dip tube as well as a new copper flex pipe and learn how to solder but once the fix is done, i'll be good for another 10-15 years


Home owner life.

[jeffh]

Cycling your valves every 6-12 months is a good idea.

[dj_rice]

Originally posted by jeffh
Cycling your valves every 6-12 months is a good idea.

Thanks for tip. Learning so much things I have to do maintenance wise as a homeowner now. I miss my condo life :cry:

[dj_rice]

Update.


After removing the hot side connection, I bought a new Sharkbite connection, installed it but looks like it won't create a good seal on the hot side nipple as after 16 years (tank was built in 2000), some of the top thread on the nipple rusted off with the copper connection I removed.

So here I am trying to figure out a fix. I've tried using a pipe wrench but the nipple won't budge. Youtube'd some videos and put a bushing nut over it, drilled a hole through both the nut and nipple and a bolt through both and tried to crank that for more leverage but still no dice.

Tanks still good and was working and don't wanna plop down money to buy a new one just for a damaged nipple.

Any ideas?

Heres the method I'm trying. I'm just using a pipe wrench currently, Canadian Tire didn't have a big enough socket to fit over it. I think its a 38-40mm socket.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DADf5XyD_Tc&t=45s

[The_Penguin]

Did you try any penetrating oil? That's hoping the bulk of the rust is at the top.

Do you have a large pipe? Or what really works well for me is the handle off of my floor jack.
Put it over the end of the wrench, mucho leverage.

[dj_rice]

Finally got it to budge. Installed new nipple and connection and we're all good there



But now I can't get the pilot light to stay lit. Followed instructions and pilot just shuts off. If it's not one thing it's another lol.

[The_Penguin]

If it's the turn to pilot, push in, click button type, how long are you holding it? sometimes it takes 20 seconds or so to really get the thermocouple working.

[dj_rice]

Originally posted by The_Penguin
If it's the turn to pilot, push in, click button type, how long are you holding it? sometimes it takes 20 seconds or so to really get the thermocouple working.

I don't have the electronic ignition. Old fashioned lighter method. But I turn to pilot push in and wait 60 seconds. The pilot button does push back up but pilot just dies.

Ill try holding it longer and see if that heats up the thermocouple. Unless I need a new one but pilot was still working when I shut off the gas. It has been sitting for a week un touched


If I'm understanding it correctly the thermocouple is what activates the gas valve? Cause if I push down and light and pilot lights that means I'm getting gas but releasing the button the thermocouple should kick in and keep gas flowing

[The_Penguin]

Originally posted by dj_rice



If I'm understanding it correctly the thermocouple is what activates the gas valve? Cause if I push down and light and pilot lights that means I'm getting gas but releasing the button the thermocouple should kick in and keep gas flowing

Don't quote me verbatim, I'm a computer guy. I only play plumber at home occasionally.
My understanding is when you push the pilot control in, it turns on das flow to the pilot.
IF the thermocouple senses enough heat, it tells the gas valve to leave gas flowing to the pilot when you release the control.

[dj_rice]

Originally posted by The_Penguin


Don't quote me verbatim, I'm a computer guy. I only play plumber at home occasionally.
My understanding is when you push the pilot control in, it turns on das flow to the pilot.
IF the thermocouple senses enough heat, it tells the gas valve to leave gas flowing to the pilot when you release the control.


I'm fairly certain you correct and from what I've read online and Youtube. I'm guessing its my therocoupler. I'm gonna borrow a multi-meter from work and light the pilot and test the voltage and see.

If that doesn't work, its gonna be an expensive Christmas for me :) but its due time.

[The_Penguin]

It'll have to be a pretty good multimeter, it's a very low voltage.

[dj_rice]

Originally posted by The_Penguin
It'll have to be a pretty good multimeter, it's a very low voltage.

Considering the thermocouple is $10, I'm just gonna replace it and see if that fixes it. No point in testing it since so cheap.


Hopefully I can just remove the thermocouple only, all videos on Youtube show removing the gas lines to control valve as well. I don't wanna mess with the gas

[dj_rice]

Changed out the thermocouple today to a new Honeywell unit I grabbed from Rona. $8 was easy peasy to do. Youtube is great.

But no dice, pilot still goes out. I think the magnet in the control valve is done. Might be time to pay the piper.

[jeffh]

How old is the tank? Gas valve may still be on warranty (8-10yr) as they cost around 200-300. Labour won't be on warranty tho.

[dj_rice]

Originally posted by jeffh
How old is the tank? Gas valve may still be on warranty (8-10yr) as they cost around 200-300. Labour won't be on warranty tho.



From the Serial# and checking on John Woods website, it shows manufacture date of Sept 2000. So that makes the tank 16 years old which most likely means its the same tank from the house was originally built :eek:

[The_Penguin]

Originally posted by dj_rice




. So that makes the tank 16 years old which most likely means its the same tank from the house was originally built :eek:

Yeah our tanks were 1998 or 1999, so we decided to replace them while we were getting a softener installed. I think these days 15 + years on a tank is getting up there, and short of draining it and sending an endoscope down inside, you'll not really know if it's about to blow out a rusted spot..

At least you tried, and probably learned a bit in the process :)

[dj_rice]

Originally posted by The_Penguin


Yeah our tanks were 1998 or 1999, so we decided to replace them while we were getting a softener installed. I think these days 15 + years on a tank is getting up there, and short of draining it and sending an endoscope down inside, you'll not really know if it's about to blow out a rusted spot..

At least you tried, and probably learned a bit in the process :)


I actually learned alot. Now I'll be prepared for when my new tank has issues down the road. I guess I'll remove the new nipple and thermocouple and save it for the new tank in the future.


Thanks all for your help. Not sure what brand of water heaer I'm gonna go with though. Home Depot has Rheem. Rona has Giant. Lowes has Whirlpool and GSW.

Action Furnace has a $999 40 Gallon installed, I just called and they use a Bradford White, but the warranty is low. 5 years parts and labour warranty.

For tanks, what are ya'll buying in terms of length of water. 12 year too much?

[spike98]

Originally posted by dj_rice



I actually learned alot. Now I'll be prepared for when my new tank has issues down the road. I guess I'll remove the new nipple and thermocouple and save it for the new tank in the future.


Thanks all for your help. Not sure what brand of water heaer I'm gonna go with though. Home Depot has Rheem. Rona has Giant. Lowes has Whirlpool and GSW.

Action Furnace has a $999 40 Gallon installed, I just called and they use a Bradford White, but the warranty is low. 5 years parts and labour warranty.

For tanks, what are ya'll buying in terms of length of water. 12 year too much?

With what you learned going through this process, you can EASILY install one yourself. Save the cash.

[dj_rice]

Originally posted by spike98


With what you learned going through this process, you can EASILY install one yourself. Save the cash.

Ehhh I'm not too comfortable with the installing the gas lines aspect of it. Removing the thermocouple and burner out is one thing but a whole tank is another. I'm sure soapy water would determine if I messed up during install and theres a leak but...


My neighbor works for Jetco Mechanical, says Plumbing/Pipe Fitting, Hot Water tanks on his truck. Gonna be friendly and see if he wants to install a new tank for me and pay him cash.

[dj_rice]

Went to Home Depot. Looked at the pricing of the tanks. Not bad.

$630 For a Rheem Performance Plus with 9 Year Warranty Tank And Parts. 1 Year Limited Labour Warranty.

But they team up with Friesens as their contractor. Install price $425-475 and it was a weekend when I went so $65 extra on top. Quite steep. And Friesens reviews online aren't very good either

Also Lowes is having a sales event where spend $500+, save 15%. Going to try and see if HD will PM this offer and pick up the tank myself and hire a Kijiji plumber $200 to install.