Solar panel roads trial in Calgary

[speedog]

Solar panel roads trial in Calgary - link (http://business.financialpost.com/news/energy/solar-panel-roads-to-be-built-on-four-continents-in-2017-with-calgary-next-in-line?__lsa=0cac-5ae4). Will be interesting to see how well this performs here.

[ExtraSlow]

solar all the things!

[Sugarphreak]

....

[slinkie]

this seems really gimmicky and stupid to me, although i'm not familiar with solar

so they won't work when there's traffic, dirt, or snow covering them. When they break down or are damaged, the road will be closed. And to top it all off, kids will probably vandalize them

This isn't manhattan or something, we have endless flat brown nothingness in every direction, is space really at such a premium that we need to put the panels in the roads? Wouldn't it be more optimal to place them on top of schools or out of town?

[sexualbanana]

Calgary gets the most sunlight in the country, so why not give it a shot. It's not like a it's a wholesale switch.

[The_Penguin]

This guy is a bit well.... enthusiastic, which some people enjoy, others are put off by, but he's pretty smart bloke when it comes to electronics engineering.
He seems to think it's not viable.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=obS6TUVSZds

[Silviawannab]

Very cool. I'm really excited about the solar roof too.

Exciting and interesting times.

[beyond_ban]

a) How will they handle snow plows and gravel/salt in the winter?
b) Pot hole resistant? Smooth roads just like Phoenix? :love:

[The_Penguin]

And a small "implementation" in Idaho

https://www.eevblog.com/2016/10/18/eevblog-935-solar-roadways-installation-busted/

[NoPulp]

I was just having a conversation with my dad about solar power. We use it a ton at our work for irrigation control. Solar power has come a long long way recently. He went to a conference for solar power recently and was telling me some of it.

German is the world leader for solar power. A way to rate locations is how many KW you can produce from a W per year. A good goal is 1. German is about 0.8 and Alberta is actually 1.2. Alberta is actually a very good place for solar power. Efficiency is affected by the amount of sunlight but also the temperature, so we are better than a place like Arizona.

Depend on the incentives that you get solar will pay itself off in about 12 years but can be as low as 8. The panels typically have 25 year warranty (being 80% effective). So the pay off isn't the best, yet.

There is a huge push for solar power here and you'll see more farms in the near future.

[HiTempguy1]

A lot of people also dont understand that solar panels also are self clearing of snow and ice (angle and design dependent of course).

Solar is most certainly THE renewable resource to embrace. It just shouldnt be rushed towards blindly.

[Gestalt]

Solar is a no brainer.

I wonder if we ever use enough solar, that we can cause global cooling, because the suns energy is now not absorbed or reflected, but used to do work.

[The_Penguin]

Solar is definitely the future for sure, and improvements are coming fast and furious.
But, it's not the holy grail just yet.

[BigMass]

Solar is the future and government involvement is necessary when scientific advancements get ahead of poor human social and economic structures. Human morals, ethics and ideas always lag behind scientific advancements, so we need government to take the role of subsidizing that which is not currently profitable but obviously necessary for future human flourishing and well being. Technology always has to start from some point where the costs are originally astronomical and not economically viable, but the continued advancements and scientific discoveries are a boon for societal advancement and eventually economically viable and furthermore superior. CERN is not a money maker but we owe the, "Internet" to it's existence. More people need to think about that. This is why libertarian economic ideals are completely bankrupt in modern society.

[kertejud2]

Originally posted by beyond_ban
a) How will they handle snow plows and gravel/salt in the winter?


From the article:

A subsidiary of Bouygues SA has designed rugged solar panels, capable of withstand the weight of an 18-wheeler truck, that they’re now building into road surfaces. After nearly five years of research and laboratory tests, they’re constructing 100 outdoor test sites...

Followed by:

“We need to test for all kinds of different traffic and climate conditions,” Harelle said. “I want to find the limits of it. We think that maybe it will not be able to withstand a snow plow.”



So in short: if they knew, they probably wouldn't need to do a trial.

[beyond_ban]

Originally posted by kertejud2


From the article:

A subsidiary of Bouygues SA has designed rugged solar panels, capable of withstand the weight of an 18-wheeler truck, that they’re now building into road surfaces. After nearly five years of research and laboratory tests, they’re constructing 100 outdoor test sites...

Followed by:

“We need to test for all kinds of different traffic and climate conditions,” Harelle said. “I want to find the limits of it. We think that maybe it will not be able to withstand a snow plow.”



So in short: if they knew, they probably wouldn't need to do a trial.

I was asking rhetorically, as in i am curious to see how it holds up.

[revelations]

Originally posted by The_Penguin
And a small "implementation" in Idaho

https://www.eevblog.com/2016/10/18/eevblog-935-solar-roadways-installation-busted/

Holy fuck, I hope the CoC isnt planning on using the same product/vendor here.

[sexualbanana]

Originally posted by BigMass
Solar is the future and government involvement is necessary when scientific advancements get ahead of poor human social and economic structures. Human morals, ethics and ideas always lag behind scientific advancements, so we need government to take the role of subsidizing that which is not currently profitable but obviously necessary for future human flourishing and well being. Technology always has to start from some point where the costs are originally astronomical and not economically viable, but the continued advancements and scientific discoveries are a boon for societal advancement and eventually economically viable and furthermore superior. CERN is not a money maker but we owe the, "Internet" to it's existence. More people need to think about that. This is why libertarian economic ideals are completely bankrupt in modern society.

Isn't that the basis of most nationalized infrastructure programs? ie. telephone, electric grid, etc?

I think AGT was a government-run company before it was privatized. If I remember correctly.

[flipstah]

No pothole means I'm for it.

[speedog]

Originally posted by sexualbanana


Isn't that the basis of most nationalized infrastructure programs? ie. telephone, electric grid, etc?

I think AGT was a government-run company before it was privatized. If I remember correctly.

Well AGT was the abbreviated form of Alberta Government Telephones so yupp, you are remembering correctly and I was there from the government owned entity to what it's become today.

[Gestalt]

Originally posted by sexualbanana


Isn't that the basis of most nationalized infrastructure programs? ie. telephone, electric grid, etc?

I think AGT was a government-run company before it was privatized. If I remember correctly.

Absolutely. TAx payers create, build, risk at times when something may not be feasable or profitable. Once its proven, big business steps in to make it even better.

[Sugarphreak]

...

[ercchry]

Originally posted by kertejud2


From the article:

A subsidiary of Bouygues SA has designed rugged solar panels, capable of withstand the weight of an 18-wheeler truck, that they’re now building into road surfaces. After nearly five years of research and laboratory tests, they’re constructing 100 outdoor test sites...

Followed by:

“We need to test for all kinds of different traffic and climate conditions,” Harelle said. “I want to find the limits of it. We think that maybe it will not be able to withstand a snow plow.”



So in short: if they knew, they probably wouldn't need to do a trial.

I thought these things were supposed to heat up, so no need for plows, salt, or gravel :dunno:

[theken]

Originally posted by Sugarphreak


Only if they can get rid of frost jacking! Forget snow plows, frost is the #1 destroyer of roads in Calgary.

Best way to get smooth roads just like Phoenix is burn coal, get yourself a nice big truck or SUV, and crank the heat in your house. The sooner global warming gets here, the sooner we can start living the good life!

One day it will come... just like they said it would 15 years ago.... sure it snowed in Tokyo for the first time in 50 years... but THAT IS JUST WEATHER PEOPLE, IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE CLIMATE! Climate change can only come when the CBC announces it, as there are no visible cues. that's first snowfall in November, not the first snowfall...seasons are weird aren't they

[Sugarphreak]

...

[revelations]

Originally posted by ercchry


I thought these things were supposed to heat up, so no need for plows, salt, or gravel :dunno:

According to the video posted above - it cant do anything besides shine some dim LEDS that are only visible after sunset.

[beyond_ban]

Originally posted by Sugarphreak


Only if they can get rid of frost jacking! Forget snow plows, frost is the #1 destroyer of roads in Calgary.

Best way to get smooth roads just like Phoenix is burn coal, get yourself a nice big truck or SUV, and crank the heat in your house. The sooner global warming gets here, the sooner we can start living the good life!


While i do agree that frost heaves are what destroy our roads, these panels would have to be a lot sturdier than their asphalt counterparts which should theoretically result in smoother roads.

[Seth1968]

Wattway layers several types of plastics to create a clear and durable casing.

Plastics created from what?

Never mind every other idiotic aspects to the scheme.

Like I've said, I was "into" reducing general pollution long before the hipsters corrupted the whole thing.

Call me ignorant all you want, but I'm not against capitalism, vaccinations, or your porn addiction.

I'm against all those gone awry. But I guess that's subjective.

[ercchry]

Originally posted by revelations


According to the video posted above - it cant do anything besides shine some dim LEDS that are only visible after sunset.

Yeah these are the ones I'm thinking of... seems way better, but it's been a couple years, wonder what happened to them?

qlTA3rnpgzU

[Gestalt]

Plastics in North America are mainly from plant sources.

[thetransporter]

being Calgary i can see this happening:

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[mazdavirgin]

Originally posted by Sugarphreak


Wait hang on... are you referring to seasons as the result of weather patterns, or seasons as climate change impacts?

I know the hipsters have said it is wrong to compare weather to climate change, as the two are totally separate from one another. But I am not sure if a change in seasonal patterns is allowed to be related to climate change.

I do feel a bit betrayed though, there are at least 100 blogs out there now claiming the snow is a climate change phenomenon. It is like they can't even follow their own protocols around what is and isn't acceptable as evidence. Almost like they are hypocrites that only accept evidence if it is in their favour or something.

You do know that there's a difference between actual science and blog posts right? Antropogenic climate change is pretty much unarguable frankly. The data shows clear warming trends coinciding with industrialization thinking otherwise is just denial.

Will it result in the end of days or the apocalypse? No, the planet will adapt it's been a lot warmer than it is now in the past... Will it result in long term consequences for low lying countries. Yeah... Should we stop extracting oil etc...? No since there's no alternative at the moment other than returning to the 1800's. Does it mean we should stop burning fossil fuels and move to nuclear? Yeah thats probably the correct long term approach here to try to stabalize the climate and not cause quite a few pacific islands to sink.

[Supa Dexta]

Gimmicky shit. Throw up a regular solar panel farm if you want to throw money in this direction.

[suntan]

Things like solar and wind are simply feel good initiatives that really do nothing to help the environment.

[ZenOps]

Not really all that practical in Canada.

Arguably, the best orientation of a solar panel as you move further from the equator is straight vertical pointing southward. In fact, if you have ever seen a solar powered traffic redirector in Calgary, you will notice quickly that its not flat, its usually straight up and down pointing south.

Placing it horizontal, is fine for New Mexico, Arizona, and California.

[Xtrema]

$30-$80/m2 for asphalt

$2500/m2 for this BS.

It generate 200w/m2 in best scenario, (probably less than 1/2 after you rough up the glass for traffic), so it generate 0.1kwh or around 1 penny/hr, $29/year, ROI is 87 years?

How would anyone think we will get $ back at all is astounding.

[sexualbanana]

Im wondering what kind of effect this will have on traction.

[Sugarphreak]

...

[beyond_ban]

Originally posted by Sugarphreak


I don't know, frost can tear apart reinforced concrete fairly easily in Alberta. Either you make it flexible enough to take 3-4" of movement, or you have to pile it with void form under which would be rediculously expensive.

Should just go nuclear up North and sell power to the rest of Canada to diversify the economy

If these panels damage as easily as asphalt, thereis no chance that they ever get approved for mass use due to the ridiculous up front costs associated - as posted above by Xtrema. At over 30x the cost, they better last longer or else these roads may as well be made out of gold bricks.