Roddy's common automotive myths part 1

[Diocletian]

There are a lot of automotive myths going around the forums that need to be exposed. I ran this a couple years ago with great success. Here is a list to get things started off:

1. An automatic transmission can never have too much cooling
2. Pushrod engines make more torque
3. More gears are always better
4. Replacing body panels in a collision is preferable as it eliminates filler
5. Rotors warp

[Darell_n]

Boost makes power.

[killramos]

Myth: The only thing that matters when buying a car is reliability

Myth: Cars are an investment

[J-hop]

Unfortunately I’ve heard this one spouted more than once by people asked to explain the difference between conventional and synthetic oil

MYTH: synthetic oil’s viscosity increases with temperature

[01RedDX]

.

[bjstare]

Myth: The only thing that matters when buying a car is reliability

Myth: Cars are an investment

Ha. Nice.

[ExtraSlow]

Amsoil is good oil and the people selling it are sharing unbiased assistance to make your life better.

[Skrilla]

This sick cold air intake makes 35HP bruh... :rolleyes:

[gretz]

4WD and AWD is better in the winter all round

[G-ZUS]

The 2 better tires go on the front (fwd)

[mzdspd]

4WD and AWD is better in the winter all round

To add to this...

4WD/AWD stop better in the winter

[J-hop]

MYTH: the people doing your oil change at a minute lube are Licensed ASTs.

No actually most have no prior automotive experience.

[mr2mike]

4WD and AWD is better in the winter all round

Truth: AWD's and 4WD's hit the highway ditches sooner and more frequently in the winter than FWD.

MYTH: Reading car forums makes you a tuner and mechanic.

[firebane]

Myth: Peopke know lots about vehicles
Fact: Peopke know crap about vehicles

[ShermanEF9]

Amsoil is good oil and the people selling it are sharing unbiased assistance to make your life better.

This. I hate how people have such a hard on for amsoil. i don't get it at all.

MYTH: using synthetic every 3000 miles prevents timing chain issues in 12 gen f150s.

[revelations]

Myth: dealerships are the best place to get your vehicle service.

Dealerships only care about profit and time on lift. Less time = more profit. Same for their mechanics too. You might end up going back 2-3x to a dealer for something an independent shop could find at first visit by spending a touch more time looking around.

[J-hop]

This. I hate how people have such a hard on for amsoil. i don't get it at all.

MYTH: using synthetic every 3000 miles prevents timing chain issues in 12 gen f150s.

On the topic of ford

MYTH: it’s ok to use seafoam or other induction cleaning products on the ecoboost engines.

[speedog]

Snow tires will enable a driver to navigate winter streets better.

[killramos]

Snow tires will enable a driver to navigate winter streets better.

:rofl:

[revelations]

SUVs are safer


Large vehicles have an advantage over small cars in a head on situation, but many angle collisions the SUVs will tend to flip on their head.
Similarly, large high-centre of gravity vehicles are now very common on the road so any advantage of perceived safety is reduced.

Also, with regards to single vehicle accidents, in inclement weather where the laws of physics always wins with respect to corners and stopping, the trucks and SUVS are the first to lose.

[ExtraSlow]

The less a vehicle is damaged in a collision the safer it is.

Yeah, we should all be driving 1970's boats because they can take a hit. Face-palm

[SkiBum5.0]

Myth: warming up a car in winter for 10+ minutes is good for the vehicle

Better Myth: putting your tailgate down improves fuel economy

Betterer Myth: 0% financing is always worth it

[Mitsu3000gt]

Myth: warming up a car in winter for 10+ minutes is good for the vehicle

Better Myth: putting your tailgate down improves fuel economy

Betterer Myth: 0% financing is always worth it

That first myth is something I think most people do not realize. Car starters are bad for your car if it's -20 or whatever outside - your whole car needs to warm up, not just the engine, and the best way to do that is drive it gently. I live around a bunch of people who let their cars run for like 10-15 mins, hop in, and speed off like it's +30 out. Or just lease and let er rip :rofl:

When is 0% financing not worth it? Not saying you're wrong, just curious. Anyone can make more than 0% on their money in investments or even the shittiest bank savings account so I am wondering when it would be preferable not to take 0% if you are financing/purchasing?

[Swank]

MYTH: Higher octane fuel improves mileage and increases horsepower
MYTH: Rear wheels follow the same path as front wheel in a turn

[Seth1968]

MYTH: Higher octane fuel improves mileage and increases horsepower

It's also "cleaner" which makes the engine cleaner.:)

[J-hop]

MYTH: cheap gas stations water down their fuel to make more money.

[Mostwanted]

MYTH: Keeping your car waxed and clean improves MPG

[BerserkerCatSplat]

There are a lot of automotive myths going around the forums that need to be exposed. I ran this a couple years ago with great success. Here is a list to get things started off:
5. Rotors warp

Never heard of warping rotors being a myth, what's the fact here?

[Tik-Tok]

Never heard of warping rotors being a myth, what's the fact here?

I think it's that a rotor doesn't technically warp (as in twist, or bend), but some area's just get more worn out than others.

[revelations]

Never heard of warping rotors being a myth, what's the fact here?

http://www.stoptech.com/technical-support/technical-white-papers/-warped-brake-disc-and-other-myths

Also cementite buildup can cause a "warped" sensation.

[BerserkerCatSplat]

Yeah I came across that link as well, but it seems more targeted at high-performance situations where pad/rotor temps are getting tremendously high and could lead to the cementite mentioned. I've measured increased parallel runout on a small city-driven car, on a single side with both rotors replaced 2 months previously. Perhaps cheap Chinese rotors can indeed warp if they were not properly heat-treated in the factory, while quality components will only experience juddering from uneven wear or buildup.

[Hallowed_point]

All fwds torque steer like crazy.

[HiTempguy1]

I think it's that a rotor doesn't technically warp (as in twist, or bend), but some area's just get more worn out than others.

Its not more worn out, its brake pad buildup. Can especially happen if the brakes are cold and a sudden, hard stop occurs and then the brake pedal is not released, cooking the pad to the rotor.

Myth: This thread is in any sense factually correct. Lots of wrong in here :rofl:

[Tik-Tok]

Its not more worn out, its brake pad buildup.

So a rotors minimum thickness limit is just the manufacturer propagating the myth?

[J-hop]

Its not more worn out, its brake pad buildup. Can especially happen if the brakes are cold and a sudden, hard stop occurs and then the brake pedal is not released, cooking the pad to the rotor.

Myth: This thread is in any sense factually correct. Lots of wrong in here :rofl:

An improperly torqued wheel will put a rotor out of true which is the cause of a large portion of the street use vehicles “warped rotors”. Technically the disc is warped but yea it’s not exactly in the way people think.

[HiTempguy1]

So a rotors minimum thickness limit is just the manufacturer propagating the myth?

What does that have to do with anything? You said some areas of the rotor wear more than others. I can assure you, in 95% of "rotor warp" cases, it has nothing to do with rotor wear or "warping". Its pad transfer buildup being unevenly distributed. It's a myth that the reason why getting rotors turned will just have them warp again right away because there is less material, no the reason is that whatever caused the pad transfer the first time is still happening (ie dumb drivers who don't know any better).


An improperly torqued wheel will put a rotor out of true which is the cause of a large portion of the street use vehicles “warped rotors”. Technically the disc is warped but yea it’s not exactly in the way people think.

No... just no. Did you learn that from watching an episode of shadetree mechanic? :rofl:

[J-hop]

What does that have to do with anything? You said some areas of the rotor wear more than others. I can assure you, in 95% of "rotor warp" cases, it has nothing to do with rotor wear or "warping". Its pad transfer buildup being unevenly distributed. It's a myth that the reason why getting rotors turned will just have them warp again right away because there is less material, no the reason is that whatever caused the pad transfer the first time is still happening (ie dumb drivers who don't know any better).



No... just no. Did you learn that from watching an episode of shadetree mechanic? :rofl:

So you believe you can torque 2 lugs, leave the others completely loose and the rotor will wear evenly?

[kenny]

When is 0% financing not worth it?

When it makes you ineligible for cash back offers.

[HiTempguy1]

So you believe you can torque 2 lugs, leave the others completely loose and the rotor will wear evenly?

So you believe that having three flush metal objects (a rim hub face, a rotor hat, and a wheel hub) bolted together will somehow cause a rotor to permanently warp or affect wear? Do you know anything about metallurgy and basic physics? :rofl:


When it makes you ineligible for cash back offers.

FFS, I get that this is Beyond ballerz, but seriously, you can probably peg new car customers as 90% of them get financing. Fuck this place is so god damn snobby sometimes. I know about 5 people who could go and drop down $30k in cash right now on a car, and most wouldn't even with the cash back offers. Beyond has never provided a reasonable explanation to do so for normal plebs.

[Darell_n]

Myth: warming up a car in winter for 10+ minutes is good for the vehicle.

It’s great for the windshield and the kids down the street that don’t get run over at -20. My vehicles can idle and warm up. Safety trumps environment or economics.

[J-hop]

So you believe that having three flush metal objects (a rim hub face, a rotor hat, and a wheel hub) bolted together will somehow cause a rotor to permanently warp or affect wear? Do you know anything about metallurgy and basic physics? :rofl:

Answer the question, you’re saying even torque doesn’t matter? If that’s true than I assume you don’t torque in a star pattern, that would be silly once you’ve got the wheel flush if that’s true.

Btw what does metallurgy have to do with even torque haha.

[speedog]

MYTH: Rear wheels follow the same path as front wheel in a turn

Hah, mine do but I drift every corner.

[killramos]

Myth: You are able to drive the Transcanada from Alberta to BC without 400+ HP

[Seth1968]

It’s great for the windshield and the kids down the street that don’t get run over at -20. My vehicles can idle and warm up. Safety trumps environment or economics.

So true. It makes me wonder if the people who say this even live in Canada:)

In addition, I don't think it's too safe to be driving while shivering.

[Hallowed_point]

Myth: You are able to drive the Transcanada from Alberta to BC without 400+ HP Pretty much accurate tbh.

[mr2mike]

So true. It makes me wonder if the people who say this even live in Canada:)

In addition, I don't think it's too safe to be driving while shivering.
Obviously not dressing appropriately for the weather. Break down and you'll only be under dressed once.

[Mitsu3000gt]

When it makes you ineligible for cash back offers.

I think that goes without saying though. If you can get the car cheaper by taking cash incentives and using money from another source whose interest will not be greater than the cash discount, that is what you would probably do. Or if you can make more on your investments than the interest charges from borrowing the money from your next cheapest source, that's good too. I assume (and hope) that most people know that and that is the norm.

I took the original comment to mean that all else being equal, there might be instances where you wouldn't want 0% financing in which case I don't think that is true. I made the assumption that the buyer is going with the cheapest option already.

[Sugarphreak]

...

[ExtraSlow]

I'd say for your average couple with kids and a million other things happening in thier lives there's some real value in simplifying thier finances. So if you can pay cash for a vehicle and not have that payment every month you may be forgoing some opportunities for investing but it's highly likely that you wouldn't be optimizing that anyway.

If investing is a hobby that's totally different, but that's not typical at all.

[Mitsu3000gt]

The reason I warm my car up is because cold oil is as thick as molasses and doesn't circulate well until it warms. At low idle RPM's you are not really putting a strain on anything, but if you start forcing your engine into higher rpm's you are putting stress on engine components that have to fight to move the oil around, in addition to running with less lubrication. I want nice warm flowable oil running to my turbo before I go anywhere, not ice cold syrup.


Don't good synthetic oils have a pour point of like -40C? I wouldn't think it would have any trouble lubricating on start up.

[Hallowed_point]

Don't good synthetic oils have a pour point of like -40C? I wouldn't think it would have any trouble lubricating on start up.

Yes. And also, you risk diluting your oil with moisture if you let it idle for 10 minutes with no load.

[ercchry]

Can we got back to brake rotors please?! Come on people, stop getting back on track

If all vibrations from brakes are from pad build up... then how come when you turn rotors to resurface does it it many passes till you have an even, smooth surface around the whole thing?!

[Seth1968]

Yes. And also, you risk diluting your oil with moisture if you let it idle for 10 minutes with no load.

That's the common argument for not letting your cold engine idle for a few minutes.

Is there any evidence to support that argument?

[mzdspd]

I always warm my cars up for 5~10 minutes. I've read the peer reviewed climate change shocker stories that pop up ever so often that proposes this is a myth. Experts of every field testifying about how gasoline washes away the oil and strips the cylinder seats, and how modern fuel injected motors don't need it... I just don't buy it.

The reason I warm my car up is because cold oil is as thick as molasses and doesn't circulate well until it warms. At low idle RPM's you are not really putting a strain on anything, but if you start forcing your engine into higher rpm's you are putting stress on engine components that have to fight to move the oil around, in addition to running with less lubrication. I want nice warm flowable oil running to my turbo before I go anywhere, not ice cold syrup.

This article on Jalopnik pretty much sums up my feeling about it:
https://jalopnik.com/yes-warm-your-damn-car-up-if-its-cold-1678251730


You are comparing peer reviewed articles to a jalopnik article with no sources or references :nut::rofl:

But seriously, I think most of us can agree that we let our cars warm up for 10-20 minutes because we want to get into a warm car. Modern synthetics have a pour point in the -40C range so even when I do not warm my car up on a cold day, I just use common sense and keep the rpms low until its at a warmer operating temp.

https://mobiloil.com/en/motor-oils/mobil-super/mobil-super-synthetic

[Tik-Tok]

That's the common argument for not letting your cold engine idle for a few minutes.

Is there any evidence to support that argument?

It's probably a legit argument in a humid area. Not in Alberta, where it's dry as a popcorn fart.

[ercchry]

It's probably a legit argument in a humid area. Not in Alberta, where it's dry as a popcorn fart.


And when normal operating oil temp is about double the boiling point of water... :dunno:

[killramos]

Do you guys also shut off their cars when they are stopped in traffic for more than a couple minutes for an accident or a train if they are so concerned about idling damaging their engine?

How about when you are picking someone up and waiting outside in the cold?

Personally i don't see how letting your car turn over for a few minutes when the oil, while pourable, is cold and thick as molasses... Bonus points for being more comfortable to sit in when the heat actually works.

I am personally far more concerned about start stop cycles than minutes idling.

:rolleyes:

[revelations]

I always warm my cars up for 5~10 minutes. I've read the peer reviewed climate change shocker stories that pop up ever so often that proposes this is a myth. Experts of every field testifying about how gasoline washes away the oil and strips the cylinder seats, and how modern fuel injected motors don't need it... I just don't buy it.

The reason I warm my car up is because cold oil is as thick as molasses and doesn't circulate well until it warms. At low idle RPM's you are not really putting a strain on anything, but if you start forcing your engine into higher rpm's you are putting stress on engine components that have to fight to move the oil around, in addition to running with less lubrication. I want nice warm flowable oil running to my turbo before I go anywhere, not ice cold syrup.
?

Its one thing to allow your car (engine coolant temperature) to reach a certain threshold, but its another thing to wait around for 10 minutes.

For eg. I let the coolant temp hit 15c before I start driving. Usually only takes 2-3 minutes in -20c. I also use 0w20 oil which pours very well in arctic conditions. I also turn on my seat heat so that the heat comes from within, rather than from the car, which allows the car to warm up faster.

- - - Updated - - -


Do you guys also shut off their cars when they are stopped in traffic for more than a couple minutes for an accident or a train if they are so concerned about idling damaging their engine?

How about when you are picking someone up and waiting outside in the cold?

Personally i don't see how letting your car turn over for a few minutes when the oil, while pourable, is cold and thick as molasses... Bonus points for being more comfortable to sit in when the heat actually works.

I am personally far more concerned about start stop cycles than minutes idling.

:rolleyes:

If its not cold, I generally shut off my engine if I am going to be waiting more than a few minutes (eg. freight train crossing). My car uses about 1$ of gas per hour at idle so its not like im saving $$$.

[J-hop]

And when normal operating oil temp is about double the boiling point of water... :dunno:

Actually it’s not, F to C conversion ;)

[Tik-Tok]

And when normal operating oil temp is about double the boiling point of water... :dunno:

Not everyone has a long enough commute for the oil temp to get up there though. My neighbor parks outside and drives 2 minutes to Tim Hortons and back every day.

[ercchry]

Actually it’s not, F to C conversion ;)

fine... AT the boiling point of water :rofl:

[J-hop]

fine... AT the boiling point of water :rofl:
:thumbsup:

Yea I agree with what you’re saying. I used to think it mattered but the level of additional engine wear is so negligible.

[J-hop]

Here’s a good one that is making the rounds on Facebook again:

Myth: headrests were purposely designed as removable and sharp to break a window in the event of a rollover/submerged vehicle

Truth: while yes it is possible to break a car window with the pointy part of the headrest this is not an intentional design nor is it even practical advice (yea you know it’s soooo easy to remove a headrest even when you’re right side up, calm and can maneuver well....not)

[revelations]

Here’s a good one that is making the rounds on Facebook again:

Myth: headrests were purposely designed as removable and sharp to break a window in the event of a rollover/submerged vehicle

Truth: while yes it is possible to break a car window with the pointy part of the headrest this is not an intentional design nor is it even practical advice (yea you know it’s soooo easy to remove a headrest even when you’re right side up, calm and can maneuver well....not)

Haha, thats pretty funny. On that note, I keep a seatbelt cutter/window shatter tool at drivers reach though.

[J-hop]

Haha, thats pretty funny. On that note, I keep a seatbelt cutter/window shatter tool at drivers reach though.

Yea that’s a good plan.

I double face palm every time that one goes around. I have enough trouble getting the headrests out of my Jetta when I’m standing half out of the car with good leverage. I can’t imagine trying to do that upside down and/or after being struck in the face by an airbag. These people obviously have never tried it!

[Tik-Tok]

Haha, thats pretty funny. On that note, I keep a seatbelt cutter/window shatter tool at drivers reach though.

I've got one in each of our vehicles too, but often wonder if it isn't going to go flying off into an unreachable area during a rollover scenario. I've never had a center console, or even glove box that was secure unless locked with a key.

[g-m]

There are a lot of automotive myths going around the forums that need to be exposed. I ran this a couple years ago with great success. Here is a list to get things started off:

1. An automatic transmission can never have too much cooling
2. Pushrod engines make more torque
3. More gears are always better
4. Replacing body panels in a collision is preferable as it eliminates filler
5. Rotors warp

You knew this would happen. Good job