Hobby Welding

[phreezee]

I bought a simple SMAW welder from Princess Auto and want to start learning how to weld.

Does anybody have recommendations on where to get steel tubing and plates locally?

I also thought about building what I need out of Extruded Aluminum T-Slot Bars if that is available locally for a reasonable price.

81141

[never]

Federal Metals for inexpensive steel products. Metal Supermarkets has a wide range of stuff but usually isn't cheap.

[mr2mike]

Metal Supermarket has some scraps at the front but you still have to pay for them.
Having gone down the route you're about to. It's harder than it looks, read and read the welding sites.
Also a fellow beyonder was nice enough to help me through some of my hangups by sending pics of the welds and he'd offer advice.

Steel tubing is easier to practice on. Sheet metal or autobody, you're likely to blow right through it the first couple of tries.

Don't go T-Slot bars. Once you get the hang of welding, it'll go way quicker than bolting together metal.

[phreezee]

Thanks for the advice! Metal Supermarkets came up 1st in my Google search, so I'm glad I asked and will try Federal Metals first to compare pricing.

Is the pricing for electrodes/rods pretty standard everywhere of is there a cheaper place to buy them? Any recommendations for or against specific brands?

[firebane]

Thanks for the advice! Metal Supermarkets came up 1st in my Google search, so I'm glad I asked and will try Federal Metals first to compare pricing.

Is the pricing for electrodes/rods pretty standard everywhere of is there a cheaper place to buy them? Any recommendations for or against specific brands?

How big of material do you plan on welding? Your saying electrodes/rods so it sounds to me like you bought an ARC Welder. SWAW or FCAW use wire and or gas if necessary for the shielding.

[mr2mike]

Hopefully you got a MIG welder. I think that is the easiest to do in a home application.
Flux core wire allows to use without a gas bottle. Got my wire from Princess Auto. Size based on application I was welding. Gone through maybe 2 tips in my time of welding. I did take the gas shield off mine just so I could see the weld a bit better as I was going.

Also keep your skin protected. Was welding outside in the summer with just mask and gloves. Got a nice sun burn on my arms. Lesson learned.

Work on laying down beads first. Try different methods, push and pull style. Test out the wire feed speed and other settings. If you can't get a constant arc, speed could be too slow.
Make sure metal is clean too or it won't work. And that the ground is connected properly.

http://www.weldingtipsandtricks.com/mig-welding-tips-articles.html

[BerserkerCatSplat]

Hopefully you got a MIG welder. I think that is the easiest to do in a home application.
Flux core wire allows to use without a gas bottle. Got my wire from Princess Auto. Size based on application I was welding. Gone through maybe 2 tips in my time of welding. I did take the gas shield off mine just so I could see the weld a bit better as I was going.

Also keep your skin protected. Was welding outside in the summer with just mask and gloves. Got a nice sun burn on my arms. Lesson learned.

Work on laying down beads first. Try different methods, push and pull style. Test out the wire feed speed and other settings. If you can't get a constant arc, speed could be too slow.
Make sure metal is clean too or it won't work. And that the ground is connected properly.

http://www.weldingtipsandtricks.com/mig-welding-tips-articles.html

OP bought an SMAW (stick) welder, not a MIG or flux-core.

[phreezee]

^ correct. My first project is going to be a racing motion simulator frame similar to this:

81142

[firebane]

^ correct. My first project is going to be a racing motion simulator frame similar to this:

81142

Stick will be far to much for that. A good 110v mig with gas will to far better and if you use a 220v version.

[phreezee]

Stick will be far to much for that. A good 110v mig with gas will to far better and if you use a 220v version.

Not sure what you mean by "far to much". Weld won't be strong enough? I need to support about 300lbs max.

This is the welder I bought to start : https://www.princessauto.com/en/detail/75a-inverter-based-dc-stick-arc-welder/A-p8538902e

[firebane]

Not sure what you mean by "far to much". Weld won't be strong enough? I need to support about 300lbs max.

This is the welder I bought to start : https://www.princessauto.com/en/detail/75a-inverter-based-dc-stick-arc-welder/A-p8538902e

Stick welders are generally used for heavy duty use or extreme uses. For everything that you want to be doing all you need is a mig welder with gas. Mig is also MUCH MUCH more forging and easier to learn than a stick especially for a beginner.

[phreezee]

So spend a little more on one of these? https://www.princessauto.com/en/detail/mig-100e-flux-cored-wire-feed-welder/A-p8538886e

[firebane]

So spend a little more on one of these? https://www.princessauto.com/en/detail/mig-100e-flux-cored-wire-feed-welder/A-p8538886e

To be honest I'd look at Kijii for a used one. You can pick up good units with no issues for cheap as I picked up a 110v Hobart 140 a few years back for $220.

[legendboy]

I have one I will sell cheap like $100

[carson blocks]

Learning to weld on a cheap PA machine can be a little frustrating. I second the idea to get a used Lincoln, Miller, or Hobart MIG, preferably with gas. Then treat yourself to an auto-darkening helmet. I think trying to build that with a PA stick welder - especially for a first project - will be an exercise in frustration. A workbench and welding cart are the textbook first projects to get in to welding and fab, simple and they don't have to be perfect.

[phreezee]

I have one I will sell cheap like $100

Cool, PM'ed you.

Thanks for the guidance guys.
I like a good Kijiji hunt, so will likely heed the advice and return the PA unit.

[Darell_n]

I used this website when I first started out with my TIG. Lots of great videos and a good forum.

http://www.weldingtipsandtricks.com/

[firebane]

Cool, PM'ed you.

Thanks for the guidance guys.
I like a good Kijiji hunt, so will likely heed the advice and return the PA unit.

Also while possible if you are planning on doing aluminum that requires a whole other setup with a welder.

[mr2mike]

Dude learn MIG first. I have heard aluminum is a whole other ball game.

Can you tell if used rigs have been abused or not cooled off properly? Any signs to look for? This is for my own knowledge.

[BerserkerCatSplat]

I have one I will sell cheap like $100

You got any HF TIG setups you want to unload for cheap too? ;)

[phreezee]

Aluminum T-slot was a backup alternative plan to welding.

[zieg]

I've just upgraded my rig to a 240v unit. Going to be selling my 120v mastercraft rig with everything you need for mig except the gas bottle...

[phreezee]

^ sure PM me a price.

[03ozwhip]

Mig is for dummys but I'm sure you're going to be grinding everything smooth? SMAW is more technical and you will get frustrated but I like SMAW better because it looks better.

If you need any tips for building a frame or anything else welding related, let me know.

[phreezee]

^^Yeah that was my original thinking, get good penetration and grind down to smooth out.
From the youtube videos I watched, flux-core mig welding is basically stick welding with a feed and I didn't want to bother with getting/re-filling gas tanks.
My main concern with the PA is that 75A might result in cold welds... would be nice to have a bit higher amps.

[firebane]

^^Yeah that was my original thinking, get good penetration and grind down to smooth out.
From the youtube videos I watched, flux-core mig welding is basically stick welding with a feed and I didn't want to bother with getting/re-filling gas tanks.
My main concern with the PA is that 75A might result in cold welds... would be nice to have a bit higher amps.

So a couple of things.... If you do more grinding than you are welding... your a grinder not a welder ;) My dad told me that once.

Tanks are not needed... You can use flux core and get decent welds you just end up with a bit more splatter and smoke because of the wire. Also gas is important if you want to weld something like .025 or small wire as it'll help keep the heat down and not cause blow through which is easier to do with flux core.

You would be surprised at how strong a mig weld can be even at 75a if you properly weld it and use good wire.

[mr2mike]

flux-core mig welding is basically stick welding with a feed and I didn't want to bother with getting/re-filling gas tanks.
Flux core you don't need a tank. Just results in a bit more splatter but whatever. Grind it off.

[RealJimmyJames]

N

[03ozwhip]

So a couple of things.... If you do more grinding than you are welding... your a grinder not a welder ;) My dad told me that once.

Tanks are not needed... You can use flux core and get decent welds you just end up with a bit more splatter and smoke because of the wire. Also gas is important if you want to weld something like .025 or small wire as it'll help keep the heat down and not cause blow through which is easier to do with flux core.

You would be surprised at how strong a mig weld can be even at 75a if you properly weld it and use good wire.

Wire is also expensive and like was said, you need co2. Not like electrodes aren't, But no co2 needed, but fuck your life if you stick and go through a box of rods because you can't figure out your heat.

Hell, I'm a welder and when I got my little machine for my garage, figuring out the heat on that thing was a nightmare.

[firebane]

Hell, I'm a welder and when I got my little machine for my garage, figuring out the heat on that thing was a nightmare.

I weld very seldomly so it takes a minute to find the groove and always screw up on the heat.

[mr2mike]

Yeah, I leave my settings as is and usually make notes on what metal for what setting. But yeah, I'll do a quick run to get the feel for it again and basically get frustrated that I suck at it and say, meh might as well start the project. Then end up wondering why I'm using a grind stone for an hour?!

[Ekliptix]

Just posting that my brother and I just started taking a welding course at SAIT, for fun. I'm having so much fun. Highly recommended.
http://www.sait.ca/programs-and-courses/continuing-education/courses/weld/weld-a-saurus

[firebane]

Just posting that my brother and I just started taking a welding course at SAIT, for fun. I'm having so much fun. Highly recommended.
http://www.sait.ca/programs-and-courses/continuing-education/courses/weld/weld-a-saurus

Course outline?

[BerserkerCatSplat]

I took the evening TIG welding course at SAIT a number of years ago, really great program and tons of hands-on time. I wanted to take the followup advanced course but they stopped offering it around that time, IIRC the instructor went off to start his own welding business - I want to say it was Unobtanium but I could be misremembering.

[Ekliptix]

Course outline?

Click "LEARN MORE" at the link I provided.

[firebane]

Click "LEARN MORE" at the link I provided.

I did its vague and tells you nothing.

[Ekliptix]

Well, I've only been to 2x 3hr classes so far:
1st class: some safety, explaining the gasses, the teacher took a piece of metal and showed us how to cut it with an oxy acetaline torch (sp?). We all went to our very cool booths and proceeded to practice cutting up our own piece of metal, adjusting the gasses to make the cutting better. It was a little crazy for me since there was molten steel flying back at me sometimes. Felt better after 2hrs of practice.

2nd class: Teacher explained how TIG welding worked, the hose, feeding the wire in, what the gasses do. We went to a work station, he took a flat piece of metal and just 'zapped' it a little, making weld dots on the surface. He had us each go to our stations and do that for 30 min to get comfortable. Then he showed us how to weld 2 pieced of metal together on a horz surface using 'stringer' welds. After that he showed us how to do a weld on a vertical surface using 'weave' welds. Again, I've never done any of this and didn't know how a weld worked. Super fun.

3rd class: This is next week. As part of the course we are given pre-cut pieces of metal and have to weld them into a dinosaur skeleton. 2 of them actually. They're pretty large, 2x2". I think we stat that next class. It'll take a while. I'm pumped. I think we're going to learn TIG too.

[Darell_n]

Has anybody taken the TIG class at SAIT? I’ve been self-learning at home for 5 years and it would be nice to be shown proper technique.

[03ozwhip]

Has anybody taken the TIG class at SAIT? I’ve been self-learning at home for 5 years and it would be nice to be shown proper technique.

Proper technique doesn't exist. There are dipping techniques and continuous techniques. It's what you're comfortable doing.

Everyone holds the torch different and everyone has their preferred way of doing it. When I tig, it's almost never the same "technique" every time.

[Darell_n]

Proper technique doesn't exist. There are dipping techniques and continuous techniques. It's what you're comfortable doing.

Everyone holds the torch different and everyone has their preferred way of doing it. When I tig, it's almost never the same "technique" every time.

I was referring to the different material joint types, not holding the torch and rod specifically. I’ve been brazing hundreds of pounds of rod with acetylene for the last 18 years, so TIG was a fairly easy transition for me. Just looking to step up my game with my Miller Diversion 180 at home.

[03ozwhip]

I was referring to the different material joint types, not holding the torch and rod specifically. I’ve been brazing hundreds of pounds of rod with acetylene for the last 18 years, so TIG was a fairly easy transition for me. Just looking to step up my game with my Miller Diversion 180 at home.

I'm trying to understand what you're saying but I can't lol what techniques are you referring to when it comes to material and joints?

Are you talking about what material(rods and type of steel) to use for ie: stainless steel, carbon?

[Darell_n]

I'm trying to understand what you're saying but I can't lol what techniques are you referring to when it comes to material and joints?

Are you talking about what material(rods and type of steel) to use for ie: stainless steel, carbon?

All of it. There are 7000 different cup sizes and styles, electrode materials and diameters, gas mixtures / flow rates, rod alloys with mixed work pieces, different AC patterns and frequencies. You know, what welding actually is. This is why I like TIG vs MIG as TIG is not just an idiot box with a couple of cords on it.

I’ve learnt a lot on my own but would like instruction from a professional.

[03ozwhip]

All of it. There are 7000 different cup sizes and styles, electrode materials and diameters, gas mixtures / flow rates, rod alloys with mixed work pieces, different AC patterns and frequencies. You know, what welding actually is. This is why I like TIG vs MIG as TIG is not just an idiot box with a couple of cords on it.

I’ve learnt a lot on my own but would like instruction from a professional.

If you want, you can look at my 2nd and 3rd year welding books lol honestly, most of the welding instructors just go off of the books anyways.

There are a few that really know their shit, but I would say that's more of a WET instructor.

[schurchill39]

I took the evening TIG welding course at SAIT a number of years ago, really great program and tons of hands-on time. I wanted to take the followup advanced course but they stopped offering it around that time, IIRC the instructor went off to start his own welding business - I want to say it was Unobtanium but I could be misremembering.

Yep that would be Unobtainum. He was a teacher at SAIT before he started his own thing.

[legendboy]

I was referring to the different material joint types, not holding the torch and rod specifically. I’ve been brazing hundreds of pounds of rod with acetylene for the last 18 years, so TIG was a fairly easy transition for me. Just looking to step up my game with my Miller Diversion 180 at home.

Same with having 15+ years of tig experience and soldiering electronics

Sorry guys have not had time to dig my Mig out