91 -> 93 Octane

[M.alex]

My ECM is tuned for 93 octane. Don't really feel like the hassle of re-tuning it and I suppose the combination of Shell 91, our elevation, and the knock sensors make it okay to get away with, but if I wanted the simplest way to boost the octane to 93 is there any harm in adding an octane booster like Boostane at fillup? The reviews seem okay, but are there any negatives, like over time it will clog fuel injectors, etc.? Not doing it for power, moreover peace of mind of not having to rely on the knock sensors to save the engine in the event of an issue.

[Sentry]

What car/mods/tune? Shell 91 on its own is probably sufficient.

[M.alex]

Viper; heads/headers/straight pipes/intake/mopar ecu. Apparently if I try to tune the ECU it will over-write with the base file and I'll have to spend days on the dyno dicking around.

From what I can gather because of our elevation/air density running a n/a car that was tuned for 93 at sea level is safe using 91 up here

[ThePenIsMightier]

Non-turbo makes it that much safer.
It sounds like most "Octane Boosters" raise points by about 1/10th of what the label tries to indicate. If so, that's not worth anything.

[killramos]

I mean, and I never say this, but why not just run one of the ethanol ridden 94’s like petrocan or Husky if you are concerned about octane?

That seems far preferable to an octane booster imo?

[Sentry]

Viper; heads/headers/straight pipes/intake/mopar ecu. Apparently if I try to tune the ECU it will over-write with the base file and I'll have to spend days on the dyno dicking around.

From what I can gather because of our elevation/air density running a n/a car that was tuned for 93 at sea level is safe using 91 up here
Yeah just run 91

[M.alex]

Yeah just run 91

kinda where I'm leaning towards. I've read several issues with octane boosters such as valve deposists and fouled plugs


I mean, and I never say this, but why not just run one of the ethanol ridden 94’s like petrocan or Husky if you are concerned about octane?

That seems far preferable to an octane booster imo?

Refuse to use ethanol!

[Sentry]

Shell 91 has consistently been the best ethanol-free straight gasoline available in the area. It always makes the most power of any straight gasoline on the dyno at work.

[never]

Since it was tuned at sea level, you could probably get away with 87 up here.


Yeah just run 91

But seriously, this if you’re anti-ethanol.

[killramos]

Refuse to use ethanol!

We are in the same camp then. I definitely worry about octane boosters more than ethanol though.

[jacky4566]

Just general advice for any high performance car.
You only need the advantage of high octane when the cylinders are running at peak pressure. So if your in Hill Billy, BC and all they have is 87 octane you'll be fine so long as you don't rail on the engine. N/A is usually a bit safer too since they don't generate any intake heat.

[Maxx Mazda]

Why not use 94? Petro Canada and Husky both carry it here.

[mr2mike]

Vehicle might pull a little timing but I bet you wouldn't notice.
Just use 94.

[Tik-Tok]

Why not use 94? Petro Canada and Husky both carry it here.

Because...




Refuse to use ethanol!

:thumbsup: fuck ethanol. For political, environmental, and economical reasons. Hate that shit.

[jabjab]

My tune is set at 93 octane and I use 94. If i use 91, it clearly lacks pick up and I got the occasional misfire under full throttle. STick with 94 octane

[Misterman]

Viper; heads/headers/straight pipes/intake/mopar ecu. Apparently if I try to tune the ECU it will over-write with the base file and I'll have to spend days on the dyno dicking around.

From what I can gather because of our elevation/air density running a n/a car that was tuned for 93 at sea level is safe using 91 up here

Which heads did you go with? This a Gen3?

[Skrilla]

My brother in law adds a booster to his BBC Chevelle at every fill up, and that car gets ran hard. Never heard him say anything negative about it, and hes a mechanic. Not sure about a Viper, but his motor is built and handles it fine.

[benyl]

I'd just run 91. The only days I would be worried is when it is a high pressure day and like -20 and DA is near sea level.

[R-Audi]

What about mixing your own booster based on Toluene?

[Maxx Mazda]

Because...

:thumbsup: fuck ethanol. For political, environmental, and economical reasons. Hate that shit.

Doesn’t pretty much ALL gas have ethanol in it these days? Even regular 87 has a tiny bit doesn’t it?

[killramos]

Most does yes. 87 has plenty actually.

Shells 91 Vpower doesn’t.

I think overall Stream is regulated to include at least 10% ethanol.

Implieing that shells 87 and 89 has more than 10% to make up for all the 91 they sell.

Most 94 you see is full of ethanol which naturally has higher octane than gasoline.

[Disoblige]

definitive list of stations that sell pure, ethanol-free gasoline
https://www.pure-gas.org/index.jsp?stateprov=AB

I think there are more stations that aren't listed on this site.

Superstore used to have 0 ethanol in premium until they switched over to Mobil.

[Misterman]

Doesn’t pretty much ALL gas have ethanol in it these days? Even regular 87 has a tiny bit doesn’t it?

The lower grade fuels is where you'll be most likely to find ethanol. It allows the gasoline company to blend a cheap shit 82 octane gasoline, then just bump it to 87 with cheap ethanol. Shell specifically does not run that garbage in their premium fuel. Now you have some makers employing a marketing strategy of selling you a 94 Octane PREMIUM fuel, and charging a mint for it, even though it is just as cheap to produce as 89-91 because they just bump the octane up with ethanol.

[Sentry]

Doesn’t pretty much ALL gas have ethanol in it these days? Even regular 87 has a tiny bit doesn’t it?
Like I said:

Shell 91 has consistently been the best ethanol-free straight gasoline available in the area. It always makes the most power of any straight gasoline on the dyno at work.

[Tik-Tok]

Doesn’t pretty much ALL gas have ethanol in it these days? Even regular 87 has a tiny bit doesn’t it?

CO-OP 87 FTW! They still don't use any ethanol in any grade of fuel in Calgary.

[ThePenIsMightier]

Most does yes. 87 has plenty actually.

Shells 91 Vpower doesn’t.

I think overall Stream is regulated to include at least 10% ethanol.

Implieing that shells 87 and 89 has more than 10% to make up for all the 91 they sell.

Most 94 you see is full of ethanol which naturally has higher octane than gasoline.

This is valuable info and true.
Just keep in mind that is market specific. The stickers on the Shell pumps on Vancouver Island do indicate that even V-power MAY contain up to ___% ethanol (I think it's up to 10%).
The Scotford Refinery produces zero ethanol V-power but that doesn't cover the whole country, is all I'm saying.

[Maxx Mazda]

The lower grade fuels is where you'll be most likely to find ethanol. It allows the gasoline company to blend a cheap shit 82 octane gasoline, then just bump it to 87 with cheap ethanol. Shell specifically does not run that garbage in their premium fuel. Now you have some makers employing a marketing strategy of selling you a 94 Octane PREMIUM fuel, and charging a mint for it, even though it is just as cheap to produce as 89-91 because they just bump the octane up with ethanol.

Doesn’t apply to me anyways, I run leaded AvGas in the Mazda. But for the OP it should work.

[Misterman]

The Scotford Refinery produces zero ethanol V-power but that doesn't cover the whole country, is all I'm saying.

I used to make gasoline there.

[sabad66]

This is valuable info and true.
Just keep in mind that is market specific. The stickers on the Shell pumps on Vancouver Island do indicate that even V-power MAY contain up to ___% ethanol (I think it's up to 10%).
The Scotford Refinery produces zero ethanol V-power but that doesn't cover the whole country, is all I'm saying.

all V-power across the country has 0% ethanol. this could change in the future but for now we're good.

[Maxt]

My ECM is tuned for 93 octane. Don't really feel like the hassle of re-tuning it and I suppose the combination of Shell 91, our elevation, and the knock sensors make it okay to get away with, but if I wanted the simplest way to boost the octane to 93 is there any harm in adding an octane booster like Boostane at fillup? The reviews seem okay, but are there any negatives, like over time it will clog fuel injectors, etc.? Not doing it for power, moreover peace of mind of not having to rely on the knock sensors to save the engine in the event of an issue.
My srt-10 ram has a 93 octane tune in it, my wife put multiple tanks of midgrade through it with no ill effects.

[revelations]

I'd just run 91. The only days I would be worried is when it is a high pressure day and like -20 and DA is near sea level.

Can we actually approach density alt of sea level here in those conditions? wow

[Maxx Mazda]

Can we actually approach density alt of sea level here in those conditions? wow

With a low altimeter setting (29.72) my calculations show a density altitude of 331’ ASL at -20*C. We get down to 91’ ASL with a standard pressure.

[ThePenIsMightier]

all V-power across the country has 0% ethanol. this could change in the future but for now we're good.

The stickers on the pumps at some Shell stations (as I mentioned) clearly indicate otherwise.
So... What's the deal? What do you know that counters that?

[M.alex]

The stickers on the pumps at some Shell stations (as I mentioned) clearly indicate otherwise.
So... What's the deal? What do you know that counters that?

Every Shell sticker I've seen at the pump clearly says NO ethanol on v-power.

[ThePenIsMightier]

Every Shell sticker I've seen at the pump clearly says NO ethanol on v-power.

I've def seen them; however, I've now looked it up and according to Shell.ca in the FAQ section they claim ALL Shell V-Power in Canada has zero ethanol.
So, I know I've seen the stickers and I guess those stickers are misplaced.
Sorry!

[94boosted]

definitive list of stations that sell pure, ethanol-free gasoline
https://www.pure-gas.org/index.jsp?stateprov=AB



CO-OP 87 FTW! They still don't use any ethanol in any grade of fuel in Calgary.

All CO-OP 87? From the link Disoblige provided it looks like only 91 is ethanol free at all stations.

Either way this is good news as now with the 8c/L refund from CO-OP I think they've got the cheapest gas in the city.

[killramos]

I am not sure anywhere offers 87 ethanol free. Pretty sure the entire sales stream has to hit 5% average meaning if they offer one stream without then they have to load up the ethanol on other streams to make up for it.

Edit: Looks like federal mandate is actually 5%, 10% is Ontario. Point is still valid directionally though.

https://www.producer.com/2017/06/ethanol-consumption-exceeds-mandate/

[Tik-Tok]

ALL Co-op gas in the Calgary region is ethanol free. Maybe not forever, but for the past decade and as of the last time this came up on Beyond (I called corporate office and confirmed). They get away with this because they have their own refinery, and the laws are applicable at the refinery level, not at the pump. So they sell more ethanol to other buyers.

https://forums.beyond.ca/threads/408819-Why-did-gas-prices-just-drop-10-cents?p=4757778&highlight=ethanol#post4757778

[94boosted]

ALL Co-op gas in the Calgary region is ethanol free. Maybe not forever, but for the past decade and as of the last time this came up on Beyond (I called corporate office and confirmed). They get away with this because they have their own refinery, and the laws are applicable at the refinery level, not at the pump. So they sell more ethanol to other buyers.

https://forums.beyond.ca/threads/408819-Why-did-gas-prices-just-drop-10-cents?p=4757778&highlight=ethanol#post4757778

:thumbsup: Neat

[swak]

I know for a fact there is no ethanol in VPower gas, and the same is often true for many rural gas stations even in the regular. Retail sites don't have Mid-grade tanks, so when you are buying mid grade gas, it is a blend from the premium tank and the regular gasoline storage tanks.

I believe the same is true for Esso as well, that there is no ethanol in the premium.
Obviously Petro-Can has ethanol.

Too, Calgary loading stations don't have ethanol injectors at the sites, as such this is later loaded into the tankers from a rail car if they have an ethanol blend on their site.
As such, doesn't surprise me that Calgary has a lot of sites without ethanol.