Operating a Car Wash Business

[vengie]

Part of me has always wanted to open a car wash.

They are a license to print money if done right and in the right location.

[bjstare]

Part of me has always wanted to open a car wash.

They are a license to print money if done right and in the right location.

The Western Pride one on Richmond Rd seems to be lined up like every time I go there. Only time I've been when it's had a bunch of empty bays was at like 11pm on a sunday.

I'd say that is a serious exception though. I bet getting a car wash in the right spot to be that successful is like a 1% chance.

[vengie]

The Western Pride one on Richmond Rd seems to be lined up like every time I go there. Only time I've been when it's had a bunch of empty bays was at like 11pm on a sunday.

I'd say that is a serious exception though. I bet getting a car wash in the right spot to be that successful is like a 1% chance.

Exactly, not to mention I'm sure there is some sort of Monopoly... Know the right people, grease the right pockets.

[BavarianBeast]

Car wash margins are extemely low even if your flat out. Need to scale that business and own 20+ of them to generate a significant cash flow.

[R-Audi]

Part of me has always wanted to open a car wash.

They are a license to print money if done right and in the right location.

Largest issue is the cost of the land, building and actual wash parts. Expect to pay over $1M for those new fancy ones.(Wash parts only) Thats a lot of loonies...

[BavarianBeast]

Then factor in all other expenses. I looked at buying one a short while back, and they were returning 2% on a good year.

[Chester]

Car wash margins are extemely low even if your flat out. Need to scale that business and own 20+ of them to generate a significant cash flow.

:werd:

[Buster]

Then factor in all other expenses. I looked at buying one a short while back, and they were returning 2% on a good year.

Did you look at their "financials" or their financials?

[Thaco]

seems like there isn't a lot of turnover on them so i am not sure how they can have such low margin like you guys suggest, either that or everybody that has them just use them for laundering money for their more lucrative side businesses.

[BavarianBeast]

Did you look at their "financials" or their financials?

What are you trying to say?

[Buster]

What are you trying to say?

Most of the profit in car washes is off the books. AKAIK

[roopi]

What are you trying to say?

They make plenty of money. Just because you looked at their books doesn't mean anything. It's a cash business.

[BavarianBeast]

Yeah it means a fair bit when they’re audited financial statements. Making the assumption that all car washes aren’t recording their cash transactions accurately is bold and ignorant.

[roopi]

Yeah it means a fair bit when they’re audited financial statements. Making the assumption that all car washes aren’t recording their cash transactions accurately is bold and ignorant.

What would you call making the assumption that all car washes return 2% based on reviewing the audited financial statements of one car wash? Or did you review them all?

You don't see many car washes come up for sale or stay on the market very long. I don't think the reason is because people are looking for a good place to park their money for 2%. Just an ignorant assumption though.

[BavarianBeast]

What I stated was margins were low and applied a personal experience. Pretty cut and dry.

[ExtraSlow]

What I stated was margins were low and applied a personal experience. Pretty cut and dry.

But those other guys are certain the margins are huge, so you must be wrong.

[tonytiger55]

The business is not as steady.
Business slows down in the winter, you still have to keep heating on so pipes dont freeze. A secondary business helps suppliment during hard months.
Then u get the
The chinooks help a lot. Oddly enough xmas eve and boxing day were super busy.
If you can get car dealerships nearby, it helps as you can give them a business rate.
If there are other car washes nearby, the timer gets fixed/adjusted so everyone is in the same price range like gas stations.

[dj_rice]

The business is not as steady.

If you can get car dealerships nearby, it helps as you can give them a business rate.
If there are other car washes nearby, the timer gets fixed/adjusted so everyone is in the same price range like gas stations.


Most if not all car dealerships have their own in-house detail dept/washbays. Used car dealerships, probably not.

[speedog]

What would you call making the assumption that all car washes return 2% based on reviewing the audited financial statements of one car wash? Or did you review them all?

You don't see many car washes come up for sale or stay on the market very long. I don't think the reason is because people are looking for a good place to park their money for 2%. Just an ignorant assumption though.

My Dad just retired from being a commercial realtor and always said that the three best small business money makers were car washes, liquor stores and gas stations with an attached convenience store. 30 years as a commercial realtor and the contacts he had wouldn't lead me to doubt what he says and yes, there's always more to those businesses than 'their' books.

[Mitsu3000gt]

Largest issue is the cost of the land, building and actual wash parts. Expect to pay over $1M for those new fancy ones.(Wash parts only) Thats a lot of loonies...

Out of curiosity I googled the cost of the "Laser Wash" systems CO-OP uses and apparently it's only around $30-50K per bay compared to $8-10K per bay for self-serve. I assume that's USD. Doesn't sound too horrible, but I agree if the location was good the land would likely be the bigger concern.

The people I have seen looking after car washes (and yelling at people drying their cars in them haha) all seem to be driving 10+ yr old German cars so I don't know how good the money is.

[R-Audi]

Out of curiosity I googled the cost of the "Laser Wash" systems CO-OP uses and apparently it's only around $30-50K per bay compared to $8-10K per bay for self-serve. I assume that's USD. Doesn't sound too horrible, but I agree if the location was good the land would likely be the bigger concern.

The people I have seen looking after car washes (and yelling at people drying their cars in them haha) all seem to be driving 10+ yr old German cars so I don't know how good the money is.


That cost was in reference to the new large hightech carwashes, so several bays and a mix of automatic and DIY bays like the one in the NE and off Blackfoot. My Uncle owns a company that builds them and said that was a rough ballpark for those units. (Which I believe he built one of them)

[Rocket1k78]

The people I have seen looking after car washes (and yelling at people drying their cars in them haha) all seem to be driving 10+ yr old German cars so I don't know how good the money is.

Agreed, every time i see anyone driving a 10+ year old German car they have to be broke, I've never heard of anyone wealthy driving old cars. It would also make no sense for a guy who can come up with that kind of money to go and hire 1 employee to run it, why pay someone minimum wage when you can do it yourself right. Man you say some dumb things:facepalm:

[bjstare]

Man you say some dumb things:facepalm:

Ironic post. I know of a few people that have 8 figure net worths that drive old cars. One drives an early 90s 5 series. Another drives two early 2000s porsches (911 and cayenne turbo), and a rusty 98 silverado half ton.

I agree that a bunch of people who drive 10+ year old german cars are broke, but wealthy people do drive old cars.. it's way more common than you think.

[vengie]

Ironic post. I know of a few people that have 8 figure net worths that drive old cars. One drives an early 90s 5 series. Another drives two early 2000s porsches (911 and cayenne turbo), and a rusty 98 silverado half ton.

I agree that a bunch of people who drive 10+ year old german cars are broke, but wealthy people do drive old cars.. it's way more common than you think.


Agreed, I know a guy with close to an 8 figure net worth driving a 2012 Ford Fiesta that's dented to shit that he inherited from his Grandma. Its worth Maybe $1000?
An important lesson that I've learned (the hard way) is stop caring what other people think of you. Once you can be genuinely happy with who you are life becomes much funner!

Hell I never thought I would be driving a $3500 Honda Fit as a daily driver but here I am! Its cheap as hell, and allows me to KEEP my money working for me. :thumbsup:

Anyways, back on topic. Car washes and shit.

What thread was this even split off from?

[89coupe]

Part of me has always wanted to open a car wash.

They are a license to print money if done right and in the right location.

Make sure you own the land or have an iron clad lease agreement, I know a couple car wash owners who had the rug pulled out under them because of shitty lease agreements on the land.

The west side needs a wand wash, you would make a killing if you could get a hold of some commercial land.

[muse017]

ROI might not be as good as it sound, it still makes pretty good cash flow. I've seen friend of mine's makes north of 500k in Calgary but they bought the business and property for 5mil +.

[ercchry]

Then factor in all other expenses. I looked at buying one a short while back, and they were returning 2% on a good year.

I would think you’d want to leverage that purchase, land and assets... should be easy enough to secure financing

Let’s say $4m land, $1m equipment... would probably need to put up $1.2m

10 bays, $1/min... busy 8/24hrs 365 days a yr...

Average of 12% on borrowed funds, about $500k interest payments annually... leaving you about $1.2m in revenue... even a couple min wage staff on site and you’re returning 80-90% on your capital, plus own appreciating land

[Buster]

I would think you’d want to leverage that purchase, land and assets... should be easy enough to secure financing

Let’s say $4m land, $1m equipment... would probably need to put up $1.2m

10 bays, $1/min... busy 8/24hrs 365 days a yr...

Average of 12% on borrowed funds, about $500k interest payments annually... leaving you about $1.2m in revenue... even a couple min wage staff on site and you’re returning 80-90% on your capital, plus own appreciating land

You'd also have to pay some multiple of cash flow.

[ercchry]

You'd also have to pay some multiple of cash flow.

To the lender? Lots of private money out there that would do a straight interest only deal... but there would also be fees attached to securing the money, and also on renewals

[Rocket1k78]

Ironic post. I know of a few people that have 8 figure net worths that drive old cars. One drives an early 90s 5 series. Another drives two early 2000s porsches (911 and cayenne turbo), and a rusty 98 silverado half ton.

I agree that a bunch of people who drive 10+ year old german cars are broke, but wealthy people do drive old cars.. it's way more common than you think.

My bad, i though it was pretty obvious i was being sarcastic about agreeing with mitsu saying you're broke if you drive an old car. I wasnt agreeing with him at all and thats why i said he says dumb things lol I know a few wealthy people who drive shit boxes too. If i had to lend money to someone and hoped of getting it back and had to choose between a guy with a 2019 bmw or a guy with a 2009 bmw i would probably go with the 2009 :rofl:

[tonytiger55]

I forgot to add. You can also sign up companies with fleet vehicles and give them a flat rate. Its not necessarily dealerships that may use it. I remember that we had a few companies sign up.

A lot of wealthy people I knew drove some shitty ass old vehicles too. Some had some very nice ones indeed.

I remember this one guy turned up with this classic car from the 1950's. After he washing the car it would not start. I was in the bay next door, all I could hear was the engine struggling to turn over and him constantly cursing like a old man 'Son of a bitch.. god dammit'.

[ercchry]

my ex's father... for every 0 added to his net worth, his vehicles dropped a bracket... 7 figures, SLS AMG, then older E63, now at high 8 figures... mazda 3, then he bought a mini RV and sold his mansion outside of london and was going to live in the RV cause Anthony Hopkins does that 6 months out of the year or some nonsense :rofl:

he gave up on the RV, bought another house and just rents villas in the Mediterranean like a sane rich person now... very questionable for a while though... thats true "fuck you" money though... zero fucks given, and random ass impulse decisions

[Mitsu3000gt]

That cost was in reference to the new large hightech carwashes, so several bays and a mix of automatic and DIY bays like the one in the NE and off Blackfoot. My Uncle owns a company that builds them and said that was a rough ballpark for those units. (Which I believe he built one of them)

Sorry I thought I replied to this but I don't think I did - you would have the better information then! That's definitely more than I thought.

And I was clearly joking about the car comment, if it somehow wasn't obvious with the actual laugh inserted into the sentence lol. Just a funny stereotype IMO. CEO of a company I used to work for drove a 10yr old base model Grand AM, and was probably one of the richest people I have ever met in person.

[phreezee]

https://www.cnbc.com/2017/09/21/why-these-5-billionaires-still-drive-these-cheap-cars.html

I drive a shitbox so people know I'm rich :D

[Buster]

To the lender? Lots of private money out there that would do a straight interest only deal... but there would also be fees attached to securing the money, and also on renewals

No, I mean to the seller of the business.

[killramos]

I mean. If you spend all your time working ( most CEO’s etc., should probably put my flame suit on for that one) then you are less likely to have a substantial hobby interest in cars.

Cars likely just don’t interest them nearly as much as using that capital for work.

At least that’s my theory?

As for running a car wash. I’m sure there are worse jobs.

[roopi]

https://www.cnbc.com/2017/09/21/why-these-5-billionaires-still-drive-these-cheap-cars.html

I drive a shitbox so people know I'm rich :D

I'd be curious to see how many miles/kms they put on these vehicles. They may own shitboxes and drive them on occasion but they are most likely using a car service/driver/jet/etc..

[tonytiger55]

A Carwash owner died yesterday.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/centex-cedarbrae-owner-killed-1.5199293


The owner of a Centex gas station in southwest Calgary died on Wednesday afternoon after he was pinned in a drainage pit in the gas station's car wash.

Centex Petroleum owner Shafiq Bhura said the owner of the Cedarbrae location died, but that his name won't be released as his family has requested privacy.

Police said at 12:40 p.m. they responded to the call at 11211 Oakfield Dr. S.W.

The 64-year-old man was cleaning out a drainage pit in the car wash when the driver of a vehicle drove in, pinned the man against the edge of the pit, killing him.

"We are deeply saddened and heartbroken and are doing our best to support his family through this difficult time," Bhura said in an emailed statement.

Police said the incident is still under investigation, but they don't expect charges to be laid.

Occupational Health and Safety have also been notified of the death and are investigating.

[ercchry]

No, I mean to the seller of the business.

Ah, I thought we were building one from scratch?

[Buster]

Ah, I thought we were building one from scratch?

I think BavarianBeast mentioned he was looking at buying one. But your analysis is spot on for a setup.

[Chester]

A Carwash owner died yesterday.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/centex-cedarbrae-owner-killed-1.5199293

Holy shit. That's crazy. RIP.

[dirtsniffer]

I'm going to have to give that carwash a try. i didn't know there was one in cedarbrae

[Rocket1k78]

I forgot to add. You can also sign up companies with fleet vehicles and give them a flat rate. Its not necessarily dealerships that may use it. I remember that we had a few companies sign up.


My friend worked for a company with a fleet account at the big bucket and he gave me the code once and man i never knew life could be so good using the air dryer lol

[ExtraSlow]

Ah, I thought we were building one from scratch?

We're building a car wash? Count me in.

[muse017]

"10 bays, $1/min... busy 8/24hrs 365 days a yr....

Average of 12% on borrowed funds, about $500k interest payments annually... leaving you about $1.2m in revenue... even a couple min wage staff on site and you’re returning 80-90% on your capital, plus own appreciating land"



Chemical + equipment maintenance + utilities + insurance + dirt cleanup fee/disposal + property tax and list goes on

[DustanS]

.

[Misterman]

My Dad just retired from being a commercial realtor and always said that the three best small business money makers were car washes, liquor stores and gas stations with an attached convenience store. 30 years as a commercial realtor and the contacts he had wouldn't lead me to doubt what he says and yes, there's always more to those businesses than 'their' books.

I have friends that own each of those business'. The car wash and convenience store seem to make big bank. Liquor store seems like small potatoes. It's pretty hard to paint everything with a broad brush in these niches, as the revenue from each of these will vary wildly based on location and other competing business' in the area.

[R-Audi]

I think for liquor stores it really only works if you have a few and are large enough to distribute to other business. (Restaurants, other stores etc)

I'll dig for more info on the carwash costs...

[mr2mike]

There's probably a Car Wash REIT out there for you to buy.
National Retail Properties NNN

"Its top five tenants are Susser Holdings (owner of Stripe's convenience stores; 5% of annualized base rate), Mister Car Wash (4.9%), Pantry (Kangaroo Express convenience stores; 4.4%), 7-Eleven (4.2%) and L.A. Fitness (4.2%)."

[R-Audi]

OK, so here we go with some numbers: (Keep in mind, these are rough ballpark numbers)

-Land in Calgary (approx, will change per location) $750k-$1.25M per acre
-General building Cost $225 per square foot
-Self wash wand bays cost ~$30k per bay for the equipment

Top Gear wash was around $7.5M for everything, Wash King was around $11M!

One large car wash in AB (Wont location or name given for Obv. reasons) averages 240,000 washes a year at an average of $12 per wash. Cost on consumables is $2 per wash. Also to keep in mind, all new washes are credit card based, so that cash incentive doesnt happen as much!

[P_D]

my ex's father... for every 0 added to his net worth, his vehicles dropped a bracket... 7 figures, SLS AMG, then older E63, now at high 8 figures... mazda 3, then he bought a mini RV and sold his mansion outside of london and was going to live in the RV cause Anthony Hopkins does that 6 months out of the year or some nonsense :rofl:

he gave up on the RV, bought another house and just rents villas in the Mediterranean like a sane rich person now... very questionable for a while though... thats true "fuck you" money though... zero fucks given, and random ass impulse decisions

from what i gathered from this post is that you have an ex that has a rich father................. any red flags i need to know about before i jump on that lol.

[RX_EVOLV]

OK, so here we go with some numbers: (Keep in mind, these are rough ballpark numbers)

-Land in Calgary (approx, will change per location) $750k-$1.25M per acre
-General building Cost $225 per square foot
-Self wash wand bays cost ~$30k per bay for the equipment

Top Gear wash was around $7.5M for everything, Wash King was around $11M!

One large car wash in AB (Wont location or name given for Obv. reasons) averages 240,000 washes a year at an average of $12 per wash. Cost on consumables is $2 per wash. Also to keep in mind, all new washes are credit card based, so that cash incentive doesnt happen as much!

$12 per wash?? That seems so high.

[TomcoPDR]

my ex's father... for every 0 added to his net worth, his vehicles dropped a bracket... 7 figures, SLS AMG, then older E63, now at high 8 figures... mazda 3, then he bought a mini RV and sold his mansion outside of london and was going to live in the RV cause Anthony Hopkins does that 6 months out of the year or some nonsense :rofl:

he gave up on the RV, bought another house and just rents villas in the Mediterranean like a sane rich person now... very questionable for a while though... thats true "fuck you" money though... zero fucks given, and random ass impulse decisions

You need to get back in there. Then throw a huge ass Beyond yacht party.



from what i gathered from this post is that you have an ex that has a rich father................. any red flags i need to know about before i jump on that lol.

[ShermanEF9]

I'm going to have to give that carwash a try. i didn't know there was one in cedarbrae

It wasn't great. Last 2 times I went they had no soap, and the cashier said it wasn't their problem.

[spike98]

$12 per wash?? That seems so high.

I have never washed for less than $10, ever. Most are $12-$15. My truck when muddy is sometimes over $16.

[R-Audi]

$12 per wash?? That seems so high.

Its a rough average.. Im usually ~$10 with an SUV that isnt super dirty on a coin wash, but always higher on the credit card washes. That also includes the automatic washes, as I think they start around $10 or 12 per.

[RX_EVOLV]

I have never washed for less than $10, ever. Most are $12-$15. My truck when muddy is sometimes over $16.

I average $4-5 per wash.. $2 on soap and $2 on rinse for the 335.. and $3/$2 on the X5.. dry by hand. Do you guys actually do the pre-soak and the spotless rinse??

[civicHB]

was just crunching numbers for curiosity

240,000 washes a year for a 12 bay location is about 385 car washes/bay/week

55 car washes/bay/day

assuming 12 hour a day operation this is 4.6 car washes per hour/bay.

those seem like very high numbers, essentially this car wash is running flat out year round. Maybe my marth is way off, but was surprised.


OK, so here we go with some numbers: (Keep in mind, these are rough ballpark numbers)

-Land in Calgary (approx, will change per location) $750k-$1.25M per acre
-General building Cost $225 per square foot
-Self wash wand bays cost ~$30k per bay for the equipment

Top Gear wash was around $7.5M for everything, Wash King was around $11M!

One large car wash in AB (Wont location or name given for Obv. reasons) averages 240,000 washes a year at an average of $12 per wash. Cost on consumables is $2 per wash. Also to keep in mind, all new washes are credit card based, so that cash incentive doesnt happen as much!

[R-Audi]

was just crunching numbers for curiosity

240,000 washes a year for a 12 bay location is about 385 car washes/bay/week

55 car washes/bay/day

assuming 12 hour a day operation this is 4.6 car washes per hour/bay.

those seem like very high numbers, essentially this car wash is running flat out year round. Maybe my marth is way off, but was surprised.


I am not aware what setup this wash had, but I am assuming its on of the large types (similar to Top Gear/Wash King) For obvious reasons they werent able to hand out more information. For comparison sake, they also said a typical single bay automatic gas station car wash gets around 60,000 washes per year.

[mr2mike]

I have never washed for less than $10, ever. Most are $12-$15. My truck when muddy is sometimes over $16.

I have never washed for more than $7.
So maybe $12 is the avg. But it does seem high.

[ShermanEF9]

My truck is usually between $10-$20. girlfriends car can be done for $5-$6. during the summer i wash at home.

[Misterman]

I average $4-5 per wash.. $2 on soap and $2 on rinse for the 335.. and $3/$2 on the X5.. dry by hand. Do you guys actually do the pre-soak and the spotless rinse??

I like my vehicle to be clean if I'm going to spend money washing it, never made sense to me to spend 5$ and drive out with a film on it still. So yes, pre-soak, soap spray, rinse, and then spot free rinse. If I was in there every other day I could probably get away with a 5$ wash. Costs me somewhere between 10-20$ depending how dirty it is.

[nj2Type-S]

i spend around $6: $2 soap spray, $2 foam brush, $2 rinse. i drive out of the bay then i wipe the vehicle dry.

[killramos]

~10 here. Maybe a buck or 2 more for the Jeep.

I’m a big fan of the spray on pre soak foam which adds a few bucks. It’s the only think that actually works for get Calgary’s sooty dusty grime off 100%.

[Twin_Cam_Turbo]

It varies heavily between what vehicle I’m washing, time of year and what I’m trying to achieve. Often times if my truck is really muddy after being off road it will be $30-50. I’ve spent as much as $80 on a work truck.

[AndyL]

I think you guys are missing out on that maintenance component...

Carwashes are nasty places. Constant corrosion wear, how many threads about carwash brushes destroying paint?

Just the doors alone - when we maintained the coop automated washes - call or two a week. Any repair had dozens of parts because shit got rusty overnight from the chemicals used. Didn't matter if it was electric, hydraulic or pneumatic - stuff got rusty then broke, try to repair you're swapping 30 extra parts because it's cheaper than grinding it clean (and you grind off the coating to prevent rust, so worse next time). Constant door got hit calls. Maintenance has got to be chewing up a huge amount of their profit...

Anyone remember how much that new spyhill carwash was getting repaired? Teething + repairs constantly even on brand new warrantied items. And they actually invested in good product - wasn't the cheapest sh*t like most.

[Misterman]

One thing is for sure, people don't spend millions of dollars on a business investments because they lose money or have poor returns. At the end of the day business is generally valued based on ROI. I don't think established car washes are getting their valuations purely by selling them to suckers.

[Masked Bandit]

The one on Midpark Blvd is for sale, nice & cheap too!

http://www.thecarwashgirl.com/ForSale.php/Details/102/231-midpark-boulevard-se-autoclean-car-wash-calgary-ab

The devil will be in the details of the lease agreement.

[nj2Type-S]

The one on Midpark Blvd is for sale, nice & cheap too!

http://www.thecarwashgirl.com/ForSale.php/Details/102/231-midpark-boulevard-se-autoclean-car-wash-calgary-ab

The devil will in the details of the lease agreement.

this is the one that i usually go to. it's a pretty decent facility.

group buy on a car wash? lol.

[you&me]

The one on Midpark Blvd is for sale, nice & cheap too!

http://www.thecarwashgirl.com/ForSale.php/Details/102/231-midpark-boulevard-se-autoclean-car-wash-calgary-ab

The devil will in the details of the lease agreement.

There are other listings on the site that include land... Good to see some (kinda) real numbers wrt pricing, etc.

[muse017]

The one on Midpark Blvd is for sale, nice & cheap too!

http://www.thecarwashgirl.com/ForSale.php/Details/102/231-midpark-boulevard-se-autoclean-car-wash-calgary-ab

The devil will in the details of the lease agreement.

Very true especially regarding the environment/land soil contamination and clean up in the lease agreement

[O&G]

If anyone (or group) gets serious to buy something - PM please. Im in to invest

[npham]

We are this far in, and no one is talking about making meth on the side?

[roopi]

We are this far in, and no one is talking about making meth on the side?

There is no money in meth. Maybe 1-2% return.

[dirtsniffer]

The one on Midpark Blvd is for sale, nice & cheap too!

http://www.thecarwashgirl.com/ForSale.php/Details/102/231-midpark-boulevard-se-autoclean-car-wash-calgary-ab

The devil will in the details of the lease agreement.

I used to go to that carwash until the current owner started treating customers like crap. So many signs saying do this and don't do that. Moved on to somewhere that appreciated my business. Could be reasonable to expect better performance from a new owner

[civicHB]

is there anyone who actually operates, or has actual experience with a car wash? please PM if so, would love to pick your brain. Thanks!