Career progression in this economy

[ragu]

With current state of economy which has lasted half a decade, I've been pretty lucky to have a job. I was promoted through this phase but it has certainly taken a lot to stay ahead, pick up new tech, saving costs and just generally be the go to person. Having said that, next phase of OG looks to be even tougher and I do have serious concerns about how low the progression looks like going fwd.

Now, I'm curious how others are going about building a career. What else is there other than OG? Those who've left OG, what are you doing now? What do you plan to do in next 3-5 years that's different?

[killramos]

Automation is always relevant and transferable outside of O&G.

[revelations]

Follow your passion and not just money. If youre over 35 you should have a good handle on where you can focus and excel (or not).

Once you've figured that out, then you can pick something thats more money-driven (specialization).

[Buster]

leave Canada, ASAP.

[ragu]

Can't. Have to support baby boomers and pay for kids education.

[speedog]

Can't. Have to support baby boomers and pay for kids education.

Thank you.

[Disoblige]

What do you do exactly?
O&G is very vague to determine your transferable skills.

[SkiBum5.0]

I know where this view comes from it - did it in 2016. I’ve just moved back to accept a new position with a different company that is better in every way. Earning potential over the long term is worse, but in the end we made the family decision to raise kids in Canada. Career progression in Canada is limited only because there are only so many companies, and positions for people to move up into. I think you get really good at one or two things, show a desire to outwork your peers and you’ll be fine in Canada

[pheoxs]

Control systems / automation is still plenty busy. Know of a bunch of companies all still hiring teams for projects

[RT16V]

Genuinely curious on some perspectives RE: ‘career progression’ these days. Asking partially based on some trends I am seeing (in our firm) but also based on trying to better understand expectations etc.

[Maxx Mazda]

I’ve been pretty fortunate in the sense that I’ve known what I’ve wanted to do ever since I was young and I spent my teenage / college years working towards that field. Now that I’m well established, it’s nice knowing that I’ll likely never have to look for another job and just sit back and enjoy collecting years of service and a pension until I retire.

Not saying that to sound like a dick, just answering the OP’s question. Both my parents worked in oil and gas and both made very successful careers out of it before retiring in the last decade, however seeing what they did really encouraged me to pursue a career away from O&G. The office life is just not for me. I sympathize with just about everyone who’s been affected by the downturn in the oil industry, I know especially in Calgary it’s tough.

What advice I can offer is what’s already been mentioned above: go after something that you’re passionate about. Even when I’m working it doesn’t feel like I’m “working.” I look forward to it most days.

[95EagleAWD]

I feel like I’m a few years behind you, so this shortage better continue haha.

I’ve got a great gig in Toronto now, and looking forward to the next step while enjoying this one. I’ll be at 1000 hours by the end of summer and should get my ass to a regional airline soooooon.

[Mitsu3000gt]

I consider myself lucky as well, but I have had no problem progressing in O&G. The market isn't great but there is still a ton of work to be done and a lot of production that needs to move. Lots of baby boomers are retiring right now and that opens up higher level positions. If I had a kid looking for work, I might not steer him/her to O&G but for those of us already in it, it's not going anywhere anytime soon. I fully plan on finishing my career in O&G but I guess that isn't up to me at the end of the day haha.

[revelations]

I feel like I’m a few years behind you, so this shortage better continue haha.

I’ve got a great gig in Toronto now, and looking forward to the next step while enjoying this one. I’ll be at 1000 hours by the end of summer and should get my ass to a regional airline soooooon.

You know that in Asia right now, they are paying INSANE $$$ for bush pilots from Canada? You know, the ones who can actually FLY a fucking airplane hands on? (instead of pushing buttons and reading a chart). HUGE problem with pilots there who just go through the motions but know very little about HAND flying.

Senior captains (777, etc.) were getting offered something like 1/2 million $$ a year in China for eg. (as a contract pilot).

[95EagleAWD]

You know that in Asia right now, they are paying INSANE $$$ for bush pilots from Canada? You know, the ones who can actually FLY a fucking airplane hands on? (instead of pushing buttons and reading a chart). HUGE problem with pilots there who just go through the motions but know very little about HAND flying.

Senior captains (777, etc.) were getting offered something like 1/2 million $$ a year in China for eg. (as a contract pilot).

Then you have to live in China, which would suck a lot.

[revelations]

Then you have to live in China, which would suck a lot.

Its not JUST China. All over SE Asia. ALL of the carriers are hiring. You could easily move into the heavies very quick. Skip all the regional BS here in North America.

Plus China is very good if you have connections and status (which you would, as a pilot).

If I was young pilot, mostly single - that would be a great experience.

However, avoid the Arab airlines though - they pay good but treat you like garbage.

[Disoblige]

Maybe if you could live in Japan or something, that would be cool.
Agreed living in China would be terrible.

[ExtraSlow]

Regarding the O&G landscape right now, Canada is still a tough place to make much "progression" on both the producer and service side of things. However, if you are currently employed, now is a great time to make sure you are really learning things and differentiating yourself from your peers. Get to the field as much as you can, get some complimentary skills in data science, public speaking, sales or management (cheap online courses in all of these). Read SPE papers and keep up on best practices from other regions even if you can't implement them in your current projects. Get overseas or USA experience if you can.

Level advancement will come in a few years, but if you aren't working now for it, it won't come to you.

[vengie]

Regarding the O&G landscape right now, Canada is still a tough place to make much "progression" on both the producer and service side of things. However, if you are currently employed, now is a great time to make sure you are really learning things and differentiating yourself from your peers. Get to the field as much as you can, get some complimentary skills in data science, public speaking, sales or management (cheap online courses in all of these). Read SPE papers and keep up on best practices from other regions even if you can't implement them in your current projects. Get overseas or USA experience if you can.

Level advancement will come in a few years, but if you aren't working now for it, it won't come to you.

Do you think Udemy and other such online carriers are a good place for some of these courses? or are there others...

Cheers.

[ExtraSlow]

Coursera, udemy, Khan, really it doesn't matter where you get the course from, because you aren't doing it for the certification in most cases. If it's anything to do with coding or data science, you also want to built up your portfolio in the developer communities (stackexchange etc)

Actually, if you want someone to critique specific courses or learning platforms, those communities would be the place to ask that question.

[Marsh]

Then you have to live in China, which would suck a lot.

Not necessarily, You could easily live in Singapore or Hong Kong and just jump a quick flight to China to fly out.

[bjstare]

Regarding the O&G landscape right now, Canada is still a tough place to make much "progression" on both the producer and service side of things. However, if you are currently employed, now is a great time to make sure you are really learning things and differentiating yourself from your peers. Get to the field as much as you can, get some complimentary skills in data science, public speaking, sales or management (cheap online courses in all of these). Read SPE papers and keep up on best practices from other regions even if you can't implement them in your current projects. Get overseas or USA experience if you can.

Level advancement will come in a few years, but if you aren't working now for it, it won't come to you.

This is solid advice. Only thing I'd add to that, is find an extracurricular at your company and get very involved in that. There's no better way to network with your company leadership than being involved in/driving non-profit work that the company supports, and having personal relationships with leadership is a great differentiator (arguably the best, in my experience).

[ExtraSlow]

For sure. And of course all this advice is only helpful if you have the mental energy to do it. So many people are suffering depression or other mental health issues after watching thier friends and family get laid off. Now is also a great time to make use of your company health services and talk to a counsellor or therapist. In many cases even two or three sessions can be a really healthy reset.

[Darkane]

Damn extraslow and his great advice.

I think you motivated me to take some additional courses.

I’m already involved in a work side project where I rub elbows with the GMs and VPs.

Time to step it up, regardless of economy. Standing out is the most important thing.

[vengie]

Coursera, udemy, Khan, really it doesn't matter where you get the course from, because you aren't doing it for the certification in most cases. If it's anything to do with coding or data science, you also want to built up your portfolio in the developer communities (stackexchange etc)

Actually, if you want someone to critique specific courses or learning platforms, those communities would be the place to ask that question.

I can't rep you anymore unfortunately, but thank you for this post. :thumbsup:

[ExtraSlow]

I can't rep you anymore unfortunately, but thank you for this post. :thumbsup:

I accept high-fives at the foodie meets as well.

[Maxx Mazda]

You know that in Asia right now, they are paying INSANE $$$ for bush pilots from Canada? You know, the ones who can actually FLY a fucking airplane hands on? (instead of pushing buttons and reading a chart). HUGE problem with pilots there who just go through the motions but know very little about HAND flying.

Senior captains (777, etc.) were getting offered something like 1/2 million $$ a year in China for eg. (as a contract pilot).

I know a few guys who have made the expat mistake overseas (both in Asia and the sandbox.) they all say the same thing. There’s a reason they have to pay insane amounts of money, and STILL can’t put qualified guys in their airplanes.

The phrase “because China” doesn’t even begin to cover it...

[revelations]

I know a few guys who have made the expat mistake overseas (both in Asia and the sandbox.) they all say the same thing. There’s a reason they have to pay insane amounts of money, and STILL can’t put qualified guys in their airplanes.

The phrase “because China” doesn’t even begin to cover it...

I was thinking of a 3 year contract perhaps - and then come back to NA ready to fly the majors. I know people who (white canadians) went to live in China (not as pilots) and they did just fine.

Is there a forum or discussion group that talks about the major problems expats face?

[95EagleAWD]

I was thinking of a 3 year contract perhaps - and then come back to NA ready to fly the majors. I know people who (white canadians) went to live in China (not as pilots) and they did just fine.

Is there a forum or discussion group that talks about the major problems expats face?

AvCanada if you’re willing to put up with the cesspool.

But yeah China sucks balls. I’d rather make less money here.

[Maxx Mazda]

I was thinking of a 3 year contract perhaps - and then come back to NA ready to fly the majors. I know people who (white canadians) went to live in China (not as pilots) and they did just fine.

Is there a forum or discussion group that talks about the major problems expats face?

Problem is, if the airline gig is your goal, even if you go overseas and make a million bucks and come back here in 3-5 years, even IF you get on with a major here or in the states, you’re now ~1200 seniority numbers behind where you’d have been if you just stayed on. Once you do the expat thing you can’t really come back from it. I’ve seen a few guys go back to corporate, but you’re starting all over again if you head the airline route. Doesn’t matter if you’ve got 20,000 hours on the 777 you’re still going bottom of the list.

[Buster]

Problem is, if the airline gig is your goal, even if you go overseas and make a million bucks and come back here in 3-5 years, even IF you get on with a major here or in the states, you’re now ~1200 seniority numbers behind where you’d have been if you just stayed on. Once you do the expat thing you can’t really come back from it. I’ve seen a few guys go back to corporate, but you’re starting all over again if you head the airline route. Doesn’t matter if you’ve got 20,000 hours on the 777 you’re still going bottom of the list.

So unions suck basically

[revelations]

Ah - true - but heres the deal - there is an actual (starting to be) pilot shortage - even in North America - which will get worse in time.

More and more potential pilots realize that going 200,000$ in debt combined with 50,000$ a year in income, makes no sense. Fuck, 10 years ago some of the regional low time FOs were making 9,000$ a year.

Soon the unions will have to make concessions to let in the pilots with heavy experience, in at a certain level (not bottom). Otherwise no one is going to work for them.

[ExtraSlow]

Unions are awful for skilled professionals.

[msommers]

Ah - true - but heres the deal - there is an actual (starting to be) pilot shortage - even in North America - which will get worse in time.

More and more potential pilots realize that going 200,000$ in debt combined with 50,000$ a year in income, makes no sense. Fuck, 10 years ago some of the regional low time FOs were making 9,000$ a year.

Soon the unions will have to make concessions to let in the pilots with heavy experience, in at a certain level (not bottom). Otherwise no one is going to work for them.

A family friend of ours has been a pilot for a long time with Air Canada, doing transpacific flights for the last...10? As far as I understand, he's making quite good money...

It'd be a hard life anyways as a pilot. Plus I recall some statistic that it's just hard on your body with the large swing in changing altitudes, year after year.

Someone at Westjet told me that long-time flight attendents can make upwards of 70-80k+/yr....

[ianmcc]

Unions are awful for skilled professionals.

Unions are awesome for unskilled laborers.

[ExtraSlow]

True dat bruvah.

[Toilet_X]

Liuna out here in Toronto pays great. Labourer wage of around 35 an hour. Our swampers are something like 38 an hour. But then again, that cost of living here.

[95EagleAWD]

Liuna out here in Toronto pays great. Labourer wage of around 35 an hour. Our swampers are something like 38 an hour. But then again, that cost of living here.

Depends where you are in Toronto, as I’m sure you know. Toronto proper is expensive as hell. If you’re out in Durham or Hamilton or Vaughn or something it’s quite a bit cheaper.

[speedog]

Depends where you are in Toronto, as I’m sure you know. Toronto proper is expensive as hell. If you’re out in Durham or Hamilton or Vaughn or something it’s quite a bit cheaper.

Yeah but a bitch of a commute from Durham to Toronto proper.

[95EagleAWD]

Yeah but a bitch of a commute from Durham to Toronto proper.

Oh god it sure is. My gf does the reverse commute from our place and it’s not bad but the other way looks like hell.

[msommers]

As a geologist I'm trying to figure out what to do, what my transferrable skills are, where to live that isn't Texas...

Feeling like I need to start over.

[bjstare]

As a geologist I'm trying to figure out what to do, what my transferrable skills are, where to live that isn't Texas...

Feeling like I need to start over.

Just go to Texas. Preferable climate, cost of living, wages, and economy.

I'm getting great progression and such here in Calgary, but I'm still thinking of going down there in the near term.

[BavarianBeast]

As a geologist I'm trying to figure out what to do, what my transferrable skills are, where to live that isn't Texas...

Feeling like I need to start over.

Maybe work for a geotechnical firm that works in construction. I work with a lot of them that are ex-O&G and they all love the change.

[bigboom]

Just go to Texas. Preferable climate, cost of living, wages, and economy.

I'm getting great progression and such here in Calgary, but I'm still thinking of going down there in the near term.

Lifestyle sucks though if you are into to anything active outdoors. Spent a bunch of time in Midland and Houston lately and it would drive me nuts.

[ExtraSlow]

Denver buddies. That's a cool town, and lots of outdoors stuff.

[Buster]

Denver buddies. That's a cool town, and lots of outdoors stuff.

shhhh.

That's what I've concluded too.

It's top of the list of about 10 places in the US I'd rather live than anywhere in Canada.

[ExtraSlow]

Unless you move to portland and just #getweird

[Maxx Mazda]

Unless you move to portland and just #getweird

Portland is a shithole.