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speedog
06-16-2020, 07:39 AM
After being on beyond for a few years now and in light of some more recent threads, it has become apparent that there are more than a few beyond members out there who appear to believe that they are so mission critical to the company they toil for that they are almost irreplaceable or that the company they toil for would almost come to a standstill if they weren't available.

Now I have been an indentured schmuck for a large corporation, have worked for others in very small 2 man operations, have owned my small relatively small independent company and now just work for other companies as a subcontractor and at no time did I believe that I was not replaceable.

But I have across many others over the years who thought they were almost god's gift to that company that they were working for and what a shock it was for them to be to be laid off or packaged out. I watched people at TELUS who had to be escorted out by security and police when their time came and yeah, what they were doing as an employee was maybe important but the company just soldiered on and either there was someone else who stepped up to do the work of that removed employee or it was quickly found out that that employee's specialized niche wasn't all that niche-like after all.

As a company owner, I fairly quickly got people hired on that could run the place if I was gone and I mean run the place to the point that I could go off grid for 10 days straight which we did every year - nothing like fishing in a rowboat for 6-7 hours on a remote high mountain lake in BC where there was no services at all and the only company one had was moose, deer and the occasional bear in the woods.

When I worked for someone else in a small 2 man operation, the owner of that company was able to take very remote getaways as we'll other continents bcause I could run the whole,operation but wth the same time I wasn't irreplaceable and when I opted to move on, the owner did find someone else to step in to cover my shifts.

Now currently as a subcontractor, I am easily replaceable - I am not going to fool myself for one minute into some delusion that I am that important and/or valuable that I can't be replaced. As such, are you that untouchable, that valuable that the company you toil for can not continue to operate as normal if you're not around. I do get the sense that there are at least a few beyond members who place themselves on quite lofty plateaus although they are not remote plateaus because they need to be connected/available because important, eh.

ExtraSlow
06-16-2020, 07:43 AM
If you are referring to the camping thread, it's less about some inflated sense of self-importance, and more about using fewer vacation days and inconveniencing co-workers less.

killramos
06-16-2020, 07:53 AM
Yea if that's the thread you are talking about... That's the nature of some peoples jobs in this industry.

Whether you are too important to be replaced is irrelevant, but if its your job in the moment to be available to take calls at all hours of the day then you cant be fucking off into the bush without making prior arrangements willy nilly. When operations have standby fees in the 10's of thousands of dollars an hour while they wait on Calgary to make a call. You answer the phone.

Everyone can be replaced given enough time and inconvenience, that doesn't mean what they are doing isn't important in the moment and them not being there wont have significant impacts to the company.

I am lucky enough to be so far down the call list that no one would ever call me ( plus i have no idea what I would do if they did ) but not everyone is so lucky.

speedog
06-16-2020, 07:55 AM
If you are referring to the camping thread, it's less about some inflated sense of self-importance, and more about using fewer vacation days and inconveniencing co-workers less.

Well that thread is what kick started this one but there are many other threads where my thoughts can be validated as well.

If people actually believe that the being a bit less of an inconvenience to others or the company they work for makes them more valuable then they'll probably be in for a big shock some day - in the end, companies don't really give a damn about your skill sets when it comes to the crunch. You are simply a body with a number attached to it and when difficult decisions need to be made, your sacrifices will mean absolutely jack shit. Fuck, I have watched far too many so called valuable people let go over the years, people who thought their contributions would have more weight when crunch time came - what opener it was for those people.

Always be humble, always be good at what you're required to do and don't ever fall into the trap of a sense of an over inflated self worth to the company you work for even if it's your own company - customers will set you straight on that very quickly.

speedog
06-16-2020, 07:59 AM
Yea if that's the thread you are talking about... That's the nature of some peoples jobs in this industry.

Whether you are too important to be replaced is irrelevant, but if its your job in the moment to be available to take calls at all hours of the day then you cant be fucking off into the bush without making prior arrangements willy nilly. When operations have standby fees in the 10's of thousands of dollars an hour while they wait on Calgary to make a call. You answer the phone.

Everyone can be replaced given enough time and inconvenience, that doesn't mean what they are doing isn't important in the moment and them not being there wont have significant impacts to the company.

Heh, I watched TELUS walkout people on almost a moment's notice - people who many thought were invaluable and the company forged ahead with without the smallest blip showing up on their radar.

I'm not saying one can just screw off into the bush without a bit of notice, hell, I can't do that as a simple peon-like subcontractor but everyone should be able to screw off into the bush and getting off grid is really good for one's self.

killramos
06-16-2020, 08:04 AM
Heh, I watched TELUS walkout people on almost a moment's notice - people who many thought were invaluable and the company forged ahead with without the smallest blip showing up on their radar.

I'm not saying one can just screw off into the bush without a bit of notice, hell, I can't do that as a simple peon-like subcontractor but everyone should be able to screw off into the bush and getting off grid is really good for one's self.

Do you just think its not reasonable for people to be on call or something? You know its not 365 days a year right?

I mean, you do you, but people are well compensated for these inconveniences.

Again, it has literally nothing to do with inflated senses of self importance, its just the nature of your job.

Not every company is some massive organization like Telus where there are a dozen guys right behind you ready to take the call if you aren't either.

ExtraSlow
06-16-2020, 08:08 AM
I'll just say, in regards to the camping thing, if I can leave for camping at noon Thursday but I have to stay in cell range, or I have to leave at 5pm Friday and I can go "to the bush", I'll stay in cell range with a smile on my face.
I know exactly how replaceable I am, that has nothing to do with it.

speedog
06-16-2020, 08:11 AM
Do you just think its not reasonable for people to be on call or something? You know its not 365 days a year right?

I mean, you do you, but people are well compensated for these inconveniences.

Again, it has literally nothing to do with inflated senses of self importance, its just the nature of your job.

Not every company is some massive organization like Telus where there are a dozen guys right behind you ready to take the call if you aren't either.

I have seen the same in smaller companies as well, I get it, you're important. Sorry for offending you.

killramos
06-16-2020, 08:16 AM
I have seen the same in smaller companies as well, I get it, you're important. Sorry for offending you.

you still seem very incapable of understanding the difference between work being time sensitive, and conflating that with personal self importance.

rage2
06-16-2020, 08:17 AM
I am replaceable. I've always built my teams so that everyone on my team, including myself, is fully replaceable and that things will move on without any one of us. Everything (as much as possible) needs to be documented so that others can carry on.

I used to have a self importance complex. The company can't go on without me. Everything is in my head. It's very detrimental to personal life. I used to be the guy that can't be away from a laptop and internet at the drop of a hat. Shit goes down, nothing will get fixed without me. It's not worth it.

We're employed because we do what we do efficiently and effectively.

Buster
06-16-2020, 08:21 AM
Maybe people make themselves always available precisely because they are replaceable... And if they don't answer the phone they will get replaced.

lasimmon
06-16-2020, 08:25 AM
I mean I can pass call off to someone else in the office when I am away but it just makes a mess for when I return - such is the nature of the consulting business in O&G though. If I am out of the Country i'll pass off most of my responsibilities, if I am at the lake for a week or something I'll hold onto it.

ExtraSlow
06-16-2020, 08:27 AM
Maybe people make themselves always available precisely because they are replaceable... And if they don't answer the phone they will get replaced.
That's probably a better way of saying it.

vengie
06-16-2020, 08:28 AM
I am replaceable. I've always built my teams so that everyone on my team, including myself, is fully replaceable and that things will move on without any one of us. Everything (as much as possible) needs to be documented so that others can carry on.

I used to have a self importance complex. The company can't go on without me. Everything is in my head. It's very detrimental to personal life. I used to be the guy that can't be away from a laptop and internet at the drop of a hat. Shit goes down, nothing will get fixed without me. It's not worth it.

We're employed because we do what we do efficiently and effectively.

This is exactly how I run my team as well.
In fact I have a guy on my team who could very likely step right into my role tomorrow if needed.

I've never been a believer in hindering the experience gained by another employee in order to "protect my job".
If I want to move up, its my job to make sure I have someone to replace me.

That said, as of this moment I am one of the main "Calgary" guys, and I am on call quite frequently.
If I plan on taking time off, I make arrangements for coverage.

Nature of a 24/7 business.

Buster
06-16-2020, 08:33 AM
I obviously missed all the excitement. Then again, I would never click on a thread that had any sort of reference to "camping". Gross.

RX_EVOLV
06-16-2020, 08:34 AM
Everyone is replaceable. Several years ago in my small company (<5) one guy was responsible for everything sales and marketing related, and in most cases he was the only one interacting with all of our resellers and customers. He felt like he was irreplaceable, and if anything, he wanted to be the CEO because he thought he was already managing so many parts of the business. When I took over the company, as part of the restructuring I had to let him go to manage costs. When he left he told me the business is doomed because he's the face of the company and I can't do what he does.

Well when I told our resellers/customers the guy is no longer with us, all of them just said " oh okay! We will just talk to you then". Not only did we not lose any business, but sales grew >30% the year after. So yeah, very replaceable.

Buster
06-16-2020, 08:46 AM
replaceability is usually correlated to compensation. All things being equal the highest paid people are usually the ones that are harder to replace.

It's why CEOs and pro athletes get paid so much.

flipstah
06-16-2020, 08:55 AM
i am replaceable. I've always built my teams so that everyone on my team, including myself, is fully replaceable and that things will move on without any one of us. Everything (as much as possible) needs to be documented so that others can carry on.

I used to have a self importance complex. The company can't go on without me. Everything is in my head. It's very detrimental to personal life. I used to be the guy that can't be away from a laptop and internet at the drop of a hat. Shit goes down, nothing will get fixed without me. It's not worth it.

We're employed because we do what we do efficiently and effectively.

qft

pheoxs
06-16-2020, 08:59 AM
I'd say 4/10 or maybe 5/10. On one hand I'm completely replaceable, they could likely hire and train a replacement in ~3 months kind of thing but thats also because lots of things are well documented and organized. I think that's a good thing tbh because lets be real, after a couple years I'd rather jump on better opportunities than stay somewhere for life. I do say partially mission critical just because working on some projects that have to happen during turnarounds could get impacted if I dropped off the earth. It might be hard for someone to pick it up, learn on the fly, and still execute it on time when we have the shutdown windows at site.

As for if I could shift to working from a remote connection while camping ... probably, I use VPN+Remote Desktop so even if I'm running some scripts and my internet dies, the computer keeps chugging along. So it would be painful with tons of input lag but I could probably still keep things rolling along slowly for a while. Couldn't do it forever but could likely get ahead on work and then coast for a bit and then play catchup without any impact on my team members / projects.

ExtraSlow
06-16-2020, 09:10 AM
Even worse than being replaceable is when you get laid off and they don't even both to replace you. :cry::cry::facepalm::cry::rolleyes::dunno::cry: Had that happen to me, although, the role was designed for an environment that didn't exist shortly after I showed up. Although they then hired me back for a consulting thing for a bit. Job roles are transactions, and I'm slowly getting my head around that.

Disoblige
06-16-2020, 09:13 AM
I am replaceable. I've always built my teams so that everyone on my team, including myself, is fully replaceable and that things will move on without any one of us. Everything (as much as possible) needs to be documented so that others can carry on.

I used to have a self importance complex. The company can't go on without me. Everything is in my head. It's very detrimental to personal life. I used to be the guy that can't be away from a laptop and internet at the drop of a hat. Shit goes down, nothing will get fixed without me. It's not worth it.

We're employed because we do what we do efficiently and effectively.
YES!

Too many people in companies purposely hide info or act like they are the only one to do it. If you are of true value, you set up the architecture for long term success.

I also agree that it is not worth the stress just for a perceived increase in job security. In fact, a lot of people I see end up getting laid off/fired as companies eventually figure out you are replaceable as you aren't being efficient by doing shit like this.

sabad66
06-16-2020, 09:33 AM
My role is critical to our company's operations, especially when things go wrong and you need someone who knows all the pieces and how they fit with each other.

That said, notice how i specifically said "my role is critical" and not "I am critical". I am under no illusion that i am the only one in the world who can do my job, but the job/role itself is critical to our business area indeed. If it wasn't me it would be someone else and life/business would go on.

The Cosworth
06-16-2020, 09:39 AM
I used to think I was critical in every position I was in. Young, dumb, and ..... you know the rest. Now I realize that there are positions I've been in that might be more of a disruption than others, but power won't stop if anyone at our company is gone that day or the afternoon. As long as the position is replaced / trained up eventually we can catch up.

In a sense though it is freeing, I'm off right now from my surgery and it is a little worrisome being at home but also not too worried about it at the same time. I could find something if I needed to or would survive.

ExtraSlow
06-16-2020, 09:41 AM
I'm trying like hell to prevent my role from morphing into a "mission critical" operations role. I am working to push that to another guy and separate myself from it. I should know by Christmas if I've been successful.

flipstah
06-16-2020, 09:42 AM
Life is easier if you realize that you're just a cog in the machine and it's better to have spare cogs to take over for when you become a bigger cog :)

spikerS
06-16-2020, 09:50 AM
My role is mission-critical. My role is also one that will never generate income for the company and will always be a hole where money disappears. However, the company knows that my role can and has saved the company millions of dollars on the regular, so even when there is belt-tightening, our team is never touched unless it is a voluntary layoff.

Am [i]I[/b] mission-critical? No. We are a team of 14 people who all do precisely the same job. Any one of us could be replaced in a heartbeat and train a new person inside 3 months, and we are all money-hungry whores and we all love overtime.

Tik-Tok
06-16-2020, 09:53 AM
My current job, very replaceable, and I'm enjoying every minute of that.

My old job, well, two of us left at the same time, and over the next 6 months they replaced us with 6 people, and I'm still getting texts asking about stuff a year later.

So while replaceable, we were both important cogs, even though we didn't have important titles, or positions.

rage2
06-16-2020, 10:03 AM
Too many people in companies purposely hide info or act like they are the only one to do it. If you are of true value, you set up the architecture for long term success.
This drives me nuts. I had to deal with those kind of staff before and it takes way too much energy to simply get things documented. It's great once things are done. A year ago, I walked away from heading the Cloud Operations team and passed the torch to my next in charge, We had maybe 2 weeks of transition. Shit still running smoothly, although he had a bit of a rough ride for a couple quarters with the amount of stress. But the job function completely moved on without me.

I hope in a year or two time the new team that I'm heading can do the same and I can walk away. Because I'm sick of working with kenny. :rofl:

speedog
06-16-2020, 10:07 AM
Life is easier if you realize that you're just a cog in the machine and it's better to have spare cogs to take over for when you become a bigger cog :)

Hah, my very first gmail account and the one I still use all these years later is exactly related to being a cog in the machine.

Disoblige
06-16-2020, 10:15 AM
My role is mission-critical. My role is also one that will never generate income for the company and will always be a hole where money disappears. However, the company knows that my role can and has saved the company millions of dollars on the regular, so even when there is belt-tightening, our team is never touched unless it is a voluntary layoff.
"Value" for the company can come in operating efficiencies, cost-savings, etc. There are many ways one can contribute value. A company would be tremendously short sighted if they only saw value on income generation.

Xtrema
06-16-2020, 10:18 AM
YES!

Too many people in companies purposely hide info or act like they are the only one to do it. If you are of true value, you set up the architecture for long term success.

I also agree that it is not worth the stress just for a perceived increase in job security. In fact, a lot of people I see end up getting laid off/fired as companies eventually figure out you are replaceable as you aren't being efficient by doing shit like this.

Those are the one going to be replaced 1st. Because hiding info will eventually lead to bigger incidents that trace back to you.

Everyone is replaceable. But sometimes, there are value plays that give you bangs on the $ that makes it harder.

I am replaceable. I always make sure my guys knows whats up so I can disappear whenever. This goes double during pandemic.

The_Rural_Juror
06-16-2020, 10:19 AM
100% replaceable but so is my employer. Always demand to scrub toilets.

rx7boi
06-16-2020, 10:52 AM
I'm replaceable but not expendable.

I oversee data management/governance and database builds for my organization so the role comes with a steep learning curve.

We have plans for business continuity when I'm away but some days I wish that I had a counterpart who also worked full-time.

Skrilla
06-16-2020, 11:56 AM
"Everyone is replaceable, including me."

-Michael Schumacher

Reminds me of another thread about people flexing or something like that :dunno:

killramos
06-16-2020, 11:58 AM
"Everyone is replaceable, including me."

-Michael Schumacher


But his team would sure be pissed if he didn’t show up for an individual race.

The Cosworth
06-16-2020, 12:05 PM
But his team would sure be pissed if he didn’t show up for an individual race.

Yeah exactly, I think the comments about a position being critical and not the person is important. Can you run a race car without a driver? No. However can you get a different driver to fill that position? Sure.

max_boost
06-16-2020, 12:10 PM
I am replaceable. I've always built my teams so that everyone on my team, including myself, is fully replaceable and that things will move on without any one of us. Everything (as much as possible) needs to be documented so that others can carry on.

I used to have a self importance complex. The company can't go on without me. Everything is in my head. It's very detrimental to personal life. I used to be the guy that can't be away from a laptop and internet at the drop of a hat. Shit goes down, nothing will get fixed without me. It's not worth it.

We're employed because we do what we do efficiently and effectively.

Well said boss!

Everyone's situation is different but I am definitely mission critical. :D

"You will never be criticized by someone who is doing more than you. You will only be criticized by someone doing less"
Work smart, not hard but you have to work hard to figure out how to work smart. You are paid based on your value to the company. I'm important here but a nobody out there so I better govern myself accordingly.

Anyway, my issue has always been balancing the right amount of work with personal relationships. It's a struggle.

Skrilla
06-16-2020, 12:20 PM
But his team would sure be pissed if he didn’t show up for an individual race.

I’m sure they would lol. Just reminded me of that, was posted somewhere before.

SKR
06-16-2020, 12:24 PM
I hope to not be mission critical. Needing a certain person to be available at all times is a sign of a shitty operation. For every role there should be a pool of people who can rotate in and out seamlessly.

lasimmon
06-16-2020, 12:27 PM
I hope to not be mission critical. Needing a certain person to be available at all times is a sign of a shitty operation. For every role there should be a pool of people who can rotate in and out seamlessly.

I think most places can survive without someone for X amount of time. But that doesn't generally mean things will be done well or how they should be.

Having a pool of people that can rotate in seems like waste to me. But I guess that depends on what your company does.

topmade
06-16-2020, 12:36 PM
I can be replaced by a monkey. Only reason they keep me around is that I’m a good worker that does a decent job without pissing off too many people and I make lame jokes and bring in donuts and snacks sometimes.

SKR
06-16-2020, 12:38 PM
I think most places can survive without someone for X amount of time. But that doesn't generally mean things will be done well or how they should be.

That's a problem then. If having things go smooth for your customers is important to you, you need to be able to count on more than one guy.


Having a pool of people that can rotate in seems like waste to me. But I guess that depends on what your company does.

I only know my own job so maybe it's different at other places. But I can't think of any situation where a company would prefer that everything hinges on one guy.

killramos
06-16-2020, 12:40 PM
That's a problem then. If having things go smooth for your customers is important to you, you need to be able to count on more than one guy.



I only know my own job so maybe it's different at other places. But I can't think of any situation where a company would prefer that everything hinges on one guy.

Ever met a startup?

SkiBum5.0
06-16-2020, 12:47 PM
A family farmer - remove him/her and the business will suffer immediately.

dirtsniffer
06-16-2020, 12:47 PM
I'm far from mission critical and 100% replaceable. I do try to network internally and stay as close to the customer and dollars as possible. Been there long enough to understand how everything works but not too long where I'm abnormally high on the cost structure.

Also bring in donuts and snacks lol.

eblend
06-16-2020, 01:39 PM
I'm replaceable, but to a great inconvenience to the company as I know most of our systems inside and out...and it took me a good 5 years to get to this point, so if they replace me, the learning curve would be pretty high, but as long as you don't need to make any changes, I am definitely replaceable. I have never been fired or laid off from any job in my 15 or so years doing this, and have been asked to come back multiple times to the places that I left myself, so guess they value me most places. At my current place, we are a team of 7 that supports 1400 users, 14 offices all over North America, and I'm the only one who does what I do in my group, and the only one with the title that I have, so it would be a pretty big gap to fill as I have my hands in many many things. Replaceable, sure, but I don't think I gave any company I worked for a reason to get rid of me as I do the job, do it well, and doubt you would find anyone better for less money anyways, if saving money to the company is the primary concern. It also helps that there are at least a few other team members on the team who don't pull their weight and would probably go before me.

Disoblige
06-16-2020, 01:49 PM
... so the role comes with a steep learning curve.


I'm replaceable, but to a great inconvenience to the company as I know most of our systems inside and out...and it took me a good 5 years to get to this point, so if they replace me, the learning curve would be pretty high ...

I used to have this mentality, but I would just be a bit careful. Although training another person up can take up a lot of time/resources, in the end you wouldn't want that to be the main reason they are keeping you around. I would assume both of you are not in that category so don't take it personally, just sharing a thought is all.

People who have the decision making power for keeping you may not care about all the consequences of training someone new. They could be bean counters who are focused on something that is saving the company money in the short term, even if it sacrifices quality.

Devil's advocate: What makes you think the learning curve is steep that another person can't do it, or even do it better? In many cases, there is always someone who can be thrown in deep waters and manage really well.

Mitsu3000gt
06-16-2020, 01:49 PM
I'm in a very small group (just me and one other guy working directly under a VP), so if one of us was lost it would be catastrophic in the short term (possible, but would be massively inconvenient), but I'm well aware that there are lots of talented people looking for work right now and I feel very fortunate to still have my job. I prefer being overworked but highly valuable rather than being part of a larger team where each individual is much more expendable.

speedog
06-16-2020, 02:06 PM
Yeah exactly, I think the comments about a position being critical and not the person is important. Can you run a race car without a driver? No. However can you get a different driver to fill that position? Sure.

Kyle Larson in NASCAR learned that the hard way just recently.

eblend
06-16-2020, 02:33 PM
Devil's advocate: What makes you think the learning curve is steep that another person can't do it, or even do it better? In many cases, there is always someone who can be thrown in deep waters and manage really well.

It's not so much the learning curve itself, it's intimate knowledge of how most everything in the company runs off our systems. Anyone can learn how something works in some time, but it took my like 5 years at the same place to have a good understanding of our environment. I was initially a consultant at this place and full time about 4 years now. We have 4 data centers, 14 offices with some on-prem equipment, cloud services etc etc, so it's a lot of moving pieces with my hands in most of them. Each product by itself may not be that difficult to understand, but holistically it's a bit different. Customer service would suffer for example if I wasn't around, as someone would have to figure everything out from the ground up, so something I could fix in 5 min could take some one hours or days. That type of thing. I don't much care if they don't see the value in me and I get fired, will find another job. I'm in a good position where I don't need my work to live happily, but I choose to work where I do because I enjoy it. Not being cocky or anything, like I said, I am replaceable, it just never happened to me in my career and my mindset is like this at the moment. Think key is to keep on top of things, and if it's not entirely obvious, I work in IT and shit is constantly evolving, the moment you stop learning is when you are 100% replaceable. In my company, people I have seen fired were all useless, and good people are always around, so that gives me some comfort. I was personally involved in getting 2 people shit-canned because of my recommendation...they were on our team and were a sad excuse for an employees.

rx7boi
06-16-2020, 02:48 PM
I used to have this mentality, but I would just be a bit careful. Although training another person up can take up a lot of time/resources, in the end you wouldn't want that to be the main reason they are keeping you around. I would assume both of you are not in that category so don't take it personally, just sharing a thought is all.

People who have the decision making power for keeping you may not care about all the consequences of training someone new. They could be bean counters who are focused on something that is saving the company money in the short term, even if it sacrifices quality.

Devil's advocate: What makes you think the learning curve is steep that another person can't do it, or even do it better? In many cases, there is always someone who can be thrown in deep waters and manage really well.

I will preface my response that eblend and I both started out by saying we're replaceable so we don't lose sight of that.

IMO the amount of onboarding training required is never a reason why an organization should choose to keep an employee but to eblend's point, it is more about the period of turbulent transition when someone leaves, especially if their role has high business impact. People leave jobs for a myriad of reasons everyday so a business should be robust enough that work doesn't come to a halt. People more important than I in the organization have left and we're still trucking along so I don't have any misconceptions that we can adapt no matter who leaves/quits.

Even though my role has a steep learning curve, we make it a point to loop in others for cross-training purposes both from a staff empowerment and continuity perspective. Better to have someone be able to pick up 20% of the slack instead of 0% if I died tomorrow while they look for a replacement.

Lastly, to comment on your question: a job with a steep learning/complexity curve is not magic armor, it simply refers to how replaceable you are relative to the requirements of your position. There's always someone out there better but it's also a moot point because it doesn't change the fact that I'm the subject matter expert during my tenure with said organization. Fortunately, workplaces nowadays also value other things such as soft skills and how apt you are at advocating for your organization's mission values so the whole package matters just as much.

I just don't want you to misrepresent and attribute/imply what I'm saying as arrogance. There are alot of talented folks out there who can do what I do and more.

Just to be fair, a steep learning curve is all relative. It might be steep for me because I really enjoy going above and beyond in a role so part of it could be me projecting my expectations onto others. I think one of the best values you can bring as an employee is to have an enthusiasm and willingness to look beyond your role and how it impacts the organization and the work that others do.

Xtrema
06-16-2020, 03:02 PM
So am I getting the vibe that people who think they can be replaced are usually the ones you don't want to let go and replace?

AndyL
06-16-2020, 04:54 PM
and I'm still getting texts asking about stuff a year later.


My 2020 resolution was not to answer questions to an employer I left 7yrs ago.

I still get weekly calls or texts asking questions about how/why...

It doesn't seem to be getting me a job offer to return though :rofl:

R154
06-24-2020, 09:11 PM
I am replaceable as an entity within the framework of my company. My relationships, skill set & willingness to work until something is done correctly, is not. I have made it through years of downturn because when the chips are down my company (and the company I left) knows they'd rather have me than another joe anybody.

I guess if what you do isn't very specialized or can be easily trained then you'd have a different view. A lot of what I learned wasn't on the job, it was years of interest and training around the world.

When a critical data center needs a guy to figure out how to rejig a rented EPS in 4 hrs< because that is the time left on the UPS, then you want a guy who knows their system. Precious few people know how to setup a reliable microgrid using multiple different PP/CHP units and an unreliable utility within 2 12hr commissioning sessions with blank retrofitted controls. There are probably only 15 other people on beyond that know what I am talking about. If I had the skills of an electrician I'd be a one man show. Alas, I do not.

There are many jobs that are not replaceable and the people who work them are worth every dollar they are paid. My call out rate isn't my salary (god I wish), but I have yet to have a customer who doesn't pay their bill when I get a 2am call.

If I look at the pre-engineering only part of my job, I am hella replaceable. I also look at that part of my job as such. Its the project management/field execution/troubleshooting that isnt.

My team & I sat in front of 3 of the most powerful individuals in North American transportation infrastructure whom told me that if a single component of their electrical network fails, they are losing 1.4MM/hr. I carry a phone for this single customer. This phone is NEVER off. If I lose it they hand deliver a new one 3<hr. If I travel, on vacation, dying, its on me until I am dead/no longer in the industry. I have to alert them if I plan to be on an airplane/no reception. Typing it out loud makes me really think about how crazy it is.

The older I get, the less I care about making others aware of what I do. Now I just say "plcs and generators". In the past I'd flex on anybody who'd listen. The older I get the less defined by a title I get. Making it home with all my fingers and kissing my wife matters most to me. I also realize that it isn't ME who is important, it's my position. If they could find another me, they would.

ExtraSlow
06-24-2020, 09:24 PM
Buncha really urgent shit the last two weeks. 97.4% of it could have been done by an administrative assistant, or possibly even an engineer, if they had assistance. I have been assured the work was mission critical. I was also assured that nobody else was GOING to do it.

killramos
06-24-2020, 09:27 PM
Some people just don’t get it. Which is fine. Different strokes.

MalibuStacy
06-24-2020, 09:45 PM
I can't really meaningfully contribute to this thread being a teacher lol. If our provincial gov could have it their way I'm sure I'd be replaced by machine haha. COVID hasn't really helped this.

But at a fundamental level I believe everyone is replaceable and no one is truely mission critical. I think there are a lot of deficiencies everywhere and this breeds positions which would seem mission critical, and that there are often a lack of redundancies. I dunno man I just teach good :dunno:

Twin_Cam_Turbo
06-24-2020, 10:20 PM
1/10 I could be replaced in a few hours. There’s been a few times I felt like I should have I messed up so bad.

msommers
06-24-2020, 11:16 PM
I'm very important to the EI system.

A790
06-25-2020, 08:28 AM
I sit in the 6-7 range, which is why I have multiple contracts running because I am acutely aware of the fact that they can come and go pretty quickly.

flipstah
06-25-2020, 08:35 AM
My 2020 resolution was not to answer questions to an employer I left 7yrs ago.

I still get weekly calls or texts asking questions about how/why...

It doesn't seem to be getting me a job offer to return though :rofl:

That needed to be a resolution? :rofl:

cjblair
06-25-2020, 08:46 AM
Some people need to learn that "highly valuable/critical" =/= "irreplaceable".

killramos
06-25-2020, 08:48 AM
Some people need to learn that "highly valuable/critical" =/= "irreplaceable".

“You must spread some reputation...”

LilDrunkenSmurf
06-25-2020, 08:56 AM
3/10, very replaceable. The only reason I'm not a 1, is because it would take them at least a week for my replacement to get permissions, and another week to learn the environment.

ExtraSlow
06-25-2020, 09:08 AM
The entire point of this thread is to argue about semantics guys.

Rat Fink
06-25-2020, 09:31 AM
.

civic_stylez
06-25-2020, 09:53 AM
Im 100% replaceable.

Where I get some of my job security is with the position I hold and area that I oversee, the relationships with our partners is a very important part. To sever these without having another person in place that has been trained by the outgoing position would effect my company greatly. That being said, nothing is certain. My position is important but I, as an individual, not as much. I just work as hard as I can to grow our business and validate my role and salary every year.

MalibuStacy
06-25-2020, 10:06 AM
I'm very important to the EI system.

Lol

MalibuStacy
06-25-2020, 10:09 AM
The entire point of this thread is to argue about semantics guys.

Semantics?!? Did you just assume our genders?
Sorry, reminded me of a prof who marked me down slightly once for addresses my class as "guys" :whocares:

AndyL
06-25-2020, 10:12 AM
That needed to be a resolution? :rofl:

Yup.

Wasn't bad when it was an excuse to check in with old friends... But started to be random strangers demanding info they could look up easily...

msommers
06-25-2020, 10:39 AM
The entire point of this thread is to argue about semantics guys.

I thought it was about receiving negative rep

Xtrema
06-25-2020, 02:12 PM
Yup.

Wasn't bad when it was an excuse to check in with old friends... But started to be random strangers demanding info they could look up easily...

I did that a couple years when old colleagues were still there. Once they are all out and company keep calling, I start billing before answering anything. It stops really quick. It's not my fault that you fumble succession/transition plans.

The Cosworth
06-25-2020, 02:43 PM
I'm very important to the EI system.

Not sure you're how that works. LOL

MalibuStacy
06-25-2020, 05:24 PM
I thought it was about receiving negative rep

Damn cant give you more rep

mr2mike
06-25-2020, 09:17 PM
replaceability is usually correlated to compensation. All things being equal the highest paid people are usually the ones that are harder to replace.

It's why CEOs and pro athletes get paid so much.

All still replaceable.
Only an ignorant person would think that they're not. Or they just listened to their mom pumping them up as a kid a little too long.

Buster
06-25-2020, 09:30 PM
All still replaceable.
Only an ignorant person would think that they're not. Or they just listened to their mom pumping them up as a kid a little too long.

But not necessarily replaceable by someone with equivalent competency. At least according to their shareholders

gqmw
06-25-2020, 10:51 PM
But not necessarily replaceable by someone with equivalent competency. At least according to their shareholders

Well average tenure of a CEO is pretty short. Good CEOs are harder to find sure, but most of them get brought in to do specific job (growth, cost cutting, turnaround, etc.) and then it's onto the next CEO for the next stage of the business

legendboy
06-25-2020, 10:55 PM
I thought I was mission critical until I got a PIP out of no where which i refused to sign. I had done a good job training my replacement and was kicking ass at my job.
Now at 41 I am starting an electrician apprenticeship. Specialist industrial commercial electro-mechanical automation, instrumentation, controls and plc programming expert.

Now is a good time to make a change and do something I actually enjoy for the next 20 years. Hopefully things work out!

Buster
06-25-2020, 11:17 PM
Well average tenure of a CEO is pretty short. Good CEOs are harder to find sure, but most of them get brought in to do specific job (growth, cost cutting, turnaround, etc.) and then it's onto the next CEO for the next stage of the business

Yes, my point is if people with CEO level skills grew on trees, they would not be compensated in the way that they are.

killramos
06-26-2020, 07:02 AM
Well average tenure of a CEO is pretty short. Good CEOs are harder to find sure, but most of them get brought in to do specific job (growth, cost cutting, turnaround, etc.) and then it's onto the next CEO for the next stage of the business

I think the word “most” is extremely out of place.

speedog
06-26-2020, 10:21 AM
Well average tenure of a CEO is pretty short. Good CEOs are harder to find sure, but most of them get brought in to do specific job (growth, cost cutting, turnaround, etc.) and then it's onto the next CEO for the next stage of the business

Entwistle, in his 20th year at TELUS as the head machismo.