BMW M3 CSL vs Noble M12 3.0

[E36M3]

I've been looking through the classifieds and see a couple of each car available at tempting prices.. seems depreciation is quite high on both of these cars.

They are both lightweight, super fast and beautiful (in my opinion). What do you guys think? Which is a better overall car?

Neither one of them is practical (the M3 has a bigger trunk but keep in mind the CSL is stripped down to the core and only a two seater) -- I'd probably have to keep the S4 as a daily driver or at least for when I needed to move people or stuff.

Seems like the Noble would mop up on the track, but I think the CSL might be a better everyday cruiser.

[///M3]

i would go for the CSL as long as you dont care for the cons.

Pros:

-Shortened 3.23:1 final drive
-Top speed limiter removed
-Aluminum doors
-Reduced sound insulation
-Stiffer springs
-M shock tower brace
-Forged M Double Spoke wheels (7.5x17-in. front, 8.5x17-in. rear)
-M3 GT front spoiler
-Carbon fiber-look dash and center console trim

Options:

-M3 GT rear spolier
-Lower chassis X-brace (for added stiffness)
-Upper strut tower brace
-BMW M oil pan and dual-pickup oil pump
-Ride-height adjustable suspension
-Cross-drilled brake rotors
-Adjustable camber plates

cons:


-Air conditioning delete
-Radio delete
-Tool kit delete
-Console Valet delete


there were only 120 built so make up your mind fast!

[///M3]

hold on a sec. after actually looking up the noble id go with it. dayymmm.:eek:

[rage2]

The CSL looks too close to an M3. Noble, you can't mistake it for anything else. The noble is a much nicer looking car.

[E36M3]

All of the cons are negatable.. most of the M3 CSLs have Air Conditioning and Radio added (from the factory or dealer, I'm not sure).

There must be more than 120 I think.. there are four of them in the Auto Trader right now and at least 10 new ones still at dealers.

The Noble is pretty low production too.. I'd be surprised if there were more than 1000.

[statick]

this may be irrelevant, but if u hav an s4, y not just make that fast ? then u could buy summin else for a daily driver if u needed.

[E36M3]

I got a ride in a 450+ hp S4, and it was great, but it is still really a FWD platform (albeit in an AWD configuration) and I don't think the handling is anywhere near as good as these cars. The S4 is more of a grocery getter in my opinion.. it is a great car, but hardly a supercar like the M3 CSL or Noble M12.

I think that it would end up costing me about the same to upgrade my S4 (base car + mods) as it would to get one of these cars and I doubt it would be as refined and well sorted.. and it certainly would not be as light.


Originally posted by statick
this may be irrelevant, but if u hav an s4, y not just make that fast ? then u could buy summin else for a daily driver if u needed.

[ridiculous_]

whats a noble m12?

[Weapon_R]

At first glance, the Noble M12 looks like an unreal machine.

However, I cannot see that as being a daily, or even semi-daily driven vehicle. The turbo lag is a problem, according to reviews, which makes it difficult to drive at cruising speeds. The interior is also nothing I can picture someone as yourself feeling comfortable in. Not to mention, the engine isn't exactly one of the best you can get and the car seems like a fragile hybrid of parts.

My vote goes to the CSL for practicality (loosely stated) and the ability to hang with the best of them.

[E36M3]

Here is a link to Noble in case anyone doesn't know what an M12 is:

http://www.noblecars.com/new-noble-site/index.html

As for practicality, it really doesn't matter much.. the M3 CSL is pretty damn impractical too.

[ridiculous_]

wow get the m12 man, m3s are a dime a dozen compared to those

[NiteRider]

is the noble easy to find parts for, and is it easy to be serviced?

[E36M3]

Shouldn't be too bad.. England (where it is made) is where I am.. it uses a Ford supplied engine and mostly Ford parts (like a Saleen S7 or Koeningsegg before you get any ideas about it being crappy) so it should be serviceable at the local Ford dealer.. although I don't know that for sure yet.


Originally posted by NiteRider
is the noble easy to find parts for, and is it easy to be serviced?

[///M3]

oh sorry there were 120 made for the US market, is what i ment.

[E36M3]

I'm pretty sure none came to the US.. you might be thinking of the E36 M3 Lightweight.


Originally posted by ///M3
oh sorry there were 120 made for the US market, is what i ment.

[max_boost]

Originally posted by E36M3
Here is a link to Noble in case anyone doesn't know what an M12 is:

http://www.noblecars.com/new-noble-site/index.html

As for practicality, it really doesn't matter much.. the M3 CSL is pretty damn impractical too. Wow I didn't even know such a car existed.

[BigMass]

dude, get the Noble just for the fact that the rev needle changes colors as the revs go up.

[962 kid]

noble :thumbsup:

[blinkme_210]

Don't you have to sign a waiver from BMW stating that the racing tires equipped on the CSL are meant to be only used in dry conditions, and should anything happen when you drive in non-dry conditions you're not covered?

[africano]

There's a Noble dealer here in Canada, 1 g Racing.

http://www.1gracing.com/

Looks like a :bigpimp: car. Had a look over it on Sport Car Revolutions. Chassis looks awesome, think can 1.157 g's in the skidpad :eek: . Sweet car, sweet sweet car. :thumbsup:

[E36M3]

Where does it say they are in Canada? The link you sent is the U.S. dealer. If they are in Canada, I'd be interested in finding out.


Originally posted by africano
There's a Noble dealer here in Canada, 1 g Racing.

http://www.1gracing.com/

Looks like a :bigpimp: car. Had a look over it on Sport Car Revolutions. Chassis looks awesome, think can 1.157 g's in the skidpad :eek: . Sweet car, sweet sweet car. :thumbsup:

[africano]

I always assumed Sport Car Revolution was Canadian, like Tuner Transformations.

Could still be, my bad.


http://www.sportscarrevolution.com/index.htm

links to 1g racing but same site so, shitty.

[962 kid]

Originally posted by africano
There's a Noble dealer here in Canada, 1 g Racing.

http://www.1gracing.com/

Looks like a :bigpimp: car. Had a look over it on Sport Car Revolutions. Chassis looks awesome, think can 1.157 g's in the skidpad :eek: . Sweet car, sweet sweet car. :thumbsup:

the nobles are not legal in canada :( superformance (i think) has tried every trick in the book to get em here, but to no avail

[max_boost]

For curiosity, what's the price on both vehicles?

[Redlyne_mr2]

Originally posted by max_boost
For curiosity, what's the price on both vehicles?
The Noble is around $90K CND, the CSL is around $130K CND. The CSL is a rip off, why not just get a GT#? Its a round the same price and a much more capable car.

[rage2]

According to E36M3, the CSL's are heavily discounted in England, cuz nobody wants 'em.

[max_boost]

$130K for the CSL!?! God damn, I didn't even know they were so special to warrant such a price tag. Well the NSX is over priced too! For $130K, I agree with redlyne_mr2, it's Porsche time!

[E36M3]

Actually the Noble M12 3.0 lists at about 60k pounds (which is about 140 cdn or so) and the CSL lists at about 58k, so they are very close. Market value with each having about 2000 miles on it is at about 38-40k pounds. (100k CDN more or less)


Originally posted by Redlyne_mr2

The Noble is around $90K CND, the CSL is around $130K CND. The CSL is a rip off, why not just get a GT#? Its a round the same price and a much more capable car.

[boostless]

cars depreciate as fast as those cars accelerate in the UK, especially after the car is over 3 years older, might hav somerthing to do w/ needing an MOT (like an outta prov inspections sorta) for each year after, sorta like in japan...

IMHO...for that much dosh...grab up a porsche from there...lil more practical, pimp ride, still a fast ass car....

[DonJuan]

Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't a Noble M12 win the Road & Track ultimate supercar challenge a couple years back. From what I remember though it didn't have a turbo Ford 3.0, but rather the C5R powertrain.

[C4S]

Um ... by the way, when is the M14 coming ? Is it out yet ? damn nice looking car, and awesome performance too ..

I am just not a fan for the style of the M12 .. :)

[Chester]

Originally posted by E36M3
Actually the Noble M12 3.0 lists at about 60k pounds (which is about 140 cdn or so) and the CSL lists at about 58k, so they are very close. Market value with each having about 2000 miles on it is at about 38-40k pounds. (100k CDN more or less)



Have you take either of them for a test drive?