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View Full Version : Decent turbo setup for 1999 SiR (B16A2)



heavyD
11-29-2004, 09:15 AM
Originally posted by A790
Alright, within the next while (whenever I can save the cash) I want to turbocharge my SiR.

What will I need and how much will it cost, including the install (I am not a mechanic by any means). As well, could the car be used as a daily driver?

I'm looking to run probably 7 psi (to be safe). I want an intercooler and a nice blow off valve. I want something that will spool up relatively quickly and still pull nice and strong as I yank it toward that 8,000rpm redline.

Any ideas how much such a setup would cost? I am on a budget here and need to know how long it will take for me to save the cash :P

Leave the car stock! You are going to end up spending thousands of dollars for short term enjoyment and long term problems. If your Honda isn't fast enough for you buy a faster car. I love Hondas but there is a reason factory turbocharged cars are all the rage now.

eclipseqt
11-29-2004, 01:01 PM
Do it yourself and you will save thousands however, the Honda is not built for a turbo so if you leave the internals stock, an internal clock is ticking.

I think $7000 is quite steep, that's just for the turbo, install and tuning. Not even the internals so you will be limited when it comes to boost. It will give you a reasonable gain though.

heavyD
11-29-2004, 01:33 PM
Originally posted by 88CRX


not at all buddy:thumbsdow

He's actually correct. Putting a turbo on a Honda engine with stock internals greatly reduces the lifespan of the engine.:rolleyes:

dsmer
11-29-2004, 01:41 PM
Originally posted by heavyD


He's actually correct. Putting a turbo on a Honda engine with stock internals greatly reduces the lifespan of the engine.:rolleyes:

i dont know whos side you are on but its true, if it was built for a turbo they would have built the damn car with a turbocharger straight from the factory.

heavyD
11-29-2004, 03:18 PM
Originally posted by dsmer


i dont know whos side you are on but its true, if it was built for a turbo they would have built the damn car with a turbocharger straight from the factory.

I'm not taking sides but I agree with eclipseqt. Have you ever seen the rods on the B16A? They were not made for turbocharging (I owned one) but hey, kids these days have alot of money to burn so if that's what he wants. Turbocharging a B-series engine is okay if you have a reserve account for a rebuild because you will need it. Maybe not for 6 months or a year, but you will need it.

eclipseqt
11-30-2004, 12:04 PM
Originally posted by 88CRX


not at all buddy:thumbsdow

Have you ever turbo charged a naturally aspired engine before?

Try running 10 pounds daily on a stock Civic block and I guarantee you will eventually start droping pieces of your engine all over the road. A factory turbo engine would be able to withstand 10 pounds easily. Even if you are pushing 5 pounds of boost, Honda's piston rings aren't built to see any forced induction, they will eventually wear out a lot sooner.

It amazes me how you people think your Honda engines are bullet-proof when they aren't even close. Internals are a major flaw in naturally aspired motors, I wouldn't even go near a turbo without a properly built motor.

ls/vtec-crx
11-30-2004, 12:56 PM
Originally posted by eclipseqt


Have you ever turbo charged a naturally aspired engine before?

Try running 10 pounds daily on a stock Civic block and I guarantee you will eventually start droping pieces of your engine all over the road. A factory turbo engine would be able to withstand 10 pounds easily. Even if you are pushing 5 pounds of boost, Honda's piston rings aren't built to see any forced induction, they will eventually wear out a lot sooner.

It amazes me how you people think your Honda engines are bullet-proof when they aren't even close. Internals are a major flaw in naturally aspired motors, I wouldn't even go near a turbo without a properly built motor.

WHATEVER! you guys have no clue! I have known quite a few people that have been running stock honda motors turbocharged running anywhere from 6-11psi of boost and no problems . these cars are daily drivers and also bagged quite often. Couple of these guys have been running them for at least 2-3years. All you guys assume that all these other people that have blown their motor was just because of boost. In fact it could be inproper fuel management (which is the case for most) and in my own experience shitty parts. In my case used a copper head gasket, didn't seal properly and was leaking boost pressure into coolant system. THis was in my 2000 type r which was running a good 9psi. I have also consulted with a couple shops in vancouver which were also running stock type r's and they have been running flawless for 2 years.

yes parts will wear out sooner but ass long as tuned properly and maintanence is done more than usual then you will have a turbocharged vehicle that will last, not as long as a naturally turbo motor but it will last long enough

legendboy
11-30-2004, 01:03 PM
Originally posted by eclipseqt


Have you ever turbo charged a naturally aspired engine before?

Try running 10 pounds daily on a stock Civic block and I guarantee you will eventually start droping pieces blah blah fucking blah i have a dsm and i think i know everything blah blah blahblahblah

:rolleyes:

:drama:

Aleks
11-30-2004, 01:05 PM
Shit, I guess I just blew all this money for nothing?! :thumbsdow

gpomp
11-30-2004, 01:09 PM
Originally posted by eclipseqt
Try running 10 pounds daily on a stock Civic block and I guarantee you will eventually start droping pieces of your engine all over the road.
mine works fine at 12.......

ls/vtec-crx
11-30-2004, 01:11 PM
Originally posted by legendboy


:rolleyes:

:drama:

:rofl: :guns:

Dirty_SOHC
11-30-2004, 01:30 PM
Originally posted by eclipseqt


Have you ever turbo charged a naturally aspired engine before?

Try running 10 pounds daily on a stock Civic block and I guarantee you will eventually start droping pieces of your engine all over the road.

Mine seems to be holding together just fine at 9- 12 psi for almost 2 years now:dunno:

heavyD
11-30-2004, 01:39 PM
Originally posted by ls/vtec-crx
All you guys assume that all these other people that have blown their motor was just because of boost. In fact it could be inproper fuel management (which is the case for most) and in my own experience shitty parts.

Sure buddy. You keep telling that to your customers. :rolleyes: Boost is directly related to fuel management. If these people didn't turbocharge their car, they wouldn't need extensive fuel management. I'm still waiting for that three month old post of the 450 hp Honda you were pimping that mysteriously got removed when the guy's car went limp at Race City to come back up.

I'm not pimping any products or businesses, I'm just giving advise to people that may save them alot of money and frustration. But I know nothing and you are the expert so maybe he should listen to you and fork over $7K. Just get the extended warranty.;)

dsmer
11-30-2004, 02:14 PM
Honda is not built for a turbo so if you leave the internals stock, an internal clock is ticking.


not at all buddy. :thumbsdow



Originally posted by ls/vtec-crx
... yes parts will wear out sooner ...

umm, you just proved eclipseqt's point. :rolleyes:

legendboy
11-30-2004, 02:40 PM
Originally posted by heavyD


Leave the car stock! You are going to end up spending thousands of dollars for short term enjoyment and long term problems.


omg. you should talk! You should share how much you have spent on your rebuild/build up after you grenaded your mighty "factory turbocharged" (OOOO) dsm :rofl:

I guarantee i can build a stronger honda motor cheaper than you can for your dsm.



Originally posted by heavyD


Sure buddy. You keep telling that to your customers. :rolleyes: Boost is directly related to fuel management. If these people didn't turbocharge their car, they wouldn't need extensive fuel management.

uh ya, thats the same reason you blew your car up.....fuel management. has nothing to do with turboing a honda.

my system overboosted my motor, shit happens to everybody sooner or later :dunno:

EK 2.0
11-30-2004, 02:57 PM
HOLY...did we ever go off on a tangent here...

legendboy
11-30-2004, 03:18 PM
my bad my bad :D

Primer_Drift
11-30-2004, 03:23 PM
Originally posted by eclipseqt


It amazes me how you people think your Honda engines are bullet-proof when they aren't even close. Internals are a major flaw in naturally aspired motors, I wouldn't even go near a turbo without a properly built motor.

*cough cough* crankwalk *cough* dsm flaw *COUGH* expired warranty *cough*..
man I need to go to the doctor about this cold

edit: $7000 sounds reasonable for a installed and tuned turbo setup. Speedtech warranty thier setups outta curiousity?

ls/vtec-crx
11-30-2004, 03:59 PM
Originally posted by heavyD


Sure buddy. You keep telling that to your customers. :rolleyes: Boost is directly related to fuel management. If these people didn't turbocharge their car, they wouldn't need extensive fuel management. I'm still waiting for that three month old post of the 450 hp Honda you were pimping that mysteriously got removed when the guy's car went limp at Race City to come back up.

I'm not pimping any products or businesses, I'm just giving advise to people that may save them alot of money and frustration. But I know nothing and you are the expert so maybe he should listen to you and fork over $7K. Just get the extended warranty.;)

:banghead: :banghead: :banghead:

well let's see......his car was running great at race city but we specifically told him not to bounce his car off the rev limiter cause it was a fuel cut and not ignition but. so a couple weeks later at the edmonton shoot outhis first 11.8 run was the last cause if you want he video he specifically did not follow instructions and bounced it off the limiter numerously, which caused detonation and scored the sleeves and ruined the pistons. i honestly don't know what your talking about cause obviously you don't cause it never went limp at race city.

i don't know anything cause we haven't turboed any vehicles and have no experience in the honda world. so yeah just give me your $7000 and let me blow your motor :banghead: :banghead:

eclipseqt
11-30-2004, 05:01 PM
I'm not saying its bad to turbo a Honda Civic, but relying on stock internals will not be very wise. It wasn't designed to see any boost.

88CRX says it apparently is. Yes 88CRX, Honda specifically built its motors for boost. :rolleyes:

7 grand can buy a 95 Talon TSi. So if you want to invest that much into your Civic and run 10 pounds, best of luck to you. For 7 grand I can make a Talon run 12s.

As for crankwalk, why would you even bring this up? He is asking for information on turbocharging a Civic...

Primer_Drift
11-30-2004, 05:28 PM
Originally posted by eclipseqt
Internals are a major flaw in naturally aspired motors, I wouldn't even go near a turbo without a properly built motor.

If your eclipse is a daily driver, perhaps you shouldnt go near it. It seems it wasnt "properly built" with good thrust bearing to main cap clearances to withstand the longitudial stresses of a turbo motor..
My point being there are stock components of your factory turbo motor that increase its chances of catostrauphic failure, and despite common joe-dsm's belief the thing is not bulletproof. Granted it has a tougher reciprocating assembly than the average honda motor, this does not mean turboing a NA motor means you are doomed. Adding any power modifyer decreases the life of the engine.. unless you are downgrading :rofl: ...so what does an average 4g63 get for engine life in mileage?
[/threadjack]

heavyD
11-30-2004, 06:13 PM
Hey legendboy. Thanks for the new sig. You almost had me in tears that's so funny.:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

dsmer
11-30-2004, 07:57 PM
Originally posted by Primer_Drift


If your eclipse is a daily driver, perhaps you shouldnt go near it. It seems it wasnt "properly built" with good thrust bearing to main cap clearances to withstand the longitudial stresses of a turbo motor..
My point being there are stock components of your factory turbo motor that increase its chances of catostrauphic failure, and despite common joe-dsm's belief the thing is not bulletproof. Granted it has a tougher reciprocating assembly than the average honda motor, this does not mean turboing a NA motor means you are doomed. Adding any power modifyer decreases the life of the engine.. unless you are downgrading :rofl: ...so what does an average 4g63 get for engine life in mileage?
[/threadjack]

This isnt a dsm vs honda thread. Face it, its true, stock internals dont respond well to boost in the long run. You will be wearing out your rings. Even ls/vtec-crx said it. That is all. Sure 7000 bucks is a good deal but think of it this way, for that money you can already buy a different car.


Originally posted by legendboy

I guarantee i can build a stronger honda motor cheaper than you can for your dsm.


:rolleyes: sure you can. dsms, are infact pieces of shit right? i had a 91 tsi, less than 2000 into it and i was running mid 13s all day.

redline
11-30-2004, 08:00 PM
:whocares:

dsmer
11-30-2004, 08:18 PM
Originally posted by redline
:whocares:

:rofl:

legendboy
11-30-2004, 10:06 PM
Originally posted by eclipseqt
7 grand can buy a 95 Talon TSi. So if you want to invest that much into your Civic and run 10 pounds, best of luck to you. For 7 grand I can make a Talon run 12s.

Again, you open your mouth and show us all you have no idea what your talking about. Good job :thumbsup:


Originally posted by heavyD
Hey legendboy. Thanks for the new sig. You almost had me in tears that's so funny.:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

Honestly man, I don’t see anything funny about that. Seriously, you really must not know anything about building a Honda motor …or what it costs.


Originally posted by dsmer
:rolleyes: sure you can. dsms, are infact pieces of shit right? i had a 91 tsi, less than 2000 into it and i was running mid 13s all day.

Becides the fact that I don’t believe you :rofl: Trust me man, that’s nothing to roll eyes over. Lots of Hondas have done it for the same money.


I like DSM’s. I have done custom fabrication for them. Its just lots of DSM owners constant bullshit that bugs me. You won’t catch me chiming in a DSM thread about how they are pieces of shit and nobody should waste their money on them...blah…blah...blah. Thats what bugs me :guns:

eclipseqt
11-30-2004, 11:26 PM
Originally posted by legendboy

Again, you open your mouth and show us all you have no idea what your talking about. Good job :thumbsup:


I suggest you take a look at this thread before making your assumptions.

http://forums.beyond.ca/showthread.php?s=&threadid=66336

As far as you making a Honda run 12's for 2000 dollars. Good luck. I can tell you right now its pure bull shit. :bullshit:

EK 2.0
11-30-2004, 11:45 PM
Originally posted by legendboy
I like DSM’s. I have done custom fabrication for them. Its just lots of DSM owners constant bullshit that bugs me. You won’t catch me chiming in a DSM thread about how they are pieces of shit and nobody should waste their money on them...blah…blah...blah. Thats what bugs me :guns:



I have to agree with Legendboy here...it bugs me how DSM guys/gals are looked upon poorly...I mean we are not ALL bad...there are a few of us who are closed monded when it comes to accpeting other marks and models as being able to do what our "super" cars:D do for the amount of cash we put into them...

can't we just agree that a boosted honda does have its drawbacks??...and those drawbacks are the EXACT same drawbacks that a DSM has when you go and throw 25psi at it??

If you boost a Honda...even a a low 7-9psi, you run the risk of *BOOM*...if you boost a DSM past that of what the stock fuel system can handle what do you get??...wait for it...*BOOM*

you are all arguing the EXACT same point...you just do not see it...


there are plenty fast boosted Honda's abroad and locally...Sam's EG is a HARD CORE example of that...then you have Ed the SOHC's, Dirty_SOHC's, EGMikes, and Leo's rides to show that they can and are daily direvn...you also have that on the DSM side of things...I won't list names cause no one will know who they are...;) ...but yeah...

let's get back onto the topic of this kids kit for his H-Car...

Primer_Drift
11-30-2004, 11:54 PM
^^ agreed
A790 do you still want to turbo your car, or would you like us to fight about it? :D

redline
12-01-2004, 08:39 AM
Originally posted by dsmer


:rolleyes: sure you can. dsms, are infact pieces of shit right? i had a 91 tsi, less than 2000 into it and i was running mid 13s all day.

and how many trannies and clutches did you go through?

redline
12-01-2004, 08:46 AM
Originally posted by CycloneAWD
[B]



I have to agree with Legendboy here...it bugs me how DSM guys/gals are looked upon poorly...I mean we are not ALL bad...there are a few of us who are closed monded when it comes to accpeting other marks and models as being able to do what our "super" cars:D do for the amount of cash we put into them...



I remember going to the DSM meetings back in the day, and everyone would brag how fast their car was but no one would race cause they did not want anything to break! :rofl:


can't we just agree that a boosted honda does have its drawbacks??...and those drawbacks are the EXACT same drawbacks that a DSM has when you go and throw 25psi at it??

or a any 4 cyl....

Aleks
12-01-2004, 08:56 AM
Originally posted by Primer_Drift
^^ agreed
A790 do you still want to turbo your car, or would you like us to fight about it? :D

He's probably never gonna ask or think about boosting again! :rofl:

legendboy
12-01-2004, 09:35 AM
Originally posted by eclipseqt


I suggest you take a look at this thread before making your assumptions.

http://forums.beyond.ca/showthread.php?s=&threadid=66336

As far as you making a Honda run 12's for 2000 dollars. Good luck. I can tell you right now its pure bull shit. :bullshit:

If only i was allowed to ban people for being stupid http://www.telusplanet.net/public/legend88/Smiles/rolleyesshakehead.gif

legendboy
12-01-2004, 10:10 AM
Thread split because of all the garbage in this one. New thread here http://forums.beyond.ca/showthread.php?s=&threadid=68204