Help! 4 Ontario traffic tickets need advice

[wildflower]

Hi everyone! I'm new here so please bare with me. It's a long story but over a year ago our son got into a bit of trouble while driving our car. Due to a false report the police were waiting for him to come home and when he pulled into our lane they stopped him and pulled him out of the car at gun point. Anyhow when they didn't find any evidence in the car and realized that they had gone over board they impounded the car and removed it from our property. While it was impounded they slapped 4 fines on the car. 1) improper tire. 2) window tinting too dark. 3) failure to show front plate. 4) vehicle too dirty.
The tickets were all made out in our son's name but the vehicle is registered in his father's name. The car was towed back to our farm the next day at a cost of $350.00. Thank you very much! When the car came home, I took 5 pictures of the car to show that the car was not too dirty (even though we live on gravel roads) and to show that the window tinting is not too dark. Anyhow this is coming up for court in 3 weeks and I want to know if we have a chance of fighting this? I feel that the OPP were a bit embarrassed about their big take down and as a result used these tickets against our son so that it wouldn't look so bad to the Crown about what a big waste of time and taxpayers money this whole thing is. Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Thank You!

[Redlyne_mr2]

The OPP are the worst police force in Canada. Fight whatever tickets you can even if you dont think you have a case. Youre guaranteed to have some of those tickets reduced or thrown out.

[wildflower]

I hope so! Never been to court before but I think I'll make a good lawyer haha

[2002civic]

what window tint do you have on your car? are the front windows tinted? What did they say was wrong with your tire?

[wildflower]

All the windows have a light tint. The car passed a legal safety check 4 months earlier with the same tint.
I've seen some cars that the tint is so dark that you can't see into the car, with our car you can see through the windows.
They didn't say. Just wrote "improper tire" on the ticket and handed all 4 of the fines to my son while he was in jail. All 4 tickets are for $110. each

[90Tegra]

man i hate it when cops give u bs tickets
go and fight it in court and take the pictures with u and make sure ur pics got a date on them its better

last week i was goin 65 in a 50 zone and he gave me a 52.00 ticket and i know it was my fault but that sob called me a FUCKIN LIAR and a MOMMAS BOI cuz i told him i was speeing cuz i was late home
man if any kid told me that i'd punch them out but what can you do he is a fuckin cop

[skidmark]

And from the outside of the driver's window, some of the people we meet aren't so nice to know either....

[Sorath]

what did ur son do in the first place?

[turbo'dGSR]

Originally posted by skidmark
And from the outside of the driver's window, some of the people we meet aren't so nice to know either....

So does that mean anyone inside the drivers window, no matter what they act like or what they have done, should be called 'fucking liars and momma boys'? No. Are you a cop?:thumbsdow


On Topic of this thread, Id say just sit your son down and get the story as straight as possible so not :bullshit: comes up in court. Judges hate liars..obviously. not sure how things work with the law in ontario, so its kinda hard to say anything else. If I was you i would go to the Justice of Peace and try to get the fines way way down and demerits off. Also, did they issue you a court date or did u go get one? because usually $ tickets arent given when court dates are issued, with my experience. Good luck.

[Weapon_R]

Originally posted by turbo'dGSR

are you a cop?:thumbsdow




:rofl:

[FiveFreshFish]

Originally posted by wildflower
All the windows have a light tint. The car passed a legal safety check 4 months earlier with the same tint.

Bring your legal safety check paperwork and the five photos you took when you go to court.

[wildflower]

A girl that likes to make trouble for my sons, told the police that he pointed a gun at her and threatened her life with it.....she also told the cops that "she thinks he might be running drugs and guns to gangs in Ottawa".

So when he pulled into our lane, all 12 officers and K9 unit grabbed him.. all they got off of him was a very small amount of cocaine and 1 joint, they also confiscated his pellet gun which was unloaded and had no co2 left in it.

As a mother I'm not too proud to admit the drugs as we thought we had raised him well but he got in with the wrong crowd at his work and we had only found out about the coke a week earlier. Now the pellet gun issue was a joke. This girl came over to one of my son's friends house while he was showing it to some of his friends. Just before putting it away, he sort of waved it towards her in greeting. that's it. just a joke. She knew it was a joke as she said something funny to him and then everyone laughed. She later told the police that he held the gun to her head and said "die b__ch".

For a girl that was apparently so terrified of my son, she ended up going to the bar with him and his friends an hour before she called the police.
Anyways, it's been a hell of a year but the good news is that he went to re-hab and is clean and clear of the drugs.
But now we still have to go through all of this B.S.

[wildflower]

I doubt if we still have the safety certificate for the car as we sold it about 4 months after the arrests. Every time we drove it the cops pulled us over and if it was our son driving then the cops would start laying in to him and harrassing him. So we got rid of it. But I still have the 5 pics that I took of it and I also calculated the kms from our farm to pavement so that the judge can see that we need to drive about 5-8 kms either way on gravel roads in order to get to and from home. And besides the car wasn't that dirty at all, just a little dusty from the dirt roads.

[DayGlow]

Originally posted by wildflower
A girl that likes to make trouble for my sons, told the police that he pointed a gun at her and threatened her life with it.....she also told the cops that "she thinks he might be running drugs and guns to gangs in Ottawa".

So when he pulled into our lane, all 12 officers and K9 unit grabbed him.. all they got off of him was a very small amount of cocaine and 1 joint, they also confiscated his pellet gun which was unloaded and had no co2 left in it.



and your first post says this:


Due to a false report the police were waiting for him to come home and when he pulled into our lane they stopped him and pulled him out of the car at gun point.

So wait, the cops were told that he had drugs and a gun on him, and when he is arrested they found drugs and a gun on him and you call it BS?

-edit for bad grammer

[Weapon_R]

Originally posted by DayGlow


So wait, the cops were told that he had drugs and a gun on him, and when he is arrested they found drugs and a gun on them and you call it BS?

LOL the truth comes out. Who would've thought that the police would actually arrest a man who had a gun, marijuana, and cocaine in the vehicle??

[ehos]

:bullshit:

'Small amount of cocaine'? I'm pretty sure he'd be hauled off to jail + the pellet gun and the girls phone call = 1 day for sure.

This guy is just jerking you around. This thread, like many others should be closed. :closed:

[TrevorK]

Hopefully they have some charges for him for possession and something for carrying around a pellet gun.

There's always two sides to the story, and now it's coming out and doesn't look good for you.

[Sorath]

wait, if he`s convicted of an offense, cops arent legally allowed to search the car for other stuff. like for instance if u have weed in a drawer and they open it, but they`re arresting u for another offense, legally they're not allowed to charge him with that. unless of course the drugs were out in the open, that is a different story.

my suggestions is go to a lawyer and see whats best.
its good to know his rights and all before doing anything else.

[Weapon_R]

Originally posted by Sorath
wait, if he`s convicted of an offense, cops arent legally allowed to search the car for other stuff. like for instance if u have weed in a drawer and they open it, but they`re arresting u for another offense, legally they're not allowed to charge him with that. unless of course the drugs were out in the open, that is a different story.


:confused:

If the cops search you for drugs, and they find an M16 in the process, they're supposed to pretend that it never existed? WTF...

[DayGlow]

Originally posted by Sorath
wait, if he`s convicted of an offense, cops arent legally allowed to search the car for other stuff. like for instance if u have weed in a drawer and they open it, but they`re arresting u for another offense, legally they're not allowed to charge him with that. unless of course the drugs were out in the open, that is a different story.

my suggestions is go to a lawyer and see whats best.
its good to know his rights and all before doing anything else.

It's search incident to arrest. If you are arrested out of a motor vehicle the courts have ruled it is not unreasonable to search the vehicle. Especially in an insident like this where a firearm was alleged in the offence, and 1 was found on the person. It is not unreasonable to search the car for more firearms. In that search if you came across drugs, then you would re-arrest the individual for the drugs.

Basically the courts have ruled that the police may search for 1) safety 2) means of escape 3) evidence incident to arrest. The scope is much smaller if you are detained for investigation of a crime, ie matching the description of someone in an area that a crime just happenned. If you are detained the police may only search you for safety (weapons) and in the most un-intrusive manner, ie a pat-down. Now during that search you are found in possession of something illegal it is perfectly legal to then arrest you for that (say you had a handgun) then search for the other 3 criteria because you are arrested. During that search if drugs are found you would be re-arrested for the drugs, as well as the weapon.

[turbo'dGSR]

well wildflower, i dont know what to say now that ive heard about the pellet gun and coke bit. obviously a pellet gun couldnt harm a person, except for an eye shot really. but still, its a gun. your son needs to prove that the chick who called the cops and said he pointed the gun at her while being serious, is lying. A 'little bit of coke and weed' shouldnt be too much of a problem, its just the icing on the cake for the law. I think your little boy might have some fines and community service or something of the sort to serve. good luck with it all. I am sure Karma will serve its course...whatever that course may be none of us will ever know.

[wildflower]

I thank some of you for your advice. Others well your comments were not necessary. I know my son did a very stupid thing that night, and I'm not proud of the drugs but let me ask anyone of you if you ever did any drugs? Or are all of you perfect? Atleast he's learned his lesson and if the police were fighting real crime then they would go after the thugs that are dealing it.

As for the amount of coke, well it was a small enough amount that they found it inside his wallet, and the pellet gun was lying on the floor in the backseat.

I grew up on a farm and as a kid me and my brother used to shoot at each other with one. If they are considered a weapon then why can anyone off the street walk into Canadian Tire and buy one? No questions asked!

I've questioned all of the people that were there that night and no one saw him pull a gun on her. She's making it all up in her stupid little mind. Probably because my 2 sons are nice looking and several times she's made attempts to seduce them and they have politely refused her advances.

And no he didn't spend 1 night in jail. He spent 3. And we had to bail him out on the Monday and he couldn't come home ever again as the little slut is our neighbour and he has to stay withing 500 meters from her home. So we had to sell our farm and move just so that our son can come home. And no matter what the police think my son may or may not have done that night, it gives them no reason to boot kick him in the head and ribs and then to brag to each other about what a great take down they just did. Then on their way to the station they threatened to take him down a dirt road and beat the shit out of him. Some cops we have around here!

So you guys think what you like, I know the truth and i also raised my boys to tell the truth.

[abyss]

Originally posted by wildflower
I thank some of you for your advice. Others well your comments were not necessary. I know my son did a very stupid thing that night, and I'm not proud of the drugs but let me ask anyone of you if you ever did any drugs? Or are all of you perfect? Atleast he's learned his lesson and if the police were fighting real crime then they would go after the thugs that are dealing it.

As for the amount of coke, well it was a small enough amount that they found it inside his wallet, and the pellet gun was lying on the floor in the backseat.

I grew up on a farm and as a kid me and my brother used to shoot at each other with one. If they are considered a weapon then why can anyone off the street walk into Canadian Tire and buy one? No questions asked!

I've questioned all of the people that were there that night and no one saw him pull a gun on her. She's making it all up in her stupid little mind. Probably because my 2 sons are nice looking and several times she's made attempts to seduce them and they have politely refused her advances.

And no he didn't spend 1 night in jail. He spent 3. And we had to bail him out on the Monday and he couldn't come home ever again as the little slut is our neighbour and he has to stay withing 500 meters from her home. So we had to sell our farm and move just so that our son can come home. And no matter what the police think my son may or may not have done that night, it gives them no reason to boot kick him in the head and ribs and then to brag to each other about what a great take down they just did. Then on their way to the station they threatened to take him down a dirt road and beat the shit out of him. Some cops we have around here!

So you guys think what you like, I know the truth and i also raised my boys to tell the truth.


You have made some very good points, it also must be very hard to feel your hands are so tied while trying to help your son.

Just for the record, after some incidents where pellet guns that were purchased at Canadian Tire were used to harm some innocent people, theu have cracked down a little bit on who can purchase them. I can't say it happens at all stores, but it is policy now that everyone purcashing a pellet gun or co2 or anything related has to be ID'd and over 18. If it is found that an employee of CT sold a pellet gun to a minor that was used in a crime, that employee will be fired immediately and criminal charges will be laid on them as well. My former store took this policy very seriously and I hope the other stores did as well.

Again, I'm sorry about your son, I hope everything works out for you guys. I also hope that girl gets whatever she has coming to her.

[DayGlow]

A pellet gun is a weapon much like a knife is, or a baseball bat, etc. All can be bought in a store without much trouble and all can cause serious harm to a person if used against them.

For the police pellet guns are very difficult because they look very much like more powerful firearms. Often you do not know it's a pellet gun until after a call is over. There have been many sad incidents across North America where the police have recieved a weapons complaint and had a pellet gun pointed at them and they defend themselves with their firearm. Only afterwards can they find out it's 'only' a pellet gun.

I agree that they are too available to the public and should have tighter controls.

[wildflower]

Thank you both for your advice and understanding. I agree that pellet guns are too easily available but I must also stress that there never was any intent to harm her or even scare her. If my son wanted to hurt someone, he would use his fists and then they too would be considered a weapon.

Anything can be considered a weapon if it is used to harm another but just because they found a pellet gun in the car does not automatically mean that he used it and his intent was to hurt someone with it.

The cops blew things way out of poportion that night and they know it. This was the one and only time my son has ever been in trouble in his 21 yrs. His case is coming up in a couple of months and I hope everything goes good for him. It has too! He's a hard working, decent young man and he deserves a break.

As for the girl, "what goes around, comes around" and yes she will get what she deserves sooner or later. Her lies have caused a big pile of shit for many people.

[TrevorK]

Originally posted by wildflower
I thank some of you for your advice. Others well your comments were not necessary. I know my son did a very stupid thing that night, and I'm not proud of the drugs but let me ask anyone of you if you ever did any drugs? Or are all of you perfect? Atleast he's learned his lesson and if the police were fighting real crime then they would go after the thugs that are dealing it.


A suspected gun complaint is a REAL crime, and there was obviously justification for it if your son actually had something that resembles a gun in his backset.



And no matter what the police think my son may or may not have done that night, it gives them no reason to boot kick him in the head and ribs and then to brag to each other about what a great take down they just did. Then on their way to the station they threatened to take him down a dirt road and beat the shit out of him. Some cops we have around here!

Now, I don't know both sides of the story, so I can't comment on your son's injuries, but in all fairness you can not expect police officers to be relaxed during a situation that could end in a potential standoff (Which they must've thought it they had that many cruisers there).

I'm not saying what the cops did was right because I don't know the situation. But I am saying that cops treat these situations very seriously - and with good reason.



Now, for my more constructive comments. If you can prove this whole thing was a hoax you can always go through the civil court system as a means of punishing the girl and most likely retrieving a large sum of money for your son.

As well, if your sons charges are dismissed perhaps seek out the possibility of charging the daughter with filing a false police report/statement (I think it's illegal?). This would give further ammunition in case of a civil trial.

[DayGlow]

a false statement that starts a police investigation would fall under the Mischief laws in the criminal code.

[wildflower]

When this is all done and over, I want both of my older sons (19 & 21) to file for a restraining order against her. I'm afraid she will do this all over again in the future. She has caused trouble for my boys since they were 12 & 14 yrs old.
My son wants to file a suit against her but at this point I just want this to be done with. He has suffered much, but luckily the community here knows him and her and most, if not all are on his side.
The Crown is trying to plea bargain with him and he is tempted as he wants it to all go away, but I told him that he can't plead guilty to something that he is not guilty of, as that record will stay with him for life.
Once again, Thanks for your suggestions and understanding.

[TrevorK]

Originally posted by wildflower
When this is all done and over, I want both of my older sons (19 & 21) to file for a restraining order against her. I'm afraid she will do this all over again in the future. She has caused trouble for my boys since they were 12 & 14 yrs old.
My son wants to file a suit against her but at this point I just want this to be done with. He has suffered much, but luckily the community here knows him and her and most, if not all are on his side.
The Crown is trying to plea bargain with him and he is tempted as he wants it to all go away, but I told him that he can't plead guilty to something that he is not guilty of, as that record will stay with him for life.
Once again, Thanks for your suggestions and understanding.

IF the conviction is for any sort of violet crime, he may not be allowed to enter other countries as well - something to point out to him.

Besides if EVERYONE in your community is on his side, they won't have a problem with trial because they'll be on the jury.

[fast95pony]

Wildflower,you need a lawyer.

I suggest you also take off your rose-coloured glasses. You see your son as an angel,but he's doing drugs and carring a weapon in his car. Stop blaming other people and accept YOUR responsibility. If "he's clean and clear of drugs" , why was he carrying coke and weed ??
This girl has been giving your sons problems for many years,yet
he's a bar with her ??

I have a feeling there's more to this story than you are telling.

Perhaps it's time to find some proper councelling,not an internet site to sort out your problems.

[blueripper6]

fast95 that is exactly what I was going to say. Your son is no angel, he was doing coke and had a pellet gun, if he could get a real gun Ill bet that he would, and he would probably wave it around the same like its nothing. Pellet guns look like real guns, so when they saw your son had a gun, he deserves to get his ass kicked, what if he pulled it on them and it was a real gun.

A couple weeks ago at my school these people had a pellet gun and there was an armed standoff heh, but like I said it looks like a real gun so everything they did was right.. they had shotguns out and despite being infront of a bunch of kids etc etc etc.. they did the right thing.

Dont say if the cops were out fighting real crime they would bust the dealers. YOUR SON IS COMMITING CRIMES, HES GOT DRUGS, those are crimes, dont say that there just petty crimes cause he only had a little bit of coke and weed. Your son probably just got lucky and just made a deal or something, gettin rid of his dope!

Do you think the cops just magically know who all the dealers are and shit? They get tips from people who get busted and tips from other people in general and then have investigations, Ill bet that your son's little slut friend is right about everything. And u thinking u raised some little angels u believe EVERYTHING your son says. Guess what, hes lying to you, all kids lie to there parents, there just to ignorant to see it.

Its like poker, U have 3 of a kind, but know someone has a straight, its hard to lay down that hand.:rofl:

[hampstor]

Originally posted by DayGlow


-edit for bad grammer

I hate to be a post whore but i have to do this...

GRAMMAR ;)

[DayGlow]

I make no quams that I have terrible spelling. I see it as entertainment value in my posts.

[jaysas_63]

Originally posted by Sorath
wait, if he`s convicted of an offense, cops arent legally allowed to search the car for other stuff. like for instance if u have weed in a drawer and they open it, but they`re arresting u for another offense, legally they're not allowed to charge him with that. unless of course the drugs were out in the open, that is a different story.

my suggestions is go to a lawyer and see whats best.
its good to know his rights and all before doing anything else.

actually if a cop has a reasonable doubt that there is a weapon or drugs in ur car, he can do a search,,,...there is no need for a warrent to search ur car, a car is not like ur house....

[liztic]

Hey, this same bs happened to a friend of mine.
He took it to court, and had a lawyer walk up to him and say that the problem was settled, dropped 2 tickets, but pay other three. He faught and got off, he was also taken in because his truck was locked and he refused allowing them to search it without a warrant, they got the warrant, and found, make sure your sitting, A 3 SUBS POWERED BY TWO AMPS........OH MY.

Long story short, his uncle is a lawyer......filed against the police force for brutality and 2 other charges....can't remember them........took a 22g pay off........don't let the bastards get away with it