Iraq is a DISASTER - Unseen PIx, Untold Stories

[Gweedo]

Images of thousands of dead U.S. soldiers helped to turn the tide of public opinion against the Vietnam War, but now photo-journalists are even banned from military funerals at Arlington national cemetery. A report this weekend in the Los Angeles Times documented the extremely rare publication of photos of American casualties in six major newspapers during a sixth month period. Readers of the Atlanta Journal-Constitution, Los Angeles Times, New York Times, St. Louis Post-Dispatch and Washington Post never saw a single picture of a dead serviceman or servicewoman in their morning papers.

The American public has been the most sheltered than any other country from the real war in Iraq, instead they see a glorified version of US servicemen and women through their incredibly bias media.

CLICK ON THE VIDEO LINK WHILE FOLLOWING ALONG WITH THE TEXT BELOW. VIDEO: http://play.rbn.com/?url=demnow/demnow/demand/2005/may/video/dnB20050524a.rm&proto=rtsp&start=26:02


From Democracynow.org
Violence continues in Iraq on a daily basis. A car bomb in central Baghdad killed at least nine Iraqis on Tuesday. Meanwhile the death toll from a string of attacks on Monday has risen to at least 54. Over 130 people were wounded. Over 600 Iraqis have been killed in just over a month.
The latest attacks came as American and Iraqi forces are conducting a joint offensive in Baghdad. The US military announced that over 420 people were arrested in just over 30 hours during the sweep dubbed "Operation Squeeze Play."

Five US troops have also been killed in the past two days. But Americans almost never see photographs from Iraq showing U.S. troops killed in action. Images of thousands of dead U.S. soldiers helped to turn the tide of public opinion against the Vietnam War, but now photo-journalists are even banned from military funerals at Arlington national cemetery. A report this weekend in the Los Angeles Times documented the extremely rare publication of photos of American casualties in six major newspapers during a sixth month period. Readers of the Atlanta Journal-Constitution, Los Angeles Times, New York Times, St. Louis Post-Dispatch and Washington Post never saw a single picture of a dead serviceman in their morning papers.

We're joined on the phone by L.A. Times reporter James Rainey who wrote the story. And in the studio we are joined by veteran journalist Sidney Schanberg, now the media columnist for the Village Voice. Schanberg has covered wars in India, Vietnam and Cambodia and won a Pulitzer prize in 1976 for his reporting on the rise of the Kmer Rouge and dictator Pol Pot in Cambodia. Last week, he wrote a piece in the Village Voice calling on journalists not to omit important information and images out of "timidity or squeamishness." He writes that the reason governments seek to censor and sanitize wartime coverage is "to prevent a public outcry against the war, an outcry that might bring down the administration." We are also joined by Pacifica Radio reporter Aaron Glantz. He spent months covering the occupation of Iraq and is author of the new book "How America Lost Iraq."

Children of the Iraq War:
http://www.boyko.org/gweedo/thechildren/

[jumperman8]

:whocares:

we are in Canada i dont care.

[jumperman8]

Not to mention, Iraq was a disaister prior to the Americans showing up, jsut now there are journalists over there to accually see.

[tapout]

Originally posted by jumperman8
Not to mention, Iraq was a disaister prior to the Americans showing up, jsut now there are journalists over there to accually see. iraq became a disaster from the us by keeping sanctions after the gulf war. as for you posting :whocares: show what kind of person you are. iraq has enough resources to rebuild on its own.the usa is there for 1 reason oil not for the iraqis if thoes tyrants were so worried for for the happyness of iraqis why dont they go to africa where there are children dying every day people .or is it that africa has no oil?

[Super_Geo]

Originally posted by jumperman8
Not to mention, Iraq was a disaister prior to the Americans showing up, jsut now there are journalists over there to accually see.

You have no clue what you're talking about. Pre-Gulf War, Iraq was "the jewel of the middle east" and was far, far better than they are now. But I like how your opinions are based on... well, nothing I'm guessing.

Here's a present (http://www.calgarypubliclibrary.com/) for you though. Put it to good use.

[tapout]

Originally posted by Super_Geo


You have no clue what you're talking about. Pre-Gulf War, Iraq was "the jewel of the middle east" and was far, far better than they are now. But I like how your opinions are based on... well, nothing I'm guessing.

Here's a present (http://www.calgarypubliclibrary.com/) for you though. Put it to good use. well said:thumbsup:

[civicrider]

tsk tsk tsk you simple minded liberal canadians, when will you learn. USA knows whats up and they know what has to be done so they can remain on top. they need money and power, and thats what they are doing. from our point of view it seems terrible and a bad idea of course because we get nothing. oh and you can say the americans economy is going down bla blah blah, once they get full bennefit of all that oil it will go right back up anyway, and the people going in the shitter are the lower class who are useless themsevles and didnt get a good job and chose that life. Canada needs to watch its back the government takes away the peoples weapons and other little parts of freedom at a time. who was that other government that dissarmed the people... oh yeah Hitler :rofl:

[civicrider]

also no need to ask wheres your proof wheres a link to back yourself up? dont bother i talk about ideas and possibilities because you'll never get the truth reading dumb news articles kinda like the crap above, its bias one way or the other its all garbage.

[Super_Geo]

Originally posted by civicrider
tsk tsk tsk you simple minded liberal canadians, when will you learn. USA knows whats up and they know what has to be done so they can remain on top. they need money and power, and thats what they are doing. from our point of view it seems terrible and a bad idea of course because we get nothing. oh and you can say the americans economy is going down bla blah blah, once they get full bennefit of all that oil it will go right back up anyway, and the people going in the shitter are the lower class who are useless themsevles and didnt get a good job and chose that life. Canada needs to watch its back the government takes away the peoples weapons and other little parts of freedom at a time. who was that other government that dissarmed the people... oh yeah Hitler :rofl:

How does that change the fact that the US is violating international law? Just because they can get away with it doesn't mean that we should support it. Of course they're scared shitless peak oil production and they realize one thing: Everyone else in the world's oil productions will slow to a crawl in the next few decades while the Middle East will have the last of the world's "readily accessible" supplies.

I like that you support that, because there's another "peak" that's coming up, and that's peak water. The rate at which we use fresh water is absolutely unsustainable. So, sometime in the not-so-distant future, it'll be harder and harder to get fresh water. You can purify water, but that takes a lot of energy. And with oil era nearing its rough and volitale finale, squandering energy on purifying water would be a necessary but costly sacrifice.

Good thing for people like you though, America is also on top of this problem. The USA is the only country in the world that doesn't acknowledge Canada's arctic boarders and sphere of influence because, when that time comes, they want to be able to tow away the iceburgs there without incident. Nevermind how badly we're getting raped on our current dealings with them for bulk electricity sales or water out of the Great Lakes, this is basically them saying "when the time comes, we're going to take [this Canadian resoure] away from you guys, because we need it."

I'm guessing you support that as well? Or is it simply easier to support policies that marginalize and repress brown people?

The USA is pretty much just like the bully in the playground right now. Sure it's easy to sit back and laugh as they pick on the smaller kids cause you're too afarid to stand up to him, but sooner or later it's going to be us. This is one of the big reasons why I think we should support international law all the time, because that's the only way we can retain credibility with the rest of the world when it's our resources that need protecting.

[civicrider]

a humans first instint is survival so of course if needed they will invade for water if nessasary. no i wouldnt support it because it will effect me negativly, as for the USA invading Iraq i suport it because it could become positive for me. any smart person would think like this. and why do you turn it into a racial disscussion, it has nothing to do with skin color, thats what you liberals do change the idea to make it look worse good example you just gave.

[bundi]

wow never heard this...


The USA is the only country in the world that doesn't acknowledge Canada's arctic boarders and sphere of influence because, when that time comes, they want to be able to tow away the iceburgs there without incident.

toberownd.

[Super_Geo]

Originally posted by civicrider
a humans first instint is survival so of course if needed they will invade for water if nessasary. no i wouldnt support it because it will effect me negativly, as for the USA invading Iraq i suport it because it could become positive for me. any smart person would think like this. and why do you turn it into a racial disscussion, it has nothing to do with skin color, thats what you liberals do change the idea to make it look worse good example you just gave.

Race is definately a part of this discussion. I strongly believe that Canada would have a much harder time supporrting US strikes against Britian, Austrialia, France, or any other nations with a good chunk of WASP citizens.

It's the same reason that after WWII over 4/5 (80%) of all Americans was clammoring for "enough nuclear bombs to fully wipe out the Japanese people" while a lot of the press (even in Canada) spoke candidly about how it was fortunate that the bomb was used against the people of Japan instead of Germany.

I'm not denying for a second that the reasons these policies are in place (against Iraq and the rest of the Middle East) is purely for oil and Wall Street's well being, but what I'm saying is that the reason these policies go under almost no public scrutiy and receives so much support is because they cannot empathize with the country that it is happening to.

[civicrider]

well of course they would oppose attacking britan or someone because they on the same side, and USA has no reason to invade them or any other nation within the Major UN countries. that is the worst argument ever! at the time the bomb was used on Japan because they were a threat and they attacked the USA and germany didnt. everyone knows that:rofl: it wasnt because they were asian again what a dumb thing to say.

[Super_Geo]

Originally posted by civicrider
well of course they would oppose attacking britan or someone because they on the same side, and USA has no reason to invade them or any other nation within the Major UN countries. that is the worst argument ever! at the time the bomb was used on Japan because they were a threat and they attacked the USA and germany didnt. everyone knows that:rofl: it wasnt because they were asian again what a dumb thing to say.

Are you seroius this dense? I'm not even going to respond to this. I just hope you can figure it out on your own.

[civicrider]

you dont make sense man you know im right, your racial ideas dont fit into the argument:rolleyes:

[Toms-SC]

Originally posted by Super_Geo


How does that change the fact that the US is violating international law?



International Law laid down by who? The UN? :rofl:

[Toms-SC]

Originally posted by Gweedo

Children of the Iraq War:
http://www.boyko.org/gweedo/thechildren/

Boooring, got anything better to post? Maybe some dudes running around with bombs on their chests? Maybe some Taliban raping woman because they didnt walk 20 feet behind the men?

:dunno:

[Toms-SC]

BTW: Your title is a lie

[XylathaneGTR]

Originally posted by civicrider
well of course they would oppose attacking britan or someone because they on the same side, and USA has no reason to invade them or any other nation within the Major UN countries. that is the worst argument ever! at the time the bomb was used on Japan because they were a threat and they attacked the USA and germany didnt. everyone knows that:rofl: it wasnt because they were asian again what a dumb thing to say.


Racial issues are a part of this conflict, because certain Idealogies are backed by Racial and Religious Issues. (When Allatoyah Khomeni was installed in Iran, his fundamentals and idealogies called for the USA/Western influence to peace the fuck out of Iran/Middle East. His Racial background has something to do with those idealogies.) Spend some time in a class room, or read a book.
What were the reasons for dropping the Bomb on Japan? I'll tell you why.
Stalin was un-cooperative in Eastern Europe and basically told the other allied countries to that 'I'm rolling in bitches, so fuck you.' Stalin feared 'containment' and wanted to spread communism, while the US Policy was starting to gear towards preventing that spread.
That's why the USA wanted to end the Pacific War quickly, before Stalin could get involved. When stalin attacked japanese troops in China and Manchuria, it was too late. The USA now needed to end it quickly, before Stalin could advance any further. What's the quickest way? Show stalin the US's new toy.
Mainland Japan was firebombed to shit in the closing months of the war, and since buildings in tokyo were made mainly out of WOOD (espically residential areas), the result was very destructive.
US Intel stated that Japan was too weak to continue the pacific war for very long, their war machine back home had been crushed, and all that was left to do was to occupy the mainland.
The official reason for dropping the bomb was to save american lives, which is very true. Resistance would have been strong on a troop based mainland invasion, but reasons go further than that.
At that time, the world was still VERY ethnocentric (Look it up, i doubt you'll know what it means.) An Asian baby was worth less than a white baby in the eyes of most people (and by most, i mean North Americans, Europeans, etc.) This is supported by the fact that Japanese were imprisioned in NA during the war, but Germanic or Italian north americans were not.
If the USA was going to kill thousands of people to end a war, better they be japanese than white.
When the bomb was dropped, stalin stoped advancing, but (and unfortunatly for the USA) his influence had already spread. (Communist party in China, Northern part of Korea, etc)

Yes, Japan was bombed to end the war, but the reasons go deeper than that, and it comes down to the fact that their Asian lives were worth less than White lives in the eyes of those in power at the time.

Read a couple text books, look at some history, come back to this thread when you can hold up an educated fight.
Sorry for the long post.

[TKRIS]

Originally posted by civicrider
i talk about ideas and possibilities because you'll never get the truth reading dumb news articles kinda like the crap above, its bias one way or the other its all garbage.

Translation:
"I hide behind semantics by saying that my views are only ideas, all the while presenting them as ideas. This way, I can make ignorant and unfounded remarks and noone can say I'm wrong because I've included a disclaimer that any of my views are only "ideas" and therefore do not require proof or factual foundations."


I got to this post and quit reading. An intelligent person doesn't need to immediatly open a loophole with some bullshit argument like this to avoid having to back up their claims.

On the other hand, maybe I'm wrong. Maybe we shouldn't be reading the news (which is more often than not biased), reading between the lines, and forming our opinions based on facts. We should all just stick our fingers in our ears, scream "LA-LA-LA-LA-LA" and pull "ideas" out of our asses. That way, even if we're blatantly wrong, we can always say "Well, they were just my "ideas". I was just exploring some "possibilities". I never said they had any relevance whatsoever to the actual incidents."

Once you grow a set, and quit making excuses for your bullshit before you even type it, then people will start to consider taking you seriously.

Kris

[civicrider]

TKRIS
i know you have only read this thread but in all the older threads on war/politics dumb shit came up and now i am explaining that before it comes up again and will be compleatly usless, maybe i should have mentioned something about that...

so its so much better if you always say "but CNN said it so its true im right i win" because its bullshit thats what almost everyone i have talked with does, if the news says it its true and thats dumb. i can go find articles on almost everything i say. want proof go search "the truth of iraq" on beyond and read both threads, does that make what i say always right? no.


XylathaneGTR
its religion not race, and then you as a person steriotype the muslums to be brown and christians to be white americans. you can make the same argument without mentioning race.

sure there is some truth behind them thinking asians are worth less, but who would you want revenge on more, a country to is at war but has not done anything to you, or someone who bombed your land and is directing its attacks on you? makes sense doesnt it. they had no reason to hit germany with such harsh attacks. end of story.

[koopkoop2]

Originally posted by civicrider
a humans first instint is survival so of course if needed they will invade for water if nessasary. no i wouldnt support it because it will effect me negativly, as for the USA invading Iraq i suport it because it could become positive for me. any smart person would think like this. and why do you turn it into a racial disscussion, it has nothing to do with skin color, thats what you liberals do change the idea to make it look worse good example you just gave.

I hope you're fucking joking. That's the most selfish shit I've ever heard.

By your philosiphy, anyone can do whatever they want no matter the consequences on other people.

I'm going to invade your house and steal all your stuff because I can sell it for more then my annual salary. I'm doing it because it will be a positive benifet for me. Then, instead of calling the cops, you'll compliment me on how smart I am.

[Super_Geo]

Originally posted by civicrider
they had no reason to hit germany with such harsh attacks. end of story.

You're right, because Germany and the USA didn't fight in WWII. :rolleyes:

[civicrider]

Originally posted by koopkoop2


I hope you're fucking joking. That's the most selfish shit I've ever heard.

By your philosiphy, anyone can do whatever they want no matter the consequences on other people.

I'm going to invade your house and steal all your stuff because I can sell it for more then my annual salary. I'm doing it because it will be a positive benifet for me. Then, instead of calling the cops, you'll compliment me on how smart I am.

it is selfish but true. if the USA was dieing because they has no water i think they would rather take over another country then sit back and die.

[civicrider]

of course the USA invaded germany, but by the time they did germany was already colapsing and something like a nuklear weapon was not needed.

[Super_Geo]

Originally posted by XylathaneGTR



Racial issues are a part of this conflict, because certain Idealogies are backed by Racial and Religious Issues. (When Allatoyah Khomeni was installed in Iran, his fundamentals and idealogies called for the USA/Western influence to peace the fuck out of Iran/Middle East. His Racial background has something to do with those idealogies.) Spend some time in a class room, or read a book.
What were the reasons for dropping the Bomb on Japan? I'll tell you why.
Stalin was un-cooperative in Eastern Europe and basically told the other allied countries to that 'I'm rolling in bitches, so fuck you.' Stalin feared 'containment' and wanted to spread communism, while the US Policy was starting to gear towards preventing that spread.
That's why the USA wanted to end the Pacific War quickly, before Stalin could get involved. When stalin attacked japanese troops in China and Manchuria, it was too late. The USA now needed to end it quickly, before Stalin could advance any further. What's the quickest way? Show stalin the US's new toy.
Mainland Japan was firebombed to shit in the closing months of the war, and since buildings in tokyo were made mainly out of WOOD (espically residential areas), the result was very destructive.
US Intel stated that Japan was too weak to continue the pacific war for very long, their war machine back home had been crushed, and all that was left to do was to occupy the mainland.
The official reason for dropping the bomb was to save american lives, which is very true. Resistance would have been strong on a troop based mainland invasion, but reasons go further than that.
At that time, the world was still VERY ethnocentric (Look it up, i doubt you'll know what it means.) An Asian baby was worth less than a white baby in the eyes of most people (and by most, i mean North Americans, Europeans, etc.) This is supported by the fact that Japanese were imprisioned in NA during the war, but Germanic or Italian north americans were not.
If the USA was going to kill thousands of people to end a war, better they be japanese than white.
When the bomb was dropped, stalin stoped advancing, but (and unfortunatly for the USA) his influence had already spread. (Communist party in China, Northern part of Korea, etc)

Yes, Japan was bombed to end the war, but the reasons go deeper than that, and it comes down to the fact that their Asian lives were worth less than White lives in the eyes of those in power at the time.

Read a couple text books, look at some history, come back to this thread when you can hold up an educated fight.
Sorry for the long post.


Originally posted by civicrider
of course the USA invaded germany, but by the time they did germany was already colapsing and something like a nuklear weapon was not needed.

Do you not read other posts? Come on man... don't just say the same shit over and over. XylathaneGTR gave you a pretty good overview of the situation in Asia at the end of the war, instead of ignoring it because it doesn't agree with your overly simple outlook on the topic, try see where he's coming from.

[Super_Geo]

Originally posted by civicrider


it is selfish but true. if the USA was dieing because they has no water i think they would rather take over another country then sit back and die.

See you have that viewpoint because, for all of your life, the only thing you've ever experienced is a luxory of us bombing others without even thinking about the aftermath.

Do you remember 9/11? Remember how fucking pissed off Americans were over that? And that was ONLY FOUR THOUSAND LIVES lost. As far as numbers go, that is absolutely nothing. A drop in the bucket at the most. Yet, that is the closest we've come to experiencing what other go through when they're on the receiving end of weeks of bombing. If you ask around in other countries what people really think about 9/11, most of them will say "fuck it, it's nothing," because by comparison there's been so much worse atrocities committed, and a lot of it has been at the hands (or through direct funding by) the Americans.

When 9/11 happened, my frist thought was "My god, this could be a blessing in disguise. If America could learn from this and see that this is what they do to other countries (only when they do it it is 10x-100x worse) maybe they'll stop?"

Nope.

[dericer]

Originally posted by civicrider
tsk tsk tsk you simple minded liberal canadians, when will you learn. USA knows whats up and they know what has to be done so they can remain on top. they need money and power, and thats what they are doing. from our point of view it seems terrible and a bad idea of course because we get nothing. oh and you can say the americans economy is going down bla blah blah, once they get full bennefit of all that oil it will go right back up anyway, and the people going in the shitter are the lower class who are useless themsevles and didnt get a good job and chose that life. Canada needs to watch its back the government takes away the peoples weapons and other little parts of freedom at a time. who was that other government that dissarmed the people... oh yeah Hitler :rofl:


Read " the black pope"

Then tell me how you feel about the US

[Toms-SC]

Originally posted by dericer



Read " the black pope"

Then tell me how you feel about the US

Na, just by reading the title I can assume it will cover the following:

1) American's are bla bla bla morons bla bla bla
2) American's are greddy bla bla bla bla
3) We hate America bla bla bla
4) America is a bully bla bla bla

[Super_Geo]

Originally posted by Toms-SC


Na, just by reading the title I can assume it will cover the following:

1) American's are bla bla bla morons bla bla bla
2) American's are greddy bla bla bla bla
3) We hate America bla bla bla
4) America is a bully bla bla bla

What part of the title "The Balck Pope" suggested any of the above?

[AcuraTl]

Originally posted by Super_Geo


What part of the title "The Balck Pope" suggested any of the above?

:werd:

i believe the invasion of Iraq, and the sanctions that were placed on Iraq, were the systematic rape of a nation...Iraq had a higher Literacy rate than the USA before the sanctions...no shit!

[tapout]

may god grant peace to every living human on earth

[TheBenzo]

Originally posted by tapout
well said:thumbsup:

Quit hating white people. Other countries wouldnt tolerate half of your bullshit attitude, so dont give it to us. Iraq was a shithole prior to the war and its a shithole now.

If the majority of this site wasnt racist towards white/north american people... they would be less likely to throw their shitty dinner-table opinions out.

[TheBenzo]

Originally posted by AcuraTl


:werd:

i believe the invasion of Iraq, and the sanctions that were placed on Iraq, were the systematic rape of a nation...Iraq had a higher Literacy rate than the USA before the sanctions...no shit!

Well thank you rythmn nation. Now come up with your own opinion, quit using quotes from maddox.

Your incredibly stupid point about sanctions affecting literacy rates.. makes little sense. Are you now saying that because of the US led invasion... Americans are smarter? Is the way to improve literacy in a country to invade another? Or are you saying that Iraqis were kinda stupid before... and are now incredibly stupid...

You appear to be jumpin in to this thread/debate almost to see how well you would do against the argueing faction of the site.. Good luck little one.

[streetarab]

it comes down to the US bein the bully, we can dish it out but we cant take it, we will bomb any country into dessimation and not think twice about it, but as soon as you step foot onto this country and do anything, even if its 20 times less than what we did to you, we will get more pissed off than ever before, we are the bully, we are greedy, we are powerhungry,

[XylathaneGTR]

Originally posted by civicrider
of course the USA invaded germany, but by the time they did germany was already colapsing and something like a nuklear weapon was not needed.
Japan had already collapsed, and there was no reason solid reason to use a Nuclear Weapon.
Japanese cities were firebombed, with thousands of CIVLILLIANS killed, that would be more than enough of a revenge for the bombing of Pearl Harbor 4 years prior, which was mainly a military thing.
The bomb was used to intimidate Stalin and stop his advances, and since they needed a demonstration, why not Japanese, because they're worth about as much as used toilet paper. That was the thinking of the day.
Religion and Race are closely related, espically in areas of the world where Religion dictates daily life to every detail.
As far as i know, Religion is their ('Extremist Muslims' in Iraq/Iran) way of life, and is part of what defines their race.
Western Values that are being imposed on their contries also come with western faith, and religion.
Quit talking Civicrider, and instead, read a book or two, it will do you good.

[koopkoop2]

Originally posted by civicrider


it is selfish but true. if the USA was dieing because they has no water i think they would rather take over another country then sit back and die.

I already know the USA is capable of this. It was the fact that you supported these actions that made me hate you.

[Toma]

Originally posted by TheBenzo


Well thank you rythmn nation. Now come up with your own opinion, quit using quotes from maddox.

Your incredibly stupid point about sanctions affecting literacy rates.. makes little sense. Are you now saying that because of the US led invasion... Americans are smarter? Is the way to improve literacy in a country to invade another? Or are you saying that Iraqis were kinda stupid before... and are now incredibly stupid...

You appear to be jumpin in to this thread/debate almost to see how well you would do against the argueing faction of the site.. Good luck little one.
You'r intelligence (or lack of) is disturbing.

Why even open your mouth. The statistics were from the UN, and are 100% true. On the sanctions lists were items such as school books and pencils (not to mention equipment required to repair water treatment facitilities the yanks bombed, certain medication .... but that's another story, and why around 1 million Iraqi childred died from disease and malnutrition... etc).

. Your wasting valuable canadian air. If you like the US so much, go back to TexASS.

[civicrider]

Originally posted by Super_Geo




Do you not read other posts? Come on man... don't just say the same shit over and over. XylathaneGTR gave you a pretty good overview of the situation in Asia at the end of the war, instead of ignoring it because it doesn't agree with your overly simple outlook on the topic, try see where he's coming from.

yeah i already know what went on during WW2 and it doesnt change anything, i see where hes trying to get at but its not a racial issue.

[civicrider]

Originally posted by koopkoop2


I already know the USA is capable of this. It was the fact that you supported these actions that made me hate you.

i dont support it but it makes sense and its the truth

[civicrider]

Originally posted by dericer



Read " the black pope"

Then tell me how you feel about the US

no thanks i dont read left wing garbage

[civicrider]

Originally posted by XylathaneGTR

Japan had already collapsed, and there was no reason solid reason to use a Nuclear Weapon.
Japanese cities were firebombed, with thousands of CIVLILLIANS killed, that would be more than enough of a revenge for the bombing of Pearl Harbor 4 years prior, which was mainly a military thing.
The bomb was used to intimidate Stalin and stop his advances, and since they needed a demonstration, why not Japanese, because they're worth about as much as used toilet paper. That was the thinking of the day.
Religion and Race are closely related, espically in areas of the world where Religion dictates daily life to every detail.
As far as i know, Religion is their ('Extremist Muslims' in Iraq/Iran) way of life, and is part of what defines their race.
Western Values that are being imposed on their contries also come with western faith, and religion.
Quit talking Civicrider, and instead, read a book or two, it will do you good.

i would hate to see you become a leader. "oh we got invaded maybe we should just give them a warning and wait till next time" who would do that:dunno: honestly if your the most powerful nation in the world your not going to let them off easy or you will look weak lay down the law and show that no one show fuck around with you. i'll never understand why you guys think that way.

[Toma]

Originally posted by civicrider


i would hate to see you become a leader. "oh we got invaded maybe we should just give them a warning and wait till next time" who would do that:dunno: honestly if your the most powerful nation in the world your not going to let them off easy or you will look weak lay down the law and show that no one show fuck around with you. i'll never understand why you guys think that way.
Invaded!?!?!?! Invaded!?!?!?! Are you stupid? When did Japan invade the US?

The US INVADED a shitload of pacific islands to which Japan had claim, Japan wanted them for themselves. That's what that was about. Sheesh.

The ONLY reason the US used the bomb was to show off and mercilessly slaughter hundreds of thousands of civilians....

[civicrider]

umm pearlharbor, im pretty sure that was an invasion.
you make japan look so innocent, what about all hte countries they invaded prior to the USA stepping in, its not as if they wernt doing anything wrong in the first place.
your right they did use the a bombs to show off and it worked no one fucked with the USA

[AcuraTl]

Americans had no Honor in Nukin Japan, the only reason they did it was because they saw massive casualities in invading Japan...dont even get me started about the incediary bombing that destroyed most of Japan...all senseless shit...dead civilians Gahhhh "goes mad"

[Primer_Drift]

WTF does this have to do with Iraq war censorship?
You guys are so off topic its ridiculous.:thumbsdow




editted for content (I'm not adding more to this fire :P)

[Benton]

Originally posted by Toma

Invaded!?!?!?! Invaded!?!?!?! Are you stupid? When did Japan invade the US?

The US INVADED a shitload of pacific islands to which Japan had claim, Japan wanted them for themselves. That's what that was about. Sheesh.

The ONLY reason the US used the bomb was to show off and mercilessly slaughter hundreds of thousands of civilians....

I am sorry for saying this but the public school system that I can only assume that you participated in has failed you in a manner that is beyond description. I mean you are saying that the United States invaded "a shitload of pacific islands to which Japan had claim." Do you know how Japan had claim to those islands, they went in and slaughtered the populations of those nations without any mercy whatsoever. I can't believe that you didn't know those simple facts about the biggest war (in terms of scale) of the 20th century.

Japan was an empirialistic empire that continually added land such as Thailand, French Indo-China, Malaya, Sumatra, Borneo, Sawawak, the Philippine Islands, Taiwan, Hong Kong, Burma, and a large section of China. They invaded these nations for the most part since 1931 where they occupied Manchuria (this you might remember is thought to be the example of the shortcomings of the League of Nations). In 1937 Japan invaded China, and guess what they murdered and/or raped millions of men, women and children. Still doesn't ring a bell? Oh they also took over the territory now known as South Korea and enslaved the population sending the women to Japan to act as comfort women, or if you hadn't heard about that, sex slaves where they were forced to perform sexual acts on Japanese soldiers or they were to be murdered.

I am sure none of this really is sinking in, but do you not realize Japan had some of the most racist policies ever seen. I really suggest you read up on the Bushido code, especially the parts dealing with racial superiority.

Also the use of the atomic weapon was used in order to shock the Soviets more than anything, as they were already deep into Japan, and were a power to be reckoned with. It was the only way in which they could at least temporarly stop the communist threat, and yes it was a threat. Even if it wasn't, what other option did the americans have, risk millions of their mens lives, along with millions of Japanese who would otherwise fight to the death for their emperor? The main islands of Japan were heavily defended, to think otherwise would be ignorant - just look at the defences establised on the smaller islands if you need proof.

Lastly as someone supporting Japan and their actions in the war I wouldn't get into an arguement regarding the mercy of actions, unless you want to first discuss the actions of Unit 731, and the countless others that existed, although once again I am sure you know nothing about the small thing known as history and would rather just spew whatever random thought made their way into your obviously stunted brain.

If it is all America's fault why did the emperor of japan not surrender after the first atomic weapon was dropped, he was given that option you know. The option did exist.

Lastly Japan did have plans to invade other nations such as Austrillia and also the United States, who should obviously have been expected to sit back and accect this, especially after Japan you know attacked them in an unprovoked manner

[AcuraTl]

Originally posted by Benton


I am sorry for saying this but the public school system that I can only assume that you participated in has failed you in a manner that is beyond description. I mean you are saying that the United States invaded "a shitload of pacific islands to which Japan had claim." Do you know how Japan had claim to those islands, they went in and slaughtered the populations of those nations without any mercy whatsoever. I can't believe that you didn't know those simple facts about the biggest war (in terms of scale) of the 20th century.

Japan was an empirialistic empire that continually added land such as Thailand, French Indo-China, Malaya, Sumatra, Borneo, Sawawak, the Philippine Islands, Taiwan, Hong Kong, Burma, and a large section of China. They invaded these nations for the most part since 1931 where they occupied Manchuria (this you might remember is thought to be the example of the shortcomings of the League of Nations). In 1937 Japan invaded China, and guess what they murdered and/or raped millions of men, women and children. Still doesn't ring a bell? Oh they also took over the territory now known as South Korea and enslaved the population sending the women to Japan to act as comfort women, or if you hadn't heard about that, sex slaves where they were forced to perform sexual acts on Japanese soldiers or they were to be murdered.

I am sure none of this really is sinking in, but do you not realize Japan had some of the most racist policies ever seen. I really suggest you read up on the Bushido code, especially the parts dealing with racial superiority.

Also the use of the atomic weapon was used in order to shock the Soviets more than anything, as they were already deep into Japan, and were a power to be reckoned with. It was the only way in which they could at least temporarly stop the communist threat, and yes it was a threat. Even if it wasn't, what other option did the americans have, risk millions of their mens lives, along with millions of Japanese who would otherwise fight to the death for their emperor? The main islands of Japan were heavily defended, to think otherwise would be ignorant - just look at the defences establised on the smaller islands if you need proof.

Lastly as someone supporting Japan and their actions in the war I wouldn't get into an arguement regarding the mercy of actions, unless you want to first discuss the actions of Unit 731, and the countless others that existed, although once again I am sure you know nothing about the small thing known as history and would rather just spew whatever random thought made their way into your obviously stunted brain.

If it is all America's fault why did the emperor of japan not surrender after the first atomic weapon was dropped, he was given that option you know. The option did exist.

Lastly Japan did have plans to invade other nations such as Austrillia and also the United States, who should obviously have been expected to sit back and accect this, especially after Japan you know attacked them in an unprovoked manner


nobody disagress with you that the fact that Japan had it shares of war-crimes, but does two wrongs make a right? was the second bomb really necessary?...questions you must think of...

[Benton]

Well that depends on how many casualties you are willing to accept, if you attempt to have an amphibious assault on a stronghold with a large number of dedicated soldiers you are looking at number of around 1 million Americans and roughly 2 million Japanese. Thus from a humanistic standpoint dropping the atomic weapons in order to stop the war is quite possibly the best thing that could have happened, Yes people did die, much like they died in Berlin, hamberg, Dresden, Toyko, and countless other cities, but the numbers of dead could possibly be less than they would be otherwise.

[TheBenzo]

Originally posted by Toma

You'r intelligence (or lack of) is disturbing.

Why even open your mouth. The statistics were from the UN, and are 100% true. On the sanctions lists were items such as school books and pencils (not to mention equipment required to repair water treatment facitilities the yanks bombed, certain medication .... but that's another story, and why around 1 million Iraqi childred died from disease and malnutrition... etc).

. Your wasting valuable canadian air. If you like the US so much, go back to TexASS.

Toma, your out and out bullheaded approach to all things american is repulsive. You are racist, here is why:

-You believe in and repeat ONLY negative things about the US.
-You refuse to accurately debate anything positive about the US
-You have the mental capacity of a 7 year old.. (which isnt bad for someone like you)
-You are anti-american to the core... and have been probably for decades.

I think you just dont like the fact that there is an equallizing power in the world that wont allow bullshit to happen. You think Iraq has no WMD... even when there is reports about the US supplying them! (will find it for you and provide)

If you hate so much... why not quit being a pussy and put your money where your fat meathole is; boycott all things american! Wait, that means you wouldnt have a job, wouldnt drive a car, wouldnt listen to music and probably wouldnt eat. :rolleyes:

Yeah, I will go back to TexaSS.. better pussy, better weather, better food and better cars.

Don't want to cut into your "watching movies by yourself" time, so I will end this post.

[AcuraTl]

Originally posted by TheBenzo


Toma, your out and out bullheaded approach to all things american is repulsive. You are racist, here is why:

-You believe in and repeat ONLY negative things about the US.
-You refuse to accurately debate anything positive about the US
-You have the mental capacity of a 7 year old.. (which isnt bad for someone like you)
-You are anti-american to the core... and have been probably for decades.

I think you just dont like the fact that there is an equallizing power in the world that wont allow bullshit to happen. You think Iraq has no WMD... even when there is reports about the US supplying them! (will find it for you and provide)

If you hate so much... why not quit being a pussy and put your money where your fat meathole is; boycott all things american! Wait, that means you wouldnt have a job, wouldnt drive a car, wouldnt listen to music and probably wouldnt eat. :rolleyes:

Yeah, I will go back to TexaSS.. better pussy, better weather, better food and better cars.

Don't want to cut into your "watching movies by yourself" time, so I will end this post.

so he finds his mustange "repulsive" dude your an idiot, he is just standing up for the little guy who usually gets raped by the media, note its not the american people we hate, or even there ideologies, its the spin doctors and the media that fuck them up....

[TheBenzo]

Originally posted by AcuraTl


so he finds his mustange "repulsive" dude your an idiot, he is just standing up for the little guy who usually gets raped by the media, note its not the american people we hate, or even there ideologies, its the spin doctors and the media that fuck them up....

You have no position in this arguement because you cannot read. Stop posting. Dont try to cover your ass after you you talk bullshit.

[Toma]

Originally posted by TheBenzo



Yeah, I will go back to TexaSS.. better pussy, better weather, better food and better cars.

You forgot about the better crack whores....about the only pussy you get .... or afford ;)

[Toma]

ALL wars in modern times are politically motivated. They often have very little to do with the reason used, given, made up etc.

I realize Japan was an expansionist imperialistic nation.... as was the US, Britain, Germany, Spain, France etc....

In my humble opinon, THAT is what WW1 and 2 were really about... but we wont go there.... that is what the majority of blood spilled in the last 500 years has been about. Money, power and land.

But anyway ;)

Its a well know fact to all the reasonable world that Iraq was/is a sham. Nothing but modern US imperialism.

No reasonbale person that has a clue can argue Iraq is better at anytime SINCE 1990 then it was prior to the US intervention of 1990 to present.

George Carlin (a smart US comedian) said it best in regards to US foreign policy..... "If they have bigger dicks then us.... BOMB EM!" lol

[hampstor]

The US used a nuclear weapon on Japan to flex their muscles and show off (to Stalin and the USSR).

At Potsdam, Truman mentioned to stalin that they had a weapon of "unusual destructive force" and Stalin told him to "make good use of it against the Japanese.

http://www.dannen.com/decision/potsdam.html

no one can say this is purely about religion. If being Muslim means the US hates you, then Indonesia should've been their first target because Indonesia has the world's largest Muslim population. Indonesia basically has more Muslims then the entire Arab world combined.

http://www.aneki.com/muslim.html

[tapout]

Originally posted by hampstor
The US used a nuclear weapon on Japan to flex their muscles and show off (to Stalin and the USSR).

At Potsdam, Truman mentioned to stalin that they had a weapon of "unusual destructive force" and Stalin told him to "make good use of it against the Japanese.

http://www.dannen.com/decision/potsdam.html

Civicrider, if this is purely about religion and being Muslim means the US hates you, then Indonesia should've been their first target because Indonesia has the world's largest Muslim population. Indonesia basically has more Muslims then the entire Arab world combined.

http://www.aneki.com/muslim.html nice post i never knew that .wow indonesia

[hampstor]

We live in an era of imperialistic america... The US truly is the biggest, baddest bully on the block. Anyone who has taken any type of european history knows how dangerous nationalism can be... and how easy it is to manipulate the most ordinary people into person with a lot of hate.

this isn't making any sense and I forgot where I was going with this, im going to bed :D

[Benton]

Originally posted by Toma


No reasonbale person that has a clue can argue Iraq is better at anytime SINCE 1990 then it was prior to the US intervention of 1990 to present.



Well a few things, it was Iraq that first invaded another nation - Kuwait and the world responded to that act of aggression, so it actually wasn't a United States invasion of Iraq (which happened in 1991 by the way). Really considering it a large scale invasion would also be incorrect as the only area that the coalition forces entered was into Southern Iraq.

Iraq under Saddam really wasn't that great of a nation to live in, even before the initial Gulf war.. It seems as though you want to ignore the fact that there was a long war with Iran that left millions dead, and then well there was that pesky incident of using chemical weapons against his own people in the early 90s, but why should we care about the Shiite and Kurd population.

[hampstor]

Originally posted by Benton


Well a few things, it was Iraq that first invaded another nation - Kuwait and the world responded to that act of aggression, so it actually wasn't a United States invasion of Iraq (which happened in 1991 by the way). Really considering it a large scale invasion would also be incorrect as the only area that the coalition forces entered was into Southern Iraq.

Iraq under Saddam really wasn't that great of a nation to live in, even before the initial Gulf war.. It seems as though you want to ignore the fact that there was a long war with Iran that left millions dead, and then well there was that pesky incident of using chemical weapons against his own people in the early 90s, but why should we care about the Shiite and Kurd population.

I think the point most are trying to make is the US isn't doing this self-lessly and for humanitarian reasons (i thnk that's what you're trying to point out by refering to chemical weapons being used on the Kurds and Shiites). Many people have said it before... if it wasn't for oil, the US wouldn't send in their forces. Also, it's been shown that WMD's was most likely an excuse to invade iraq (alterior motive).

Those that argue that it was more humanitarian should remember that more people have died in Africa due to war then Iraq - thats not even including famine/disease. If the US's motives were purely humanitarian then Africa should be their priority - not Iraq.

[AcuraTl]

Originally posted by hampstor


I think the point most are trying to make is the US isn't doing this self-lessly and for humanitarian reasons (i thnk that's what you're trying to point out by refering to chemical weapons being used on the Kurds and Shiites). Many people have said it before... if it wasn't for oil, the US wouldn't send in their forces. Also, it's been shown that WMD's was most likely an excuse to invade iraq (alterior motive).

Those that argue that it was more humanitarian should remember that more people have died in Africa due to war then Iraq - thats not even including famine/disease. If the US's motives were purely humanitarian then Africa should be their priority - not Iraq.


:werd: :werd: :werd:

all about that liquid gold (oil)

[TheBenzo]

Toma is SMRT... my question to you then is Why is it all of the sudden wrong to expand? The earths history is that of expanding "imperialism" and now when the US starts... its wrong? Dont you dare say that about the Asian countries... youll probably get banned.:rolleyes:

Of course its about oil. I see this situations motives in no different way then I see the sales of some asian produced items being sold in the US and Canada. They are capitalizing on paying shit wages and having virtually NO cost. I disagree that it is boosting Taiwans economy because their quality of life is not improving as a result of their massive export. Other than the bloodshed, who is this different than the oil crusade going on in Iraq? There are capitalistic ideals behind both and to some degree they are both putting undue hardships on people.

Whats even funnier is that the UN doesnt support it, but does nothing to stop it. Why? Well, what IF Gee Dub actually won the war.. do you think those UN countries will want to miss out on the opportunity to gain from the dirty work the US did? I don't like bush, and I dont like the situation in Iraq, but when someone as mindless as you categorizes every american in that manner, Im going to correct you and re-educate you.

[TheBenzo]

Originally posted by dericer



Read " the black pope"

Then tell me how you feel about the US Go Read "Mein Kamph" and then tell me how you feel about Jews.

You are a wackfuck. Take a hike. :rolleyes:

[dericer]

Originally posted by civicrider


no thanks i dont read left wing garbage


You need to educate yourself with both view points before making an educated decision.

[dericer]

Originally posted by TheBenzo
Go Read "Mein Kamph" and then tell me how you feel about Jews.

You are a wackfuck. Take a hike. :rolleyes:

Wow, that has to be the stupidest comparison I have ever seen.


Black pope is about a jesuit sect made illegal by the catholic church in the 3rd century.

Have you actually read it, or just making an uneducated speculation?

[Toms-SC]

Originally posted by dericer


Wow, that has to be the stupidest comparison I have ever seen.


Black pope is about a jesuit sect made illegal by the catholic church in the 3rd century.

Have you actually read it, or just making an uneducated speculation?

So what does this have to do with, well, anything?

[tapout]

Originally posted by TheBenzo


Quit hating white people. Other countries wouldnt tolerate half of your bullshit attitude, so dont give it to us. Iraq was a shithole prior to the war and its a shithole now.

If the majority of this site wasnt racist towards white/north american people... they would be less likely to throw their shitty dinner-table opinions out. WTF are ya still on the pipe? :dunno:

[dericer]

Originally posted by Toms-SC


So what does this have to do with, well, anything?

This book follows the collapse of the Vatican Assasins who where made illegal by the catholic church in the 3rd century (responsible for the 2nd and 3rd crusades. Disbanded and became 'the templers' and the 'Illuminati' who aligned with the Anglican church in the 18th century and are now mostly the 'Free Masons' (you might have seen the article in the Sun last week with the Masons celebrating the 100th year of their anglican built temple)

Every single US president since Taft has been a Free Mason.

Plus every foreign countries leader involved in the Iraqi war are Free Masons aswell.

Anyways the book is well researched, about 50% bullshit (like most other books of this genre), 50% interesting facts.


Weight it against other historical biographies, do alittle research, and it paints an interesting tapistry of the political landscape of the G8 nations

[dericer]

Originally posted by TheBenzo




Yeah, I will go back to TexaSS.. better pussy, better weather, better food and better cars.

Don't want to cut into your "watching movies by yourself" time, so I will end this post.

Texas must have pretty tasty food.

http://www.statehealthfacts.kff.org/cgi-bin/healthfacts.cgi?action=profile&area=Texas&category=Health+Status&subcategory=Obesity

That can only mean one thing about the pussy?

Man it's all yours

[TheBenzo]

Originally posted by dericer


Wow, that has to be the stupidest comparison I have ever seen.


Black pope is about a jesuit sect made illegal by the catholic church in the 3rd century.

Have you actually read it, or just making an uneducated speculation? So then where the fuck is the relevance there you halfwit blank. Your quote "Read the Black Pope THEN see what you think about the states" You have made it clear that you are not of calibre to argue with me.

Why is it a stupid comparison? You are trying to push left wing garbage into peoples faces while I compare its absurdity to a heavy propganda related book... Man you are a fucking blank, leave this thread.

[TheBenzo]

Originally posted by dericer


Texas must have pretty tasty food.

http://www.statehealthfacts.kff.org/cgi-bin/healthfacts.cgi?action=profile&area=Texas&category=Health+Status&subcategory=Obesity

That can only mean one thing about the pussy?

Man it's all yours Even better is that you just posted that statistically the Blacks, Hispanics and Indians are the fattest of them all. Asians to be the least and whites to be the 2nd least obese.

I'm sure since you follow stats on the fats... you watched the documentary on how disgustingly piggish Canadian children are becoming. I believe it was on CBC a while ago.

So after all of your shit arguements you, in all of your incredible idiocy, post a fat chick up and call it a day. Good idea.

[streetarab]

i think you guys are douchebags, it would make for good entertainment if there wasnt so much reading :rofl:

[TheBenzo]

Ahab, I own your IQ by 10 points, I hear Massachusetts has good cheeseburgers.

[tapout]

Originally posted by dericer


Texas must have pretty tasty food.

http://www.statehealthfacts.kff.org/cgi-bin/healthfacts.cgi?action=profile&area=Texas&category=Health+Status&subcategory=Obesity

That can only mean one thing about the pussy?

Man it's all yours :rofl: :rofl: