Do you get the flu shot? 2018 edition

[tirebob]

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Yea that is true. Then people that don’t really understand flip that around and say well clearly flu vaccines are not effective. Which is not an intelligent argument in the least. Argue that our delivery system is poor in that we need too much lead time and can’t react and therefore we should focus on improving that . But saying flu vaccines are ineffective is a garbage argument IMO

Let me reiterate that I don't think it has zero impact. I just feel that it isn't the problem in the first place that the big business of vaccinations is attempting to convince us it is. I have no issue with anyone who wants to participate. I just have an issue with being told you must participate when I believe the consequences of not doing so to be of no overall consequence to the human experience.

Shit, if we believe that everything science says should dictate how we live our lives then we should be allowing the genetically weak to die off rather than letting them pollute the human race with inferior genes making us all eventually weak. We all know that the earth is going to be overpopulated one day so why do we choose to inject morality into science in one area (saying it is our civic duty to care for those that would not survive naturally) but reject it in another (allowing ourselves to become weaker over generations and overpopulated causing other horrific things to happen to us). Please don't think I am advocating these thoughts. I am just speaking to the extreme for effect. My point is that where one chooses to accept the moral reasons to do something is a sliding scale. Where one chooses to accept risk to ones own self and situation is the only valid argument here IMHO. It is the trying to make others feel bad for not subscribing to the propaganda making us bad human being where I really have an issue

[tirebob]

Edit double post

[The_Rural_Juror]

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Let me reiterate that I don't think it has zero impact. I just feel that it isn't the problem in the first place that the big business of vaccinations is attempting to convince us it is. I have no issue with anyone who wants to participate. I just have an issue with being told you must participate when I believe the consequences of not doing so to be of no overall consequence to the human experience.

Shit, if we believe that everything science says should dictate how we live our lives then we should be allowing the genetically weak to die off rather than letting them pollute the human race with inferior genes making us all eventually weak. We all know that the earth is going to be overpopulated one day so why do we choose to inject morality into science in one area (saying it is our civic duty to care for those that would not survive naturally) but reject it in another (allowing ourselves to become weaker over generations and overpopulated causing other horrific things to happen to us). Please don't think I am advocating these thoughts. I am just speaking to the extreme for effect. My point is that where one chooses to accept the moral reasons to do something is a sliding scale. Where one chooses to accept risk to ones own self and situation is the only valid argument here IMHO. It is the trying to make others feel bad for not subscribing to the propaganda making us bad human being where I really have an issue

This took a dark turn. I am definitely in the lower half of the gene pool. If science says that I should be euthanized, then F U science!
But forget of all that. Let's see the research supporting your argument. I'm quite open minded (probably because I am in the lower 50% - those f-ing top 50% never listen).

[tirebob]

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This took a dark turn. I am definitely in the lower half of the gene pool. If science says that I should be euthanized, then F U science!
But forget of all that. Let's see the research supporting your argument. I'm quite open minded (probably because I am in the lower 50% - those f-ing top 50% never listen).

My example was extreme. I hope you realize I am not saying anything like that is what should be happening. It was said just to illustrate the point that while science is obviously important and necessary, it also is not the magic fix to the entire human condition.

[Mista Bob]

If I've ever had a flu shot before, it was when I was too young to remember.

Maaaybe had the flu once. Only time's I've ever been sick much was way back when working in customer service. So I'd rather just not waste my time getting a flu shot.

[The_Rural_Juror]

Thanos did nothing wrong.

[Mitsu3000gt]

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That's expensive for the healthcare system in terms of both dollars and hospital bed usage. It's also expensive for business in the people who don't need to be hospitalized, but do need a week off work when a $25 injection is the alternative even if not 100% effective.

Just to expand on this, my GF is an ER nurse and you would not *believe* the amount of people who come in with the flu or think they have the flu, wasting literal millions upon millions of your tax dollars on doctor's time, tests, and beds only to be told to go home and get some rest after wasting several hours of everyone's time. Many of them even take ambulances there - when that happens, the paramedics have to wait with them until they get seen, pulling an ambulance off the street, and they are such low priority that it amounts to many hours. Guess what every single one of them says when the hospital asks if they got the flu shot? "No".

Apparently this year the shot is particularly effective against the flu - even if you're a normal hold-out, this year is a good time to start.

[Misterman]

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I do actually agree with Misterman that proper hygiene is probably just as effective, if not more effective, than simply getting a shot that is hit and miss. I work directly with the public with the flu season being the time I am busiest with an absolutely massive amount of person to person contact, shaking hands etc with people all the time so I wash my hands probably a dozen times a day as well as sneezing into my arm rather than my hand etc. I have not had the flu in over 20 years. That is no scientific study by any means, but it works.

Does a flu shot decrease an individuals odds of catching the flu? Sure I can agree with that, but I totally feel it is unnecessary for most people and the severity and effect of the flu on society as a whole is incredibly overblown. Why is that? I am to cynical of the powers that be to have a rational discussion on the matter I think but until some super virus is running around wiping out a third of the population I will stick to my hygiene routine that works well for me.

How dare you!!! Baby Murderer!! Troll!!

[HiTempguy1]

So holdup a second. I think I've been looking at my reasoning for not getting a flu shot all wrong:

People who SHOULD NOT get the flu shot:

Children younger than 6 months of age are too young to get a flu shot.
People with severe, life-threatening allergies to flu vaccine or any ingredient in the vaccine. This might include gelatin, antibiotics, or other ingredients. See Special Considerations Regarding Egg Allergy for more information about egg allergies and flu vaccine.

So, what you are telling me, is if people acted responsibly AND GOT THEIR OWN FLU SHOTS, that I wouldn't have to, because I'm not concerned about getting it.

This has changed from my stance of "regardless of anything, if I don't want something injected in me, I'll pass" to my stance now being "take fucking responsibility for yourself and get the fucking flu shot yourself if its a concern".

I can't remember the last time I was remotely in the same vicinity as a kid under 6 months. And anyone around me over 50 better be getting the damn shot themselves or else fuck them.

[phreezee]

The flu shot lobbying by pharmaceuticals has pushed their agenda to propaganda proportions. The flu shot is NOT FREE. It is paid for by our taxes to the tune of $1.5B annually. Those so called millions wasted in hospitals happen even after wasting $1.5B.

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/life...rticle1318824/

Unlike real vaccines, the flu shot is a best guess of strains every year and it's efficacy is highly questionable.

[JustinL]

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The flu shot lobbying by pharmaceuticals has pushed their agenda to propaganda proportions. The flu shot is NOT FREE. It is paid for by our taxes to the tune of $1.5B annually. Those so called millions wasted in hospitals happen even after wasting $1.5B.

Here is some data from last year. The year you are quoting was the H1N1 year and is not reflective of the current costs.

Alberta Health purchased 1.6 million doses of influenza vaccine in 2016/17.
Total cost of $12.7 million.
In 2015/16, Alberta Health purchased 1.8 million doses.
Total cost of $12.7 million (the unit cost for influenza vaccine was slightly higher this year).
During last year’s influenza season (2015/16):
27% of Albertans (roughly 1.1 million people) received the influenza vaccine;
62 people died with lab-confirmed influenza; and
1,698 Albertans were admitted to hospital with lab-confirmed influenza.

[tirebob]

I really get annoyed at how the stats are laid out. 62 people died with influenza, but how many of those were people barely remaining alive and it is just the final straw that puts them over the edge, and it may not even be the flu that gets them. They make it sound like 62 healthy people were short changed on their lives when we reality these days it is doctors working hard at keeping bed ridden people alive longer than they should realistically be. It is a shitty conversation to have no doubt, but it is reality none-the-less. The more I research online the more I am finding the factual sense of everything in question on both sides of the argument. At this point it seems people just subscribe to a belief and insist their science is the right science and big business is sitting their wringing their hands in glee. I don't trust any of these groups sadly.

[bjstare]

I get the flu shot, because having the flu sucks. If this silly shot can decrease my chances of catching the flu, count me in.

Besides, this year I got it at an airport while I was waiting for a delayed flight anyways. Cost me 0 time and effort. Win win.

[Mitsu3000gt]

Can you guys link us to all the peer reviewed medical articles you're reading that show washing your hands is equally effective? Personally not trusting the data is not evidence that the data is false.

[spikerS]

I got the shot a while back, and sure enough, just like every other time, got sick 8-10 days after that lasted about 2 days.

I swear that the flu shot makes me sick. EVERY time I have gotten it, I get sick about a week later.

[Mitsu3000gt]

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I got the shot a while back, and sure enough, just like every other time, got sick 8-10 days after that lasted about 2 days.

I swear that the flu shot makes me sick. EVERY time I have gotten it, I get sick about a week later.

You either:

A) Were already sick and didn't know it yet (incubating)

B) Got sick in the ~2 week window it takes for the shot to take effect

C) Got sick anyway, but not from the shot

It is literally medically impossible to get sick/the flu from the flu shot.

A small percentage of people get mild flu-like symptoms for 1-2 days after the shot, but you aren't really sick. It's possible you're in that group.

[J-hop]

K you guys really have to stop saying “I got sick from the flu shot”. I’m no biology major but basics are: the symptoms you get when you actually have the flu are your body reacting to a virus. A flu vaccine is a deactivated virus or a gene pattern from a virus.


The whole point is your body reacts to the dormant virus the way it would the actual virus and builds antibodies and programming. Some symptoms associated with that are perfectly normal.

You guys complaining are wusses haha. It’s not even 1/10 that if an actual flu.

[The_Rural_Juror]

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Can you guys link us to all the peer reviewed medical articles you're reading that show washing your hands is equally effective? Personally not trusting the data is not evidence that the data is false.

How dare you ask so much.



In other fake news: This year's vaccine appears to be quite effective.

Virus Characterization:The majority of influenza viruses characterized antigenically and genetically are similar to the cell-grown reference viruses representing the 2018–2019 Northern Hemisphere influenza vaccine viruses.

Source: https://www.cdc.gov/flu/weekly/index.htm

Alberta Health Services Stats (aka Also Fake News): https://www.albertahealthservices.ca...Page14481.aspx

So back on that HPV thing. 100% effectiveness at preventing head & neck cancer is damn good, no?

[Sugarphreak]

...

[Misterman]

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So back on that HPV thing. 100% effectiveness at preventing head & neck cancer is damn good, no?

I must have missed where someone was arguing against this? I'm all for HPV vaccine, that could be the difference between your daughter dying of cervical cancer or not. Big difference between, you might maybe have a little higher chance of getting a flu for a week(or you might just get the flu anyway).