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Thread: C-Train Accident

  1. #441
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    Originally posted by Guillermo
    what about if you fall to your death rock climbing - are you stupid then?
    Better analogy, if you fall to your death rock climbing do you blame the mountain?
    Originally posted by HeavyD
    you know you are making the right decision if Toma opposes it.

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    Originally posted by Go4Long


    Better analogy, if you fall to your death rock climbing do you blame the mountain?
    no, but while people can't move mountains, they can design train crossings. maybe the current trains crossings are sufficient, but why does that have to stop us from trying to make things even better? the argument that train crossings are OK now and there is no room for improvement is very caveman-like IMO. my grandfather says the same thing with regards to "snail mail" and email.
    Last edited by Guillermo; 12-08-2011 at 03:36 PM.

  3. #443
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    ...you are going to tell me this is not stupid?



    If I did something like this, I would've thought to myself, "that's pretty damn stupid of me".
    Last edited by mucat; 12-08-2011 at 03:51 PM.

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    Originally posted by mucat
    ...you are going to tell me this is not stupid?



    If I did something like this, I would've thought to myself, "that's pretty damn stupid of me".

    that's stupid.

    I'm guessing a Guillermo-ish argument iwould state that its not uncommon for people to be on their phones, so it was an accident, so it was not stupid.

    "If you fall into a water fountain, while texting on your phone, is it stupid?"


    yes....yes it is.
    Last edited by Skyline_Addict; 12-08-2011 at 04:10 PM.

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    I don't think it's right to call it stupid. I prefer complacent. Think of a train like a loaded gun, except you know exactly where it's aimed. Are you going to walk in front of that gun without checking if someones hand is on the trigger?
    Originally posted by HeavyD
    you know you are making the right decision if Toma opposes it.

  6. #446
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    Originally posted by Go4Long
    I don't think it's right to call it stupid. I prefer complacent. Think of a train like a loaded gun, except you know exactly where it's aimed. Are you going to walk in front of that gun without checking if someones hand is on the trigger?
    "complacent" and "stupid" doesn't have to be mutually exclusive. In fact, they usually go hand in hand.

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    ...
    Last edited by Sugarphreak; 07-08-2019 at 12:35 PM.

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    Originally posted by Go4Long
    Again, it's this method of thinking that just doesn't make sense to me, or I think anyone else involved with the railway. It's this "people are getting hit by the train, the railway (in this case Calgary transit) should move their trains to stop people from being able to walk in front of them" I mean seriously, why is the default to protect people from themselves, why can't it be to teach people to learn how to protect their own existence? Moving train tracks is expensive...think like $1 million dollars a mile for signalled track at grade, why is it the responsibility of the railway to move, and not the people to learn? What do you think would happen to our already high fares if we expected them to bury or raise every mile of track they have in the city?[/rant]
    I think you misunderstood, nobody is saying to move the tracks. There no arguing that trains are dangerous, so why not reduce the interaction between pedestrian and trains by building pedestrian overpasses over the tracks?

    An example Anderson LRT station. When it first opened, there was one way in/out of the station and it was through a set of doors, up the escalator, over the tracks then down the escalator. Then, they added in a second access to the platform on the other end by taking down the fence and paving a path across the tracks. Not necessary, and more dangerous. CT claims there isn't much they can do to increase safety, and this is where I disagree.
    ---

  9. #449
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    Originally posted by -relk-


    Stupidity is not involved in every case. There is a difference between stupidity and not paying attention. Stupidity would be seeing the train coming and trying to beat the train across the tracks. Not paying attention involves seeing the first train leaving, assuming the lights and sounds are for that train, and having already checked the other direction of the track for another train, assume it is safe to go.
    Not paying attention while navigating a road filled with multi tonne vehicles (often driven by morons), and the occasional 80+ tonne train is stupidity. You have to pay attention, even if you are just a pedestrian. Be responsible.

  10. #450
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    Originally posted by Guillermo


    no, but while people can't move mountains, they can design train crossings. maybe the current trains crossings are sufficient, but why does that have to stop us from trying to make things even better? the argument that train crossings are OK now and there is no room for improvement is very caveman-like IMO. my grandfather says the same thing with regards to "snail mail" and email.
    We have better things to spend our precious resources on, like expanding the system by adding more trains & stations.

    We don't need to improve crossings. You can't fix stupid. Dumb people will always get themselves killed somehow.

    When I was kid, I was taught to look both ways before crossing the street and be aware of your surroundings at all times. As such, I have successfully avoided being struck by a car, truck, train, etc for 32 years. It's pretty basic.

  11. #451
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    I probably will never get it. While I'm sadden by a man losing his wife, kids losing their mom, others losing their relative, best friend etc.

    Maybe I don't take enough Calgary transit anymore but when I was a kid I took the train regularly and never once did I come close to getting hit by one.
    Originally posted by rage2
    Shit, there's only 49 users here, I doubt we'll even break 100
    I am user #49

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    Originally posted by kenny


    I think you misunderstood, nobody is saying to move the tracks. There no arguing that trains are dangerous, so why not reduce the interaction between pedestrian and trains by building pedestrian overpasses over the tracks?

    An example Anderson LRT station. When it first opened, there was one way in/out of the station and it was through a set of doors, up the escalator, over the tracks then down the escalator. Then, they added in a second access to the platform on the other end by taking down the fence and paving a path across the tracks. Not necessary, and more dangerous. CT claims there isn't much they can do to increase safety, and this is where I disagree.
    Agreed. I mean it's only a matter on a minute to take this entrance/exit which will dramatically decrease accidents. the only reason this is open is convenience, so people can drop people off here and get back on to macleod immediately.

    honestly, i use this myself at chinook but everytime i use this path there is almost at least one or two people who start this motion to beat the train before the train leaves and when you see a couple people start this trend, everyone continues it. luckily the driver expects this and waits for most of them. And of course you get these indecisive people who can't decide whether they want to wait 30 seconds or just beat the train so they linger around waiting for someone to make a decision for them (like the video posted earlier).

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    Originally posted by Guillermo
    you guys, these were accidents. everyday i walk through the hallways at the U of C, where half of the people are texting on their phones etc. instead of paying attention to where they are walking. it is not uncommon for people who are walking in crowds to not be paying attention to what is happening around them - and in fact, i bet many of the critics here are guilty of this themselves. so I am not surprised that there are people crossing the tracks who are looking at their phone... maybe this isn't what we would consider a "safe" practice, but certainly it doesn't make the few who get hit by trains stupid.

    if you die from a concussion playing hockey, does that make you stupid? what about if you fall to your death rock climbing - are you stupid then? what if you're walking to work and slip on the ice, falling into traffic and getting crushed to death. are you stupid?
    There's a difference between something that is within your control, and something that isn't.
    You have a couple of photos that are great... you must be very good at photoshop!

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    Originally posted by masoncgy


    We have better things to spend our precious resources on, like expanding the system by adding more trains & stations.

    We don't need to improve crossings. You can't fix stupid. Dumb people will always get themselves killed somehow.

    When I was kid, I was taught to look both ways before crossing the street and be aware of your surroundings at all times. As such, I have successfully avoided being struck by a car, truck, train, etc for 32 years. It's pretty basic.
    This is the same argument made by the auto industry when Ralph Nader was working for auto safety regulations. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unsafe_at_Any_Speed "But seatbelts are too expensive! Besides, only idiots kill themselves in automobile accidents!!!"

    click for larger version
    » Click image for larger version

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    Originally posted by clem24


    There's a difference between something that is within your control, and something that isn't.
    i don't get it. you mean like moving mountains (to make them safer) versus designing safer railroad crossings?

  16. #456
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    BTW, from what I've heard the crossings for the new Chinook station will be completely at grade. By the looks of it some of you won't be happy about this...

    If CT ever looked at automatic doors at least at a few train stations (they probably have), I wonder what they concluded. I'm sure there is a report floating around about various crossing safety features.
    Last edited by WithTheLightsOn; 12-08-2011 at 05:50 PM.

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    Originally posted by dandia89

    Agreed. I mean it's only a matter on a minute to take this entrance/exit which will dramatically decrease accidents. the only reason this is open is convenience, so people can drop people off here and get back on to macleod immediately.

    honestly, i use this myself at chinook but everytime i use this path there is almost at least one or two people who start this motion to beat the train before the train leaves and when you see a couple people start this trend, everyone continues it. luckily the driver expects this and waits for most of them. And of course you get these indecisive people who can't decide whether they want to wait 30 seconds or just beat the train so they linger around waiting for someone to make a decision for them (like the video posted earlier).
    but as ridership has increased they found it necessary to increase the capacity of the station to move people off and on the platform at a greater rate, hence the second access point.

    I agree with masoncgy on this one, the city has better things to spend it's money on than babysitting people who are so uninvolved in their own safety. At some point you have to draw a line, the light, the bells, even the little pedestrian arm at some of the crossings, that's the limit to how much effort the city should put in, at some point people have to stand up for their own safety and say "hey, I know there's train tracks here, maybe texting becky about how bad rachel looked in those pants today isn't really that important"

    Call it cold hearted or cave-man-esque if you want...I really don't care, I'm sick of people insisting that personal safety shouldn't be at all the responsibility of the people demanding it.
    Last edited by Go4Long; 12-08-2011 at 06:03 PM.
    Originally posted by HeavyD
    you know you are making the right decision if Toma opposes it.

  18. #458
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    Originally posted by Guillermo


    i don't get it. you mean like moving mountains (to make them safer) versus designing safer railroad crossings?
    Texting or listening to music. That's a choice you make = in control of the situation. If you decide to climb a mountain with no safety gear and you fall and die, heck if you decide to climb a mountain, you also made that choice. Think about it.

    Now on the flip side, if you're on the train and something failed mechanically and it derails and kills everyone on board, that's truly an accident.

    There should be absolutely no need to cater to lowest common denominator.
    You have a couple of photos that are great... you must be very good at photoshop!

  19. #459
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    ^^no, i would still call those things accidents.

    people walking in large groups (at U of C hallways, at the tran stations, etc.) have a herd mentality. i konw this because i have to deal with the herds every time i walk on campus (which I try to limit). they feel safe walking in the middle of the herd, and are relying on things like peripheral vision and the movement of others to guide them. there are models of how things like this move - herds ofanimals, swarms of bees, etc. - look it up. you call it stupid, i call it nature.

    why don't you have a little respect for the deceased? Just imagine the silly-ass way you're gonna look when you die - how is your family going to feel when people start a thread on beyond about what a fucking idiot you were when you died.

    jesusfuckingchrist.
    Last edited by Guillermo; 12-09-2011 at 09:41 AM.

  20. #460
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    Originally posted by Guillermo
    herds ofanimals, swarms of bees, etc. - look it up. you call it stupid, i call it nature.
    we're the top of the goddamn food chain and you're saying that people walk in front of moving trains because they think they're in a swarm/herd? I feel very bad about the future of our society as we know it.
    Originally posted by HeavyD
    you know you are making the right decision if Toma opposes it.

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