Calgary plans to battle suburban sprawl; developors bitch and moan

[Super_Geo]

http://calsun.canoe.ca/News/Alberta/...99311-sun.html

Here's the ONE time I hear about Calgary making a smart urban planning decision and what do you have? These cocksucker developers bitching and fearmongering about how making denser communities will "make Calgary a less desirable place to live, significantly reducing the quality of life our residents currently enjoy." Come on! That is some baseless Scare-Tactic-101 bullshit right there!

Low density suburbia is going to be North America's biggest liability in this new era of high oil/gas prices. Instead of having people live close to your commercial districts (where people shop and work), people now have to drive 25+km in one direction to get to work, all the while going 20km/hr on Deerfoot or Crowchild.

What are your guys' thoughts? Low density or high density housing for Calgary?

[Tik-Tok]

Yeah, we need to start building up, not out.

We need a "new" downtown. An area away from the current one, where developers can start building highrises for commercial and residential use, and have a skytrain going directly between the two "downtowns" for business's to take advantage of.

[lint]

How exactly does this erode housing affordability?

[Weapon_R]

Originally posted by lint
How exactly does this erode housing affordability?

Because the greedy bastard homebuilders can't buy a lot for peanuts inner-city and sell a home for twice their cost.

[lint]

Originally posted by Weapon_R


Because the greedy bastard homebuilders can't buy a lot for peanuts inner-city and sell a home for twice their cost.

But doesn't a denser plan include a larger number of condos? Which would mean increased affordability?

[Tik-Tok]

Originally posted by lint


But doesn't a denser plan include a larger number of condos? Which would mean increased affordability?

Yes. They're lying to save their own skin.

[rc2002]

If I was a homebuilder making millions in the current Laissez Faire style planning system Calgary has right now, then I would complain too when the city finally smartened up and threatened my profits.

Hopefully the city is smart enough to realize the developers have deep enough pockets to suck it up.

[Xtrema]

It's a good thing. We are going to have too many condos on the market anyway. Stopping development will prevent a housing market crash so we won't end up like the US with foreclosures.

I think we can afford not to build any residential for the next 2-3 years.

[benyl]

Haha, I hate urban sprawl, but the selfish person in me says it is bad (cause I live on the edge of town). haha, I want them to keep building more until I am inner city in Royal Oak... lol

Looks like Bronco won't be getting as many kick backs now... hehe

[Lex350]

Originally posted by Weapon_R


Because the greedy bastard homebuilders can't buy a lot for peanuts inner-city and sell a home for twice their cost.

the builders don't make that much off of the lots. They are as much at the mercey of the developers as your average home ownere is.

[Fivewayradio]

It's whole culture of greed that extends from landowners through developers to builders and every tangent in between. I'm sure you could cut a couple of middlemen out in there--people who add absolutely no value, but demand a portion of profits--and the industry as a whole would be better for it.

This market is going to weed out the shitty businesses anyhow. If your company can't adapt to the challenges--the business climate, the bylaws, the bureaucracy, then maybe you're not the savvy real estate professional you thought you were. You can't just make money in the easy times and expect that the powers that be are going to spoon-feed you profits in the lean years.

I'm with the city on this one. The good of the city as a whole outweighs the profits of developers. They can adapt and find new ways to profit so the city can grow in more efficient and sustainable ways.

[buh_buh]

I already live too far away from everything, and I don't even live on the outer edge of the city. Lets start building up. I don't know if this is true, but I heard a statistic that Calgary has the largest cities in Canada area wise, yet we're, what 5th in terms of population?

[Thaco]

The more dense the population the dirtier and more crime the communities have, look at the "undesirable" communities, they are so because they all have basement suites and duplexes/fourplexes, making higher density, more crime, more dirty... as much as i dislike the urban sprawl, I'd prefer that over nastiness and crime, honestly, 90% of what i do is 10 minutes from me with the exception of specialty shops.

[frozenrice]

Originally posted by benyl
Looks like Bronco won't be getting as many kick backs now... hehe

I don't think he would have been getting many to begin with. In his first election campaign for mayor, one of his election mandates was to impose a levy on land development. This levy was suppposed to go towards infrastructure like sewers, roads, utilities into the new developments. A lot of builders were against this as they predicted that the land developers would simply pass tack the extra levy into the price of lots and drive the lot prices up. IIRC, this added a few thousand bucks per lot.
Builders feared and predicted that the price increase would cause loss of sales and therefore a downturn in new home sales, which meant loss of profit and jobs - all doom and gloom. I wonder what those same builders are saying now about the housing market and their loss of profit.

[Toma]

Originally posted by Thaco
The more dense the population the dirtier and more crime the communities have, look at the "undesirable" communities, they are so because they all have basement suites and duplexes/fourplexes, making higher density, more crime, more dirty... as much as i dislike the urban sprawl, I'd prefer that over nastiness and crime, honestly, 90% of what i do is 10 minutes from me with the exception of specialty shops.

No it ain't....

Higher density is better. Lets say you have 1000 cops patroling 200 square km, or 600 square km?

Calgary is the biggest city by land area in NA I believe, with extremly low density.

Sprawl is why we have shit roads, declining health care, declining school system, our sewer system cannot handle heavy rains and communities/homes flood.....

[Xtrema]

Is it illegal for the city to charge $500K-$1M/lot on the edge?

Builder can keep on building if there's such demand. And it may force them to rebuild inner city neighborhoods because it will be more economically viable.

I hate my taxes keep going to new schools yet people with kids refuse to live in old homes/neighborhoods to utilizes schools there.

[sexualbanana]

Originally posted by Toma


Calgary is the biggest city by land area in NA I believe, with extremly low density.

I believe in terms of land area, we are about the same as, if not slightly bigger, than NYC. There is not a fucking chance that we are bigger in sprawl than some of the other major urban centres in North America. Unless you count just the cities and not the suburbs, then I'd believe it. For example, if you just take the city of Los Angeles and leave it's suburbs of Santa Monica, West Hollywood, Beverly Hills, Rosemead, etc. Then I'd say it's possible that Calgary is larger.

[finboy]

Originally posted by sexualbanana


I believe in terms of land area, we are about the same as, if not slightly bigger, than NYC. There is not a fucking chance that we are bigger in sprawl than some of the other major urban centres in North America. Unless you count just the cities and not the suburbs, then I'd believe it. For example, if you just take the city of Los Angeles and leave it's suburbs of Santa Monica, West Hollywood, Beverly Hills, Rosemead, etc. Then I'd say it's possible that Calgary is larger.

calgary is one of NA's biggest geographical cities without suburbs, i think on calgary's wiki it mentions our footprint is almost as large as the 5 boroughs of NYC

i still think calgary is too crowded for its size

[Hakkola]

Originally posted by sexualbanana


I believe in terms of land area, we are about the same as, if not slightly bigger, than NYC. There is not a fucking chance that we are bigger in sprawl than some of the other major urban centres in North America. Unless you count just the cities and not the suburbs, then I'd believe it. For example, if you just take the city of Los Angeles and leave it's suburbs of Santa Monica, West Hollywood, Beverly Hills, Rosemead, etc. Then I'd say it's possible that Calgary is larger.

We are bigger, we were second largest in 2002, I think Jacksonville was bigger, this does not include suburbs of course.

[Toma]

Originally posted by finboy


i still think calgary is too crowded for its size

Calgary only SEEMS crowded cause sprawl is so bad, and everyone has to drive..... Drive to shop, drive to get your hair cut, drive 30km to go to work, drive to schools etc... its TOO BIG.

Go out at nights.... compared to other "big" cities, this place is a ghost town after midnight. Hell, we only have one 24 hour walmart lol