Welding Techniques

[dj_rice]

When welding, is it better to push a weld or to pull a weld or is it dependant on the angle of the weld?Pros/cons on both

[sr20s14zenki]

Its better to pull the weld in MIG, it is also dependent on the inclination of your torch as well as the included angle. Why do you ask? If you are tigging, you would use a forehand motion, with the filler in front of the tungsten, and going towards the filler. If you are sticking, away from the weld, as you dont want slag inclusions in the weld. Also, yes position is dependent

example: if you were doing a 3F which is a vertical lap joint, or FILLET, you would weld starting at the bottom and moving up, stick or mig or tig, doesnt matter, thats how its done. you use what is called "herringbone" weave to do this weld.


if you were doing a 2F, which is a horizontal FILLET weld, you would pull with mig, as well as with stick.

those are just some examples. This is all by the book, as i am in sait for my second period welder.

[dj_rice]

Originally posted by sr20s14zenki
Its better to pull the weld in MIG, it is also dependent on the inclination of your torch as well as the included angle. Why do you ask?

And forgot to add, MIG welding

Just asking, as when I'm pulling the weld, I seem to melt through the steel moreso than when I am pushing the weld..and no its not car stuff, its work related, just trying to gain some knowledge on welding before I go to Welding skool

[RZRSHARP_SVX]

with mig its better to pull much cleaner weld. also angle can play a part, can affect the penetration of the weld pool

sounds like you are moving to slow and to much amps

[sr20s14zenki]

Originally posted by dj_rice



And forgot to add, MIG welding

Just asking, as when I'm pulling the weld, I seem to melt through the steel moreso than when I am pushing the weld..and no its not car stuff, its work related, just trying to gain some knowledge on welding before I go to Welding skool

The reason you melt thru the steel pulling is because at that point you are getting maximum penetrtion, also melting of the steel is caused by incorrect settings, causing too much heat input. If you push, the reason you dont melt thru is because you are quenching the puddle by adding relatively cold wire to it.

[dj_rice]

Originally posted by sr20s14zenki


The reason you melt thru the steel pulling is because at that point you are getting maximum penetrtion, also melting of the steel is caused by incorrect settings, causing too much heat input. If you push, the reason you dont melt thru is because you are quenching the puddle by adding relatively cold wire to it.

So in your theory, if I turn down the amp/voltage and pull, I will not melt through?


Also how many hours are needed to get into the Welding Program First Year

[sr20s14zenki]

Originally posted by dj_rice



So in your theory, if I turn down the amp/voltage and pull, I will not melt through?


Also how many hours are needed to get into the Welding Program First Year

Correct, your voltage and wire settings need to be set in relation to the metal you are welding. If you are melting some mild steel pipe 1/8th inch thick for example, you could set for 170 IPM, and 17 volts, that may be a bit cold, or hot, adjust if needed. Every machine is different, and every manufacturer has differnt charts in their welders for reccomended settings. Usually in my experiance, the 10, 100 method works good, eg. 200 wire speed, 20 volts, but i mean 400 wire speed and 40 volts would be retarded, so at that point, it changes, know what i mean?

1560 hours is the usual, but i believe you can get in with pretty much any hours you have, you just wont officially be a second year apprentice until after your hours have caught up.

[dj_rice]

I was welding, 500 wire speed and 23.7 volts today

[sr20s14zenki]

What were you welding on?

[dj_rice]

Originally posted by sr20s14zenki
What were you welding on?

Horse Racing Track Fencing componets where nice welds do not matter just as long you pump out production welds can look like ass

[sr20s14zenki]

Yes ok, i meant thickness of material? Thats a pretty high setting, but not that i havent welded at that before haha, its quick...hot...but quick. You can only set the machine as fast as YOU can manipulate the puddle. If you have too much puddle and not enough manipulation, you can risk cold lap as well, youll learn alllllll about it in first year, get ready to have your noggin crammed full of information (=

[Benny]

That's pretty rippin' hot dude. On your welder the amperage is in direct relation to your wire feed speed. I tend to use the 1:10 rule too for most welds (18v = 180wfs). Amperage is penetration, so if you're burning through you should turn down your WFS or up your travel speed a bit. Also, as to whether you should be welding forehand (push) or backhand (pull). The general way that I've been taught is that if you're going for more penetration and heat you should be welding backhand, if you're going for a nice smooth, fluid pass for something like a cap, you should welding forehand.

[old&slow]

If ur welding fencing ... weld it down with those high settings...weld it down anyway...and if down is not an option...push it...high heat + down = fast.

[Rockski]

Originally posted by sr20s14zenki

example: if you were doing a 3F which is a vertical lap joint, or FILLET, you would weld starting at the bottom and moving up, stick or mig or tig, doesnt matter, thats how its done. you use what is called "herringbone" weave to do this weld.

vertical root for mig is downhand (fillet)
same as your vertical stick 6010 root (fillet)
(ONLY IN SCHOOL)

Originally posted by sr20s14zenki

1560 hours is the usual, but i believe you can get in with pretty much any hours you have, you just wont officially be a second year apprentice until after your hours have caught up.

you dont need the full hours to attend school... you just need the full hours to advance in your apprenticeship


who are your teachers in second year, sr20s14zenki

[sr20s14zenki]

Originally posted by Rockski



vertical root for mig is downhand (fillet)
same as your vertical stick 6010 root (fillet)
(ONLY IN SCHOOL)




you dont need the full hours to attend school... you just need the full hours to advance in your apprenticeship


who are your teachers in second year, sr20s14zenki

Im pretty sure the 6010 root on a 3F is done uphand...i cant remember tho, i dont stick regularly at my job, so now that were back into stick as of yesterday in school, thats the first time ive picked up stick since last year of school, but i seem to remember it being up because it was a bitch to learn. I know that the 3f GMAW root is done downhill FOR SURE haha. My teachers are Jim May and Jason Purdy.

EDIT: Yes, i was correct, im looking at my 120102d first year module, Fillet Welds in the 3F position: Progression: All passes to be completed using vertical uphill progression.

[Rockski]

my bad... i slipped on the stick your right... uphand... for some reason i remember my teachers telling me downhandfor 6010 root on a fillet.... now that i thinik aboot it... that dont make much sence... mig yea down hand

what are you burning a 1/8 or 3/32 rod and whats your heat at/ arcforce for each position?

my teachers for first and second year were mike burndred and al white

first year math teacher was al knox and second year was LEN ... something or other... the drunk guy that dresses like a cowboy.... fuck can he drink

[sr20s14zenki]

LEN hes fucking awesom, lol this year we have " rain man" as we call him. Comes in to teach geometry or whatever, and hes teaching us greek words and stuff LOL, fountain of knowledge...doesnt belong teaching welding anything. On a root pass on 3/8 mild steel, would be 1/8th 6010, i think about 90-110 amps, arc force at about maybe 50?

[legendboy]

Generally speaking when i mig weld my torch is perpendicular to my work surface, so it doesn't matter which direction my torch is moving.

[sr20s14zenki]

Originally posted by legendboy
Generally speaking when i mig weld my torch is perpendicular to my work surface, so it doesn't matter which direction my torch is moving.

yep sometimes we do that too, forehand, backhand or straight on, it will all change how the finished weld looks. forehand tends to flatten the bead out, backhand tends to give a higher crown, so in teh middle would pretty much give you the best of both.

[dj_rice]

Originally posted by sr20s14zenki
Yes ok, i meant thickness of material? Thats a pretty high setting, but not that i havent welded at that before haha, its quick...hot...but quick. You can only set the machine as fast as YOU can manipulate the puddle. If you have too much puddle and not enough manipulation, you can risk cold lap as well, youll learn alllllll about it in first year, get ready to have your noggin crammed full of information (=

1.875" OD 14Gauge


And wow you guys are using all these fancy welding terms that I dont understand

And at work, I think I'm doing what is called Gas Metal Arc Welding...