Golf club, 16 employees charged with 'permitting drunkenness' after fatal crash

[Mckenzie]

Me thinks this could set quite the precedent (and the wrong one at that). I think this takes all of the responsibility out of getting wasted.



http://network.nationalpost.com/np/b...oka-crash.aspx

each of the 16 employees face penalties of a year in jail and fines of up to $100,000.

I do not see how this is serving justice...blame the waitress who served a shot / beer to a drunken golfer.

[hampstor]

Originally posted by Mckenzie
Me thinks this could set quite the precedent (and the wrong one at that). I think this takes all of the responsibility out of getting wasted.



http://network.nationalpost.com/np/b...oka-crash.aspx



I do not see how this is serving justice...blame the waitress who served a shot / beer to a drunken golfer.

As sad as this news is, the precedent must've been set a long time ago.

When I got the liquor event permit for my wedding, they informed me that I make sure no one drinks and drives as I am responsble for my guests.

However all 16 staff? Shit that's a bit of a stretching though.

[adam c]

i think the government of ontario is a bunch of liberal supports trying to make the conservatives look bad with how they are charging people and court cases lately

[gretz]

Originally posted by hampstor



When I got the liquor event permit for my wedding, they informed me that I make sure no one drinks and drives as I am responsble for my guests.

If you have any gathring, you are responsible for your guests getting home no matter what.

Even kiddies having house parties, if a friend (or not) leaves your house after a drink, you are 100% liable if anything happens after they leave.

[hampstor]

Originally posted by adam c
i think the government of ontario is a bunch of liberal supports trying to make the conservatives look bad with how they are charging people and court cases lately

wtf does Liberal hate have to do with this thread? Alberta has the same kind of laws, and i'm fairly sure that the Liberals had nothing to do with it.

Originally posted by gretz


If you have any gathring, you are responsible for your guests getting home no matter what.

Even kiddies having house parties, if a friend (or not) leaves your house after a drink, you are 100% liable if anything happens after they leave.

I wasnt aware of that part - but I can understand that. The liquor event permit removed that responsibility from establishment we had our wedding.

I wouldn't let any of my friends drive pissed drunk home if they were over at my house drinking anyway. That'd make me a bad friend!

[Xtrema]

Originally posted by gretz
Even kiddies having house parties, if a friend (or not) leaves your house after a drink, you are 100% liable if anything happens after they leave.

Would that liability be offset by availability of Taxi chits? Pretty soon we'll need to sign waivers to go to parties.

[adam c]

conspiracy

first that stupid child support case where that dumb bitch is making the non father pay for kids that aren't his
and now this where people who have absolutely nothing to do with these people and their drinking are being charged with this

[gretz]

Originally posted by hampstor


I wasnt aware of that part - but I can see how it sounds right. The liquor event permit removed that responsibility from establishment we had our wedding.

I wouldn't let any of my friends drive pissed drunk home if they were over at my house drinking anyway. That'd make me a bad friend!

for pissed drunk, but if your buddy has 3 beers - would you let him leave? Its tough in some cases - the ol' "ive never seen him before in my life" comes into play - a little harder for the golf course but just something to think about

[Crymson]

I think it's ridiculous. We need to revamp our laws to make ALL people accountable for their own actions at ALL times. What purpose does this serve? What justice will be done if these people are convicted.

If this doesn't get squashed IMMEDIATLY it will definately go to the supreme court and quite frank, i'm scared to live in a society that would have to have lost it's way so badly to think that a precendent like this would be valid.

I would think the only case for a law like this would be if you literally poisoned someone to death, and even then i would expect a vicious court case where it had to be proven that you were practically force feeding someguy shots.

This would mean, that nearly every week, some waitress/bar owner/party-holder would be going to prison for another person's stupidity.

[hampstor]

Originally posted by Crymson
I think it's ridiculous. We need to revamp our laws to make ALL people accountable for their own actions at ALL times. What purpose does this serve? What justice will be done if these people are convicted.

If this doesn't get squashed IMMEDIATLY it will definately go to the supreme court and quite frank, i'm scared to live in a society that would have to have lost it's way so badly to think that a precendent like this would be valid.

I would think the only case for a law like this would be if you literally poisoned someone to death, and even then i would expect a vicious court case where it had to be proven that you were practically force feeding someguy shots.

This would mean, that nearly every week, some waitress/bar owner/party-holder would be going to prison for another person's stupidity.

You're making it sound like this is a new bill that is going thru the legislature - it's not, not to mention you are making a mountain out of a mole hill. Ever heard the term, "You're cut off from the bar" ? The charges are for:

permitting drunkenness on a licensed premises
supplying liquor to an intoxicated person

They're not being charged with murder or making any of them responsible for the deaths.

I'm fairly sure none of them will go to jail for it - the golf club will most likely lose their liquor license though.

[a social dsease]

People should be held accountable for their own actions. The guy drank, drove, crashed, and died. Seems perfectly just to me. Sucks that his buddies died too, but when you get into a vehicle with someone who has been drinking, thats the risk you take.

[Toma]

This 'precedent' does exist in Alberta, and back when I was a bartender there were cases of the establishment AND the server getting in shit.

But all 16employees ? That is ridiculars.

[TorqueDog]

Here's a concept! How about we demand people start taking responsibility for their own actions instead of trying to find someone to blame since the original retards are dead?

[cam_wmh]

Originally posted by adam c
i think the government of ontario is a bunch of liberal supports trying to make the conservatives look bad with how they are charging people and court cases lately

LOL WUT?

Originally posted by hampstor

I wouldn't let any of my friends drive pissed drunk home if they were over at my house drinking anyway. That'd make me a bad friend!

Quoted for Truth.

[Eleanor]

Originally posted by TorqueDog
Here's a concept! How about we demand people start taking responsibility for their own actions instead of trying to find someone to blame since the original retards are dead?

What would we need the government for then though?

I personally think this is a stupid law, are we going to start charging owners of gun stores for selling weapons that were used in crimes?

If I beat someone to death with a chair from Ikea, should they charge the cashier with permitting murder?

[ercchry]

i know a girl that works at the lake joe club in the summers, thankfully for the past 2 years has worked the beer cart and not the restaurant. but i can see why these charges are happening, lots of money on that lake

[4bier]

tough to prove in some sense they could have slammed back a couple in the car ...... and they were heading to a cottage as if there was no booze in the car

[Super_Geo]

I can see where the waitress or bartender could've intervened... if you have a group of 3 guys just getting shitfaced and you know that one of them is driving, you could talk to them and see who the designated driver is.

But how effective would it be? You have a little rich kid at his parent's golf club, driving his parent's Audi who invited his equally spoiled rich brat kids out for a day of golfing. Is he really going to stop because some fucker making minimum wage is going to tell him to stop drinking at his golf course?

I mean, a lot of assumptions being made here, but I've seen a shitload of young and spoiled little kids at the more exclusive golf clubs in Calgary. Once they turn 18 and go there without the parents I doubt they'd give one fuck what 'the help' has to say about how much they've had to drink.

[Graham_A_M]

When I used to work at a golf-course, the problem is: people sneaking in their own alcohol onto the course of which becomes a very difficult thing to monitor. We'd make it known that bringing alcohol onto the course that wasn't purchased through the bar/restaurant is grounds for being permanently banned from the course, but people still do it.

There is quite a grey area for allowing people to have a good time at the course, and monitoring their drinking habits to the point where it bothers people.
By the sounds of it the Beverage cart person is the most at fault, that and the staff at the bar/restaurant. Although I can appreciate the whole staff being held liable in such an instance.

[Mckenzie]

I heard on CTV this morning that they were served 31 drinks over the period that they were there.

If it turns out they are going to be guilty of the charges, then every single bar / club / pub should be held to the same standard and we should have the fun police cracking down on every establishment.