Kitchen Knives -- lots of good knives, but what about value?

[nonlinear]

^^what is this FG10 knife you speak of?

[szw]

Sorry I meant VG10 which is the type of steel usually associated with Japanese knives (has that nice pattern on the side of the blade).

http://www.ikea.com/ca/en/catalog/products/90131068

$80 here, $50 in the US.

[r3ccOs]

funny enough it doesn't indicate that it is VG(not fg) 10 on the site... but I picked it up yesterday and it is stamped VG10 Carbon Steel on it!

Its thin, comfortable and balanced for an 8" chef's knife and yes it has all those fold markings as it is several layers of steel over a very hard core.

Out of "steel" knives, the VG10 is concidered the best material for kitchen knives, and again... this knife is about a hundred bucks less than the next VG10 knife you can get from a common name.

I also have the diamond steel that is in the series, which is an amazing bang for the buck @ $24...

As for my twin masters, they are stamped and made in spain... like you said the "lower" of the twin series but still Fridour processed.

They are maybe just a 1 or 2 below the Twin Cuisines/4star/Pro in the rockwell ratings... but if you use a steel on them before use (or after) every time... you'll they perform brilliantly.

However this 8" Ikea Slitbar chef's knife is just tip effing top.
I have no idea about the rest of the slitbar line, and will assume that the molybdenum/vanadium-steelsteel is "maybe" forged, but it doesn't indicate so.
Don't buy the wrong one... they have 2 identical knives, one not VG10.
Then again its easy to spot, and one is $29 and the other is $79
*again, the Ikea Website doesn't state that it is a VG10, it is actuality stamped on the blade*

[Mitsu3000gt]

Originally posted by szw
Sorry I meant VG10 which is the type of steel usually associated with Japanese knives (has that nice pattern on the side of the blade).

http://www.ikea.com/ca/en/catalog/products/90131068

$80 here, $50 in the US.

VG10 is apparently the "low end of the high end" when it comes to Japanese knives. More durable but won't hold an edge as well, is what I was told.

[szw]

Originally posted by Mitsu3000gt


VG10 is apparently the "low end of the high end" when it comes to Japanese knives. More durable but won't hold an edge as well, is what I was told.

So what is "higher end"?

[Mitsu3000gt]

Originally posted by szw


So what is "higher end"?

#1 and #2 blue steel, I believe. Much harder, easy to resharpen, and holds an edge for a long time. Thats what the super high end Japanese knives are made of.

[lint]

Originally posted by Mitsu3000gt
#1 and #2 blue steel, I believe. Much harder, easy to resharpen, and holds an edge for a long time. Thats what the super high end Japanese knives are made of.

Those two points are contradictory. If the steel is much harder, it would be more difficult to sharpen.

[szw]

Here is some info I just found but it doesn't really compare them all:
http://korin.com/Learn/Elements-of-Steel

Neat stuff

[JAYMEZ]

^^ How much are the high end Japanese knives your talking about?

[lint]

Kind of a tangent, but there was a National Geographic special about how Katanas are made. They wrap a super hard steel with a a softer steel for the edge to get the best of strength and sharpness. Really interesting.

http://www.spikedhumor.com/articles/...rd_Katana.html

Also, the pattern doesn't come from folding the steel, it's painted on with clay and a signature of the craftsman. For a sword anyways.

[Mitsu3000gt]

Originally posted by lint


Those two points are contradictory. If the steel is much harder, it would be more difficult to sharpen.

I was just quoting what the Knifewear guy said. This is from his website: "Often referred to as Yasuki #1 Blue Steel this is a great knife makers steel. It is hard, extremely easy to re-sharpen, rust resistant (for carbon steel), capable of an outstanding mirror finish and a long lived edge. What more can you want? This is high performance steel" He repeatedly mentions the really hard steels being "easy to sharpen" but I agree logic would suggest harder = harder to sharpen.

Also, your point about how Katanas are made, that is how some of the knives are made too. The knife I bought is made like you say, with Blue steel #2 in the middle and coated in stainless.

I have the Santoku knife from this category: http://www.knifewear.com/knife-family.asp?family=12

Highly, highly, recommened and the price isn't even bad compared to what you can buy at many other local stores.

[clem24]

Originally posted by JAYMEZ
^^ How much are the high end Japanese knives your talking about?

Look on the link I provided for some Misono knives...

[r3ccOs]

VG10 is one of the best all around steels to use for the kitchen... Rockwell of 59-61 generally

There is VG1 which is harder, and then there are those very exclusive "blue steel" tempered knives, which Kevin has...

He has incredible knives, the only issue is...
#1 they are expensive to purchase a whole set, and this thread is about good value


#2 sharpening is tough
The metal is very hard, about 63+, so you'd have to use perhaps a diamond steel, or only sharpen using water/oil stones
Also they are sharpened to 15 deg per side or less, razor sharp, but this also means its that much harder to get to that accuracy, especially when we're all used to using a steel or stone @ 20 deg

They are beautiful knives, and one day I'm sure to get some stuff from Kevin...

In the mean time, I'm very happy with my VG10 Ikea Slitbar & my set of Henckel Twin Master

[r3ccOs]

p.s. this is a VG10

good prices too!

http://www.knifewear.com/knife-family.asp?family=3

[Weapon_R]

So I finally got my set of RADA knives and these things are impressive. Sharper than anything I've used before. The Chef's knife and slicer are literally as sharp as a razor.

They are really thin and I wonder how long the blade will stay this sharp. Time will tell, but so far so good.

[szw]

Did you find any info about what RADA is made of, where/how they are made and by who?

[clem24]

Originally posted by Weapon_R
They are really thin and I wonder how long the blade will stay this sharp. Time will tell, but so far so good.

Again I hope you bought the sharpener. Well worth the $10 or whatever they charge. That's one of the issues of the Radas. While they're still sharp, you'll need the sharpener to get them back to razor sharpness. The knives are simply the best that I've used given the price.

[szw]

Originally posted by r3ccOs

The metal is very hard, about 63+, so you'd have to use perhaps a diamond steel, or only sharpen using water/oil stones

I'm curious because you keep mentioning sharpening with your diamond steel. Steels don't sharpen a knife, they hone it. And a diamond steel actually takes off some metal so I would be careful with it. From what I've read, a diamond steel is not usually recommended in general.

edit: ok, since a diamond steel will take a bit of metal off, I guess it can be considered sharpening, but I would consider it a bad type of sharpening that can damage your edge.

[Weapon_R]

Originally posted by szw
Did you find any info about what RADA is made of, where/how they are made and by who?

High carbon stainless steel, made in the U.S.A and obviously made by Rada.

[mikes334]

yea I would not use a diamond steel to sharpen my knives.