Should I drop out? *Serious Question*

[badatusrnames]

Originally posted by Kobe


Thanks man, I've really been thinking about this and I'm glad I posted it here to get it off my chest. I was planning on going to Costa Rica or Poland in June for a nice Vacation, but I think I might stay in town and just play as much poker over the summer as humanly possible to earn as much money as possible.

I think I should just finish off this Diploma next year and just take 3 classes each semester.. Maybe 4 then 2? and have it in case I want to upgrade to the Degree in a couple years. If worst comes to worse, I waste another $3,500 and call it a year, it won't be the end of the world.

When I was 18-19 my parents threatened to kick me out of the house if I continued to gamble, so I did it behind there backs. I have been learning for a long time and not just from playing, I have read books, watched videos, analyzed hands etc etc..

Poker is a game of Math and odds, and another with half a brain and time to learn can win money. There is also luck involved but with volume the odds and math equal out. My parents realized this about 1 1/2 years ago and started to support it. It was actually my mom that suggested I quit my construction job and play poker full time to make a living, when I was making $27/hour.

The reason why I can say I make roughly 40-60 an hour is because. my ROI (Return on Investment) is pretty accurate over a couple thousand games, and with the stakes I play/ Amount of games I put in for an hour I can estimate my hourly rate. There is swings in poker, and there is ups and downs, but is is not a game fully of "luck"


Here is a few peoples online graphs that will hopefully prove to you that the game is not 100% luck

This is prob the most consistent online winner you will ever see..


This player prob puts in the most volume on Pokerstars
[/img]http://img301.imageshack.us/img301/6610/jorj.jpg[/img]

A friend of mine that plays Headsup with me, and has helped me out a lot




I can keep going on.. It seems easy from those guys, but trust me it is a lot together then you think

If you want to view some bad graphs go here
http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/54...-graphs-61228/




Anyways I was really sure earlier when I was writing this thread that there was no way I am going to finish this Diploma, but thinking about it now 1 more year is not going to kill me, I will just have to suck it up and do both


Thanks Beyond!

if you were playing VLT's full time to support yourself, then you'd have a problem. Poker is a game that given you have the skills and knowledge, you can average a good income.

[Godfuader]

Step 1: Stop doing this thing for mom!

There are a lot of things you need to consider before making any decisions. Do not compare your self to other large companies in Calgary that did not require education. Chances are that those companies have been around for more than a couple decades. Those were started in a time when high school diploma was adequate to live your life. A couple decades from now, a bachelors degree will be worth high school. Unless you have a revolutionary business idea...stay in school. I worked 2-3 jobs consistently through full time college to not take on any debts. You need something to fall back on. Don't look at life now. Look at 5, 10, 20 years.

Best compromise: Take the Entrepreneurial program at Mount Royal. This way you can have a post-sec education and get the formal tools for starting a business

http://www.mtroyal.ca/ProgramsCourse...ness/index.htm

http://www.mtroyal.ca/ProgramsCourse...ture/index.htm

[D'z Nutz]

So there's two issues to your dilemma here:

1) You don't see any value of your diploma and you're wasting time and money by going to school. At the moment you're only committed to it to please your mom.

2) You see the light at the end of the tunnel. You've stuck with it this long. Maybe you should just finish it up, especially since you may want to upgrade to a degree down the line.

I'm also one of those people who also doesn't think school is for everyone, especially if one's heart isn't in it. I'd say most diplomas/degrees are only important if you're working for someone else. There's less value if you're going to run your own business. Normally I'd say don't bother cause you'll just waste your time and money (at least until you're sure you want to be in school), however in this case, you are over the hump and can finish everything up within a short timespan.

Originally posted by Kobe
I think I should just finish off this Diploma next year and just take 3 classes each semester.. Maybe 4 then 2? and have it in case I want to upgrade to the Degree in a couple years. If worst comes to worse, I waste another $3,500 and call it a year, it won't be the end of the world.

I was gonna suggest something like this. I'm not sure why you are only doing two courses a semester but if you could find a way to do more that would sort of be the best of both worlds situation. I'm going to assume your reason for doing two courses a semester is because it cuts into your poker time? You could easily get it done within a year and be done with it. Doing 3+3 may not be that much more of a workload depending on what classes are left. Or suck it up and bust your ass for 4+2 or even 5+1 so that you only have one heavy semester (just 4 months!) to worry about.

[Tomaz]

having a piece of paper with post secondary help you get work. No doubt.

at least finish what you have started. Even if you never use it, you will have the knowledge, plus it is a goo backup if things dont go as planned.

[dj_honda]

having that piece of paper might also help if you need to borrow money to start your business and the lender wants to know if you have any qualifications

[Jynx]

Another factor to consider is the high cost of starting a business these days. If your having a hard time finding enough cash to live/go to school, it is going to be next to impossible for you to find enough money to start a decent business.

Also you've already finished most of the diploma. Just finish it dude! A year here or there while your young means nothing... When your older with a wife and kids your time won't be so flexible.

A diploma/degree is just a safety net. It can, for the most part, ensure you will have the means to survive from a financial standpoint if push comes to shove. With basically any degree you can find a job that pays 30-40k/year. Not much at all but more than enough to live off of. (Generally speaking!)

Just my $.02

[bignerd]

Finish the diploma, you are almost 3/4 done? I could not imagine throwing away the time you put in to get to this point and not finishing.

[msommers]

I'm glad this thread hasn't turned into another 'school is useless' thread. There are far too many factors to consider if school is right for you.

However if I were in your shoes, I would finish. The last thing you want to do is get trapped in some financial situation that limits you from going back and saying "I wish I had just stuck it out another year."

I think some emotional side has taken place, and once this semester is up and mid summer hits, all of the stress will be totally gone and you'll be wondering what all the fuss was about.

One thing to consider over the summer may be to write up a business plan. How much are things going to cost both initial and monthly/yearly? What is going to be your target market? How are you going to implement these things? How are you going to market yourself/you business? Who are you going to get money from? Etc.

Finish school this year and then figure it out. You'll drive yourself crazy doing both!

[bastardchild]

Originally posted by Jynx
Another factor to consider is the high cost of starting a business these days.

I started mine with $80 bucks in my bank account. The price of finishing school is going to be a lot more.

[911fever]

Finish your education, get it done, and done right. You'll never regret it and you'll have something behind your name and it will be able to hopefully get you a job

[msommers]

What is your business, bastardchild?

[bastardchild]

Originally posted by msommers
What is your business, bastardchild?

I created YouTube JumpStart. I launched back in late January and its only been going up. Its a lot of work, but the reward is getting better each day.

It boosts your YouTube views in order to rank higher in YouTube's search engine.

I've realized that working for yourself is more rewarding at the end of the day. When someone finishes school, they are usually looking for a job. You have to start slow... and I couldn't live like that. I lost 23 years of my life living in poverty, and now its changing. I have a strong belief that anyone can accomplish anything, all that is required is true dedication.

[InRich]

let me tell you exactly how it is...

when I graduated from high school, I had zero job experiance because I never worked, ever. My parents belief was that I would work for the rest of my life, I should have fun now while I'm in school, so they always slipped me a 10 here a 20 there whenever I needed it for gas, or booze for that weekend party...

My friends always teased me about not working, and how hard it would be for me to even find any kinda job with no experiance.

Right outta high school, I looked for work, and got a job right away, scrubbing fucking dirty ass air vents for sears indoor clean air services. I basically went into peoples homes and cleaned their ducts and shit. It was here I learned how to sell. I started off my selling humidifiers and electronic filters for $400 each.

Got sick of it and quit, but the owner asked me to do sales full time, and it was here that I became a really good sales professional.

Anyways. I got sick of it, and I thought at 23 years old, it was time for me to goto school. I spent 40k at university, for a degree in business operations. I've always thought a degree was your best chance to get your foot in the door. When I graduated I found myself in the exact same place as I was before. for fuck shakes futureshop wouldnt even hire me. I went back to sears cause I was making about 50k a year and that was good enough to pay for student loans.

After about a year. I started working for Calcana Industries, as some of you already know. There I really learned how to market, and fine tune my sales skill. I worked there for about 1/half years, making about 50k/year, and I thought to myself. Wow what a waste of life. I'm sitting in my office, all day long, wasting my life away. I was truly miserable. So I quit. Traveled for a year all over europe, and decided, when I come back home, I was going to start my own company, no more bosses, no more waking up early in the morning, driving in shitty traffic and all that other shit everyone here hates to do.

Today. I make alot of money, well into the six figures. I own a new house, I drive nice cars, and I'm loving life.

So your probably wondering wtf my point is....

Well. school is in my honest opinion a COMPLETE WASTE OF TIME, and MONEY! I remember sitting in school, and thinking, where the fuck am I ever going to need the shit I'm learning. the shit wasn't even hands on. I learned more selling at sears and calcana then I did at school, at least 7 to 1 times more, and better experiance, whole I was making decent money. School teaches you how to be a droid for the rest of your life. How to work for someone else. How to act, speak, look, talk in front of your boss.

Let me give you the best piece of advice you'll ever hear....

When your working for someone else, your too busy to make money...

Lets face it. Whenever you work for anyone, your making them rich. Believe me. I made a ton of money for my bosses at my other jobs. When I got paid, I looked at my cheques ever couple weeks, I couldn't believe just how little money I was making, after deductions, taxes, and all that other shit, I would sit there for 20 min wondering how I would ever be able to by my own house, drive nice cars, have a family. It was a terrible time in my life. I felt trapped.

So what do I think. If you feel your wasting your time.... quit.
If you want to feel like you've achieved something, stay.
As for me personally. I felt EXACTLY like you do today. EXACTLY. as a matter of fact I quit one semester. cause I was so sick of school BS. I went back though, because I never quit at anything, and once I started, I wanted to finish.

Would I do it again.... no.
would I recommend business school.... no. you know why?
cause they have mother fucking losers teaching the shit. How do I know? well look at it this way, if the teachers are so successful at business, why are they teaching it for only 50k a year? good businessmen in this city make a minimum 100k+++

Personally I think you need to finish, you've already wasted your time and money. Your 75% done. Suck it up and finish man, D is for done

[msommers]

Originally posted by bastardchild


I created YouTube JumpStart. I launched back in late January and its only been going up. Its a lot of work, but the reward is getting better each day.

It boosts your YouTube views in order to rank higher in YouTube's search engine.

I've realized that working for yourself is more rewarding at the end of the day. When someone finishes school, they are usually looking for a job. You have to start slow... and I couldn't live like that. I lost 23 years of my life living in poverty, and now its changing. I have a strong belief that anyone can accomplish anything, all that is required is true dedication.

That's a cool idea man, glad to hear things worked out well for you. Do you find clients are mostly musicians?

Just a heads up, there is a typo on http://www.ytjumpstart.com/proof.htm at the bottom where it says "natrual"

[2Valve0]

Originally posted by InRich
let me tell you exactly how it is...

when I graduated from high school, I had zero job experiance because I never worked, ever. My parents belief was that I would work for the rest of my life, I should have fun now while I'm in school, so they always slipped me a 10 here a 20 there whenever I needed it for gas, or booze for that weekend party...

My friends always teased me about not working, and how hard it would be for me to even find any kinda job with no experiance.

Right outta high school, I looked for work, and got a job right away, scrubbing fucking dirty ass air vents for sears indoor clean air services. I basically went into peoples homes and cleaned their ducts and shit. It was here I learned how to sell. I started off my selling humidifiers and electronic filters for $400 each.

Got sick of it and quit, but the owner asked me to do sales full time, and it was here that I became a really good sales professional.

Anyways. I got sick of it, and I thought at 23 years old, it was time for me to goto school. I spent 40k at university, for a degree in business operations. I've always thought a degree was your best chance to get your foot in the door. When I graduated I found myself in the exact same place as I was before. for fuck shakes futureshop wouldnt even hire me. I went back to sears cause I was making about 50k a year and that was good enough to pay for student loans.

After about a year. I started working for Calcana Industries, as some of you already know. There I really learned how to market, and fine tune my sales skill. I worked there for about 1/half years, making about 50k/year, and I thought to myself. Wow what a waste of life. I'm sitting in my office, all day long, wasting my life away. I was truly miserable. So I quit. Traveled for a year all over europe, and decided, when I come back home, I was going to start my own company, no more bosses, no more waking up early in the morning, driving in shitty traffic and all that other shit everyone here hates to do.

Today. I make alot of money, well into the six figures. I own a new house, I drive nice cars, and I'm loving life.

So your probably wondering wtf my point is....

Well. school is in my honest opinion a COMPLETE WASTE OF TIME, and MONEY! I remember sitting in school, and thinking, where the fuck am I ever going to need the shit I'm learning. the shit wasn't even hands on. I learned more selling at sears and calcana then I did at school, at least 7 to 1 times more, and better experiance, whole I was making decent money. School teaches you how to be a droid for the rest of your life. How to work for someone else. How to act, speak, look, talk in front of your boss.

Let me give you the best piece of advice you'll ever hear....

When your working for someone else, your too busy to make money...

Lets face it. Whenever you work for anyone, your making them rich. Believe me. I made a ton of money for my bosses at my other jobs. When I got paid, I looked at my cheques ever couple weeks, I couldn't believe just how little money I was making, after deductions, taxes, and all that other shit, I would sit there for 20 min wondering how I would ever be able to by my own house, drive nice cars, have a family. It was a terrible time in my life. I felt trapped.

So what do I think. If you feel your wasting your time.... quit.
If you want to feel like you've achieved something, stay.
As for me personally. I felt EXACTLY like you do today. EXACTLY. as a matter of fact I quit one semester. cause I was so sick of school BS. I went back though, because I never quit at anything, and once I started, I wanted to finish.

Would I do it again.... no.
would I recommend business school.... no. you know why?
cause they have mother fucking losers teaching the shit. How do I know? well look at it this way, if the teachers are so successful at business, why are they teaching it for only 50k a year? good businessmen in this city make a minimum 100k+++

Personally I think you need to finish, you've already wasted your time and money. Your 75% done. Suck it up and finish man, D is for done

OP, take into account this is one persons experience. Obviously school doesn't teach you how to sell? Did you expect it to? Really? If you did your an idiot to begin with. If you couldn't get a job with your degree I can already tell you did not do well in school. I have friends graduated with the same degree who are making 60-70k out of the gate. University, and school in general is more the the learning aspect if you are in a business program, if people don`t realize that they are complete idiots who shouldn`t be going to begin with. You have to network, get your foot in the door by this. You want to go into operations management, get off your ass and go meet people who can get you a job. University`s have TONS of opportunities for this(not to sure about sait though).

To comment on the idiots teaching, sure some are dumbasses, but if you have ever looked into your prof`s credentials you will find out some of them have amazing experience. One of my teachers in my law classes is one of the most renowned people in her field in Canada and the U.S.A. but she just loves teaching. You shouldn`t be so quick to judge. I can agree that some people have no business in a lecture hall but its your fault for not looking into who you have teaching you, which these Prof`s can also help you get your foot in the door. Do you really think by applying for companies without knowing anyone there will get you a good job. Every job I have ever had is from my network.

Back to the OP, just finish it off, its something to fall back on, but I would suggest to take a few Entrepeneurship courses at UofC or MRC, they can help you get a sense of how life will be, and how much your really taking on.

[Disoblige]

Originally posted by InRich
...

What other nice cars do you drive, other than the Accord you've been trying to sell/trade for other cars worth roughly 30 grand over yours? Just curious.

[Jynx]

Originally posted by bastardchild


I started mine with $80 bucks in my bank account. The price of finishing school is going to be a lot more.

Fair enough..

Do you think that is the norm or the exception?

I think the latter!

[bastardchild]

Originally posted by msommers


That's a cool idea man, glad to hear things worked out well for you. Do you find clients are mostly musicians?

Just a heads up, there is a typo on http://www.ytjumpstart.com/proof.htm at the bottom where it says "natrual"

Good eye. I just fixed it.

Most of my clients are marketers, small time bands, etc. The owner of the Playinator software (you can google "Playinator") is currently using my technology as well so I get a 50% cut of his sales too. I'm trying to JV will as many people as possible so that I won't have to do much for marketing.

Originally posted by Jynx


Fair enough..

Do you think that is the norm or the exception?

I think the latter!

Its called creative thinking. Anything can be done, it just needs to be looked at from all perspectives. When I started out, I paid $8 for a domain, $8/mo for hosting. The beauty of an online business... doesn't need much to operate.

[InRich]

Originally posted by Disoblige


What other nice cars do you drive, other than the Accord you've been trying to sell/trade for other cars worth roughly 30 grand over yours? Just curious.

I got an 02 4.6 x5....
and the accord I got is an awesome car....
dont compare balls either kid. your not gonna win. you probably still live your parents...

If I wanted to I could drive any car I wanted. believe me.

[Disoblige]

Originally posted by InRich


I got an 02 4.6 x5....
and the accord I got is an awesome car....
dont compare balls either kid. your not gonna win. you probably still live your parents...

If I wanted to I could drive any car I wanted. believe me.

Oh okay.

And I totally wasn't comparing balls either. My balls could only ASPIRE to be as large as yours. And yeah, I still live with my parents. Who the hell do you think is going to pay for my WoW?

As stated in my previous post, I was simply curious since you didn't post anything regarding what you drove in your profile. But I totally see that you are definitely the bigger man from your reply.

Kudos to you, and I hope you enjoy the big balls.