FKA Firefly/wRims
Great counter-argument!! You pro-pussification guys only have the one argument where you put yourself in the position of the cow. Everything you have put up has been disputed logically and correctly by people with way more experience in the matter. I think it's time y'all shut the hell up and maybe get some stitches for that bleeding heart...Originally posted by nonlinear
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...yup. sure did. I find my sarcasm meter on beyond is set pretty low. I've found if I assume sarcasm, I unfairly give a lot of people way too much credit lol.Originally posted by SKR
You might have missed the sarcasm. I don't really think that something needs to die before you call its treatment "cruel". But when they're happy before being roped or wrassled or whatever, and they're happy seconds to minutes at most after, I have a hard time saying that it was harmed. If it wasn't harmed, then the act wasn't cruel, and if it wasn't cruel, then there's no problem.
I think logically and correctly is a bit of a stretch on some of the posts.Originally posted by Idratherbsidewayz
Great counter-argument!! You pro-pussification guys only have the one argument where you put yourself in the position of the cow. Everything you have put up has been disputed logically and correctly by people with way more experience in the matter. I think it's time y'all shut the hell up and maybe get some stitches for that bleeding heart...
My take from this thread is that we all have varying degrees on what we deem acceptable treatment of animals for various uses. Personally I feel completely alright with most rodeo events, but would like to see some changes to some key events to reduce preventable harm (that has been shown to happen) that happens to the animals involved. Some people see no problem with this, and others hate the very idea of involving animals in entertainment. I don't see any of us shifting on the opinions that we have formulated based on our own limited or extensive experience. Example, I've worked on my friends ranches in Calgary helping out, and I put in a year on an Australian cattle station. More than some, and a lot less than others, but these events have been key in my personal opinions on animal rights and appropriate treatments.
Last edited by Freeskier; 07-15-2010 at 03:14 PM.
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The pro-rodeo advocates refuse to define harm, but seem to be interpreting it as obvious and visible injury, this is a false interpretation. Harm is any physical damage, whether you can see it or not and whether it is minor or severe. The fact that the animals might be more resilient than others is not an excuse for physical abuse. You cannot deny that there is harm or hurt, even if in many cases it is minor or brief, it is still harm. Feel free to argue that the harm is minor and that death is rare, but stop trying to deceive others that there is NO harm.
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Where are you going to draw the line?Originally posted by mx73someday
The pro-rodeo advocates refuse to define harm, but seem to be interpreting it as obvious and visible injury, this is a false interpretation. Harm is any physical damage, whether you can see it or not and whether it is minor or severe. The fact that the animals might be more resilient than others is not an excuse for physical abuse. You cannot deny that there is harm or hurt, even if in many cases it is minor or brief, it is still harm. Feel free to argue that the harm is minor and that death is rare, but stop trying to deceive others that there is NO harm.
Mammals, birds, reptiles, insects, plants... (no sarcasm)
Hell Bent on the Worst Kind of Infamy
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As far as entertainment goes? Or do you mean in general?Originally posted by Dycker
Where are you going to draw the line?
Mammals, birds, reptiles, insects, plants... (no sarcasm)
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I was watching Mantracker today, and got to thinking about this thread. If we're going to shitcan every form of entertainment that harms animals, and we're going to define harm as forcing an animal to do anything but stand there, wouldn't Mantracker fall into this? I mean, the horse is there against his will, it has to pack a man over rough terrain for two days, on several occasions the horse has gotten hurt, and the whole thing doesn't serve a purpose other than to entertain people.
By several people's definition of "harm", this show is an outrage. So are all westerns, trail riding, the RCMP Musical Ride, the Budweiser commercials where the Clydesdales are hooked up to a wagon, sleigh rides for the kids at Christmas, etc. All these animals are "harmed", in that they have to endure some physical stress for the purposes of entertainment, so do we quit that too? Or do we draw a line?
2007 GMC 2500 Duramax
1981 GMC C1500 454
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lets not forget pigeon races, dog shows, super dogs, cat shows, humane shelters, groomers, obedience classes, muzzles, leashes, collars, petting zoos, aquariums, zoos, animal preserves, vets, police K9 units, bomb sniffing dogs, drug sniffing dogs, service dogs for the blind or disabled, camel caravans and all that jazz.Originally posted by SKR
I was watching Mantracker today, and got to thinking about this thread. If we're going to shitcan every form of entertainment that harms animals, and we're going to define harm as forcing an animal to do anything but stand there, wouldn't Mantracker fall into this? I mean, the horse is there against his will, it has to pack a man over rough terrain for two days, on several occasions the horse has gotten hurt, and the whole thing doesn't serve a purpose other than to entertain people.
By several people's definition of "harm", this show is an outrage. So are all westerns, trail riding, the RCMP Musical Ride, the Budweiser commercials where the Clydesdales are hooked up to a wagon, sleigh rides for the kids at Christmas, etc. All these animals are "harmed", in that they have to endure some physical stress for the purposes of entertainment, so do we quit that too? Or do we draw a line?
Boosted life tip #329
Girlfriends cost money
Turbos cost money
Both make whining noises
Make the smart choice.
Originally posted by Mibz
Always a fucking awful experience seeing spikers. Extra awful when he laps me.
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In all cases. Why only look at a very specific cases?Originally posted by mx73someday
As far as entertainment goes? Or do you mean in general?
Hell Bent on the Worst Kind of Infamy
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You also forgot any show, movie, play, etc with any animal in it. Monkies, birds, dogs, cats, etc. They're all trained, caged, transported, put on display, manipulated and used for entertainment.Originally posted by spikers
lets not forget pigeon races, dog shows, super dogs, cat shows, humane shelters, groomers, obedience classes, muzzles, leashes, collars, petting zoos, aquariums, zoos, animal preserves, vets, police K9 units, bomb sniffing dogs, drug sniffing dogs, service dogs for the blind or disabled, camel caravans and all that jazz.
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If you don't understand what anyone in here has meant by 'harm', you're either retarded or intellectually dishonest. It has been used in countless contexts and examples. If you can't read between the lines and need a definition, like I said, go to dictionary.com.Originally posted by mx73someday
The pro-rodeo advocates refuse to define harm, but seem to be interpreting it as obvious and visible injury, this is a false interpretation. Harm is any physical damage, whether you can see it or not and whether it is minor or severe. The fact that the animals might be more resilient than others is not an excuse for physical abuse. You cannot deny that there is harm or hurt, even if in many cases it is minor or brief, it is still harm. Feel free to argue that the harm is minor and that death is rare, but stop trying to deceive others that there is NO harm.
I think 'harm' has been explained to the nth degree.
Make a valid point, and stop trying to loophole with these crap responses.
Just because it happened to you, doesn't make it interesting.
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http://www.cbc.ca/sports/story/2010/...xth-death.htmlThursday's death brings to six the number of horses that have died at the Stampede in 2010:
Two suffered apparent heart attacks.
One was put down after it broke its back in the saddle bronc event.
One was euthanized after it suffered a shoulder injury in the chuckwagon races.
Another died of undetermined causes.
"To lose six horses in one year is very unusual. It's also very upsetting," Fraser said.
"Each of the six deaths is the result of distinct circumstances. And we want to point out that none of the deaths are the result of an on-track accident, human error or negligence."
but also, CBC readers have this to say. Unfortunately it's a very black and white poll...
Should animals be excluded from rodeo events?
Yes 46% (68 votes)
No 54% (81 votes)
Total Votes: 149
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I know a guy who doesn't like to eat cane sugar - because its extracted from a live plant.
There are some indian cults (near where Ghandi is famous) where people drink milky tea for most of their sustinence. The tea leaves are not harvested - they wait until it falls from the tree. Same thing with sugar - they wait until the fruit falls - then they extract.
Thats pretty extreme. The UK heading in that direction though, green party and pope "no pollution" lovers.
Cocoa $11,000 per tonne.
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That surprises me. It is closer than i would have originally thought.Originally posted by Freeskier
http://www.cbc.ca/sports/story/2010/...xth-death.html
but also, CBC readers have this to say. Unfortunately it's a very black and white poll...
Should animals be excluded from rodeo events?
Yes 46% (68 votes)
No 54% (81 votes)
Total Votes: 149
Brilliant idea though, remove the animals from the stampede. Lets only have games and rides! Like every other carnival out there... /Sarcasm
The Calgary Stampede has been, and always will be, based on rodeo events. That wont change. Maybe tweaking and correcting some of the events to prevent injury and harm can be more acceptable way to deal with this
So i forget, are we up to 5 or now 6 animals that have died this year? A lot of the deaths seem to be from heart attacks... Sounds like obesity and fast food can be blamed for the deaths instead of animal cruelty (yeah, i know its a bad joke).
Beyond's Most Wanted
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6
You can technically get a ticket for each window that's illegally tinted. So as above, if you're being an ass to the officer (or if he's just an ass to begin with), he can give you two. (or three tickets if you're dumb enough to tint the windshield of your BMW... but if you own a BMW you can't be stupid right?)
Originally posted by RoseLover
Any penny you have to work hard to get, you will consider as "cheapness"...if you hate people from overseas...why you stay in North America!
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And don't forget, if caught on camera wins the family thousands of dollars as North America laughs at it on Americas Funniest home videos... yet its different at the stampede... how?Originally posted by JustGo
That being said, here is a good comparison with a dog: Let's say Fido is tied up in the back yard. A long rope attached to his collar. Fido sees a rabbit and goes barreling after it, but Fido's rope is just a bit too short. What happens? YANK, and Fido ends up on his back. A scenario that has undoubtedly happened millions of times around the world. Does Fido lay there like 'oh God, get me to a doctor, this is unbearable!'... no, he gets up and sheepishly walks back to the porch.
Totally agree with you JustGo, cows have thicker skin (thus: leather) and thicker muscles. They'll feel some discomfort , sure, but nothing like that a dog, cat, human would feel.
Originally posted by Mibz
She's already exhibiting signs of turning into my Mom, I need some sort of legal recourse if a full-blown transformation occurs.
Banned
the lives of 6 horses is a very cheap price to pay for the citizens of Calgary to enjoy this age old tradition! YEEHAW!!!!but sorry guys, gotta run, gotta wash my Lucky jeans and get my hair highlighted for Ranchman's tonight.
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Originally posted by Dycker
I think you're more disgusted by city people watching the rodeo than the rodeo itself.
Originally posted by nonlinear
the lives of 6 horses is a very cheap price to pay for the citizens of Calgary to enjoy this age old tradition! YEEHAW!!!!
Hell Bent on the Worst Kind of Infamy
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pretty interesting how the humane society and the SPCA are all at these events, and yet are quiet. The stampede organizers invite them to come and monitor events and the paddocks and barns to make sure the animals are treated right.
You would think that if the animals are indeed harmed, or if the animal deaths were anything but normal, they would be holding press conferences and the like.
To all the bleeding heart animal activist hippies, get off your high horse. Pun intended.
Boosted life tip #329
Girlfriends cost money
Turbos cost money
Both make whining noises
Make the smart choice.
Originally posted by Mibz
Always a fucking awful experience seeing spikers. Extra awful when he laps me.
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Originally posted by nonlinear
the lives of 6 horses is a very cheap price to pay for the citizens of Calgary to enjoy this age old tradition! YEEHAW!!!!
Every argument I have ever seen you make on this forum has no evidence for anything. You can say your an animal activist but come with some proof before you say riding a bull is harming the animal and blah blah blah.
Banned
i'm convinced you meant "proove."Originally posted by Type_S1
Every argument I have ever seen you make on this forum has no evidence for anything. You can say your an animal activist but come with some proof before you say riding a bull is harming the animal and blah blah blah.
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