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  1. #1001
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    Quote Originally Posted by blitz View Post
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    Awesome.

    I haven't been able to find any info on buffer size, has anyone seen anything?
    It's unfortunately rather small, Z7 buffer is apparently around 23 images and I think that is 12bit. Z6 there is a lot less info on.

    Positives seem to be the AF, ergonomics (possibly the first FF MILC that actually fits an adult's hand), the Z/F adapter, and DPR (god I hate their clickbait-style news articles) is claiming it's the best EVF they have ever seen on any body. The EVF also does not drop refresh rate or resolution at any time, unlike Sony. Both Z6 and Z7 have AF down to -4.0EV which is pretty amazing for OSPDAF.

    Negatives seem to be the single card slot (not great for wedding shooters), AE (not AF) is locked on the first frame for the fastest frame rates, 12bit only for fastest frame rates (not an issue above ISO 400), and buffer size is small compared to their DSLRs.

    Z6 will do 12fps 12bit, 9fps 14bit with AE locked, and 5.5 FPS with AE between frames. AF between frames for all though. Z7 will do 9fps 12bit but 8fps 14bit with the same AE caveats.

    Overall pretty awesome for the first iteration of a product at least at first glance, but I do think they missed the mark in a couple areas especially with such glaringly obvious targets to beat (Sony A7 III for Z6 and A7R III for Z7). The system has incredible potential tough. We knew it had a 54-55mm mount months ago, so that opens up some unique lens possibilities which they seem to have delivered on.

    Super impressed they released a lens roadmap though and the Noct lens to show the market they were serious. Typically Nikon is horrible about announcing their intentions and giving people long-term confidence in new systems from a marketing perspective.

    F/Z adapter will be discounted if you buy it with a camera.

    The long rumored 500/5.6E VR PF also looks like it could be a game changer for some.

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    Thanks, that buffer is disappointing. Hopefully the Z6 can squeeze in a dozen more frames or so with it's smaller file size. Single card slot is a real bitch.

    The roadmap is awesome, makes buying into the system early a little more justifiable.

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    best EVF on a FF MILC? curious to see comparisons with the Leica SL.

    what's the estimated price for the Z6, tempted but considering I'm invested to Sony FE lenses not really in a rush to jump ship, hopefully it means cheap used A7III though

    question is do you guys pronounce it Nikon Zed or Nikon Zee?

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    Quote Originally Posted by blitz View Post
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    Thanks, that buffer is disappointing. Hopefully the Z6 can squeeze in a dozen more frames or so with it's smaller file size. Single card slot is a real bitch.

    The roadmap is awesome, makes buying into the system early a little more justifiable.
    All the news is 90% focused on the Z7 so the Z6 buffer size is unknown. Given that it can do 12fps and is being marketed as the "speed" variant of the two, I have to believe they have more than a 2 second buffer available.

    They are releasing an update so you can use CFExpress or XQD, which makes the memory card situation *slightly* better just from an optionality perspective. I do wish they just squeezed a SD slot in there though (or just went dual UHS-II SD). XQD is wasted on these bodies because their primary benefit is enabling massive buffers (that's how the D500/D5/D850 get their unlimited RAW buffers and sub 2-second clear times). The direct Sony competition has 2 slots, so that and the small buffer are the two biggest head-scratchers of this release in my opinion.

    You can charge the battery through the body via USB which is awesome for traveling with a portable battery pack, or just avoiding a large charger.

    Both bodies are also waterproofed to the D850 standard which is very well sealed.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by taemo View Post
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    best EVF on a FF MILC? curious to see comparisons with the Leica SL.

    what's the estimated price for the Z6, tempted but considering I'm invested to Sony FE lenses not really in a rush to jump ship, hopefully it means cheap used A7III though

    question is do you guys pronounce it Nikon Zed or Nikon Zee?
    That's what DPR is saying. There is a lot of glass in the EVF as well. Even the earliest rumors for the Z6/Z7 suggested Nikon was putting major focus on the EVF because they as a company have been long time critics of EVFs compared to OVFs, but it is unavoidable in this case.

    Prices are $2599 and $4399 ($5199 w/24-70) in Canada - basically D750 and D850 pricing + a little bit for the EVF/new model premium which is directly in line with expectations and A7 II / A7R III pricing.

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    Z7 at $3,400USD? Fuck.

    40% lighter though and a bunch of other benefits...

    https://photographylife.com/nikon-z-7-vs-nikon-d850
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    Quote Originally Posted by msommers View Post
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    Z7 at $3,400USD? Fuck.

    40% lighter though and a bunch of other benefits...

    https://photographylife.com/nikon-z-7-vs-nikon-d850
    Prices are the same as the A7 III and A7 R III pretty much, which really are the only other cameras in the market Nikon can even target.

    Canon will probably put one of their existing sensors with crappy DPAF in and call it a day, so they won't even be on the radar if they actually do that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mitsu3000gt View Post
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    XQD is wasted on these bodies because their primary benefit is enabling massive buffers
    That's just to get people set up for the Z ecosystem. Yeah it's wasted on these bodies, but when subsequent bodies come out with better buffering, people will just need to upgrade bodies without having to invest in a new memory format. It makes sense cause if you're coming out with a whole new system, may as well start laying the groundwork for future iterations. I do agree that having dual slots, whether dual XQD or XQD+SD, would have been really nice.

    That said, I'm definitely keeping my eye on the Z6. Glad I never invested in any E-mount lenses. I wonder how much I can get for my A7 haha

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    Quote Originally Posted by D'z Nutz View Post
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    That's just to get people set up for the Z ecosystem. Yeah it's wasted on these bodies, but when subsequent bodies come out with better buffering, people will just need to upgrade bodies without having to invest in a new memory format. It makes sense cause if you're coming out with a whole new system, may as well start laying the groundwork for future iterations. I do agree that having dual slots, whether dual XQD or XQD+SD, would have been really nice.

    That said, I'm definitely keeping my eye on the Z6. Glad I never invested in any E-mount lenses. I wonder how much I can get for my A7 haha
    they go for around 700-900 CAD$ used.
    not doing much photography lately so pretty happy with the A7, Loxia 21mm, FE 50mm 1.8 and 24-240mm cover most of my photography need but IBIS and imroved AF on the A7III would be nice.

    is Canon also releasing a FF MILC or are they happy with their EOS-M line?

  9. #1009
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    Quote Originally Posted by D'z Nutz View Post
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    That's just to get people set up for the Z ecosystem. Yeah it's wasted on these bodies, but when subsequent bodies come out with better buffering, people will just need to upgrade bodies without having to invest in a new memory format. It makes sense cause if you're coming out with a whole new system, may as well start laying the groundwork for future iterations. I do agree that having dual slots, whether dual XQD or XQD+SD, would have been really nice.

    That said, I'm definitely keeping my eye on the Z6. Glad I never invested in any E-mount lenses. I wonder how much I can get for my A7 haha
    Just odd that the buffers are a bit small (at least on the Z7). Nikon of all companies has always had the most impressive buffers compared to its peers. Mirrorless does introduce some different processing challenges because the electronic shutter, OSPDAF, and reading the image itself all require sensor reads/refreshes and more data crunching, but image processing is also highly parallel and is easy to speed up. I highly suspect sensor readout is the bottleneck in this case, which makes sense as I haven't seen anything that suggests a stacked sensor design.

    The single slot won't be a deal breaker for too many people I don't think, but it will make the wedding crowd nervous. It's not a whole lot worse than cameras like the Canon 1DX II and Sony A9 with majorly crippled secondary card slots, preventing you from using certain camera features altogether.

    Overall their first attempt at FF mirrorless looks fantastic, there is just a couple little things I am surprised they did not manage to overcome given the engineering talent behind it all and market price points.

    Currently there is no mirrorless camera that can find in my hand without my bottom 2 fingers being below the body, and the edge of the camera digging into the top of my ring finger. It looks like this may be the first MILC that you can hold properly unless you have Donald Trump hands.
    Last edited by Mitsu3000gt; 08-23-2018 at 01:57 PM.

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    Careful, your Nikon boner is showing
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  11. #1011
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    Quote Originally Posted by msommers View Post
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    Careful, your Nikon boner is showing
    Actually I thought the opposite haha, if anything I am slightly disappointed in the release. I don't see any compelling reason why someone would trade a D850 for a Z7 unless minute size savings were paramount, or you had a huge lens collection that would benefit from IBIS. There's nothing there that would make me want to get rid of my D850, anyway.

    The Z6 seems like the better deal of the two, with build quality and EVFs being identical and ~$1700 cheaper. It also naively gets -4.0 EV AF where the Z7 needs "low light mode" to get there from -3.0 EV. As long as it has a decent buffer I think that is a much better deal than a Z7.

    I'm way more excited by the Mavic 2 Pro getting a 1" sensor and I am actually buying a Sony product before my next trip in September.
    Last edited by Mitsu3000gt; 08-23-2018 at 03:01 PM.

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    Battery life is also like that of a 1st gen mirrorless. Around 300-350 shots per battery.


    https://www.captiongenerator.com/107...rorless-launch

    pretty much sums up all the Nikon negatives

    I'm happy with my A73 and Canon lenses. EyeAF, Dual Card slot, longer battery life. Still waiting for Canon but yah.. EosM ftw.. Roll eyes
    Last edited by Wakalimasu; 08-24-2018 at 04:41 AM.

  13. #1013
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wakalimasu View Post
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    Battery life is also like that of a 1st gen mirrorless. Around 300-350 shots per battery.

    I'm happy with my A73 and Canon lenses. EyeAF, Dual Card slot, longer battery life. Still waiting for Canon but yah.. EosM ftw.. Roll eyes
    You can't look at shots per battery for any given camera - it's wildly variable, even in mirrorless. If you are doing lots of continuous shooting it's not unusual to see 10++ times or more "shots per charge" rating on some cameras. CIPA also uses 50% flash, lots of LCD usage, zoom usage where applicable, etc. Cameras that don't have some of these things are also not proportionately represented. It's mostly a useless number.
    Last edited by Mitsu3000gt; 08-24-2018 at 09:26 AM.

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    The new 58mm 0.95 Noct is a manual focus lens, which kills my excitement for it completely.

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    Have to get a Df again
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  16. #1016
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    I just noticed TCS has the Z6 and Z7 on pre-order on their website:

    http://www.thecamerastore.com/13978-Nikon-Z6-Body.aspx
    http://www.thecamerastore.com/13977-Nikon-Z7-Body.aspx

    Once an M-mount adapter is available, I may sell my A7 and switch over.

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