Quantcast
New Bill - Minimum Mandatory Sentences for Drug Crimes - Beyond.ca - Car Forums
Results 1 to 18 of 18

Thread: New Bill - Minimum Mandatory Sentences for Drug Crimes

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    Calgary
    My Ride
    2013 Q5
    Posts
    1,679
    Rep Power
    18

    Default New Bill - Minimum Mandatory Sentences for Drug Crimes

    Anyone hear about this new bill Mr. Bush Jr is trying to pass? This article sums it up pretty well.

    Mandatory minimums for drug crimes are a giant step backward for Canada

    ERIKA SASSON

    When Prime Minister Stephen Harper prorogued Parliament last December, at least one good thing happened: Bill C-15 was temporarily put to rest. That bill sought to introduce mandatory minimum prison sentences for drug offences, in order to tackle “organized crime and serious drug offences.” Now in its newest iteration as Bill S-10, the draft legislation has already survived a second reading and has a very good chance of becoming law.

    Bill S-10 will neither deter organized crime nor make any serious dent in Canada’s drug trade. Simply put, any major drug trafficker with provable ties to a criminal organization will not be daunted by a one- or two-year jail sentence, the proposed sanctions of the legislation. Convicted members of organized crime are generally incarcerated for much longer periods of time, so a mandatory one-year sentence will have no meaningful deterrent effect.

    Rather, it’s the low-level street dealers who should be alarmed. As there’s no minimum amount of cocaine required to trigger the mandatory sentence, someone who sells even a 10th of a gram of cocaine for $10 and who has a previous conviction for a “designated substance offence” will be swept up by the new laws. Street dealers are middlemen who facilitate the exchange, while the buyers and suppliers actually control the level of drug use in Canada.

    If the Harper government wants to incarcerate street dealers, then it should be forthright and say so. But the government is mobilizing our legitimate fear of organized crime as a Trojan horse against minor drug offenders, the most disorganized of criminals. This is an unnecessary manipulation of public sentiment that punishes the people who have the least impact on the strength of the drug trade.

    The legislation is also problematic because courts need flexibility to be effective. In Toronto, for example, many street-level offenders are battling mental illness, as well as drug addiction and poverty. While the new legislation makes an exception for “successful” completion of drug treatment court, that doesn’t begin to cover the gamut of people who end up in the system simply because there’s nowhere else for them to go.

    The courts currently use alternative sanctions to address these issues. Prosecutors and judges often work with mental health workers and defence lawyers to devise creative solutions: Conditional sentences with treatment, community service, lengthy probation and job training are just some examples of those combined efforts. These solutions can balance the needs of the community with those of the offender, thereby furthering the goal of restorative justice. The impending legislation, however, will make it impossible to pursue restorative measures.

    To make matters worse, Canadians will have to pay for more space in jails. The Tories recently pledged $155.5-million to expand prisons, and that’s just in Ontario and Quebec, despite the fact that Statistics Canada says the crime rate is dropping. Add to that the price of housing prisoners each year – $57,000 a prisoner in provincial jail and $88,000 a prisoner in a federal one.

    Furthermore, Canadians will have to finance more trials for offenders who will have less incentive to plead guilty due to the mandatory minimum. An offender who can’t get a better deal by pleading guilty will simply roll the dice and go to trial. This will create huge financial burdens on our already under-resourced court system.

    The distressing financial effect cannot be overstated. In the United States, the culture of mandatory minimum sentences has crippled many state economies, causing some jurisdictions to release offenders from jail without regard for their dangerousness simply because they can’t afford to house them any longer. Certainly, the mandatory sentences in the U.S. are much harsher than the ones being proposed in Canada; but the principle remains the same: Mandatory jail sentences are extremely costly because taxpayers must pay for increased jail time and many more trials.

    It’s absurd to adopt a trend from a country that incarcerates the highest proportion of its population in the world, and one that’s starting to move away from the culture of mandatory minimums. Americans just have too many non-violent offenders in jail, and they haven’t even come close to winning their war on drugs.

    To tackle serious organized crime, the government can supply our police forces with more resources for surveillance and intelligence, so they have the time and manpower to build solid cases against those who bring violence into our communities. When major cases hit the courts, the offenders will be incarcerated for much longer than what’s proposed in the new bill. These sentences already exist in our jurisprudence and current legislation, and don’t require mandatory minimums. With serious cases against organized crime, the right people will be punished.

    Instead, the Harper government writes legislation that casts a very wide net, which will over-incarcerate all sorts of minor criminals but never the Tony Sopranos. This bill should not be allowed to pass.
    Source: http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/...rticle1801674/

  2. #2
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Calgary
    Posts
    19
    Rep Power
    0

    Default

    a very well worded counter argument to this bill.

    IMO it would be ok if they legalized minor drugs like pot... i would be worried wed be putting small time pot users/dealers in jail for a year at great cost with no real benefit.

    thanks for the read.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Calgary
    Posts
    19
    Rep Power
    0

    Default

    dp sorry

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Victoria
    My Ride
    1990 4runner
    Posts
    263
    Rep Power
    0

    Default

    Wow, excellent article. Shows that the populist tough on crime stance isn't always the best for a country

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Pallet Town
    Posts
    476
    Rep Power
    0

    Default

    And Chretien nearly got to decriminalizing, before prorogueing as well.

    Really though, the full out legalization for recreation in California was 3.8 million no to 3.3 million yes...

    This law seems out of touch with the public. Maybe it is time to think about a democracy instead of our current Canadian dictatorial system.

    Kim Jong Rob Anders, no vote for you!
    Greta the destroyer.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Calgary, Alberta
    My Ride
    2011 Mustang GT
    Posts
    1,726
    Rep Power
    16

    Default

    Interesting read.

    What other solutions are there? Shoot 'em all?

    What part of the "business" should be tackled?

    Producers>importers/exporters>distributors>dealers>users

    The problem I see with trying to take down any of these sections would be that there will always be someone else to take place. We (humans) are self-destructive naturally. No matter what we do, there will always be more.
    Beyond's Most Wanted

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Pallet Town
    Posts
    476
    Rep Power
    0

    Default

    They seem to be targetting the drug dealer.

    Which is not even part of the equation - if you allow people to grow their own drugs (in a 5x5 foot pen) for personal consumption.

    Unless you want to charge on growing (the grow op) The whole reason there are drug dealers is because it is criminal at this point in time.

    This applies to marijuana, opium poppy and cocaine plants. Grain alcohol is of course legal, and regulated.
    Greta the destroyer.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Calgary
    Posts
    510
    Rep Power
    12

    Default

    It's foolish to say targeting street dealers does nothing. It's a drop in the bucket, for sure, but it's still taking a bit of the problem away, even if temporarily.
    Originally posted by teamPRO


    howbout suck my black kettle...

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Edmonton
    My Ride
    '15 Taco TRD
    Posts
    3
    Rep Power
    0

    Default

    I wrote a term paper on MMS last year and how ineffective they are (regardless of the crime). I found it amusing that research put forth by the government actually admitted to that, yet they still keep pushing it because its what the public understands.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Location
    Calgary, Alberta
    My Ride
    07 Ruckus, 05 Echo
    Posts
    508
    Rep Power
    17

    Default

    "Drug crimes"? Which part is the crime, is it the voluntary exchange of plants for bank notes?

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Calgary
    My Ride
    Z
    Posts
    369
    Rep Power
    0

    Default

    Originally posted by qcp1
    dp sorry
    we're sorry
    Z32 TT
    1996 Integra - winter beater with studs - RIP (deer)
    2002 WRX - to be sold
    2010 sti - winter

  12. #12
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Calgary
    My Ride
    8P 3.2
    Posts
    58
    Rep Power
    0

    Default

    "Instead, the Harper government writes legislation that casts a very wide net, which will over-incarcerate all sorts of minor criminals but never the Tony Sopranos. This bill should not be allowed to pass."

    Criminals are criminals. Besides, you cripple the "Tony Sopranos" by crippling their foot sellers. And they are cheaper to prosecute.

    I hate the "crush the little guy" stance that potheads take. Or the make it legal 'cause "it makes great rope" type of argument. Every person I have ever known that was a pot head was a complete retard. Complete retard. I have worked with people who brought vodka in a thermos to work every day and they were more functional.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Victoria
    My Ride
    1990 4runner
    Posts
    263
    Rep Power
    0

    Default

    Clearly you don't know many potheads. I've seen professors of mine at the 420 on april 20 at Uvic.

    Sure it's cheaper on a case by case comparison, but how many foot sellers do you have for every tony soprano...

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    calgary
    My Ride
    fg2
    Posts
    75
    Rep Power
    0

    Default

    you can follow the status of the bill at the link here if your interested...

    http://www2.parl.gc.ca/Sites/LOP/LEG...7007&List=stat

    personally i think chronic should be legal and we should be listening to all the reports and studies that show prohibition doesnt work with shit and costs us taxpayers a fortune.

    unfortunately thats not really the debate here. and thats what a lot of stoners are failing to understand when they argue against this bill.

    even if this bill fails, chronic is still illegal. and this bill doesnt really do anything to impact your average stoner accept maybe drive up the price a bit if a bunch more growers end up in jail.

    in its original form C-15, it was bullshit in that any amount of marijuana at all would carry a mandatory jail sentence. But the bill in its current form only imposes mandatory minimums on production and trafficking, and theres other factors considered as well.

    this bill doesnt have any impact on personal possesion of small amounts of chronic. actually it doesnt even impact you GROWING small amounts of chronic

    5 plants and below is not impacted by this bill at all. (although its still illegal, its just illegal under our current laws which are rather vague)

    anything from 6-200 plants and the police/crown have to provide additional proof that you were growing for the purposes of trafficking before a mandatory minimum would be imposed.

    if your producing above 201 plants, your traffiking and with that comes a 6 month mandatory minimum.

    then above 500 plants is 1 year minimum

    and there are aggrevating factors such as, if they found weapons, or traps on the premises. if its near a school, or if you have previous convictions in the last 10 years. all these can increase your setence.

    also there is a provision in the bill that you can avoid mandatory minimum sentences by entering a drug rehab program.

    so its really not as terrible as some stoners are trying to make it sound.

    so while you might (like me) think the whole premise of ganja being illegal is bullshit, i think you would have a hard time finding majority public support to say it should be legal for people to have large scale grow ops specifically for the purposes of mass production and sale. which is what this bill is targeting.

    i still hope it fails, as i think its a step in the wrong direction and we should to be moving towards legalization. but in its current form, and with our current laws/policies regarding the status of marijuana, its hard to make a strong arguement against it (at least i dont have one lol). and its quite likely we will see this pass soon.


    but whatever side of the argument your on, i think this is pretty funny. the bill was sent to committee for review.. check out the time the committee held its first meeting.

    OTTAWA, Wednesday, October 20, 2010

    The Standing Senate Committee on Legal and Constitutional Affairs, to which was referred Bill S-10, An Act to amend the controlled Drugs and Substances Act and to make related and consequential amendments to other acts, met this day at 4:20 p.m. to give consideration to the bill.

    coincidence? or is it possible the senate has a sense of humor? haha either way i got a good laugh out of it.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    S.E. (not the drrty south)
    My Ride
    Blandness
    Posts
    7,043
    Rep Power
    26

    Default

    Originally posted by frizzlefry
    Every person I have ever known that was a pot head was a complete retard. Complete retard.
    The "complete retards" are the ones who are obvious about it because they were retards BEFORE they started smoking.

  16. #16
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Calgary
    My Ride
    8P 3.2
    Posts
    58
    Rep Power
    0

    Default

    Originally posted by Tik-Tok


    The "complete retards" are the ones who are obvious about it because they were retards BEFORE they started smoking.
    Likely a good point

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Vancouver
    Posts
    160
    Rep Power
    0

    Default

    Originally posted by frizzlefry

    Criminals are criminals. Besides, you cripple the "Tony Sopranos" by crippling their foot sellers. And they are cheaper to prosecute.
    No you don't. They will simply raise their prices enough so more people will start selling to replace those in prison. America has some ridiculously harsh laws, and you can still find a dealer if you put a bit of effort into it. All it does in America is increase the prices and make more money for the Tony Sopranos who do cause more serious crimes, while at the same time draining tax money to keep a bunch of dealers in prison

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    403/514
    Posts
    65
    Rep Power
    0

    Default

    Originally posted by Antonito
    No you don't. They will simply raise their prices enough so more people will start selling to replace those in prison. America has some ridiculously harsh laws, and you can still find a dealer if you put a bit of effort into it. All it does in America is increase the prices and make more money for the Tony Sopranos who do cause more serious crimes, while at the same time draining tax money to keep a bunch of dealers in prison


    In Thailand and alot of SE Asia you get the death penalty or life in prison even for a small amount of drugs. That still hasn't deterred people. Anyone who advocates prosecution for small amounts of drugs should check out what's happening in Portugal:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drug_policy_of_Portugal
    BOOOOOya!!!


Similar Threads

  1. Ex-soldier gets life sentences for Iraqi murders

    By turbotrip in forum Society / Law / Current Events / Politics
    Replies: 100
    Latest Threads: 09-11-2009, 01:48 PM
  2. Bill 44 - Alberta's Evolution Bill (we really are the Texas of the North)

    By vadeit in forum Society / Law / Current Events / Politics
    Replies: 22
    Latest Threads: 06-05-2009, 10:06 PM
  3. Bill ' o Reilly vs. Barney Frank ( House finance chief) Bill loses it.

    By brownchild in forum Society / Law / Current Events / Politics
    Replies: 13
    Latest Threads: 10-10-2008, 10:55 AM
  4. vancouver courts to review axe attack sentences

    By finboy in forum Society / Law / Current Events / Politics
    Replies: 7
    Latest Threads: 12-13-2007, 10:59 AM
  5. Iran Sentences Rape Victim to Death by Hanging

    By SLR in forum Society / Law / Current Events / Politics
    Replies: 128
    Latest Threads: 05-03-2006, 12:19 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •