Have a Sinking Feeling my xmas is going to suck

[Sugarphreak]

...

[95teetee]

Originally posted by AE92_TreunoSC
I don't sue though, I just fall lol.

oh, us silly Canadians

[ArjayAquino]

Originally posted by 95teetee
oh, us silly Canadians

sorry

[reijo]

Are you handy with plumbing?

FYI, you might also be able to get a standard city drawing on-line on what is down there - std. home service ... pretty sure I have one around somewhere.

Hire someone/firm to hydrovac or simply dig it out (so you be the General Contractor on it ... ) ... should be about 8' down (standard for City water systems) ... and then do the repair yourself - e.g. cracked (frozen?) pipe section to replace .... or it might still be the curb stop(city valve) because that is where the joints/connections are ... and the water will tend to migrate up along its own path ...

It's not rocket science and you can save yourself a bundle if you want.

R

[Sugarphreak]

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[revelations]

Originally posted by Sugarphreak


Pretty much, all part of the joy of home ownership.

One thing I learned from living in a condo is that now we set aside a few bucks each month to offset the inevitable costs of home ownership (roof, furnace, water heater, etc.) ..... sometimes shit just happens.

(condo fees cover repairs down the road)

[Grogador]

Oh haha a "sinking" feeling, now I get it! Shitty deal hope you can get it fixed in a jiffy. I'm surprised insurance doesn't cover stuff like this!

[Ven]

Hydrovac is no good for that kind of work. You need a backhoe on site for the line pull, and to install and remove the trench cage, and to tamp. And you'll need a tandem there to take away the spoil and return with the correct backfill.

[Masked Bandit]

Originally posted by revelations


One thing I learned from living in a condo is that now we set aside a few bucks each month to offset the inevitable costs of home ownership (roof, furnace, water heater, etc.) ..... sometimes shit just happens.

(condo fees cover repairs down the road)

Until there's a cash call because there wasn't enough in the reserve fund to cover the new roof / siding / windows / mold / whatever. Don't kid yourself, things can go sideways in a condo too.

[benyl]

Originally posted by revelations


One thing I learned from living in a condo is that now we set aside a few bucks each month to offset the inevitable costs of home ownership (roof, furnace, water heater, etc.) ..... sometimes shit just happens.

(condo fees cover repairs down the road)

You just haven't experienced a special assessment yet. One condo I own had $25 k in special assessments in 2 years. 2 million reserve fund. Repairs to the building envelope were 3-5 million.

[ipeefreely]

Man that sucks OP. I hope everything works out!

Originally posted by Masked Bandit
Nope. Coverage for something like this isn't available in any manner.

My utility company (EPCOR) has been pimping an insurance company that will cover these problems. HomeServe. I'm not sure if they offer coverage in Calgary though... (and I know it doesn't help the OP right now...)

Here's a few links.
FAQs About Our Partnership with HomeServe

homeserve-partners-with-epcor

Epcor teams with Homeserve to offer water line insurance, but is it needed?

Sounds like they don't have the best reputation...

Masked Bandit seeing has you're the Insurance Guru what you opinion on these guys? I almost get the feeling you still might be out of pocket somehow even after getting insurance from these guys...
I was going to ask my insurance company if they offered similar coverage (my water main goes under my driveway) but from what you said, sounds like most don't.

[Sugarphreak]

...

[Masked Bandit]

Originally posted by ipeefreely
Man that sucks OP. I hope everything works out!

My utility company (EPCOR) has been pimping an insurance company that will cover these problems. HomeServe. I'm not sure if they offer coverage in Calgary though... (and I know it doesn't help the OP right now...)

Here's a few links.
FAQs About Our Partnership with HomeServe

homeserve-partners-with-epcor

Epcor teams with Homeserve to offer water line insurance, but is it needed?

Sounds like they don't have the best reputation...

Masked Bandit seeing has you're the Insurance Guru what you opinion on these guys? I almost get the feeling you still might be out of pocket somehow even after getting insurance from these guys...
I was going to ask my insurance company if they offered similar coverage (my water main goes under my driveway) but from what you said, sounds like most don't.

If you go through the fine print it's not actually an insurance policy, it's a service contract. It's much more like an extended warranty you buy on a used car (and we all know how well that usually works out). For better marketing though they refer to it as "insurance". The fact that they already have to call it something different should be a red flag.

I've seen this type of product on many different things. Pre-paid legal services is one, windshield repair / replacement is another but if you really analyze the programs, they're all the same. For a certain fee they will agree to "protect you in the event of damage / breakdown". I think Atco has a program similar to this here in Calgary that is for your furnace & other HVAC items but don't quote me on that. The problem is in all of the fine print. If you research the company (the last link provided) these guys have been in trouble in both the UK and the USA for shady business practices.

I personally wouldn't go anywhere near this product as a consumer and I sure as shit wouldn't partner with them and associate my company with them. I'm surprised Epcor agreed to. Like Sugarphreak said, 1500 clients and one payout? As an investor I would sure like those numbers. As a customer, not so much.

I've been in the business now for 13 year and I currently have about 1700 clients and over all of those years do you know how many clients I've had call me to say that their waterline let go?

Exactly 0, zip, zilch, nada.

Now to put another light on this situation, I've never had a client's house burn to the ground either so maybe we should all cancel our house insurance too. The difference is that if my house burns down with all my stuff in it I'm probably out close to $1,000,000. If my waterline ruptures I'm out $5,000 - $10,000 by the looks of things. This is why I wouldn't by the Homeserve product.

[ipeefreely]

Thanks for the reply Masked Bandit!

Do you know why there is no appetite for insurance companies to have a product to cover this?

Seems like pretty easy money (odds of it happening) and with maybe a 3$ or lower fee per month people would pay just incase... I think I would...

Originally posted by Sugarphreak
If the odds are 1 in 1500, then the city could offer the same insurance for 1$ a month and still make a pretty decent profit.

I don't see why there couldn't be a 1 or 2 dollar rider on everyone's bill (like with your gas line) then you wouldn't have to worry and you'd know it was done right instead of having to rely on some contractor ...

[Cos]

.

[mo_money2supe]

Originally posted by Ven
Hydrovac is no good for that kind of work. You need a backhoe on site for the line pull, and to install and remove the trench cage, and to tamp. And you'll need a tandem there to take away the spoil and return with the correct backfill.

Although I agree that a small backhoe is needed (for caging and backfill), a hydrovac is the still most efficient means of excavating the area. The hydrovac will also "suck" up any refuse material so there will be no need for a dumptruck to remove the excess. As for backfill, most hydro'd holes are simply filled in with pea-sized gravel since it's self-compacting.

OP, sorry to hear about your luck. Since it is a deficiency from the developer's contractor initially, this is potentially something you may be able to recover (some) costs from the Alberta New Home Warranty program. As for price, yes, this sort of work will cost between $5k-$10k. Trust me, I price this kind of stuff out all the time.

[Sugarphreak]

...

[Ven]

Originally posted by mo_money2supe


Although I agree that a small backhoe is needed (for caging and backfill), a hydrovac is the still most efficient means of excavating the area. The hydrovac will also "suck" up any refuse material so there will be no need for a dumptruck to remove the excess. As for backfill, most hydro'd holes are simply filled in with pea-sized gravel since it's self-compacting.

Unless there's a ton of utility crossing there shouldn't be a hydrovac at all, but who knows with this job right? It would otherwise make no sense to hire a hydrovac, a tandem, and a hoe. When the hoe can excavate quickly and it's already there. As for speed, unless you're sucking sand, a hoe can keep close pace with a hydrovac for this kind of work, and easily surpass it if there's a lot of pit run. Pea gravel and wash is not backfill, it's for bedding and drainage. You'll still need backfill and compaction. I'm sorry for the OP's troubles, I deal with this everyday and hope he's got a reputable company. Too many companies find ways price gouge, like billing for too much unneeded equipment on site.

[Ven]

double tap

[Masked Bandit]

Originally posted by ipeefreely
Thanks for the reply Masked Bandit!

Do you know why there is no appetite for insurance companies to have a product to cover this?

Seems like pretty easy money (odds of it happening) and with maybe a 3$ or lower fee per month people would pay just incase... I think I would...

I really don't have an answer for you. I don't venture too far into that end of the business. One theory I could offer is that insurance companies underwrite potential losses based on the risk of something happening. It's possible that they (the actuaries that study this stuff) can't come up with any kind of reliable models that indicate when something is likely to go wrong. Because of the uncertainty they just stay away from it all together.

I might just be talkin' out my ass too, it is the middle of the night and I can't sleep so anything is possible.



The real answer is that I simply don't know why the insurance companies don't go after this.