Idle No More protests target bridges, roads across Canada

[TurboMedic]

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Didn’t they take those kids and put them in residential schools to teach them Christianity and give them the skills they needed to be successful in the fast developing western world?

That was the "theory" behind it. In the end, what ultimately happened was alot of abuse, alot of neglect, alot of forced labour, all under the guise of "we are going to try and assist them into society".

[370Z]

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Didn’t they take those kids and put them in residential schools to teach them Christianity and give them the skills they needed to be successful in the fast developing western world?

Wtf man, seriously? You really think that's all that happened.... these kids were raped so fucking much they're still digging up the dead kids bodies (from both suicides and murders) the fields around these schools to this day.

I don't blame you, many Canadian's don't know or care.

At the end of the day, it doesn't really matter much, we have Beyonders here who actually think we should just put a bullet into drug addicts' heads to solve our addiction problems. Some people just simply lack empathy.

I fucking hate these outside groups funding a lot of these protestors too.... it takes away from the real issues that indigenous face... they're using them just as much as the oil companies.

[gwill]

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Didn’t they take those kids and put them in residential schools to teach them Christianity and give them the skills they needed to be successful in the fast developing western world?

the sole purpose was to take the indian out of them. Being an indian was not acceptable to our country there fore it needed to be abolished. Most would use the word cultural genocide.

But yes rape murder and all sorts of abuse were the norm

[AndyL]

Lets take an honest - timeframe based look at residential schools.

1800s-early 1900's most privileged kids were sent away to 'grammar school'. Both of my grandfathers were. Like being sent away to a high end boarding school now - it's still 'done' - it was at the time (and still somewhat is) considered best practice for the children.

Most of our prime ministers from SJAM on were graduates of the grammar schools. When you look at it that way - does it seem like we were punishing them or trying to destroy their culture? No it seems like we were trying to help them... Putting them through school programs most canadians youth wouldn't have been able to access.

Yup, the church bungled it... Government bungled it... But - the intention was 'honorable', noble even...

[Misterman]

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Yup, the church bungled it... Government bungled it... But - the intention was 'honorable', noble even...

And most importantly it was an agreed upon plan with aboriginal leaders.

[ThePenIsMightier]

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the sole purpose was to take the indian out of them. Being an indian was not acceptable to our country there fore it needed to be abolished. Most would use the word cultural genocide.

But yes rape murder and all sorts of abuse were the norm

It's even worse when one considers how really super excellent everything was going for Indigenous society prior to Residential Schools, too. They definitely didn't have children frequently freezing to death in the streets nor was their literacy rate near zero with unemployment near 100. Alcohol abuse was definitely not completely rampant, either. Oh, and Tuberculosis was not epidemic either. Nope - basically, Indian Reserves were advanced like The Jetsons. Then evil people came in for no reason at all and thought they'd regress the culture a few thousand years by scooping up their kids and putting them into rape factories that made Auschwitz look like a Sandals Resort.

Humans aren't inherently evil and there is no racial or ethnic difference in inherent evilness. Yet no one bothers to consider how completely catastrophically irreparably fucked things were for Indigenous society that the dominant ethnic group actually came up with, and sold the idea of "holy shit - I think the only thing we can do is take their children and force them through an English, Christian education system to break this cycle of despair!"

I can't wrap my mind around it, but at least I can consider that it was a factor in the decision that turned out to be incredibly flawed and disastrously implemented.

How. Fucked. Must things. Have been?

No one will help you think for yourself like that in today's school though. Nope. "Here's your Orange shirt now watch this video even though you're in Grade-1 about how bad you are because you're associated with these disgusting atrocities."

[gwill]

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Yup, the church bungled it... Government bungled it... But - the intention was 'honorable', noble even...

nothing about residential schools was honorable or noble. The sole purpose of residential schools was to eliminate the culture, traditions and language.

[AndyL]

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nothing about residential schools was honorable or noble. The sole purpose of residential schools was to eliminate the culture, traditions and language.

Suppose that's the belief when you're focused on the current ideology. Yes teaching them french/english was a goal... Helps them integrate... You don't eliminate the culture/traditions just by sending kids to school.

Are they any better off not speaking the language? Are they better off subsistence living, living in tents in a nomadic lifestyle and warring with other FNs?

[ExtraSlow]

Certainly with the benefit of hindsight it's clear forced residential schooling wasn't a good plan and that should have become clear MUCH sooner than it did. There's no doubt there was an element of racism. Back when the plans were first created, there were educated and well-meaning people who weren't even sure if "natives" and "whites" were the same species.

Humanity has a long way to go still, but things have changed a lot in the last few generations.

[gwill]

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Suppose that's the belief when you're focused on the current ideology. Yes teaching them french/english was a goal... Helps them integrate... You don't eliminate the culture/traditions just by sending kids to school.

Are they any better off not speaking the language? Are they better off subsistence living, living in tents in a nomadic lifestyle and warring with other FNs?

your so far off in left field with your vision of residential schools. You remind me of senator beyak who's tried to spin residential schools were somehow a benefit. They were forced upon first nations. It wasnt a choice. Nor was the abuse, rape or murder.

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Certainly with the benefit of hindsight it's clear forced residential schooling wasn't a good plan and that should have become clear MUCH sooner than it did. There's no doubt there was an element of racism. Back when the plans were first created, there were educated and well-meaning people who weren't even sure if "natives" and "whites" were the same species.

Humanity has a long way to go still, but things have changed a lot in the last few generations.

i agree in hind sight its really easy to see the racism that existed back in the day was 10000 x worst then it was today yet somehow people still spin residential schools or the abuses that happened into something that was beneficial. It wasnt.

In case people ever second guess first nations issues we can use some of these posts to see how far canada still has to go on educating people on the history.

[AndyL]

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your so far off in left field with your vision of residential schools. You remind me of senator beyak who's tried to spin residential schools were somehow a benefit. They were forced upon first nations. It wasnt a choice. Nor was the abuse, rape or murder.



i agree in hind sight its really easy to see the racism that existed back in the day was 10000 x worst then it was today yet somehow people still spin residential schools or the abuses that happened into something that was beneficial. It wasnt.

In case people ever second guess first nations issues we can use some of these posts to see how far canada still has to go on educating people on the history.

Sending kids off to school - as was done for the priviledged... With the goal of educating them is a bad thing?

And as was mentioned - the FN leaders agreed to this plan... But now it's racist?

You can call me racist all you want - I've got multiple close FN friends, Just because I can look at this in a different view than you doesn't make me racist... Those of privledge sent their young children off to grammar schools. It was a fairly common practice throughout the commonwealth... A functional education was for their benefit. Still is... So are we still trying to eliminate their culture and languages?

[gwill]

I never called you racist sorry your taking it that way. When it comes to first nations history there are 3 groups of people. There are those that dont know. Theres the uneductated/ignorant and then theres the racists.

I'll go back to my original statement that your so far from the facts that its disturbing. I bet you would try to put a positive spin on the holocaust or outright deny that it happened.

[Inzane]

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there are 3 groups of people.

There are those that dont know. Theres the uneductated/ignorant

^ What's the difference between those two groups? They sound like the same thing to me.

[gwill]

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^ What's the difference between those two groups? They sound like the same thing to me.

Theres a large number of people who know nothing on first nations history which is not their fault. Typically theyll be open to learning history and the facts.

The uneducated/ignorant will take the little they know and put their own spin on things while ignoring facts/history. I suppose I could have just said ignorant.

[msommers]

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That was the "theory" behind it. In the end, what ultimately happened was alot of abuse, alot of neglect, alot of forced labour, all under the guise of "we are going to try and assist them into society".

x100000

[Antonito]

Also in the end it's been proven that the government knew things were happening, possibly not before they started happening, but well before they put a stop to it. Which is why Canadians, whether new or old, white or not white, are on the hook for it. Not because of some bullshit white guilt persecution complex fuckery, but from a legal standpoint. It's why every government (including Conservatives) tries their best to give as much leeway as possible without having to really start writing big checks. For every apology and deference, there's a lawyer standing behind that politician pointing to projected legal costs and settlements and telling them to go out and make it believable.

[killramos]

See I think we should just write the big checks, tear up the Indian act, and ensure we have only one set of rules and classes for all citizens of this country regardless of race or where their great grandparents were born.

Because whatever the fuck it is we are currently doing is broken and making our country the circus of the world.

The perpetuity of ridiculousness needs to end.

[msommers]

I don't disagree with writing a cheque and cleaning the slate.

But if the SW ring-road is any small, but significant, indication, that cheque value will be all over the map and ever changing through negotiations. And how many separate deals would there be?

And most importantly, would any of the bands actually go to a negotiating table. I personally don't see that ever happening.

[arcticcat522]

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see i think we should just write the big checks, tear up the indian act, and ensure we have only one set of rules and classes for all citizens of this country regardless of race or where their great grandparents were born.

Because whatever the fuck it is we are currently doing is broken and making our country the circus of the world.

The perpetuity of ridiculousness needs to end.

rep. Or just say enough is enough. Deal with it.

[gwill]

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See I think we should just write the big checks, tear up the Indian act, and ensure we have only one set of rules and classes for all citizens of this country regardless of race or where their great grandparents were born.

Because whatever the fuck it is we are currently doing is broken and making our country the circus of the world.

The perpetuity of ridiculousness needs to end.

Pierre trudeau introduced the white papers in 1969 which was to do exactly that but eventually withdrew it after a big uproar.

Overall not many would dispute how things are becoming ridiculous. The only variable I'd see debated is who's fault is for it getting to this point?

If I ran a railroad company I'd be sueing the govt for not enforcing the rule of law. I'd give 24 hours notice that trains were going to be running as usual and just plow through any barricades.

Watching the rcmp negotiate access to bc legislature the other day with some young kid was pure comedy. At some point you need to stop with the BS.