Testosterone Replacement Therapy?

[Misterman]

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I get my pharmasist to just order me a box of each. It was VERY cheap and about half the price as the stuff from this site. A box of 100 1cc BD barrels and 100 25ga x 1" was $55.

I'm not covered by any insurance, but my issue was that no pharmacies ever had stock of pins. So fuck it, I just ordered mine. That's why I mentioned that it's basically for ease of supply. And you don't have to put up with any ignorant pharmacists. I remember one trying to ask me what I needed them for one time. I was like WTF? None of your business, I'm injecting my dog with stuff, what does it matter to you?

[spike98]

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I'm not covered by any insurance, but my issue was that no pharmacies ever had stock of pins. So fuck it, I just ordered mine. That's why I mentioned that it's basically for ease of supply. And you don't have to put up with any ignorant pharmacists. I remember one trying to ask me what I needed them for one time. I was like WTF? None of your business, I'm injecting my dog with stuff, what does it matter to you?

I hear ya. My pharmacist is very good so i dont get any guff but i have dealt with a few that think they are MD's for sure. My current one also used the new covid rules to renew my new T script for me when i couldn't get to a doctor before vacay.

They will order them for you bulk though if you dont mind the hassle. Its half the price but we aren't talking about significant amounts either so its half/50 i suppose.

[birdman86]

For the guys on it, do you know what you're reading for test now, and if the improvement is closer to superman or just slightly improved?

I got my bloodwork and I have more test than I thought, 16-17 nmol/L test ("random test", not sure if totals or free), estradiol at 63 so lower end of the range, LH is low at 3 but probably doesn't matter (normal range 1-9), albumin is at the high end at 43 g/L. I don't know what my DHEA or SHBG levels are though, can't find them in my paperwork.

So now I'm trying to decide if I its worth going ahead with the pretty expensive consultation... I'm willing to be pretty generous in interpreting my results, like even if I'm in the normal range I'm still below average, but I'm not sure I want to commit to a lifetime of injections if the benefit is going to be mild at best. Anybody have thoughts?

Aka treatment to go from 9 nmol/L to 29 nmol/L probably feels great, but can you say the same going from 17 to 29?

[JRSC00LUDE]

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For the guys on it, do you know what you're reading for test now, and if the improvement is closer to superman or just slightly improved?

I got my bloodwork and I have more test than I thought, 16-17 nmol/L test ("random test", not sure if totals or free), estradiol at 63 so lower end of the range, LH is low at 3 but probably doesn't matter (normal range 1-9), albumin is at the high end at 43 g/L. I don't know what my DHEA or SHBG levels are though, can't find them in my paperwork.

So now I'm trying to decide if I its worth going ahead with the pretty expensive consultation... I'm willing to be pretty generous in interpreting my results, like even if I'm in the normal range I'm still below average, but I'm not sure I want to commit to a lifetime of injections if the benefit is going to be mild at best. Anybody have thoughts?

Aka treatment to go from 9 nmol/L to 29 nmol/L probably feels great, but can you say the same going from 17 to 29?

I don't know what to make of my results, I went in for bloodwork after a night of boozing which may have f'd them up?

Test 30.80 nmol/L
Sex Horm Bind Glob 77.6 nmol/l
Bioavailable Test 9.1 nmol/L
DHEA-S 7.98 umol/L
Cortisol 452 nmol/L

Don't know albumin

Creatine was quite high and glomerular filtration and anion gap quite low but I attribute those to dehydration that morning.

Would a hangover not LOWER test results as opposed to spike them?

[SKR]

I got testosterone checked once 7 days after a needle and another 7 days after that (I get needles every 2 weeks). The 7 day was 31 I think and 14 day was 9. I don't know what the units are, but normal is 8-28. I don't remember if I got anything else checked at that time.

I'm supposed to go get tested again but I think you have to book appointments, and I'm in a course where apparently the weekly schedule is none of my fuckin business. I'm not too worried about going and getting it checked again. Either I'll feel good or I won't, and I feel good so I don't see any need to fuck with it.

[nzwasp]

I put off getting my test results due to not being in Calgary. I had my normal 200mg dose on tuesday and I plan to get my lab tests next tuesday (mid cycle)

[spike98]

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I put off getting my test results due to not being in Calgary. I had my normal 200mg dose on tuesday and I plan to get my lab tests next tuesday (mid cycle)

You are going to want to test the day before your next injection. You want trough levels. Anything else in between is meaningless.

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For the guys on it, do you know what you're reading for test now, and if the improvement is closer to superman or just slightly improved?

I got my bloodwork and I have more test than I thought, 16-17 nmol/L test ("random test", not sure if totals or free), estradiol at 63 so lower end of the range, LH is low at 3 but probably doesn't matter (normal range 1-9), albumin is at the high end at 43 g/L. I don't know what my DHEA or SHBG levels are though, can't find them in my paperwork.

So now I'm trying to decide if I its worth going ahead with the pretty expensive consultation... I'm willing to be pretty generous in interpreting my results, like even if I'm in the normal range I'm still below average, but I'm not sure I want to commit to a lifetime of injections if the benefit is going to be mild at best. Anybody have thoughts?

Aka treatment to go from 9 nmol/L to 29 nmol/L probably feels great, but can you say the same going from 17 to 29?

It depends on symptoms really. You need total and free T to make any determination of what your levels are. Also you want to make sure you test before 8am when your test is the highest. Your measurement is likely Total Test (based on the units). Pre-TRT, i was 10-12nmol/L, post TRT, i am 25-27 nmol/L. Thats is with a free test of about 700pmol/L and estradiol at 125pmol/L. My E is a little high but i am working on reducing that by losing fat vs an AI. I would say you are probably on the lower end of the normal range. Far from optimal in my opinion. Its hard to say what is best because of peoples different needs.

[nzwasp]

I thought @Misterman was saying mid cycle.

[Misterman]

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I thought @Misterman was saying mid cycle.

I don't recall mentioning anything about blood test timing? Maybe someone else?

I don't know why Spiker would say that mid cycle(I assume you guys are referring to midway point between injections not cycle?) is meaningless? It still gives an idea of where your levels are at. But there would also be value in a blood test the day prior to your injection, as that will tell you how far you dropped between shots, and whether you should decrease time between or not.

[ExtraSlow]

need continuous monitoring, like those airthings radon detectors. or the temp sensors I have. Yeah, wifi enabled continuous testosterone monitors. that's the way.

[spike98]

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I don't recall mentioning anything about blood test timing? Maybe someone else?

I don't know why Spiker would say that mid cycle(I assume you guys are referring to midway point between injections not cycle?) is meaningless? It still gives an idea of where your levels are at. But there would also be value in a blood test the day prior to your injection, as that will tell you how far you dropped between shots, and whether you should decrease time between or not.

Minimum serum levels are what is important. The day before your shot (unless you pin at night). It doesn’t matter what your peak is. It’s always the trough. Why would you even bother taking test if your dipping below normal between pins.

This is always why you test first thing as your test levels are the highest in the morning before 8am.

[Misterman]

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Minimum serum levels are what is important. The day before your shot (unless you pin at night). It doesn’t matter what your peak is. It’s always the trough. Why would you even bother taking test if your dipping below normal between pins.

This is always why you test first thing as your test levels are the highest in the morning before 8am.

Because you want to know what your average/normal levels are so you can figure out your dosing. Knowing your lows is also important so you can tailor your dose spacing adequately as well.

[spike98]

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Because you want to know what your average/normal levels are so you can figure out your dosing. Knowing your lows is also important so you can tailor your dose spacing adequately as well.

Sorry but nah. Trying to figure out normal/average serum levels is like throwing darts at a dart board, blind folded. Sleep, diet, stress levels and time of day can change your levels dramatically. The most important serum level is the low. My doc and uro both say the same thing. The juicer (I’m not a blaster) forums I frequent say the same thing and every thread on r/trt and r/testosterone says the same thing.

[Misterman]

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Sorry but nah. Trying to figure out normal/average serum levels is like throwing darts at a dart board, blind folded. Sleep, diet, stress levels and time of day can change your levels dramatically. The most important serum level is the low. My doc and uro both say the same thing. The juicer (I’m not a blaster) forums I frequent say the same thing and every thread on r/trt and r/testosterone says the same thing.

Very incorrect. You're trying to shift all the value to one thing, when both have equal value. If all you care about is the low, then just whack 1000mg every week, you'll never have to worry about being low. That is such an oversimplified idea of what is trying to be achieved. And the reality is that what you're trying to achieve is steady blood levels of testosterone.

[spike98]

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Very incorrect. You're trying to shift all the value to one thing, when both have equal value. If all you care about is the low, then just whack 1000mg every week, you'll never have to worry about being low. That is such an oversimplified idea of what is trying to be achieved. And the reality is that what you're trying to achieve is steady blood levels of testosterone.

No, low serum levels is what causes symptoms.

Listen, we can bounce back and forth all day but you aren’t going to convince me to take your advice or endorse it in the slightest. You are not only wrong in my books, but it’s contrary to every available resource I have read and against the advice of every SME I’ve seen online and talked to in person.

[nzwasp]

So true balance clinic says this "IF YOU ARE USING HORMONE PATCHES OR HORMONE INJECTIONS:
• Please have your blood drawn approximately midway through the application interval." so for me that would be the 1st week after taking my shot. Ideally if I want to get my appt soon I would go get my labs tomorrow.

[Misterman]

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No, low serum levels is what causes symptoms.

Listen, we can bounce back and forth all day but you aren’t going to convince me to take your advice or endorse it in the slightest. You are not only wrong in my books, but it’s contrary to every available resource I have read and against the advice of every SME I’ve seen online and talked to in person.

Low T causes low T symptoms. Swinging blood levels causes a host of other symptoms. I don't know what resources you're referring to? But there is no Endo out there that isn't going to try and get your levels steady in combination with maintaining your levels above low, the two things are synonymous and go hand in hand.

Fortunately nzswap has a proper medical resource giving him guidelines to follow.