GET OUT and VOTE!! NDP Bitches!!!

[ZenOps]

If you factor in that the US did not land on the moon, lefty Putin-land doesn't look all that bad comparitively. Sure, they massively overspent on now rusting military - but they also do have great industrial capacity.

If you factor in that the US did land on the moon, then yes - the US kicks everyones ass and noone in the world should be allowed to use their netflix - other than US exceptional citizens because eveyone else sucks gonads.

I personally wouldn't mind seeing a NDP minority govt or five way tie.

[M.alex]

I don't pay much attention to how govn't budgets work, but if there's a minority govn't taxes wouldn't go up, would they? NDP would vote yes, the others would vote no, and there should be more no's than yes's?

[flipstah]

Originally posted by M.alex
I don't pay much attention to how govn't budgets work, but if there's a minority govn't taxes wouldn't go up, would they? NDP would vote yes, the others would vote no, and there should be more no's than yes's?

Liberals might work with NDP with conditions so it's not that easy to get a lot of 'no'.

[HiTempguy1]

Originally posted by rage2

I love how nobody understands how dividend tax works. Here's a quick primer:

http://www.epr.ca/dividends-vs-salaries/

While dividend tax rates is lower, it's also post corporate tax, which combined *gasp* works out to the same as salary.

The difference is the differing benefits between the 2 types of income.

It's hilarious how everyone thinks that pays themselves through dividends are cheating on taxes and screwing everyone else lol.

Hey, I appreciate the learning opportunity. Fair enough! But to make it sound like small-business owners don't get perks is hilarious. Yes, there has been some serious clamping down on it as there should be.

If corporations and businesses are "people" in the eyes of the law, I see little reason why they should be subsidized. Then again, I see little reason why ANYTHING is subsidized, it all just becomes pork.

[Toma]

Originally posted by Tik-Tok



Bullshit. He just knew when to get on the ground floor of some lucrative contracts, asides from that he was playing nice just trying to get some princess tail. He also knew the rebels would be a good hiding spot from Jabba.

good grief man. thats the ENTIRE concept in the movies.

light side, people's champions=ndp
dark side, imperialists/corporatists= pc/wildrose.

nothing wrong with individuals making a living. its the evil EMPIRE that we are after.

lol. man.

[Tik-Tok]

Originally posted by Toma


good grief man. thats the ENTIRE concept in the movies.

light side, people's champions=ndp
dark side, imperialists/corporatists= pc/wildrose.

nothing wrong with individuals making a living. its the evil EMPIRE that we are after.

lol. man.

That's your version of the concept.

Another persons version is that that the Empire was practically NDP heaven because everyone was the same, every single soldier was a clone... all... equal...

[Feruk]

Originally posted by mr2mike
http://boereport.com/2015/05/04/ndp-...-oil-industry/

I'll leave this right here... that Norway vs. Alberta picture is a non issue if there's no fracturing.

Oh man, fear mongering at it's very worst. Nobody has even said a word about a fracking moratorium; nobody's that stupid. Actually, someone is that stupid... the employees of BOE Report. Or should I say current and ex Long Run Energy employees. I'd never vote NDP, but this story is just pathetic drivel.

[phreezee]

Originally posted by HiTempguy1

But to make it sound like small-business owners don't get perks is hilarious. Yes, there has been some serious clamping down on it as there should be.

"Perks" are just a trade off for unpaid vacations, no health benefits, no ESOP, no RRSP matching, no employment insurance, etc. You make it sound like these people are stealing from you. They also potentially employ others and help the economy.

[HiTempguy1]

Originally posted by phreezee


You make it sound like these people are stealing from you.

I think everyone should pay their fair share Also, your trickle down economics ("they" provide jobs) has been disproved time and time again.

So yes, if a company of any sort is utilizing public infrastructure and gets a larger return on their use of it (be it the citizens, resources, hard infrastructure, governance, etc etc) they should be paying. And I would argue right now that with the "no taxes before $500k revenue" and 10% corporate tax rate, its currently not enough

Edit-
As well, everyone likes to scapegoat union workers as taking more than their fair share. Having been on both sides, I clearly have a different viewpoint than some on "who gets what" and "who pays enough".

[ZedMan]

Originally posted by Toma


good grief man. thats the ENTIRE concept in the movies.

light side, people's champions=ndp
dark side, imperialists/corporatists= pc/wildrose.

nothing wrong with individuals making a living. its the evil EMPIRE that we are after.

lol. man.

Oh BS. I don't remember seeing any contractors working on the deathstar. Every guy there was a public sector employee.

[ExtraSlow]

All the TFW's were in that filthy cantina.

[7thgenvic]

All we need is another Cunt in charge of this Province... UGHHHH

[300zxfairlday]

Ill vote for pc before i ever vote ndp
Wildrose ftw

[revelations]

Originally posted by 7thgenvic
All we need is another Cunt in charge of this Province... UGHHHH

What an extremely well thought out statement.





But, back to the NDP. You can see that Mrs. Notley squarely aligns with the typical NDP background in big labour. Expect her actions to reflect those of the past. She wont pander to big oil, but she probably wont kick them to the curb either.


(wiki)

After law school, Notley articled for Edmonton labour lawyer Bob Blakely, and went on to work for the AUPE representing members with Workers' Compensation cases.

In 1994, Notley moved to Vancouver, British Columbia, where she worked for the Health Sciences Association of BC as their occupational health and safety officer.[9]

During her time in BC, she worked for one year as a ministerial assistant to the provincial Attorney General.[10] In this role, she was part of the team that first expanded the application of BC's family relations laws to same sex couples, several years before the Government of Canada took similar initiatives.

Notley acted as a representative of the provincial labour movement in the negotiation and drafting of new workplace health and safety standards.[1]

During her time in Vancouver, Notley was active with “Moms on the Move”, an organization that advocated for the rights of special needs children. She is also a past board member of the Vancouver Community College.[7]

Notley returned to Edmonton in 2002. She worked for a short time for the National Union of Public and General Employees (NUPGE),[11] worked at Athabasca University,[12] acted as volunteer co-ordinator for the Friends of Medicare "Romanow Now" campaign, and finally as a labour relations officer for the United Nurses of Alberta.[1]

[Nitro5]

so wait, I'm a little behind, I should hate on someone because they worked hard and have a nice car? Got to get this NDP mindset right for tomorrow.

If the NDP wins, should we start some BMW's on fire?

[Sugarphreak]

...

[rage2]

Originally posted by HiTempguy1
I think everyone should pay their fair share

I've been pretty quiet about this fair share business because I'm probably going to sound like a douche but here we go.

We had a fair share system. Under a flat tax system everyone paid a fair share. Low earners pay a lot less than high earners. Simple. Under the NDP platform the progressive tax system punishes hard workers who make more than 125k and severely punishes earners over 300k (to be fair PC failed here with their new progressive tax system, but not as bad as what the NDP are proposing). The problem is that PC is spending out of control, and NDP is proposing even more spending which is mind boggling. We need to trim the fat, not open up our wallets and give the NDP a blank check.

Does that make me a money hungry asshole? I believe I'm fairly generous. More money in my pocket means I can donate and contribute to what I want to, support the things that I believe in. I don't like the government taking more from me, and dictating where those contributions go.

The huge shift to NDP goes to show that the majority of people have become entitled today, and that annoys the hell out of me. Punish the rich, the (mostly) hard working people who are creating wealth and pouring it back into the economy. Hardly fair share.

[msommers]

Originally posted by InRich


Thank-you for that comment. I do appreciate that. And yes I will do ANYTHING to keep my business going as strong as possible. Believe me its hard, dealing with trades alone is a nightmare!!! but on top of that keeping them busy is a while other story. if I gotta door knock 7 days a week (which I do btw) I'll do it to keep the leads flowing. Oh btw this year has been the hardest year in 8 YEARS. I'm already going to be laying off 25% of my work force, if the NDP get in, I can see my business suffering even worse. I know i
m a hot head when speaking on here, I'm just saying how I feel, no filter between my head and my mouth. Dont take it personally fellas. DO NOT VOTE NDP plz! Its tough for guys like me in the front line trenches.

Well I hate to break this to you man, but some family friends of ours run a custom homes company. She designs and he project manages, so I've heard all the horror stories of dealing with trades. Today, they aren't knocking on doors for business (and haven't been for well over 5+ years now) and they are actually getting progressively busier building homes instead of high-end renos. So while things have definitely slowed as a whole, the current government may be partially to blame for that, not one that currently has zero say on how business is done here.

Originally posted by rage2

I've been pretty quiet about this fair share business because I'm probably going to sound like a douche but here we go.

We had a fair share system. Under a flat tax system everyone paid a fair share. Low earners pay a lot less than high earners. Simple. Under the NDP platform the progressive tax system punishes hard workers who make more than 125k and severely punishes earners over 300k (to be fair PC failed here with their new progressive tax system, but not as bad as what the NDP are proposing). The problem is that PC is spending out of control, and NDP is proposing even more spending which is mind boggling. We need to trim the fat, not open up our wallets and give the NDP a blank check.

Does that make me a money hungry asshole? I believe I'm fairly generous. More money in my pocket means I can donate and contribute to what I want to, support the things that I believe in. I don't like the government taking more from me, and dictating where those contributions go.

The huge shift to NDP goes to show that the majority of people have become entitled today, and that annoys the hell out of me. Punish the rich, the (mostly) hard working people who are creating wealth and pouring it back into the economy. Hardly fair share.

Agreed -- for the most part. The only issue is "punishes hard workers who make more than 125k." It makes it sound like anyone who is making <125K isn't working hard when in reality they could be putting in way more hours than people making >125K for various reason. But I get your overall point.

Regarding dividends and salaries, it really depends. If you start a business and have the intention of keeping money in the company, making various family members shareholders (like your children), setting up trust funds etc, then yes you do end up paying less tax overall. Essentially, you can setup a retirement fund within the company and disperse funds later on to limit your yearly salary and taxable income. Not having to pay CPP saves you personally at least 2,600/year, if not 5,200/year depending on your setup. Times that by how many years and it adds up. Various tax write-offs do also add up at the end of the year, but aren't government-paid items like a lot of people seem to think.

There are also O&G companies downtown that haven't paid a cent of tax for years, primarily through acquisition.

I think as a whole, Albertans recognize the need to get off the boom-bust cycle that dictates entirely how good or bad things are here, and come to a level that's more predictable and sustainable. Those are two lovely catch-words that every fucking politician will promise, but the reality is this latest cycle really illustrates how quickly things turn to shit when we haven't planned properly. If this was the first time then I think there would be more forgiveness. But the 80's was the perfect example of what not to do and the government didn't change a thing. That's hard to ignore.

[rage2]

Originally posted by msommers
Agreed -- for the most part. The only issue is &quot;punishes hard workers who make more than 125k.&quot; It makes it sound like anyone who is making &lt;125K isn't working hard when in reality they could be putting in way more hours than people making &gt;125K for various reason. But I get your overall point.

That's why I said (mostly) hard working.

But ya, to add to my opinion, I'm not opposed to tax increases. I'm just opposed to overspending, and progressive taxation. If we cut the fat and still can't make ends meet because we've been subsidizing ourselves over the years with O&G money, then we should definately increase the flat tax rate so that everyone actually pays a fair share.

[HiTempguy1]

In my opinion, its not a fair share. Even having the flat tax based on percent, at the end of the day it still is disproportionately harder financially on the poorer folk than the more well off people. The systems we have in place have given everyone (including myself) a leg-up to get where we are today. If we need a bit more money to support them, I think it is in almost everyone's best interests to do so. Rage, is 2% higher tax really going to affect your bottom line? Will you even NOTICE that money gone after the initial year? I know right now if somebody said 1% of my salary was gone, it'd be a pretty yawn moment.

Understand, I earn enough money that I will probably get hit with higher taxes, if not immediately, almost certainly within the next couple of years if the progressive tax goes through. I have skin in this game. I'm also a business owner now.

I agree with your assessment of needing to trim the fat. As I've said before, wildrose says it will cut half of AHS management. I personally believe that could be done and service quality would not suffer.

Hell, where I work could cut half of management and nobody would notice

So while we do have a spending problem, we do have a revenue problem as well, mainly that O&G royalties (when the times are good) have subsidized that flat rate.

Of course, as I always point out, O&G has been subsidized in many ways. Have the plants up north paid for the twinning and multiple overpasses north of Fort Mac? Fuck no! Did they pay for the additional oversized load routes that go around those overpasses so they don't have to ship large equipment on barges down the Athabasca? Nope! (please correct me if I am wrong!)

Alberta citizens being put on the hook for a refinery that could cost us billions? Sole sourcing bullshit contracts for the modular schools in southern Alberta when the floods hit?

I am sick of ALL subsidies, loop holes, etc etc. I want it all gone, whether its said issues I have with corporate welfare, or healthcare that costs us $1k more per year than any other province and we still have worse service. So the Wildrose could do it, but unfortunately, I don't believe this province has its tax system structured to survive WITHOUT oil royalties. We need to change that NOW, the sooner we can do that, the better off we'll be to get past peak demand of oil and a changing world in general.

The NDP currently advocates for that. They have their issues though. Minimum wage is already what, $10.50/h or close to it? A gradual increase to $15/h (if that ever goes through, and I honestly doubt it would) over the next couple of years isn't insane. I don't agree with it, buI can overlook it as a flaw vs a fundamental policy issue, especially considering most fast food joints seem to be advertising $13/h anyways, and in the larger cities, it is pretty damn tough to get by on that (so again, society subsidizing labour for corporations by having a minimum wage that may not truly reflect a "minimum" wage).

These are tough issues. I actually don't like any of the parties running. I personally feel we do a pretty good job in this province of taking care of business, including the business of the people who need a helping hand. The PC party in and of itself isn't the problem, its that they are a bunch of crony dickheads.

So wildrose or NDP? One is going to raise taxes, no questions asked. The other is going to start cutting like back in the Klein years. Some would argue that Klein hurt this province by kicking the can of infrastructure and development down the road, and we are now feeling what happens (especially in an acute sense due to the until recently blazing hot economy).

Wow, that got out of hand quick. TLDR; our taxes are too low to sustain the province without oil royalties. Something has to give/be changed. The well off can afford to have services that the province provides cutback, the less well off can't. Therefore, I side with NDP.