New Alberta Climate Change Plan

[schocker]

Isn't the southern leg of KXL already built too?

[HiTempguy1]

I don't recall addressing you at all in my comments that precipitated your response. Were your ears burning? Seems to me that you had an opportunity to start a reasonable conversation but chose otherwise...

The glib, condescending nature of your initial post removes any chance of reasonable conversation with you. I simply replied in kind, it just so happens that it was in response to your (typical) reply.

I don't agree with you. It's easy enough to shape the perception of a large group of people. We're already doing it now. Consider the message we're sending when we take our entire leadership base to a climate summit.

Baby steps.

Well that's fine, but you are wrong. Like I said, we have no problem selling our oil. We have no problem shipping our oil. The only "problem" is STRICTLY in the eyes of environmentalists and the liberals/easterners of this country.

I think you're forgetting the fact that I'm addressing the people crying foul over the climate summit. Not once did I say that I agree with the steps taken by the Notely government.

FORTY THOUSAND PEOPLE flew in to be at the Paris conferences. We are allowed to cry foul, that's a shit ton of unneeded pollution. Nobody gives a shit about Canada's emissions, nobody cares what Trudeau and his assholish "holier than thou" attitude has to say, and nobody cares what the premiers think.

Also, I'm curious: if people buy as much oil as we produce, why was there so much riding on Keystone XL?

There wasn't and there isn't. If I can make one dollar more per hour at my job, of course I'm going to make it seem like a big deal, because it is in the grand scheme of things. With oil at $40/barrel, one extra dollar is huge, let alone the cost savings of ~$5/barrel that was calculated. But the oil industry was fine without Keystone, and it will continue to chug along. The biggest thing, as Killramos has perfectly pointed out, is the sheer audacity of the political pandering involved as the decision was a net-negative overall, and yet the eco-weenies and liberals just lap it up and circle-jerk each other off over it

You're absolutely correct that perception is reality, until the rubber hits the road and the final score is tallied. Theory is great on paper though!

[suntan]

Well shit it's already done.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/busin...3a9_story.html

From what I've been able to gather about the Montana leg a lot of it was simply that the landowners wanted more money, and that was shrouded in the "environment" argument.

[phreezee]

Originally posted by suntan
Well shit it's already done.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/busin...3a9_story.html

From what I've been able to gather about the Montana leg a lot of it was simply that the landowners wanted more money, and that was shrouded in the "environment" argument.

Look over here!

[killramos]

It doesnt take 7 years to build a pipeline. Just to not approve it. Its been 90% done for like 4 years or something?

[A790]

Originally posted by HiTempguy1
Well that's fine, but you are wrong. Like I said, we have no problem selling our oil. We have no problem shipping our oil. The only "problem" is STRICTLY in the eyes of environmentalists and the liberals/easterners of this country.
As well as the people in the USA that ultimately terminated the project. Seems to me that the problem is much more significant there.

FORTY THOUSAND PEOPLE flew in to be at the Paris conferences. We are allowed to cry foul, that's a shit ton of unneeded pollution. Nobody gives a shit about Canada's emissions, nobody cares what Trudeau and his assholish "holier than thou" attitude has to say, and nobody cares what the premiers think.
That's a lot of people.

However, don't confuse your perspective with the views of other people. Just because you think Trudeau's an asshole, and because you don't care what he/the premiers have to say, doesn't make that perspective universal. I bet there are a lot of people sitting in offices far more important than mine that value their perspectives.

There wasn't and there isn't. If I can make one dollar more per hour at my job, of course I'm going to make it seem like a big deal, because it is in the grand scheme of things. With oil at $40/barrel, one extra dollar is huge, let alone the cost savings of ~$5/barrel that was calculated. But the oil industry was fine without Keystone, and it will continue to chug along. The biggest thing, as Killramos has perfectly pointed out, is the sheer audacity of the political pandering involved as the decision was a net-negative overall, and yet the eco-weenies and liberals just lap it up and circle-jerk each other off over it

I never understood the opposition to it, especially considering that rail is the alternative.

So, what I'm hearing is that our ability to ship oil is somewhat incapacitated in comparison to an environment where KXL was implemented. Is that right?

Also, is it the Canadian eco-weenies/Liberals that are against it... or their American counterparts?

You're absolutely correct that perception is reality, until the rubber hits the road and the final score is tallied. Theory is great on paper though!
In this situation, the right answer is less important than the path we take to get there. It's like in school when you were forced to show your work on a math problem: sure, the answer is important, but the individual steps to get there are more important.

Our government absolutely should be taking steps to shift perception where needed. This is best for our industry and our economy.

[suntan]

So, what I'm hearing is that our ability to ship oil is somewhat incapacitated in comparison to an environment where KXL was implemented. Is that right?

Yes. That's why Canadian Light Sweet and Western Canadian Select almost always sells for lower than WTI. Our supply is so limited by transportation methods that demand for it is crimped.

Also, is it the Canadian eco-weenies/Liberals that are against it... or their American counterparts?

Basically everyone.

[HiTempguy1]

Originally posted by A790
Don't confuse your perspective with the views of other people. Just because you think Trudeau's an asshole, and because you don't care what he/the premiers have to say, doesn't make that perspective universal. I bet there are a lot of people sitting in offices far more important than mine that value their perspectives.

No, there really isn't on an international scale. You are completely delusional if you believe this to be the case because at the end of the day, Canada doesn't matter.

I do care what they have to say. Well, I care what the premiers have to say, the "barely a grade school teacher" I could care less what he has to say

[killramos]

Sounds like this debate has more to do with you two picking personal beefs with each other than any kind of actual facts or discussions of the topic?

Oh wait it's beyond carry on

[frizzlefry]

Climate Change a Low Priority For Most Canadians

When presented with a long list of policy issues, only 13 per cent of Canadians chose climate change as one of their top three worries, according to an Ipsos poll provided exclusively to Global News. Forty per cent of Canadians chose health care, and 39 per cent chose unemployment. Climate change even ranked below crime and education.

[g-m]

The government says we care. Therefore we care?

[dirtsniffer]

"climate change even ranked below crime and education"

hahaha no shit.

[A790]

Originally posted by killramos
Sounds like this debate has more to do with you two picking personal beefs with each other than any kind of actual facts or discussions of the topic?

Oh wait it's beyond carry on

Typical killramos

[A790]

[A790]

Originally posted by HiTempguy1


No, there really isn't on an international scale. You are completely delusional if you believe this to be the case because at the end of the day, Canada doesn't matter.

How have you come to that conclusion?

[HiTempguy1]

Originally posted by A790

How have you come to that conclusion?

How have you come to yours?

[Maxt]

Maybe we do need WW3, just to put the world view back to utter survival and get us off the enviro navel gazing.

[phreezee]

We are headed toward what has happened in Ontario

Ontarians paid $37-billion above market price for electricity over eight years: AG

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/...ticle27560753/

[suntan]

Just implement the plan from Kingsman... Say, has anybody seen Richard Branson recently?

[Nitro5]

Is this what we have to look forward to as we switch to green energy?

Ontario Hydro Auditor's Report Finds Consumers Overcharged By $37 Billion
http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2015/12...n_8707404.html