Guaranteed Basic Income to start.

[ZenOps]

Free money. Yes, you heard that right - free money.

http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2016/02...n_9328264.html

But only in select Ontario areas to start.

[Sugarphreak]

...

[M.alex]

if implemented properly maybe it works - you get rid of a shit load of unnecessary, bloated services?

[BandW]

Originally posted by Sugarphreak
If you pay people to be poor, you'll never run out of poor people... but you might run out of other peoples money

Well the status quo seems to be doing a pretty good job of creating more poor people anyway.

[Sugarphreak]

...

[phreezee]

Ontario is $308B in debt and pays $11B in interest per year!
Fucking Liberals!
Alberta needs to separate from these welfare states.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ontario_government_debt

[lilmira]

No failing in school, no failing in life. At least it's consistent right?

[Masked Bandit]

So this is basically welfare on steroids? All the deadbeats & bums will move to Ontario and who exactly is going to pay for all of this? The only way I can see this working is if all the other social assistance programs like welfare, OAS, AISH, EI, etc. are abolished and the entirety of their budgets are brought under this umbrella WITHOUT any increase to the total expenditures of the previously fractured system.

But I'm sure that's not going to happen.

[sputnik]

Originally posted by Sugarphreak
Giving large sums of money out to people who can't manage their own cash with no strings.... I am sure the casinos, bars and local drug dealers will all be thrilled, lol

I have a feeling it is probably cheaper just to give the poor a guaranteed basic income than it is funding endless amounts of social workers and social programs that "help" the poor.

The poverty industry is a billion dollar industry that only helps the people working in it.

[Feruk]

Originally posted by sputnik
I have a feeling it is probably cheaper just to give the poor a guaranteed basic income than it is funding endless amounts of social workers and social programs that "help" the poor.

The poverty industry is a billion dollar industry that only helps the people working in it.

My thoughts exactly!

[rx7boi]

Give money away
Reduce poverty
?????
Profit

[Swank]

Originally posted by sputnik


I have a feeling it is probably cheaper just to give the poor a guaranteed basic income than it is funding endless amounts of social workers and social programs

And at least the social workers will have a guaranteed income to fall back on when their jobs are abolished

[Feruk]

Originally posted by rx7boi
Give money away
Reduce poverty
?????
Profit

We're pretty much doing that today as is.

[Xtrema]

If we believe in the future of autonomous cars, self service kiosk and robot taking more job then it creates, then we need GBI before society turn into:

[kertejud2]

Originally posted by Masked Bandit
So this is basically welfare on steroids? All the deadbeats & bums will move to Ontario and who exactly is going to pay for all of this? The only way I can see this working is if all the other social assistance programs like welfare, OAS, AISH, EI, etc. are abolished and the entirety of their budgets are brought under this umbrella WITHOUT any increase to the total expenditures of the previously fractured system.

But I'm sure that's not going to happen.

That is the idea of how it saves money, but you are right that it needs a lot of stuff to work that way. It can have other benefits like allowing people to 'follow their dream' because they don't need to stress about income which can lead to a lot more small business startups which helps the economy. Plus streamlining social welfare is just good policy. If it can allow more freedom for single income households that is good for the children and can open up jobs for others (in theory).

With the world in a position where automation can increase economic growth without creating jobs I think UBI is something every developed country will need to explore eventually, so trials are good. Not sure if Ontario is in the best situation to start one but they can do what they want.

[ExtraSlow]

I can see the value in this concept. I also think our current system is insanely complex for folks at the bottom.

As always, the devil is in the details, and I don't trust any level of government to implement social programs without screwing them up somehow.

[revelations]

Originally posted by kertejud2


That is the idea of how it saves money, but you are right that it needs a lot of stuff to work that way. It can have other benefits like allowing people to 'follow their dream' because they don't need to stress about income which can lead to a lot more small business startups which helps the economy. Plus streamlining social welfare is just good policy. If it can allow more freedom for single income households that is good for the children and can open up jobs for others (in theory).

With the world in a position where automation can increase economic growth without creating jobs I think UBI is something every developed country will need to explore eventually, so trials are good. Not sure if Ontario is in the best situation to start one but they can do what they want.

The theory behind basic income has been tried many times and seems to have worked in these cases.

Not everyone has or wants goals and many would rather sit in front of TV ALL DAY if given a chance.

With Basic Income, these people get off the workforce for those who want to work and get ahead.

[kertejud2]

Originally posted by ExtraSlow
I can see the value in this concept. I also think our current system is insanely complex for folks at the bottom.

As always, the devil is in the details, and I don't trust any level of government to implement social programs without screwing them up somehow.

It gets more complicated when you have such significant divisions in social welfare between jurisdictions like Canada has. Ideally we would see a trial started at the federal level with cities/towns in each province (with provincial buy-in) to get a real idea of how this might work.

But at the same time something that works one way in Dauphin, MB probably won't work the same way in Calgary or Toronto so just how many trials do we need before we can try universal implementation which needs a generation to gauge anyway.

[kertejud2]

Originally posted by revelations


The theory behind basic income has been tried many times and seems to have worked in these cases.

Not everyone has or wants goals and many would rather sit in front of TV ALL DAY if given a chance.

With Basic Income, these people get off the workforce for those who want to work and get ahead.

The cable companies will be lobbying hard for UBI.

[BandW]

Originally posted by revelations

Not everyone has or wants goals and many would rather sit in front of TV ALL DAY if given a chance.

This rationale sounds somewhat similar to what would happen if all drugs were legal and there was a huge bucket of free meth on a street corner downtown.

I wouldn't give a shit if meth was legal and handed out freely. I wouldn't try it.

Still, to think that more people wouldn't try it and get hooked comes across as naive. Maybe it's not a great analogy. Maybe it is. Who knows?