Multiple attacks in Brussels. 11 dead and dozens wounded.

[KrisYYC]

Here we go again.

This time an attack at Brussels airport and metro stations.

http://metro.co.uk/2016/03/22/two-lo...rport-5766899/

[TomcoPDR]

[KrisYYC]

Just heard on Sky news that death toll now up to 23...

[n1zm0]

Just days after they caught the Abdelsalam and he said he was planning more attacks.

It's sad and shocking to see the one graphic picture of the main departure hallway, all messed up. I was stuck in that hallway for almost an hour last year doing check in after leaving the city from a nearby music festival.

[adam c]

What the fuck does this even accomplish ISIS, want to start WW3 and be wiped from the face of the earth, good fucking job

[phreezee]

Brussels attacks: At least 26 dead at Zaventem and Maelbeek
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-35869254

At least 26 people have been killed and many seriously injured in terrorist attacks at Brussels international airport and a city metro station. Twin blasts hit Zaventem airport at 07:00 GMT, killing 11 and injuring 81, Belgium's health minister said. Another explosion struck Maelbeek metro station an hour later. Brussels transport officials say 15 people were killed and 55 injured, 10 seriously. Belgium has now raised its terrorism threat to its highest level. The attacks come four days after Salah Abdeslam, the main fugitive in the Paris attacks, was seized in Brussels. Prime Minister Charles Michel called the latest attacks "blind, violent and cowardly", adding: "This is a day of tragedy, a black day... I would like to call on everyone to show calmness and solidarity".

edit: opps, thx for the merge mod.


RIP

[JRSC00LUDE]

I thought they did want to start WW3 because it'll trigger God's vengeance and all us heathens will be wiped out or some crap like that?

Religious nuts are dangerous, violent ones are even worse. Be more dangerous and kill em all? Either way it's a war, I'd rather "win" because we all know the only sky God coming down to help will be a split atom or two.

[HiTempguy1]

I don't known if you need to do that.

It really is unfortunate, but you have to keep this bullshit contained. Is it racist and xenophobic? Yep. But no more immigrants allowed from the middle east until they decide to play nice. Large problem solved.

Is it perfect? No, it punishes millions who are completely innocent. But it is time that instead of running away from their problems, that they stand and fight as ALL of our own countries have done over the years when rebellion and infighting occured.

This is why isolationism works. I've seen a lot of press releases talking about "everyone working together on the war on terror". That would involve France, Britain, Germany, USA, Canada, Australia, and (just going to lump them all together here) the nordic countries basically.going into each country of the middle east and taking over. Occupy one, clean house. Leave substantial units behind, move onto the next country. It would NEVER happen though.

[Feruk]

Originally posted by JRSC00LUDE
I thought they did want to start WW3 because it'll trigger God's vengeance and all us heathens will be wiped out or some crap like that?

Religious nuts are dangerous, violent ones are even worse. Be more dangerous and kill em all? Either way it's a war, I'd rather "win" because we all know the only sky God coming down to help will be a split atom or two.

They want the West to overreact against Muslims in their own countries, driving them straight into the hands of IS. Note how IS has been using Donald Trump's speeches as propaganda.

To be clear though, it's not religious nuts that are the problem, it's Islamic religious nuts.

Originally posted by HiTempguy1
But no more immigrants allowed from the middle east until they decide to play nice. Large problem solved.

If you look at who committed the Paris attacks, the UK attacks, the California attacks, it was mostly homegrown Islamic terrorists that were born in the West, not immigrants. Closing the border would've done nothing to stop the attacks.

The problem is the barbaric religion we know as Islam. If it wasn't, we'd already hear denouncing of this act across the Islamic world. But that's never gonna happen.

Originally posted by HiTempguy1
This is why isolationism works. I've seen a lot of press releases talking about "everyone working together on the war on terror". That would involve France, Britain, Germany, USA, Canada, Australia, and (just going to lump them all together here) the nordic countries basically.going into each country of the middle east and taking over. Occupy one, clean house. Leave substantial units behind, move onto the next country. It would NEVER happen though.

It has happened. In Iraq and Afghanistan. Didn't work so well...

[Kloubek]

It would never happen - in part because it would never work. Going into each country and occupying it will NOT solve the issue. Look at Iraq and Afghanistan as examples.

Death toll now tentative at 34.

Edit: Oops, Feruk beat me to my first paragraph.

[n1zm0]

Originally posted by HiTempguy1
It really is unfortunate, but you have to keep this bullshit contained. Is it racist and xenophobic? Yep. But no more immigrants allowed from the middle east until they decide to play nice. Large problem solved.

Except both Abdelhamid (the one they caught and killed shortly after the bombings) and Abdelsalam and his brother(who died in the Paris attack) are both 1st generation immigrant offspring, both born and raised in Belgium, the latter holding French nationality. Abdelhamid went to Syria in 2014, radicalized Abdelsalam thereafter when they spent time in prison together.

The refugees are definitely a concern but it seems that the already planted ones are more of an issue after they get radicalized.

There is a video of women in Raqqa who have been taking videos undercover, they said the foreign fighters are the most brutal and violent compared to actual Syrians and Iraqis in the IS ranks.

edit:

Originally posted by Feruk
To be clear though, it's not religious nuts that are the problem, it's Islamic religious nuts.

Exactly this, while not conclusive of course, when I was in Brussels I did walk past a fair bit of predominantly middle-eastern areas (they aren't just secluded to the Molenbeek area, believe me), they are just normal hardworking business owners/workers just as anyone else, extremely accommodating anytime I entered their shop. I mean half the small shops in prominent Paris neighborhoods even are run by mostly North Africans. It's the small handful of nut jobs that are committing these atrocities, not the entirety of Muslims worldwide.

[HiTempguy1]

You guys do realize that at some point their families came over, right? My solution isn't a short term one, there IS NO SHORT TERM SOLUTION. The damage has been done.

This crap isn't going anywhere. This is a 50 year problem.

And you are wrong about Iraq and Afghanistan. In neither of those situations did the western military powers go in and completely clean house. Half-assed attempts with weak willed politicians who gave up half-way through. If they had gone in with full military support (as if going into a true war with an enemy they were intent to destroy) and swept the entire country (for years, not 6 months), it could be done. Remember world war 2? Germany and Russia were pretty good at that. And I said multiple countries, with porous borders it does no good to take care of one country but not the 5 others.

My plan requires there to be no seperation of terrorists and state. It is "you're privledge to self governance is being revoked, if you do not comply with our demands, you are gone". Ruthlessness is the only solution, everything has been half-assed which is why we are where we are today.

[ZenOps]

Airport attack, was bound to happen somewhere.

Murder stats show airport to be the safest place in Calgary, for now anyhow.

[Feruk]

Originally posted by HiTempguy1
My plan requires there to be no seperation of terrorists and state. It is "you're privledge to self governance is being revoked, if you do not comply with our demands, you are gone". Ruthlessness is the only solution, everything has been half-assed which is why we are where we are today.

The US stayed in Iraq and Afghanistan about a decade each. At the peak, they had ~150,000 soldiers in Iraq ALONE not including all the military contractors. Over 100,000 Iraqi civilians were killed. They were all in. The end result of this occupation is it led DIRECTLY to the creation of IS. If the US had just stayed out, Hussein would still be dealing with the issues there. The answer isn't more intervention, it's less.

Multiple studies have been conducted that show for every one civilian killed, you've created 2-3 additional soldiers for groups like IS. The more brutal you are, the more people want you dead.

Short of being willing to indiscriminately butcher millions of people like Stalin did, or drop nuclear weapons on the Middle East, the last 10 years have proven that there is NO military solution.

Originally posted by HiTempguy1
You guys do realize that at some point their families came over, right?

So did yours... People move.

[403Gemini]

Originally posted by Feruk


So did yours... People move.

Difference his didn't bring over barbaric ideologies that most other cultures outgrew 1000 years ago.

I get a kick out of people comparing Islam to the Catholic crusades. Yeah, great , in 1095, Christians/Catholics thought it was a good idea to wage a holy war.

Propose that idea to a group of Catholics now, most would probably report you for planning a mass murder

I'm also obviously not saying Christians/Catholics don't break any laws/don't commit murder - but it's nothing this insane on such a grand scale. These idiots literally think they're ushering in the apocalypse. If that's not being brainwashed, I'm not sure what is.

[JRSC00LUDE]

Originally posted by n1zm0
It's the small handful of nut jobs that are committing these atrocities, not the entirety of Muslims worldwide.

I don't fully subscribe to that sentiment, if the vast majority of Islam didn't accept this behavior to some degree they would be able to crush it from within and you'd be left with a few oddball sects like the "Christians" down south. Sure the majority may not ever do it themselves but I don't see them standing out against it. A few do but not many.

I see tacit agreement with this behavior by their majority, every time it happens.

[Kloubek]

Originally posted by HiTempguy1
And you are wrong about Iraq and Afghanistan. In neither of those situations did the western military powers go in and completely clean house.

We're not at all wrong.

What you fail to see is that it isn't POSSIBLE to "clean house". This isn't like fighting a country, where you basically pound most of their military, they realize they are overpowered and give up, sign something, and people go on their way.

This is an ideology. A movement. Misplaced religion. The super staunch supporters are on the front lines fighting for it. The moderates are staying home and watching. Even if you could kill all the front line fighters (which you can't, as they are spread out and blend in), then the moderates who supported them now become the frontline fighters and their children become the moderates.

You said it yourself - this doesn't end. It's not because some people don't want it to end... it's because cannot be forced to end, so it doesn't until the people decide themselves to give up on the movement. And that sort of thing takes decades... perhaps centuries. Maybe longer.

So no, it's not possible to "clean house". Even if you can calm the immediate threat, you'll continue to have lots of smaller battles everywhere as pockets of resistance occur. Then when you leave (unless you plan on a Western country staying for decades or centuries), then everything goes to shit again. All this, besides the fact that your occupation is going to breed more discontent in itself, thereby contributing to the very movement you're trying to destroy.

It's a brutal war, no doubt. But the rest of the world really should have kept their noses out of it and let it sort itself out. Once the issue became a large enough threat to the surrounding countries, they would have had no choice but to clean up this mess themselves. Why is it that the coalition isn't largely made up of middle eastern countries? I think that's completely ridiculous. You better believe if a similar movement happened in North America that there wouldn't be a huge Middle Eastern contingent helping US out.

Originally posted by 403Gemini
I'm also obviously not saying Christians/Catholics don't break any laws/don't commit murder - but it's nothing this insane on such a grand scale.

I agree with most of what you said, but the Crusades were estimated to have killed anywhere from 1 to 4 million people. The latest figures indicate ISIS and the Syrian civil war toll has been less than 200,000. So, nowhere even remotely close to each other.

[Buster]

Originally posted by JRSC00LUDE


I don't fully subscribe to that sentiment, if the vast majority of Islam didn't accept this behavior to some degree they would be able to crush it from within and you'd be left with a few oddball sects like the "Christians" down south. Sure the majority may not ever do it themselves but I don't see them standing out against it. A few do but not many.

I see tacit agreement with this behavior by their majority, every time it happens.

Yes.

The problem with this is that views that we would consider extremist are largely considered mainstream throughout the Muslim world. Pew poll research is pretty unambiguous on this stuff.

You cannot avoid the fact that Islam/Quran/Hadith are pretty clear and straightforward in a lot of these things.

[bob9979]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y9JBQvGJ4as

[bob9979]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y9JBQvGJ4as