Boats school me on them?

[ExtraSlow]

I use a wakesetter vlx as a fishing boat with my five year old. Very good platform and the fish blood wipes off the seats mostly okay.

[r3ccOs]

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We had a Wakesetter 23LSV and I would say your description regarding owners and maintenance was not very accurate. We had WAY over 300hrs over ~10 years of ownership, and certainly did not have to replace an engine, let alone do anything more than routine maintenance and winterizations. Never had to replace a ballast pump or anything. If you replace an engine after 300hr you did something horribly wrong or have even worse luck. They also make the best tubing boats, they aren't just for surfing/wakeboarding For us it was definitely not a 'mid life crisis' or 'lifestyle' boat, nor were we 'rich' - it was two normal families looking to have as much fun as possible on the water so one bought the boat, one bought the tow vehicle. The big wakeboarding boats were by far the best equipped to handle lots of people at a time (which we had), and also they were by far the best for tubing (which we did the most). As we got older, we got more into the wake surfing - the older folks and younger kids also loved the wake surfing because it was low impact, no real risk of injury, and incredibly easy to do. It's a neat feeling being able to surf indefinitely without ever even having to get wet. We did not wake surf because we watched the X-games lol. Anyways, not everyone with one of those boats is looking to make a statement...in fact nobody I knew then or know now with one of those boats would fit your description of a typical owner. It may not be as obvious as you think.

When we were shopping, Supra was a lower-end boat along with Moomba and Centurion. I am not sure if that has changed over the years, sounds like maybe it has. On the very high end you had Malibu, Mastercraft, Air Nautique, and Tige. We test drove them all (which was surprisingly easy to do) and eventually went with the Malibu because it had by the best interior layout, storage, space, and bang for the buck for that particular year. Lots of good memories, really wish we still had it.

I really would have to say that you are what "should" be the case as the boat owner, but you and I both know that in alot of the cases, the same reason why someone is towing a Tige or Malibu behind them, is the same reason why they need a "Denali HD" badge for the vehicle doing the towing.

but hey, I mean you can't die with your money right?

I'd also say with the new wake shaper devices and the right ballast, you can take a good "ski" boat or anything with a good hull design and stern drive/vdrive and make a "surf" boat out of it.

have you guys checked out the Heyday? I've heard good things...

I mean immediately you can see it doesn't have the same seats, LCD controls or hydroturf interior like the big brands, but I've heard it puts out a very very good wake, and doesn't have the bells and whistles that could go wrong with the modern electronics.

as per the video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5dzeTB7aMHs

the guy makes a valid point that wakeboarding has its roots based on surfing, skateboarding etc... and that most pro's can't even afford a modern day boat.

[R-Audi]

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When we were shopping, Supra was a lower-end boat along with Moomba and Centurion. I am not sure if that has changed over the years, sounds like maybe it has. On the very high end you had Malibu, Mastercraft, Air Nautique, and Tige. .

To correct this, Moomba is Supra's (Skiers Choice) entry level boat... and definitely not in the same category. If you look up the prices they are right there along with Malibu, Mastercraft, Air Nautique etc. Tige was an entry level boat, but has been trying hard to get in the same league as the big boys. There are quite a few newer entries to the market that are trying to compete, but those 4 have the biggest market share.
Source: I worked at a Marina in town that sold both, and repaired many others. (While teaching and competing in Wakeboarding)

[Mitsu3000gt]

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To correct this, Moomba is Supra's (Skiers Choice) entry level boat... and definitely not in the same category. If you look up the prices they are right there along with Malibu, Mastercraft, Air Nautique etc. Tige was an entry level boat, but has been trying hard to get in the same league as the big boys. There are quite a few newer entries to the market that are trying to compete, but those 4 have the biggest market share.
Source: I worked at a Marina in town that sold both, and repaired many others. (While teaching and competing in Wakeboarding)

We bought ours in 2004, so I'm sure things have changed around. The Supra's we looked at back then were not as nice as the Mastercraft/Malibu product (at the time). I think some of them didn't even have an open bow, but I could be remembering incorrectly it was so long ago now. Centurion was kind of a newcomer and the boats were cheap but it showed - they also had some ridiculous 30 footer haha. Tige if I recall correctly was made partially from wood which we didn't like, and I think it made them heavy. Air Nautique was too expensive and had inefficient space inside. Mastercraft was our second choice, but the same 23' boat did not have nearly as much room in it as the Malibu 23' which was the decision maker at the end of the day along with 'bang for the buck' factor. The test drives also helped a lot, the boats were all very different on the water. We got a huge stereo installed but never used it except for listening quietly while floating around or changing riders. The tower speakers were so useless, at crazy volumes it was barely audible to the rider and you could probably hear it across the lake - I think we tried it once haha. I should go to a boat show again, I am curious how everything has evolved - that was all ~13 years ago.

[R-Audi]

Thats completely fair.. Supra defintiely had an open bow in 2004, The 'Launch' series would have been active and geared towards the wakeboard group, but the skiing background was strong. At the time Mastercraft and Nautique was still very much a waterski mentality, that is go out and ski and go back home. Not the lounging on the lake all day with friends and family type deal that most other manufacturers figured out. They eventually came around though! (And took over) The only negative I would have to say about the Malibus back then was their dealer network.. the Edmonton and Kelowna group had a feud for a while, and wouldnt even service each others boats. Quite the mess, but I think that has been resolved.
I never cared much for Tige... based on manufacturing and for a while they couldnt figure out the 'Tige Tilt' where basically the entire boat tilted to one side weighted and unweighted which made the wakes a different shape. Quality just wasnt there... but they have come a long way now.
I stopped working with that particular marina many any years ago (Prob 2005?) and they have since closed. A few of their workers are elsewhere now (AWS) and my family still has our 2007 Supra and its still going strong.

I havent been to the boat show in quite some time either, the prices have really skyrocketed though, especially the big Nautique. G25 maybe? Over $200k Cdn is ridiculous, but they are beautiful on the inside.

[Mitsu3000gt]

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I really would have to say that you are what "should" be the case as the boat owner, but you and I both know that in alot of the cases, the same reason why someone is towing a Tige or Malibu behind them, is the same reason why they need a "Denali HD" badge for the vehicle doing the towing.
.

Or maybe they just thought the combination of features Tige or Malibu offered provided the best value for their needs? I dunno, that's how it was for us and like I said, everyone else who we knew then or know now with a boat. People can still buy nice things because they like them, or because it fits their needs best, not just to show off. Not everyone wants to tow their boat with an old base model pickup truck or something that barely meets the minimum requirements - we used a Nissan Armada and it had nothing to do with optics. It was big, comfortable, had a decent third row, lots of power, screens for movies on long drives, etc. We spent almost all our time at either Little Bow or Invermere. On top of that we sold our boat to a family with the same goals as us - 4 younger kids and wanted to get into boating with something big enough for everyone to bring a friend or another family along. There will always be showoffs and brand whores and people with way too much money but in my experience in ~15 years of boating that does not represent the majority of wake boat owners. There's always a few idiots out on the lake, but I found it was more often someone who was irresponsible or uneducated rather than someone being obnoxious just to show off.

The biggest common problem we had with anyone was people on PWC's (SeaDoos, etc.) - they would see our boat making a big wake and come WAY too close to our riders to try and jump the wake. It was extremely dangerous and many times we had to stop the boat or pull the rider in. They would also do this when someone had fallen and was in the water, and there were some really close calls when they couldn't see the fallen rider. That was by far the worst regular behavior I witnessed while out on the water.

[Mitsu3000gt]

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Thats completely fair.. Supra defintiely had an open bow in 2004, The 'Launch' series would have been active and geared towards the wakeboard group, but the skiing background was strong. At the time Mastercraft and Nautique was still very much a waterski mentality, that is go out and ski and go back home. Not the lounging on the lake all day with friends and family type deal that most other manufacturers figured out. They eventually came around though! (And took over) The only negative I would have to say about the Malibus back then was their dealer network.. the Edmonton and Kelowna group had a feud for a while, and wouldnt even service each others boats. Quite the mess, but I think that has been resolved.
I never cared much for Tige... based on manufacturing and for a while they couldnt figure out the 'Tige Tilt' where basically the entire boat tilted to one side weighted and unweighted which made the wakes a different shape. Quality just wasnt there... but they have come a long way now.
I stopped working with that particular marina many any years ago (Prob 2005?) and they have since closed. A few of their workers are elsewhere now (AWS) and my family still has our 2007 Supra and its still going strong.

I havent been to the boat show in quite some time either, the prices have really skyrocketed though, especially the big Nautique. G25 maybe? Over $200k Cdn is ridiculous, but they are beautiful on the inside.

We bought ours from Wizard Marine, I think it's near Edmonton. I think it was $92K and that was directly influenced by the exchange rate (I think they literally took the US Price and applied that day's spot rate). I always thought these types of boats were overpriced, unless I don't understand something to do with the manufacturing process, none of them were that nice under the surface. Just a giant fiberglass shell, marine carpet, a big cheap american V8, and a bunch of cushions haha. I'm over simplifying it, but it just never seemed like there was a lot to them. Ours had a hot shower, gobs of storage, 4 ballast tanks, cruise control, "the wedge", and some other cool features but they still struck me as overpriced, even back then. $150-200K is crazy, I haven't been in any really new boats but it's hard to imagine they are twice as nice...if they haven't changed a lot, there is probably a fairly strong demand for used ones. If I recall correctly, we sold ours in 2012 for around $35K - looking at things today, they got a hell of a deal.

[asp integra]

I have been pretty in tune with the wake/surf/ski market the last few years and its crazy to see where the prices have gone. You honestly can't get into an entry level boat of any of the main manufacturers for less than 100k. This have been the driving force behind boats that are ~10 years old selling on the used market for more than they were when new. Its crazy to see 2006/07 Malibus/Tiges/Nautiques/Mastercrafts/Supras being sold for $50-60k. These boats are ~10 years old with several hundred hours on them. That being said, if you wanted a nice used boat you could probably use it a few years and sell for close to what you bought it for.

I love waterskiing and surfing and am pretty stoked that I finally have the green light from the wife to start searching for our first boat. Looking to purchase one next spring. I am in the direct drive market as I can't justify $35-50k for a V drive right now. I'm looking at older malibus/nautiques/tiges in the $10-20K range. They will be amazing for slalom skiing and with some weight we can surf and board as well.

[r3ccOs]

anyone seen a Pavati Wakeboat? They are ridiculous... saw one out this weekend and someone was using lighting up the place using LEDs on the wake

[spikerS]

We are exploring the option of a boat for family use. I don't think any of us are thinking of water skiing, but most definitely wanting to pull a 2 or 3 person tube behind it. I would also love to be able to take it to a lake and do some fishing. We also really like the idea of an open bow.

Are there any reputable dealers in and around Calgary we can check out? We are not looking for a 100k boat, far from it. I am thinking of something under $20k?

[R-Audi]

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anyone seen a Pavati Wakeboat? They are ridiculous... saw one out this weekend and someone was using lighting up the place using LEDs on the wake

Only seen them in pictures... looked pretty damn cool, although its a little risky buying something that new with little local support. (Assuming you saw it in the local area)

[r3ccOs]

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Only seen them in pictures... looked pretty damn cool, although its a little risky buying something that new with little local support. (Assuming you saw it in the local area)

I think they've been doing aluminum boats for a while, among other things, but I agree... 9000 watt stereo, all those toys, even the "chilled cupholders"... lots to go wrong

[bjstare]

Holy shit. Pavati AL26 *starts* at $262k (assuming USD). That's baller.

The poor people can get into an AL24 which starts at $220k

[Rocket1k78]

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Holy shit. Pavati AL26 *starts* at $262k (assuming USD). That's baller.

The poor people can get into an AL24 which starts at $220k

WTF?!?!?! ive been following these guys and watching videos on them and the idea sounds cool but thats a nasty price tag.

Also just found out you dont finance a boat, you mortgage it lol a guy where i was watching the fight had an older wakesetter and we got to talking about the new Centurion and i guess theres a term called boat mortgages because you can finance them for up to 25 years

[asp integra]

If you go to the boat show all the boats show the monthly cost of ownership in the 300-500 range, but they are all based on 20-25 year financing haha

[J-hop]

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If you go to the boat show all the boats show the monthly cost of ownership in the 300-500 range, but they are all based on 20-25 year financing haha

Wow, you know you can't afford a toy when....

Seems a bit ridiculous to me considering 99.9999999999999999999999% of the people using them for say wakeboarding, aren't even close to being good enough that the boat really matters.

[Mitsu3000gt]

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Wow, you know you can't afford a toy when....

Seems a bit ridiculous to me considering 99.9999999999999999999999% of the people using them for say wakeboarding, aren't even close to being good enough that the boat really matters.

A lot of them people have them because they are also the best for most other watersports, like tubing or wake surfing, they are extremely stable, and they have tons of room in them for 8-10+ people. In fact when we had ours the least often thing we did was wakeboard behind it haha, and it was by far the best type of boat for our situation.

[J-hop]

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A lot of them people have them because they are also the best for most other watersports, like tubing or wake surfing, they are extremely stable, and they have tons of room in them for 8-10+ people. In fact when we had ours the least often thing we did was wakeboard behind it haha, and it was by far the best type of boat for our situation.

Yea just an example. Just seeing guys with 60k+ boats that can barely clear the wake makes me face palm. Sure they may be the best but do people need the best for the 20 or so times they'll get out each year? Probably not.

Don't get me wrong if people can drop the cash on the boat fine, but if they're the guy getting a 25 year payment plan just so they can get the best boat out there that they aren't going to use to even 10% of its capability then maybe it's time to rethink. 20k and some sacks will get the average person all the enjoyment they could ever want.

[ExtraSlow]

They make good drinking boats and fishing boats too. I've never seen a wakeboard behind the one I borrow.
If you can only have one boat, they are quite versatile.

[r3ccOs]

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They make good drinking boats and fishing boats too. I've never seen a wakeboard behind the one I borrow.
If you can only have one boat, they are quite versatile.

well... maybe one day the surf boat will be the swiss army knife... but with the new Volvo Penta Forward Drive, its possible the runabout may do just about everything most people would want to on a boat.
Its very interesting and I'll wait to see what the runabout manufacturers come up with, and how they review for surfing.

I just spent about the last 5 days on my neighbor's Malbu, and boy... thats addictive

I met with a Program Manager at my company who happens to be a relative of the owners of Wizard Marine and Kelowna... and who often helps them out at the boat show in Calgary has strong opinions on who make the best surf boats: Malibu, Nautique and Tige AND the economics behind it.

There are many factors with buying a depreciating asset, which is very different than a car... as the hours of use are incomparable and that depreciation overall is significantly slower as there is always international market demands for quality boats.

Say at 130k malibu depreciates at incremental rate of 6-8% a year... so if you get out 80-100 hours on that Boat, you are doing quite well if you were to compare to renting or buying that "statement car" and to most people who can afford a Watersports boat, can easily eat the depreciation.

However he was adamant that there are TONS of people in Calgary who should have no business buying one of these toys and even went so far to make a bold statement that, if you don't have a recreational place to put it at, you really shouldn't buy a Surf boat in Southern Alberta.

now I'm sure he's bia'd as he grew up in the interior... but even myself looking at the economics can see myself move into one of these "toys" in the next 3-5 years

If the Forward drive technology is really as outstanding as some reviews have hyped, there is a chance that I'd be even more interested in having a multi-purpose Ski/Fish boat