Engineers breaking into ER/IBD - 2017 Perspective

[killramos]

I figure there are probably a couple of people on here who might be able to comment on this topic so here it goes.

Has anyone on here with an engineering background broken into the equity research / investment banking groups, particularly focusing on energy divisions at banks/boutiques, here in Calgary?

Been doing a lot of research on the topic and find that most everything is very heavily tailored to US/New York focused positions and firms and I wanted some perspective on the local market here in Calgary. Tough finding too much of a Calgary perspective on sites like WSO so why not beyond.

Just not liking where I am at and I am doing and feel like making a change and doing a bit of a 180 on the career. I think the skill set I have developed in industry could be readily applied to a lot of the investment analyst/research associate positions I see posted. But I am obviously lacking some of the specific financial background.

I am a 4 year Reservoir Engineer, one year of which I rotated into BD/M&A, PEng eligible (just waiting on apega) and I am currently taking my MBA in the evenings ( though I have only just started so that's not really much of an asset right now ). University grades shouldn't be a problem if that is a consideration.

Basically what I am curious about is am I wasting my time applying for banking positions with my current experience level ( am I even possibly going to get called back for interviews ) or should my focus be on building out my resume for another few years until I have the MBA and PEng. behind me?

My other concern is if my experience is OK is me wanting to take my MBA a couple nights a week going to be a deal breaker ( I realize the hours expected of entry level analysts ).

[ Yes I know I know, another killramos thread whining about his most-people-would-kill-for-it O&G job, I am just trying to actively make changes to move forward into something I will actually enjoy ]

I don't know if I am building things up in my mind out of proportion with reality but I would love to hear some of your opinions.

TIA guys

[ExtraSlow]

From our discussions, I wonder if what you really need is some time in a similar role in a different company.

[you&me]

I have a couple of friends that have taken this path and another that's in the midst of doing the MBA "getting ready to be a banker" thing.

Now, this isn't my wheelhouse, so my familiarity with it is arms-length and anecdotal, but from what I've seen, to successfully transition to I-banking in Calgary requires some connections lest you be starting at the very bottom all over again.

Depending on who you already know, it's never too early to start networking.

GL

[killramos]

Originally posted by ExtraSlow
From our discussions, I wonder if what you really need is some time in a similar role in a different company.

I don't necessarily disagree with you, I just don't think the positions are really out there for my level of experience. Have pursued a few avenues and there are a lot of brick walls and empty promises out there.

I wrote a bunch more but I deleted it as I was starting to ramble. End of the day I'm just trying to consider some different options.

[vw_rabbit2.5]

why go the MBA route and not the CFA? I thought an IBD/ER role would require a CFA designation?

[killramos]

I find the MBA content more personally interesting and relevant. As far as I know CFA is not actually required, moreso if you are trying to get an analyst position with an undergrad degree only. I looked into the CFA, decided against it.

But then again, what do I know. Hence the thread.

Most of the positions I have seen list a PEng or MBA as being an acceptable alternative to CFA.

[austic]

My friend that did it went the PEng and CFA route. From what he has told me most Calgary based opportunities value the CFA over the MBA by far.

[Disoblige]

What type of roles would someone potentially get if they had their P.Eng + CFA?
As examples, post some job listings right now on current opportunities (current or expired, doesn't matter).

Just curious myself.

[killramos]

Originally posted by Disoblige
What type of roles would someone potentially get if they had their P.Eng + CFA?
As examples, post some job listings right now on current opportunities (current or expired, doesn't matter).

Just curious myself.

The ER job that caught my eye and kind of got me rolling on this a bit has this ( not publicly posted ).

Research Associates play an integral role in the Equity Research department by providing crucial assistance to our Equity Research Analysts. Individuals in this role are learning and developing the techniques and skills necessary for investment analysis and research of securities. The Research Associate works closely with the Research Analyst to develop financial forecasts and provide recommendations on particular stocks. Associates typically gain an in-depth understanding of the financial and operational issues within a particular sector, gaining valuable skills, knowledge, and relationships. This position is based in our Calgary, Alberta office.

Job Requirements
Qualifications & Skills:
• A university degree in business, engineering, geology or geophysics is required
• A P.Eng, MBA, CA/CPA designation or enrolment in/completion of the Chartered Financial Analyst
(CFA) program is an asset
•Work experience in a financial, engineering, analytical, corporate development or M&A capacity in the
oil & gas sector is an asset
• Strong accounting, financial modeling, graphing, and analytical skills
• Excellent command of Microsoft Suite, with a particular emphasis on Excel
• Experience using mapping software such as geoScout would be an asset
• Strong written and verbal communication skills
• Capital Markets knowledge/experience would be an asset
• Experience using Bloomberg and FactSet would be an asset
• Good business judgment and decision-making skills
• Ability to perform under pressure and meet tight deadlines, sometimes for extended periods of time
• Ability to multi-task and manage several on-going projects at the same time
• Energetic, self-motivated, hardworking and detail-oriented

Requirements seem to vary a bit from bank to bank and ER is a bit different than IBD from what I have seen. All the banks seem to kindof have open opportunities of some kind in ER and IBD on their websites if you look.

[riander5]

Yea and how much can I make? I want me some 50-100% banker bonuses.

I know a guy who was a res eng when i worked at the producer I was at. He then got a job doing M&A research with first energy. No CFA or MBA. Maybe he was an exception to the rule?

[XylathaneGTR]

Originally posted by Disoblige
What type of roles would someone potentially get if they had their P.Eng + CFA?
As examples, post some job listings right now on current opportunities (current or expired, doesn't matter).

Just curious myself.

My exgirlfriend with an engineering background works for a major securities firm. While she doesn't have any CFA designations, several that she works with do have PEng+CFA; their roles were very specific - analysts and evaluations work with respect to brokering large O&G asset transactions. This is all I was exposed to through her, but I'm sure there are more opportunities.

It seemed pretty active and quite busy at the time we were together. Everyone seemed to be doing pretty well, though it was definitely a more demand, higher stressed environment than what I had been exposed to in O&G at the time (Owner project roles). Definitely some wicked smaht people there, but also seemed like a much smaller job market - she got the job through personal connections.

Edit: The job description Ramos posted is pretty much exactly what my ex was doing. She made more than I did (as a project EIT at an owner - probably makes more than me now still, too.)

[killramos]

I think utilizing a network to get a job is definitely going to have to be a part of this, which is unfortunate as I really dislike begging for jobs from friends/family and overall I think nepotism in general is pathetic but you gotto the play the game the way it's laid out.

I don't want to be barking up that tree if I am not qualified for the jobs though and again I would rather not get too far in the process and find out I have to quit my MBA if I don't have to.

If I am laid off and nothing comes up before September I would probably just accelerate my degree and/or take an internship which is another option to get a foot in the door.

I am sure any of the IBD and ER guys who actually browse beyond will chime in after 10 pm when they are done work

[Pacman]

My wife has a p.eng and a CFA.

She went from reservoir engineering at a big E&P company into their mergers and acquisitions / corporate development group.

She has a lot of interaction with the investment banks and has developed a very good relationship with some of them. Every once in a while she gets a call asking if she would be interested in a job at one of the investment banks (she's not, as she's not interested in working the hours required for those roles).

So, doing the p.eng, CFA, finance role at an E&P with exposure to banks and then jumping ship might be a pathway with less resistance.

[killramos]

That was kindof my intention before my company got rid of their corporate development group. I probabaly wouldn't have even started the MBA for another few years if at all if that was the case tbh.

Instead I'm using the MBA to give me more options.

[90_Shelby]

Originally posted by killramos
I am just trying to actively make changes to move forward into something I will actually enjoy

New thread started on this statement.

[R154]

Will you split that idea into your own new thread?

I very much (likely like others too) want to have that discussion. I don't want to poison this thread with it though...

[Marsh]

Last couple years, Engineers --> ER associate was a easier transition to make as they wanted associate with technical expertise. However, the last year or two, the ER business is going through changes on a broader level (Less interest/justification for ER reports, as most of them are garbage anyways). Especially with the oil downturn, there has been downsizing and letting people go, and these teams already have very little headcount to begin with.

I don't think I've seen too many (if at all) engineers go to IBD without an MBA or very least CFA. Mind you, IBD is probably one of the most competitive industries to break into, and your competing with not just hundreds of business grads every year from U of C/ U of A, but also Queens, UBC, Rotman, Ivey etc.

Not saying it can't be done, but its difficult as hell and most people don't last there as the hours are crazy. Expect 90-120 hours a week at a shop like RBC, no less than 60 at a boutique. ER probably about 60-80 a week, and 110+ hours during earnings season.

ER is probably the easier path to break into given your experience etc, but its something you have to be serious about...not just cause your current job sucks. Hope that helps a bit

[Disoblige]

Slightly different question, but anyone here or know someone who is in commodity trading for an oil producer? Curious on the type of job and how an engineer can transition into that.

[The BMW Guy]

I was an engineer that went to the finance side (not IB or ER) but on a trading desk. 2/3 of the traders at my shop are former engineers. Some with P.Eng, most without (myself included). Only one has an MBA and he is the only one completing his CFA. It does seem like they hire a lot of engineers.

It definitely can't hurt to get your MBA. I would consider the CFA as well though, especially for IB/ER.

Definitely utilize the shit out of your networks and make new contacts. I once bought a car part off of Kijiji and the guy ended up being a partner at an investment firm. Met up for coffee a few times after and he introduced me to others.

Become a master at Excel. You should be able to do everything in Excel without a mouse. Mastering VBA will make you stand out a lot as well when you start applying around.

Good luck.

[austic]

So what sort of compensation do these positions make for a 110 hour work week?