What percentage of your net income do you put aside every month?

[dirtsniffer]

Someone should make this thread on reddit do we can judge all of the poor people and make them feel bad.

[ExtraSlow]

Fuck the 99%!

[zhao]

Originally posted by J-hop


Not judging but how the hell are you able to finance a 50k car and own 6 other cars and pay a mortgage on less than 6 figures and still put anything substantial away for savings??

Saving isn't just hoarding money. The economy is shit, I want at least a 12 month safety net of liquid to semi liquid cash in case I lose my job. I don't want to be sweating at night trying to figure out how much longer I can eat ramen noodles for to keep my house. Or in the best case scenario I keep my job I want to move out of the city onto an acreage where I can build a nice garage for all my crappy cars . I also want to be able to take trips without spending months paying off a credit card bill. Etc. Really as max said though it's about striking a balance that allows you to sleep at night....

My wife and I contribute 1500 each to a joint account per month. This covers our mortgage, insurance, food, utilities, property tax, internet, eating out money, yard maintenance, etc... and we still have enough left over for a little slush fund of savings for doing cheapo vacations around alberta or BC. This does not accumulate enough to be a slush fund for surprise expenses though.

Expenses out of my pocket are my car payment + gas money + lunch money + clothing + going out on my own money + random junk. This adds another 1300-1600. excluding last year, we go on one vacation out of country a year, but it's usually on the cheap. Cruises are good value IMO. The car is financed through bmw at almost nothing for interest.

The other cars I own are not impressive. A Series 2 RX8 (10g), e90 bmw (10g), series 7 FD RX7 (15g), 15 year old GMC POS truck (3g), my rx7 race car (negative money), low km e39 5 series (5g-6g?).

My income varies because i'm salary + get a small commission, but take home is probably about 5600 a month. So 40-50% saved is fairly accurate. My wife is currently saving less because she is burning money doing her masters, but normally she saves more than me because she doesn't have a car payment, and doesn't spend as much going out or on her hobbies.

Where we save money is we live in a new house, which has almost zero maintenance and we did our own landscaping. It's pretty cheap on utilities because its new, and not that big (1850sqft), and we dont crank the heat, or keep more than a light or 2 on.

Food is a pretty huge way we save money too. I buy food as we need it so we throw out literally nothing. I go to safeway on the way home and usually buy 1-2 days worth of food every couple days. I buy a lot of stuff on sale that way too bceause who cares if it expires in 2 days if I'm cooking tonihgt, especially seafood which always has something on sale, or baseball sirlions which safeway loves to put on sale for dirt cheap, and I also like their cooked hams/chicken ($10 gets you 2 meals worth). I eat out most days for lunch, but the owner of the business I work likes to throw food at us, and will buy a shit ton of food for lunch randomly, which will be left over for a few days. Compared to the accountant at my work we spend a fortune on food though (she says she spends under $140 (WTF) a month on food).

Our insurance is dirt cheap thx to TD's alumni discount and perfect driving records, and we lump our house in that. Only have collision on my 3 series and the wifes e90; everything else gets PLPD or not insured.

My wife likes to thrift a lot, or use the reuse center. We live in a normal house, but in a baller part of the city here in Edmonton, and the reuse center gets some retardedly good stuff dropped off for free pick up to whoever gets it first. Our dressers for example, solid wood and nothing wrong with them. We just refinished them to match the color of our bed frame/headboard. our dining room set was thrifted. most of our display cases were thrifted. The only thing we actually bought new was a good leather couch for our family room, but we negotiated that down when we bought our appliances for the house, which we negotiated a credit for with the builder.

I'm also saving money by currently only doing cheap hobbies that cost basically nothing. I'm only racing once or twice a year right now, which is 1-2g if that.

like I said, i dont like buying the latest gadgets or nic nacs, and i think that is huge too for not bleeding money. That crap really adds up.

I put absolutely everything on visa. Points cards are retarded because its basically robbing peter to pay paul, except since they exist, if you dont use them you're subsidizing the people that do. So I use it for everything and rack up a crapton of points which i cash in for airfare, rental cars, or gift cards for stuff I need.

Clothes I dont skimp on though. My wife doesn't approve that I shop at harry rosen/henry singer, but i hate shit that falls apart or fits/looks like crap... unless it was free.

Also, no kids.

That's pretty much my expenses in a nutshell.

[J-hop]

I guess the definition of frugal is subjective. That doesn't seem overly frugal to me to be honest.

It's how you look at expenses too. For example you say you don't buy all the gagdgets but you eat out for lunch every day. I figure it costs me about 5$/day for all my food which I pack almost every day. Eating out im guessing is costing you at a minimum $10/day. That means every month you have $100 additional cost for just lunch. $100/month will buy you a fancy new iPhone gadget every single year + pay the phone bill for almost 5 months.

Alumni discount isn't all that great from what I remember. Maybe 10-15%? I bet you're still over $3k/yr ($250/mo) for that fleet.

Vacation? What is that? Haha, im guessing you're a bit more senior than I so the situation is different but I've only once taken a vacation that wasn't a road trip in AB/BC in the last 5 years. In 5 years I bet you've paid off my most expensive vehicle in just vacation payments.

I don't know, maybe frugal isn't what I think it is?

[Feruk]

Originally posted by ercchry
That's not really accurate either... if you have an insured mortgage, you best believe there is recourse... "then put more than 20% down" ...nope, there is still backend insurance... I want to say up to 65%? Not looking it up

Sorry yes, my statement doesn't qualify if you've put down less than 20%. I'm not sure what this "backend insurance" you're referring to on mortgages over 20% is though?

[ercchry]

Originally posted by Feruk

Sorry yes, my statement doesn't qualify if you've put down less than 20%. I'm not sure what this "backend insurance" you're referring to on mortgages over 20% is though?

Most lenders don't want mortgages sitting on the books, so on the back end they insure, bundle, and sell off blocks of mortgages... kinda like how the 08 meltdown happened... with the new rules lots has changed though and it's not as rampant as it was... but most mortgages were in place before November of last year

Edit: bulk insurance would be the correct term

[riander5]

I save easily over 80% of my income a month. Plan on retiring by 32. I will sit by myself in my home watching TV during retirement though because I really need to make it stretch for 70 years and all friends and family will still be leading normal lives. I also never go without and have 2 houses and 18 cars. What is so hard about this to comprehend?

[timdog]

Originally posted by HiTempguy1
Maybe its just me, but some people posting in here either:

1) Are balling out of control (not surprising, it is beyond)

2) Basically do nothing that costs any money... which isn't a bad thing if that's your kind of deal, but I just couldn't live that lifestyle

3) Are WAY oversaving for retirement.

Like Sputnik:

- 10% into TFSA
- 7.5% into my Defined Benefit Pension (with another 7.5% matched)
- 8% into RESP
- 5% into RRSP

Why?? You are saving/investing 30% of your after tax income for retirement (well a bit less because the DB and matching is before tax but I digress)? I just don't really understand, especially with a DB, you'll probably get 60-65% of your highest 5 year average income when you retire. Why would you possibly need more money then, when you probably have way more expenses now then you will then?

I'm genuinely curious, do half of Beyonders plan to retire at 40 or 50?

I earn 6 figures, I to have a DB pension and all my calculations for retirement planning indicate it will be more than sufficient. I also have a small amount going into a TFSA right now, but we're talking like 1%,

And I don't have a girlfriend or wife, I'd need even less for retirement assuming we were still together and she worked her entire life.

So yea... I don't get it, I must be missing something when people are saving 50% of their income per month. Or maybe they started saving late in their 30's and are making up for lost time?

for me it's not about retirement, it's about financial freedom to do whatever the fuck i want. maybe that includes work still, who knows. it's also about realizing that saving more gets me closer to that freedom and affords me less stress and worry. not to mention, trying to curb my spending habits actually brings me more happiness, because the consumer spiral is real and deep.

[jwslam]

Originally posted by riander5
I save easily over 80% of my income a month. Plan on retiring by 32.

So before next September...

[riander5]

Originally posted by jwslam

So before next September...

Its comin up quick

[sputnik]

Originally posted by HiTempguy1
3) Are WAY oversaving for retirement.

Like Sputnik:

- 10% into TFSA
- 7.5% into my Defined Benefit Pension (with another 7.5% matched)
- 8% into RESP
- 5% into RRSP

Why?? You are saving/investing 30% of your after tax income for retirement (well a bit less because the DB and matching is before tax but I digress)? I just don't really understand, especially with a DB, you'll probably get 60-65% of your highest 5 year average income when you retire. Why would you possibly need more money then, when you probably have way more expenses now then you will then?

I'm genuinely curious, do half of Beyonders plan to retire at 40 or 50?

The 10% into the TFSA is NOT for retirement. It is for larger household purchases (renovations or larger capital purchases) and also acts as an emergency fund to fall back on should I find myself unemployed for an extended period of time.

The 15% into the DB pension is great. However I am not even 40 yet and there is no guarantee that I will remain at this job until I am 55 (when my "magic 80" hits). So to solely rely on it for my retirement is pretty silly.

This is where the RRSP portfolio kicks in. I put an additional 5% into an RRSP to offset the difference should I choose to not retire with the company that I am currently employed with.

The RESP is for my kids. Should they choose to take advantage of it. For the most part it is really just the CCB cheques that go directly into the RESP plus a bit of a top up for the one that is over 6 years old.

I am also the sole provider for our family right now (wife is a stay-at-home-mom) and likely will be for a number of years. So saving is pretty important to us.

I plan to retire at 55. I don't live a lavish lifestyle and prefer having an abundance of time over more money.

[Dumbass17]

47% here
buuut I rent and have a work truck/gas card which helps immensely.
Give me 2 months and I'll be borrowing 47% out of my line of credit to survive when I move

[rx7boi]

Originally posted by J-hop
I guess the definition of frugal is subjective. That doesn't seem overly frugal to me to be honest.

It's how you look at expenses too. For example you say you don't buy all the gagdgets but you eat out for lunch every day. I figure it costs me about 5$/day for all my food which I pack almost every day. Eating out im guessing is costing you at a minimum $10/day. That means every month you have $100 additional cost for just lunch. $100/month will buy you a fancy new iPhone gadget every single year + pay the phone bill for almost 5 months.

Alumni discount isn't all that great from what I remember. Maybe 10-15%? I bet you're still over $3k/yr ($250/mo) for that fleet.

Vacation? What is that? Haha, im guessing you're a bit more senior than I so the situation is different but I've only once taken a vacation that wasn't a road trip in AB/BC in the last 5 years. In 5 years I bet you've paid off my most expensive vehicle in just vacation payments.

I don't know, maybe frugal isn't what I think it is?

IMO zhao's mentality is not just frugal but he understands the value of a dollar and knows exactly where each dollar is going. Alot of people don't have the discipline to budget the way that he does because it's either too much work or people are unaware of cost saving measures.

If you evaluate the way that he makes purchases, he isn't paying full price for alot of stuff and he's also looking for bang for buck.

You don't see it as frugal because your mentality revolves around moving money around in order to make purchases. As a result, you see that he's making more purchases than you which is why you don't see it as frugality.

People are right that being frugal isn't about hoarding money but it's about going as far as you reasonably can with every dollar.

I have coworkers that would spend $1400pp on a Mexico all-inclusive but fail to see that if you purchased that same package separately by using a Westjet Mastercard flight voucher and booking the hotel on its own, you can save $200pp. Maybe for some people $200 in savings is peanuts but as a result they are shelling out that same amount to go on excursions on top of paying full price on the package itself.

BTW eating out is feasible if you use coupons to offset some of the cost. Whenever I have a craving to stop by McDonalds, I'll do a quick Google search on my phone and more often than not, there will be a coupon for $3 off a combo

[J-hop]

Originally posted by rx7boi


IMO zhao's mentality is not just frugal but he understands the value of a dollar and knows exactly where each dollar is going. Alot of people don't have the discipline to budget the way that he does because it's either too much work or people are unaware of cost saving measures.

If you evaluate the way that he makes purchases, he isn't paying full price for alot of stuff and he's also looking for bang for buck.

You don't see it as frugal because your mentality revolves around moving money around in order to make purchases. As a result, you see that he's making more purchases than you which is why you don't see it as frugality.

People are right that being frugal isn't about hoarding money but it's about going as far as you reasonably can with every dollar.

I have coworkers that would spend $1400pp on a Mexico all-inclusive but fail to see that if you purchased that same package separately by using a Westjet Mastercard flight voucher and booking the hotel on its own, you can save $200pp. Maybe for some people $200 in savings is peanuts but as a result they are shelling out that same amount to go on excursions on top of paying full price on the package itself.

BTW eating out is feasible if you use coupons to offset some of the cost. Whenever I have a craving to stop by McDonalds, I'll do a quick Google search on my phone and more often than not, there will be a coupon for $3 off a combo

I don't see it as frugal because by my definition of frugal (and I think most of the world outside of beyond) it isn't. Buying lunch every day is not frugal. Going on out of country vacations every year is not frugal no matter the deal you got. Financing a 335 is not frugal. Owning 7 cars is not frugal.

It's not about "moving money around" it's about what is exiting your bank account at the end of the day. Don't know where you got the "moving money around" bit.

I just find people don't really understand what living frugally actually entails.

And maybe at the end of the day living frugally is not his goal, that is completely fine. But from his post he seemed to be suggesting it was. Making each dollar get you as much as possible isn't really being frugal if it's not a necessity. Being strategic about your vacation purchases is just common sense, it's not being frugal.

[Prail]

We should really see a financial planner sometime - I think we are on track to oversave but we are planning on having kids soon, so this picture will certainly change in a hurry.

We are late in terms of starting to really save for retirement beyond what we do through work. I'm 33 and the Mrs. is 29.

We have the benefit of the Mrs. being with the LAPP plan, as an engineer with the city she should have a pretty sweet pension if it still exists 25 years from now... The biggest perk of working for the city is she's forced to put in $1,100 a month into it, but the city matches it 100%.

Two professionals + some supplemental income with other ventures.

We are now banking the wife's salary catching up to max out both of our TFSA's by the end of next year and then will bank everything into into a non-registered account. Reckon we will save our RRSP room for higher earning years ahead of us.

As others pointed out it's just the desire to get to 'fuck you' levels of wealth where your options open up.

So I dunno, above and beyond all that we now save in the realm of 30-35%.

[rx7boi]

I would have to agree that having 7 cars is not frugal but I also have different priorities. I am fine having one daily driver and spending money on other things. Some people prefer cars, some prefer vacations, some prefer watching that $$$ number rise in their bank account.

What I mean by moving money around is that many people think in terms of not buying one thing means that they can buy another at full price. That is true but knowing the value of a dollar means that one person can make $1000 go further than someone else. Not everyone goes out of the way to take advantage of sales and promotions or use a points card to piggyback off their purchases.

I also agree that frugality means different things to people and very subjective.

At the end of the day, he averages $5600 take home per month on top of being DINK which invariably gives him more disposable income than others. Being frugal doesn't mean that Joe #1 needs to spend the same as Joe #2 and #3 if they all have different earning potential.

Perhaps we're getting away from the point by playing semantics between common sense and frugality.

IMO being frugal entails effective money management and smart spending regardless of what your purchases are.

He has a nice home, toys, vacation, and he's making ends meet although he did admit to the possibility of the slush fund being insufficient for surprise expenses. To that end, I would agree with you that he might not be meeting your standards of frugality.

[ExtraSlow]

Originally posted by Prail
We should really see a financial planner sometime - I think we are on track to oversave but we are planning on having kids soon, so this picture will certainly change in a hurry.

It's totally worth sitting down with someone to help figure this stuff out. BUT BUT BUT, don't sit down with anyone who's primary motivation is to sell you financial products. Or if you do, be VREY CAREFUL with thier advice.

I had my RBC guy do a snapshot of my families situation, and it was pretty interesting. We looked at the kids education, retirement, cash flow etc.

Note most banks have "investment advisers" who are really there to help you buy mutual funds. RBC (and the rest probably) also have financial planners who are more focused on client goals and who aren't commission based.

There are also fee based financial planners, and I suspect you get the best info out of them. There is a thread about them somewhere.

[ExtraSlow]

Originally posted by rx7boi
At the end of the day, he averages $5600 take home per month on top of being DINK which invariably gives him more disposable income than others. Being frugal doesn't mean that Joe #1 needs to spend the same as Joe #2 and #3 if they all have different earning potential.

Exactly. Guy has the income, and is saving pretty well it seems.

[HiTempguy1]

Originally posted by zhao


You and I both did the spend every cent on racing thing. You know how expensive racing is, and you're probably exactly like me at your age where if you had 5g more, that just means that many more events you can go to that year.

Oh for sure, but I still can't see it even if I stopped racing. Because as you mentioned, I make sacrifices in other areas to do the racing. Also, I've spent WAY more on racing than you, pussy :p



The funds would be reallocated based on need (a friggin house for starters ).

My commentary is not colored by my racing. Regardless if I did it or not, I ran the numbers through a spreadsheet. I just don't think I could hit the numbers people are posting here while living an average "white person in da suburbs" #mericandream life.

I also completely agree with your thoughts on retirement and what not. Then again, I still have the idea that I will have kids some day, so I know I need to get the racing out of the way now. When I go back to it when I am older, I'll be codriving, so people will be paying for my fun to fly all over the world

Either way, as I mentioned, with the way our pension works, I am putting away 24% before tax dollars and it shows an extremely comfortable retirement ($70k/year at 55). I don't really have a good way to translate that into "after tax". I suppose I could take the amounts paid and "tax" them? Then compare to my actual take home on two pay stubs. Of course, I also get paid biweekly, so two paystubs is less than somebody else's two 15 day pay periods.

That works out to 32%. I guess I'm doing ok.

Originally posted by timdog


for me it's not about retirement, it's about financial freedom to do whatever the fuck i want. maybe that includes work still, who knows. it's also about realizing that saving more gets me closer to that freedom and affords me less stress and worry. not to mention, trying to curb my spending habits actually brings me more happiness, because the consumer spiral is real and deep.

I guess that this is highly variable due to people's life goals. That does not sound like a way I want to live at all.

I do find it a bit funny how people always talk about consumerism though, reminds me of how people talk about biking and veganism. You can spend lots of money without being a consumer, trust me, I can show you my condo, there isn't much in it that is newer than 5 years lol. For instance, I spend my money on doing things (and starting my business, but I digress).

Originally posted by sputnik


I plan to retire at 55. I don't live a lavish lifestyle and prefer having an abundance of time over more money.

Fair enough. You have responsibilities that you are insuring you can take care of. I am sure if I had a family, I'd focus a lot more on saving too.

[J-hop]

Originally posted by rx7boi
I would have to agree that having 7 cars is not frugal but I also have different priorities. I am fine having one daily driver and spending money on other things. Some people prefer cars, some prefer vacations, some prefer watching that $$$ number rise in their bank account.

What I mean by moving money around is that many people think in terms of not buying one thing means that they can buy another at full price. That is true but knowing the value of a dollar means that one person can make $1000 go further than someone else. Not everyone goes out of the way to take advantage of sales and promotions or use a points card to piggyback off their purchases.

I also agree that frugality means different things to people and very subjective.

At the end of the day, he averages $5600 take home per month on top of being DINK which invariably gives him more disposable income than others. Being frugal doesn't mean that Joe #1 needs to spend the same as Joe #2 and #3 if they all have different earning potential.

Perhaps we're getting away from the point by playing semantics between common sense and frugality.

IMO being frugal entails effective money management and smart spending regardless of what your purchases are.

He has a nice home, toys, vacation, and he's making ends meet although he did admit to the possibility of the slush fund being insufficient for surprise expenses. To that end, I would agree with you that he might not be meeting your standards of frugality.

Yea I guess I come at it from a different perspective where my expenditures do not track my income changes as closely as my savings do.

If you get a good job you can afford more expensive things but you can't really say that someone who saves 50% of a six figure salary is just as frugal as someone that saves 50% of a 50k salary which is how I think a lot of people look at it when they start comparing people's earning potential to their expenditures.