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Thread: NDP trying to unionize engineers

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    Default NDP trying to unionize engineers

    https://www.apega.ca/news/apega-urge...professionals/

    Looks like the NDP is trying to appeal to their voter base with this stupid ass union shit. Personally have 0 interest in ending up forcibly unionized because the NDP decided that well the unions need more members. Also would really hate to see the shit show that would result if engineers have to deal with the bullshit of union seniority and strikes.

    I would suggest anyone who holds a P.Eng. to either participate in the survey or mail/email the government telling them to get bent.

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    I'll be doing so.

    There are too many unions as is, and they're too powerful. I despise them, and usually find that anyone that is strongly pro-union is a lazy sack of shit that has been brainwashed into thinking the company exists to serve the employee, not the other way around (i.e. how it is in real life).

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    LOL...this is a joke right?

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    Default Re: NDP trying to unionize engineers

    Originally posted by mazdavirgin
    Personally have 0 interest in ending up forcibly unionized
    If you truly believed in free markets and capitalism, people would be free to join whichever associations they wanted to, nobody would be forcing anyone to do anything

    I find it interesting on one hand you find merit in APEGGA (a completely useless body that has basically zero authority over anything of any importance) but find none in the concept of unionizing Engineers.

    From what I've seen, especially in O&G, engineers would be the exact type of people that need a union. Very classic field case of "yes master, may I have another?" when it comes to poor treatment and breaking of labour laws

    Not that I am pro union. Just find it hilarious that you are complaining about a government enabled monopoly (APEGGA) possibly being replaced by unions that actually represent their members

    Engineers also have the right to unionize in many 1st world nations. Canada and the USA being some of the few that don't.
    Last edited by HiTempguy1; 03-31-2017 at 12:26 PM.

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    I'm not a good reader. Where did it say they are being forced to unionize?

    I can't believe they were restricted and prohibited from unionizing. Didn't know that.

    Definitely support working man's rights, whether you think it's lazy or not.

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    Not sure if I'm reading this right, but this would apply to engineers that work for companies where the labor force is already unionized, right?

    Would not apply to workplaces that are currently non-union?

    If that's correct, it'll provide a strong disincentive to work for those unionized companies.
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    Forcibly forming a union I am not a fan of however it does bother me that engineers are exempt from the provincial rules for hours of work and overtime. I've had employers in the past push 100 hour weeks during crunch time (hint it's always crunch time) and chalk it all into your salary.

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    I don't see how. Every person I know in a union, whether pipe fitters, electricians, truck drivers, teachers loves their Union, the higher standards, the rights, and would never work non unionized again.

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    Originally posted by Gestalt
    I don't see how. Every person I know in a union, whether pipe fitters, electricians, truck drivers, teachers loves their Union, the higher standards, the rights, and would never work non unionized again.
    That's cause everyone you know is a peasant

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    Default Re: Re: NDP trying to unionize engineers

    Originally posted by cjblair
    I'll be doing so.

    There are too many unions as is, and they're too powerful. I despise them, and usually find that anyone that is strongly pro-union is a lazy sack of shit that has been brainwashed into thinking the company exists to serve the employee, not the other way around (i.e. how it is in real life).
    I agree with this statement 100%.


    Originally posted by HiTempguy1


    If you truly believed in free markets and capitalism, people would be free to join whichever associations they wanted to, nobody would be forcing anyone to do anything

    I find it interesting on one hand you find merit in APEGGA (a completely useless body that has basically zero authority over anything of any importance) but find none in the concept of unionizing Engineers.

    From what I've seen, especially in O&G, engineers would be the exact type of people that need a union. Very classic field case of "yes master, may I have another?" when it comes to poor treatment and breaking of labour laws

    Not that I am pro union. Just find it hilarious that you are complaining about a government enabled monopoly (APEGGA) possibly being replaced by unions that actually represent their members

    Engineers also have the right to unionize in many 1st world nations. Canada and the USA being some of the few that don't.
    Engineers shouldn't unionize because the safety of the public, and the environment etc come first and foremost before personal gain and benefit. By joining a union you are putting yourself before your duties. APPEGA is a governing body and thus removes the regulation out of the hands of the government. What do they do for us? For most of us probably nothing on a day to day basis besides collect fees. But for the profession as a whole they defend the title of "engineer", they deal with malpractice or ethical issues, and they let us do our own damn thing without the government meddling.

    Unions are a joke, allow the market to dictate pay/workload and responsibilities. Am I overworked as an O&G engineer? Maybe. But I recognize that sometimes you have to put your time in and it all balances out in the end. I take pride in my work ethic and my ability to negotiate my own compensation without some lazy union telling me that simply putting in time means I am entitled to something instead of off of actual skill based merit. If you don't like the way your employer treats you quit and go somewhere else. With this recession as an exception, if you were worth anything as a professional engineer you wouldn't struggle to find a job.
    Last edited by schurchill39; 03-31-2017 at 01:00 PM.
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    Default Re: Re: Re: NDP trying to unionize engineers

    EDIT: Double post
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    Did HiTemp just say he wasn't pro union? Quick someone quote him for truth.
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    fact.
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    guessing who I might be, psychologizing me with your non existent degree.

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    Default Re: Re: Re: NDP trying to unionize engineers

    Originally posted by schurchill39
    [B]
    Engineers shouldn't unionize because the safety of the public, and the environment etc come first and foremost before personal gain and benefit.
    Well, I mean if you are going to believe, at least you are in it 100%.

    Originally posted by schurchill39

    APPEGA is a governing body and thus removes the regulation out of the hands of the government. What do they do for us? For most of us probably nothing on a day to day basis besides collect fees. But for the profession as a whole they defend the title of "engineer", they deal with malpractice or ethical issues, and they let us do our own damn thing without the government meddling.


    So basically, its unregulated with little government oversight. Sounds like a great idea, what could possibly go wrong?

    But I recognize that sometimes you have to put your time in and it all balances out in the end
    Says every sucker ever

    Like I said, I'm not saying engineers should be unionized. I'm saying they should by all means have the right to do so The one thing you don't take into consideration is that a COMPANY holds much more sway over ones actions than whatever association (in this case, APEGGA) you are with. To act all high and mighty and righteous, when there are very clear examples in the past couple years of how your assertion that APEGGA causes engineers to put "society" first is complete and utter bullshit is laughable.

    With a union, said engineer could actually feasibly put up a defense to stop companies from doing public harm, as they would actually have someone backing them (the union) versus an organization in companies pockets.

    You do understand unions are formed by the people wanting them... right?

    Originally posted by killramos
    Did HiTemp just say he wasn't pro union? Quick someone quote him for truth.
    I'm not. I'm very neutral on them I've worked both private and public sector, and for the most part, I've been treated very well regardless as I simply don't take shit from anyone.

    They have their pluses and minuses. If you want to quote me, you can look back throughout the years where I've specifically stated I'd rather be non-union as it realistically has held me back. But it has brought some stability, which I appreciate.
    Last edited by HiTempguy1; 03-31-2017 at 01:10 PM.

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    Unions are part of free markets. Regulation against minions is anti free markets.

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    Default Re: Re: Re: NDP trying to unionize engineers

    Originally posted by schurchill39

    I agree with this statement 100%.



    Engineers shouldn't unionize because the safety of the public, and the environment etc come first and foremost before personal gain and benefit. By joining a union you are putting yourself before your duties. APPEGA is a governing body and thus removes the regulation out of the hands of the government. What do they do for us? For most of us probably nothing on a day to day basis besides collect fees. But for the profession as a whole they defend the title of "engineer", they deal with malpractice or ethical issues, and they let us do our own damn thing without the government meddling.

    Unions are a joke, allow the market to dictate pay/workload and responsibilities. Am I overworked as an O&G engineer? Maybe. But I recognize that sometimes you have to put your time in and it all balances out in the end. I take pride in my work ethic and my ability to negotiate my own compensation without some lazy union telling me that simply putting in time means I am entitled to something instead of off of actual skill based merit. If you don't like the way your employer treats you quit and go somewhere else. With this recession as an exception, if you were worth anything as a professional engineer you wouldn't struggle to find a job.
    You are an engineer, not a doctor.

    And the guy you quoted. I have found that people that emotional are never thinking straight. He's never been in a union either.

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    The day a huge national Union hired us to build their new local office BECAUSE we are non union and therefore could meet their budget was a hilarious day for me.

    Thieves and hypocrites.
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    You are missing representing the facts.

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    Default Re: Re: Re: Re: NDP trying to unionize engineers

    Originally posted by Gestalt


    You are an engineer, not a doctor.
    Doctors, lawyers, engineers, dentists are pretty much all the same as far as professions and their duty to the public. If a doctor is negligent in their duties they could kill someone, if an engineer is negligent in their duties they could kill someone.
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    Default Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: NDP trying to unionize engineers

    Originally posted by schurchill39


    Doctors, lawyers, engineers, dentists are pretty much all the same as far as professions and their duty to the public. If a doctor is negligent in their duties they could kill someone, if an engineer is negligent in their duties they could kill someone.


    You are giving yourself WAY to much credit.

    No one is in danger if an engineer on strike. This is not about doing your job badly. This is about public danger if you went on strike.

    Christ, they can't change a car tire without their wives help. In some life threatening emergency, we could just call a 2 year sait grad to save us from the engineers on strike apocalypse.

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    ...
    Last edited by Sugarphreak; 08-17-2019 at 05:02 PM.

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